Brian Cache home of the 331st and the Not-Named-Clan

[Stormlion1]

TRO:3057 isn't a complete history, remember its written in universe by Comstar adepts using the best information they have at the time so its easy for the writers to later retcon things and just say not all the info was available at the time.

[Hawkeye Jim]

Really doesn't work. The Wolverines were made up of mechs they had that were with them from Klondike and what they gained afterwords, and they could have come from anyplace.

The Wolverines were producing mechs of their own by Klondike. Both the Stag and Pulverizer were theirs.

[truetanker]

And not only that, they would have any Royal designs from the Pre-Exodus all the way up to the very beginning of their Annihilation.

Mercury II, Pulverizer and the Sling being the most newest.

I strongly suggest that we secure a line of offical credit, either snips from TRO's or H:OK and H:RW. Anything that would show either V Corps operational material. Of which they were part of, or whatever the SL gave to any Royal Division. Including Nighthawks (P)ALs.

TT

[Hawkeye Jim]

I get the impression that the Wolverines may have been one of the stronger Clans in terms of numbers and equipment. If they had a mech line producing assault mechs, they must have had some bias towards the bigger machines.

[Jaim Magnus]

I get the impression that the Wolverines may have been one of the stronger Clans in terms of numbers and equipment. If they had a mech line producing assault mechs, they must have had some bias towards the bigger machines.

What gives you that impression?  Certainly the most technically advanced, but numbers?  I'd give that the the Falcons at this point, given that BoI implies they have several galaxies operational (though this flies in the face of the culling).

[Hawkeye Jim]

I can't say why I think they might have been one of the biggest, other than that they nearly destroyed the Wolves during the annihilation. I suppose it's just a gut feeling. Plus I think I recall reading that some of the other Clans were jealous of their sucess.

[Stormlion1]

The Wolverines had essentially started a arms race, one the other Clans would be starting way behind. They were also were winning more than their share of trials which promoted jealousy among some other Clans. Size wise they probably were slightly larger than most Clans but I doubt they were the largest-yet. The big deal about the Pulverizer was that it was new, not a rebuild or a Star League vet, but from the ground up new and using new tech Battlemech, something all the other Clans had yet to even put on a drawing board or thought it might be a good idea. From the Story Betrayal of Ideals Nicky K initially saw it as a good thing at first, the Wolverines starting an Arms Race would build up his Clans as a whole-more competition and a kick in the rear for other Clans to start their own R&D up. Without the Wolverines the Clans as a whole may have stagnated for a few years before any real R&D got started up.

[Hawkeye Jim]

The Wolverines had essentially started a arms race, one the other Clans would be starting way behind. They were also were winning more than their share of trials which promoted jealousy among some other Clans. Size wise they probably were slightly larger than most Clans but I doubt they were the largest-yet. The big deal about the Pulverizer was that it was new, not a rebuild or a Star League vet, but from the ground up new and using new tech Battlemech, something all the other Clans had yet to even put on a drawing board or thought it might be a good idea. From the Story Betrayal of Ideals Nicky K initially saw it as a good thing at first, the Wolverines starting an Arms Race would build up his Clans as a whole-more competition and a kick in the rear for other Clans to start their own R&D up. Without the Wolverines the Clans as a whole may have stagnated for a few years before any real R&D got started up.

Perhaps he thought they were getting to far ahead andmight start to dominate other Clans. Since they weren't in step with him, that would be dangerous....for Nikki.....

[The Hawk]

TRO:3057 isn't a complete history, remember its written in universe by Comstar adepts using the best information they have at the time so its easy for the writers to later retcon things and just say not all the info was available at the time.

True of TR3057.  However, TR3057R is revised by Wolfnet, circa 3067, and they would certainly have accurate information regarding the Exodus fleet and Clan vessels.  Indeed, the fluff on page 4 thereof suggests that they have agents in the Homeworlds feeding them the latest.  Both versions, however, have exactly the same text regarding the number of Texas hulls that accompanied the Exodus and the number destroyed in the Exodus Civil War.

[Stormlion1]

Perhaps he thought they were getting to far ahead andmight start to dominate other Clans. Since they weren't in step with him, that would be dangerous....for Nikki.....

I don't think Nicky K was too worried about Mcevedy, she was one of his most ardent supporters initially, it wasn't until the Widowmaker Khan started wispering into his ear and he set up the watch to keep an eye on the Wolverines that she got suspicious of his behavior.

Even the 3057R says not everything is accurate as warship info is heavily guarded.

[Hersh67]

I don't think Nicky K was too worried about Mcevedy, she was one of his most ardent supporters initially, it wasn't until the Widowmaker Khan started wispering into his ear and he set up the watch to keep an eye on the Wolverines that she got suspicious of his behavior.

Even the 3057R says not everything is accurate as warship info is heavily guarded.

Rather ironic as it would be the Widowmaker Khan Jorgensen that would end Nikki's career.

[The Hawk]

Even the 3057R says not everything is accurate as warship info is heavily guarded.

In specific reference to construction programs.  Since no Texas hulls have launched since the fall of the Star League, and since the two '57 tomes reflect the same number of ships in class as TR2750 did -- 52 -- there seem to be no inconsistencies there.  The issue is surviving vessels, which should be readily ascertainable by comparing remaining (probably ComStar) figures regarding the surviving ships after the Amaris Coup, Inner Sphere and Clan sources regarding the Exodus fleet, and currently extant vessels.  Shell games in their history of the type the Clans are well-known for can account for the Perth and the Bismark, but not Prinz Eugen.

[truetanker]

Isn't the Prinz Eugen Clan Burrock now? Or is that another ship quoted from the WoR book?

TT

[Jaim Magnus]

It was.  Given the fate of the reborn Burrocks I imagine the Prinz Eugen is no more.

[truetanker]

Dark Caste owns it... can't put my finger on it.

TT

[Hawkeye Jim]

Dark Caste and Burrock are about the same these days. But their strength is very much diminished.

[Stormlion1]

I think the Prinz Eugen was destroyed. The Clans lost their prison now.

[DEZOAT]

 I just want to say thank Hotpoint for your crossover story of the Hunted Tribe. Now I know what the Wolverine are doing out there.  }:)

[Drewbacca]

Just curious. What do Wolverine fans think of the Stag, Merc II and Pulverizer?

[Robroy]

Never had a chance to play them, but I like them all. The only nit I have is the Pulverized seems a little under gunned, but it is fluffed as a command mech. It would probably be okay in a larger force.

[Tyler Jorgensson]

The Pulverizer fits a good SLDF force: just better than standard IS tech up to the Memory Core days. It’s a Commanders mech with lots of log range firepower.

The Stag in both forms is pretty good. I prefer the Stag II for its skirmishing role: move PPC, and then if things get close blaze away with your other weapons. The primary version I haven’t used as often but it does sorta the same except it’s more of a team player.

I haven’t used the Mercury II, but I would use it like a heavy scout. It’s got the mobility and electronics and enough weapons to threaten smaller units.

[Drewbacca]

Who thinks Betrayal of Ideals will bring more Wolverines into the family?

[snewsom2997]

In all seriousness,  I am working on a Minnesota Tribe regiment and want to fill it out with armor and air assets. Any suggestions as to what would fit and go with canon?

Any Star League Armor
Any Star League Aero

I do not think that Clans started producing Home Grown Vehicles until after the Wolverine Annihilation.

I would also used damaged equipment to simulate their lack of supplies and manufacturing base. Missing Armor, Broken Weapons, and Equipment.

For Example, A Star League Alacron, one of the Gauss Rifles doesn't work, and it is missing 2 tons of Armor, and has 10 points of Internal Damage.
Or the Chippawa for Example, perhaps add a negative quirk to the Targeting and Tracking for the Missiles, and have a couple busted Heat Sinks.

You are really trying to make a Rag Tag Bunch of Survivors. They would be much more like a 3rd SW Unit with poor supply, but with a Mixed Tech Base.

After the Raids in the Combine, they could have salvaged some IS Tech, they did salvage some political prisoners, and they attacked early enough that the Houses still had Advanced Tech though it was becoming rarer and rarer.

[Tyler Jorgensson]

Who thinks Betrayal of Ideals will bring more Wolverines into the family?

It certainly brought a couple and a few more came out of the woodworks.

[glitterboy2098]

i haven't read it yet, though i've read some in depth summaries and reviews. i've always found the Tribe/Wolverines interesting, the novel and recent material amplified that.

enough that when i made my HBS battletech char, i headcanoned him as a secret agent of the Wolverines. and that Raju "Mastiff" Montgomery was his handler.

[Drewbacca]

It certainly brought a couple and a few more came out of the woodworks.

i haven't read it yet, though i've read some in depth summaries and reviews. i've always found the Tribe/Wolverines interesting, the novel and recent material amplified that.

enough that when i made my HBS battletech char, i headcanoned him as a secret agent of the Wolverines. and that Raju "Mastiff" Montgomery was his handler.

I always found them interesting, like the Green Ghosts but I was never a fan boy. BoI gave an intresting take that made me look at them the way I look at the Hegemony.

[Mendrugo]

For me, the most interesting Wolverine story was "Darkness," by Randall Bills.  It strongly hints at the Wolverines being the source of the Magistracy of Canopus' advanced medical/cybernetic technology, and having a special relationship with the Ebon Magistrate. 

Granted, as part of BattleCorps' "Iron Writer" series, it's not officially canon because it was written in one hour at GenCon and not fact-checked...but since it was Randall "I determine what's canon" Bills' work, it's a good indication of at least where the Line Developer's head canon is on the subject.

[Robroy]

For me, the most interesting Wolverine story was "Darkness," by Randall Bills.  It strongly hints at the Wolverines being the source of the Magistracy of Canopus' advanced medical/cybernetic technology, and having a special relationship with the Ebon Magistrate. 

Granted, as part of BattleCorps' "Iron Writer" series, it's not officially canon because it was written in one hour at GenCon and not fact-checked...but since it was Randall "I determine what's canon" Bills' work, it's a good indication of at least where the Line Developer's head canon is on the subject.

I have heard of the story, but not been able to find it. Is it still available somewhere?

[Mendrugo]

Nope - it was buried in the 2007 subscriber exclusives on the old BattleCorps site. 

Basically, a recently initiated member of the Ebon Magistrate strips naked and walks out onto the pitch black surface of a freezing, barely habitable moonlet to meet a DropShip whose occupants are very insistent on their operational security.  Once their scan confirms she's not packing or transmitting, they let her approach, take from her a data cache full of info about the Inner Sphere's doings, and hand her a data cube with advanced medical technology data, telling her she has held to the agreement, and that the exchange is well bargained and done.

"Well-bargained and done" screams "Clan," the Magistracy has been getting advanced tech infusions from "beyond the Periphery" since the 3010s, they went from having to write their troop manuals at the fifth grade level in 3025 to having cyborg super soldiers in just a few decades (the Maskirovka views the "Ebon Magistrate" as having come out of nowhere very quickly), and the abandoned Wolverine base-world seen in "Interstellar Expeditions" opening fiction was near Canopian space.  Plus, Trish Ebon was the last known head of the Wolverine Watch.  What're the odds that a secret cadre of Canopian super-spies just happens to also be named Ebon with no Wolvie connecton?

[Robroy]

Pretty much what I heard. I had a similar idea for what the Wolverines might be up to if still around.