Author Topic: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC  (Read 6732 times)

JadeHellbringer

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MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« on: 08 February 2024, 10:49:26 »



Another Inner Sphere second-thought medium Mech, after the Vulcan, Trebuchet, Hermes II, etc.- apparently I'm typecast. But this time is different- because while I tolerate the Hermes II as a Marik player, and accept the Vulcan's important role (if not how it handles it), this is a Mech that the author actually really, really likes, despite his better judgement. It's generally bland and unappealing in most versions, easily outshined by the similar-sized Phoenix Hawk in almost every way, and yet... for some reason, there's a strong affinity here that I've never been able to entirely shake- and there's been effort. So let's talk Clints today. Note that due to the relatively small number of variants, we'll be covering the Clan IIC version as well here- double the article. Whether that's a positive or punishment depends on the reader's perspective, I suppose.

The Clint comes from the old SLDF days, when the League decided that it needed to deploy top-tier recon units to the Periphery. How such a request resulted in a Mech like the Clint is a story we'll probably never see, but must have some interesting procurement stories behind it- after all, there's not a lot of great 'recon' potential here. Built around a heavy and inefficient ballistic weapon early on, it relies on resupply capabilities that a recon unit is best not being tied to (again, see: Phoenix Hawk). There are advantages, but not many- perhaps the SLDF's massive supply chain was felt to be sufficient enough to compensate for any needs. Whatever the reason, this decision put the Clint behind the eight-ball from day one compared to its brethren. Battletech ballistic weapons are, at the very least at this point in the timeline, a very bad idea for a smaller machine.

(We'll cover the original 3025 model first in detail, then jump to looking at variants, including the original prototype)

The earliest model we find in real-world time is the CLNT-2-3T (this Mech's ID code is irritating), and coming up with a less-interesting medium Mech is a challenge. Nothing really stands out about it- it's got roughly average speed for its size at 6/9, with a standard 180m jump distance, just like the Phoenix Hawk- and allowing it to pace the kind of bug Mechs it will likely face a lot of in its role. The weaponry consists of an AC/5, a weapon of famously poor value to a Mech in this era due to its low damage and high weight, only partially redeemed by low heat. This is... god, what a dud of a choice for a Mech to be built around in this era. Note that the SLDF Sentinel is very similar in layout here in  many ways, using an Ultra in place of the standard AC and a different layout of backup weapons, but similar enough to raise eyebrows. Those backup weapons on the Clint consist of twin medium lasers, nothing unusual or noteworthy there- same as everyone else has. One ton of ammo feeds the anemic cannon, plenty enough for operations away from supply lines as long as you're not stupid about your shooting.

So all in all, we got an average speed, average jump, thin-skinned, and poorly armed Mech for the scout role. Yay. On top of all that, we have in-universe fluff stating that the Mech was difficult to maintain and prone to breakdowns far beyond what most competitors would see- it's small wonder that this became a rare sight during the Succession Wars. A hangar-queen AND not worth the effort to keep running compared to its brethren? Sign me up, right? And the crazy thing is... this was the IMPROVED version.

Enter the original prototype, the CLNT-1-2R. What we have here is a sort of Panther-y idea in which the Mech is built around one heavy weapon at the expense of all other considerations- in this case, an AC/10. This gun had, we're told, an abysmal record in-service, and was replaced on the production model with the smaller AC/5 we saw before. To compensate for this, we see only one medium laser back up the cannon, no jump jets, and a single ton of ammo to give a typical engagements' worth of firing before needing a reload. This is just... this Mech sucks. There's no redeeming value here- the AC/10 is a poor weapon in most regards anyway, and this one has to watch its shots carefully if it deploys away from its home base for long. A single backup laser and no jets... little wonder the production model moved away from this version. Not everyone found it useless though, as we shall soon see...

The CLNT_2-4T was an attempt to turn the Clint into a sniper, with twin AC/2s in place of the AC/10 of the prototype. Same idea- no jump jets, single laser backing the chatter-guns up, one ton of ammo giving basic endurance to the guns. It's a Blackjack except worse in every possible way other than a meager increase in ground speed, and there's just no good reason to ever run one of these things outside of being handed one in a scenario. Just... don't.



Let's stop for a moment and talk about TRO:3050 for a bit. That beloved book took all of our old classics from the Succession Wars era and gave them facelifts with new tech, and it was... at best, mixed. Some designs got better, with some quirks to raise eyebrows- looking at the Shadow Hawk, for example, which is simply better than before but got an XL motor to make it a little less durable- worth the trade in that case, but still concerning. Other designs were just odd, like the Trebuchet getting a Narc launcher. And some were just absolutely ruined beyond usefulness, like the Goliath or Panther. It's honestly hard to find an upgrade for a Mech that was just flat-out good with no drawbacks to bring things back down.

Enter the CLNT-2-3U. This is, and I'll die on this hill, the single best upgrade any Mech got in that book- period. It flies under the radar a bit due to its rarity and small size, but don't sleep on this monster- everything the old Clint sucked at, this version got SCARY about. And it did all that without any 'well, except...' trick like the Shadow Hawk had. It's just better- possibly the only Mech to claim that in that book. And it starts by ripping out that stupid autocannon in favor of an ER PPC. Yowza. Range is better, power is better, ammo is gone, there's just no downside here... other than the ferocious heat, which is why we have double heat sinks on board now. It'll still warm a bit if you jump and fire the big gun, but a good sniper Mech- and that's what this is now- should disengage every so often and cool down anyway. Bouncing around at the fringes of combat, delivering hammerblows with the PPC, a Clint now is a truly dangerous unit rather than an irritant. The medium lasers are upgraded to pulse models, which makes them a bit heavy, but accurate- handy in case of dealing with other small, fast units, as the Clint is designed to do. There's just no real drawbacks here- the hidden gem of its era. The FedCom lucked out here, only mitigated by the lack of numbers to work with.



When Kerensky took his toys and went home at the end of the war against Amaris, among those toys were some of the early Clint prototypes- the one with the AC/10. This can't have impressed much of anyone in the SLDF-in-Exile, nor the Clans who rose later from their remnants, but at some point someone looked at a Clint and said "You know... we could make this not suck..." Enter the Clint IIC, a Clan attempt at making a Clint- and you know what? Bravo. Not a great Mech, but has some serious clout for what it is. The gun was replaced with a Clan LB-10X, giving the Mech that always-useful dual-role punch between heavy hitting AC rounds and shotgun-blast cluster rounds. For a Clan second-line unit, that's huge- but it always sucks to have to pick between ammo types, you only get so much ammo to haul, right? Not today, freebirth. FOUR TONS of ammo feed the cannon- bring whatever the hell mixture you want to the party. ER medium lasers replace the original models as well for extra fun times. The Clans also installed jump jets for a little extra happiness. This is all courtesy of an XL engine- no surprise, but the Clan tech  means the loss of a side torso isn't the end of the Mech. The odd choice to install an XL but stick with ten single heat sinks is a curious one though, and makes a Clint IIC a bit tricky to really love sometimes, particularly if the lasers have to start barking. This Mech is popular with the Snow Ravens who make it, was traded heavily to the Blood Spirits, and through trade also shows up in Ghost Bear forces. (The Star Adders likely have plenty as well following their clashes with the Spirits). As an anti-vehicle machine, a Clint IIC has few equals- cheap, simple, rugged, and able to operate for ages away from home. Just... bring extra ice for your drink, because it's gonna get warm.

The Lyrans apparently found the Davion-owned Clints among them in the AFFC appealing, because somewhere along the line they got in on Clint production, because [AUTHOR NOTE: Add inexplicable reason in space provided: _____________ ]. This seems like too big of a change to the design to be a field refit the way the 2-3U was, suggesting the Lyrans are building this thing somewhere- it would be a surprise for such an extensive refit to be applied to such a rare machine in Steiner space to begin with. Regardless the CLNT-5U (wait, a normal-ish designation?) sees an LFE installed along with endo structure, freeing up a lot of weight. The main gun is now an ER large laser, a good choice for a sniper, with three ER medium lasers backing that up (two in the left torso, one in the center). Anyone looking at this and thinking 'didn't you guys already make this and call it a Wolfhound?' can be forgiven for that assumption- clearly the WLF influence is strong here. But the bigger Clint adds in those jump jets, and here it also gains another neat trick- a C3 slave module, allowing those sniper shots to work even better. A TAG spotting system allows for calling in artillery as well, a handy backup job. The author was VERY impressed with what Steiner brewed up here, though the two extra heat sinks don't really deal with the Mech's ferocious heat buildup as well as one would like- be careful of how you run it. These went into service just as the Civil War began, and probably were very popular among both sides- though how widespread they were, with their questionable production background, is impossible to say.



Fast forward a few years, and we find our first Jihad-era upgrade is a simple, Capellan-smelling upgrade to the already-fantastic 2-3U. This one, the CLNT-2-3UL, swaps the PPC out for a plasma rifle and three tons of ammo- lovely! The pulse lasers become ER models to save a little weight. Simple upgrade, and handy the plasma rifle is a fantastic weapon, and with plenty of ammunition it's going to be out there causing problems with the new styrofoam-gun for ages before needing to come in for more. Warm-running if you push it, but a great Mech for irritating high-heat enemy Mechs like Black Knights or Sagittaires... or making vehicles disappear. This may have been the author's favorite Clint version in testing, and is an excellent way to aggravate your opponent.

CLNT-3-3T (god, I hate this Mech's code) is a Taurian model that came out early in the Jihad. Taking the original AC/5 production model and swapping the gun for a light AC/5 is a sideways move, losing a bit of range but dropping weight as well. That weight goes into ammo- two tons, allowing for special munitions- as well as ferro-fibrous armor and CASE. Few things irritate the author more than a weight drop that gets frittered away on useless garbage (again, TRO:3050 is a tough read sometimes), but this takes the freed-up weight and really improves the machine overall, despite the loss of range. This is a pretty great Mech, really- not a battlefield-dominator by any means, but very useful, and should be considered if you're building an era-appropriate Taurian force.



We may (MAY) have an answer to where the Lyran production of the CLNT-5U came from... in that the Blakists started building a variant on Hesperus called the CLNT-6S, and it would be weird to capture those facilities and retool them to build a Clint variant instead of something else they were already making. (Conjecture, but it seems logical) The Blakists made for a pretty big change though, with a bigger engine bumping the Clint up to 7/11 ground speed, but losing the jump jets in the bargain- your mileage may vary on that swap, but the author found it disappointing. The weaponry though is nothing to sneeze at, with two ER large lasers (!!!) inhabiting the right arm. Twe ER mediums in the left torso and an odd ER small in the head round out this flashbulb. That all sounds sobering, but the twelve double heat sinks are even more taxed now than they were on the 5U, and the loss of the jump jets makes it harder to hop away to cool down. The odd addition of a small cockpit further sours things, though the  heavy-ferro armor and lack of ammo do make this a tough Clint to bring down. Overall, not a fan- one wishes that the TAG was still here, or that the C3 wasn't removed and instead was replaced with C3i. As it is, this struggles to fit a Blakist force outside of garrison-level stuff, and it's kind of expensive for that role.

Around this time, in Clan space, the Ravens restarted production of the Clint IIC- likely recognizing that they had an opportunity both to fill out their own anemic ground forces a bit better with a rugged, simple Mech, and an opportunity to trade them off to other Clans needing to restock in the face of the Jihad and Wars of Reaving going on. The result was a new variant, the Clint IIC-2. The LB-10X is gone (booooo), replaced with a trio of medium pulse lasers (yay?)- the total, with the existing pair of lasers getting upgraded as well, is a munchtastic five pulse lasers to make life miserable with. Remember how the original design was a good scout hunter? This is a Clan-made scout nightmare, even the fastest units like Fire Moths can't escape the flurry of beams from these things. The heat sinks got a much-needed boost to doubles as a result of this new heat output, but still only ten- this runs hot, so be careful. The eight improved jump jets definitely don't help the heat problem, but DO make for a Mech that can rapidly bring the lasers to bear on a target. Ferro-fibrous armor and an ECM suite round out this impressive but very-hot Mech, one that the author didn't enjoy as much as the original IIC, but has respect for regardless. The status of production of either IIC model after the Ravens' departure from the Homeworlds- whether any of the remaining Clans picked up where the Ravens left off, or whether the Ravens set up production in the Outworlds region- is unknown.



In the Dark Age era, we have one final Clint variant, CLNT-3-4T. This seems to be a new production model, apparently sharing components with the new Cadaver light Mech to streamline logistics (and make an always-troublesome design more reliable). It then starts by using reflective armor, an odd choice if you're worried about reliability. From there, we see an LB-5X with a single ton of ammo, because who wants to get to pick ammo types in combat? Twin medium X-pulse lasers are here for added muscle on what feels like a modern take on the original production model, but honestly this uses a lot of odd choices to make a Mech that feels like a nice concept, but falls flat.

We have two custom variants to discuss as well. The first, the CLNT-2-3T 'Denton', is a simple changeout on the original 3025 model, dropping the AC/5 for a large laser, then filling out the remaining tonnage with heat sinks. This. Is. GOOD. Better firepower, no ammo, only a minor loss of range, and a full jump plus the new laser is heat neutral, not words used often in that era. It's easy to see (in hindsight) how this could have lead engineers to the 3050 upgrade later. The shame is that it is a unique Mech and thus hard to add to a force, because this is an underrated gem for its era.

An odd duck shows up in the hands of one Natalia Porter, later by her daughter Carolyn Fischer (I see what you did there, devs. Cute.). This is a rare instance of a Clan Mech- a Clint IIC- being refitted with Inner Sphere equipment. Reinforced-ballistic armor sheathes the Mech in a tough shell, leaves the twin Clan ER mediums from the original IIC in place, then adds a large VSP in place of the old autocannon. The author isn't a big VSP fan, but acknowledges the usefulness of a weapon as versatile as this. A single medium re-engineered laser is also added to the fun. All of this is then tied into an IS-tech targeting computer for a little extra fun. The standard heat sinks are upgraded to doubles, but only ten- so this runs warm. How useful this is in combat- or whether to consider anything from XTRO: Royal Fantasy to be canon to begin with- is up to the reader.

So, there we have it. A Mech that has some bland, overlooked variants, and a couple that are just astonishingly good, all in a very homely, humanoid package that most players will- let's be real- overlook in most situations. And some variants really SHOULD be overlooked. Others are ignored at your great peril. So, tell us about your Clint stories- using them, fighting them, etc., and don't hesitate to go make a version or two of your own in the Fan Designs area!
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Dark_Falcon

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #1 on: 08 February 2024, 21:04:52 »
One error: The CLNT-6S was built on by Defiance Industries, but on Furillo, not Hesperus II.  It was a Lyran, not Blakist, machine.
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #2 on: 08 February 2024, 22:08:04 »
Ah, the Clint.

Only ever used this mech once, in a grinder, and unforunately it was the 1-2R.  Not a terribly fun mech to play, especially as the thin armor meant that I lost the autocannon almost immediately.  Still, having a Shadowhawk flank me only to run all the way around behind him and make a charge attack at his rear was pretty funny.  I don't remember if I actually did any significant damage, though.
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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #3 on: 08 February 2024, 22:26:05 »
The Lyrans apparently found the Davion-owned Clints among them in the AFFC appealing, because somewhere along the line they got in on Clint production, because [AUTHOR NOTE: Add inexplicable reason in space provided: _____________ ].

---

Anyone looking at this and thinking 'didn't you guys already make this and call it a Wolfhound?' can be forgiven for that assumption- clearly the WLF influence is strong here.

---

We may (MAY) have an answer to where the Lyran production of the CLNT-5U came from... in that the Blakists started building a variant on Hesperus called the CLNT-6S, and it would be weird to capture those facilities and retool them to build a Clint variant instead of something else they were already making. (Conjecture, but it seems logical)

These three snippets make me wonder if Defiance Industries came up with the Clint upgrade specifically to compete with TharHes' Wolfhound.

(The irony of that being that once upon a time Defiance used to own TharHes).
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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #4 on: 08 February 2024, 22:33:06 »
Nice article, JadeHellbringer!
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GuyIncognito

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #5 on: 09 February 2024, 05:08:59 »
I've also always had an odd fondness for the Clint. I think part of it's the lore of being a predatory design by the manufacturer that then has to somehow figure out how to survive the grind of the Succession Wars making steady replacement part access just a fantasy.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #6 on: 09 February 2024, 06:12:56 »
The original Clint variants aren't that bad, considering their intended role as a cheap bugmech hunter for marginal planets in the Periphery. On most backwater worlds, the only thing that could outspeed them are Locusts, Ostscouts, and hovercraft. Anything that can match its speed, it can outgun or stay at long range, with the exception of the Phoenix Hawk. Of course, once you have Star League technology (level 2 tech), all this goes out the window.
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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #7 on: 09 February 2024, 08:18:34 »
I always liked the idea of the Clint, but the actual execution does leave a lot to be desired... :rolleyes:

Of course I couldn't stop tinkering with it which finally resulted in a very different mech: BLA-4F Blaster. It was a lot of iterations to get that far! :grin:


17thRecon

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #8 on: 09 February 2024, 09:32:26 »
Great article! I’d never heard of the dual AC/2 variant (probably for good reason), and I think the plasma rifle variant is the best of the bunch (of the IS Clints).

I think of the Clint as a bit of a light, affordable trooper for militias, backwaters, and Periphery worlds.

Luciora

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #9 on: 09 February 2024, 09:51:01 »
I loved the dual AC/2 version.  One of my earliest kitbashes.  Can't wait for them to hit the wild so I can mod them up.   

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #10 on: 09 February 2024, 09:51:45 »
I think of the Clint as a bit of a light, affordable trooper for militias, backwaters, and Periphery worlds.
[/quote]

if it had reliable parts and supplies it would really make one think that but its so badly made it just get relegated to 2nd line land to be forgotten 

But i like the machine and the 3050 upgrade is a quality machine not had a chance to use the new versions 

ckosacranoid

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #11 on: 09 February 2024, 19:25:28 »
Ran a few mech warrior campaigns with someone running clints...then never seemed to last very long before being toasted.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #12 on: 09 February 2024, 20:05:47 »
Funny little thing with the Clint IIC - if you install DHS the BV doesn't change.

Those infuriating SHS are costing you capabilities for no rebate.
« Last Edit: 10 February 2024, 13:56:49 by Greatclub »

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #13 on: 10 February 2024, 01:32:32 »

Enter the CLNT-2-3U. This is, and I'll die on this hill, the single best upgrade any Mech got in that book- period. It flies under the radar a bit due to its rarity and small size, but don't sleep on this monster- everything the old Clint sucked at, this version got SCARY about. And it did all that without any 'well, except...' trick like the Shadow Hawk had. It's just better- possibly the only Mech to claim that in that book. And it starts by ripping out that stupid autocannon in favor of an ER PPC. Yowza. Range is better, power is better, ammo is gone, there's just no downside here... other than the ferocious heat, which is why we have double heat sinks on board now. It'll still warm a bit if you jump and fire the big gun, but a good sniper Mech- and that's what this is now- should disengage every so often and cool down anyway. Bouncing around at the fringes of combat, delivering hammerblows with the PPC, a Clint now is a truly dangerous unit rather than an irritant. The medium lasers are upgraded to pulse models, which makes them a bit heavy, but accurate- handy in case of dealing with other small, fast units, as the Clint is designed to do. There's just no real drawbacks here- the hidden gem of its era. The FedCom lucked out here, only mitigated by the lack of numbers to work with.



Um, wasn't the -3U a Capellan refit?

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #14 on: 10 February 2024, 01:44:30 »
Um, wasn't the -3U a Capellan refit?

Yes, but through the miracle of straightening out the continuity, the Federated Suns also adopted it in the mid 3050s and set up a formal refit facility on Bell.

Translation: The original 3050 TRO fluffed it as a Capellan design but also placed the production center on a Federated Suns world. This could have been intended as a reference to the original factory for the design rather than where the refits had been done, but 3050 upgrades chose to clarify this question as above. The Capellans started it, but the Feds set up a dedicated refit yard.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #15 on: 10 February 2024, 10:56:26 »
 The Clint's job when raiding is to stay out of range and take pot shots. If the enemy could potentially return fire, get out of there.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #16 on: 10 February 2024, 15:29:53 »
The Clint's job when raiding is to stay out of range and take pot shots. If the enemy could potentially return fire, get out of there.

which honestly explains why it was designed as part of a scout mech program. people forget that the star league didn't view mechs as individual combatants the way that the succession wars and post-succession wars military forces do, but as part of discrete units of lance size and larger. a scouting unit for a star league force might well have been company sized with whole lances of the same design, or a lance with different designs meant to synergize with each other. as a scout a clint is kinda meh, but as support unit for lances of bug-mechs it would work pretty well.


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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #17 on: 10 February 2024, 23:45:05 »
And the Taurians have access to all of the Clint variants at one time or another. They really doubled down on the Eastwood factor..

Nice article @JadeHellbringer

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #18 on: 11 February 2024, 02:10:30 »
IIRC the Clint IIC's fluff was the production was restarted in the 3050s & sold to the Wolves . . . which should mean a bunch of those new warriors getting sent to Tau might have ended up with it.  Which also means it saw use in the Refusal War . . . and might have left some on Wotan for the Falcons.
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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #19 on: 11 February 2024, 16:12:29 »
Very nice article. I never bothered with the Clint so most of the upgraded variants I was not familiar with. I find it a bit funny that the Davions out-panther the Panther with the -3U while Dracs build the better -1-2R with the Wolf Trap... 5 tons really can make a difference at times  :laugh:
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gyedid

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #20 on: 11 February 2024, 23:15:07 »
Very nice article. I never bothered with the Clint so most of the upgraded variants I was not familiar with. I find it a bit funny that the Davions out-panther the Panther with the -3U while Dracs build the better -1-2R with the Wolf Trap... 5 tons really can make a difference at times  :laugh:

If memory serves, doesn't the -3U also only have the same armour as the original? (i.e. barely better than the Bug 'Mechs it's supposed to hunt)  The  Panther at least is well-armoured for its size.  And the Wolf Trap...is basically a lighter Centurion.

cheers,

Gabe
So, now I'm imagining people boxing up Overlords for loading as cargo.  "Nope, totally not a DropShip.  Everyone knows you can't fit a DropShip in a WarShip!  It's...a ten thousand ton box of marshmallows!  Yeah.  For the Heavy Guards big annual smores party."
--Arkansas Warrior, on the possibility of carrying Dropships as cargo in Warship cargo bays.

TERRAN SUPREMACY DEFENSE FORCE.  For when you want to send the SLDF, but couldn't afford the whole kit and kaboodle.

JadeHellbringer

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #21 on: 12 February 2024, 14:34:51 »
If memory serves, doesn't the -3U also only have the same armour as the original? (i.e. barely better than the Bug 'Mechs it's supposed to hunt)  The  Panther at least is well-armoured for its size.  And the Wolf Trap...is basically a lighter Centurion.

cheers,

Gabe

Its armor sucks, no doubt. A few solid hits to a Clint and the Clint goes away, simple as that. The idea is that as a mobile, generally long-range oriented, jumpy little monster, it won't take many hits... both because it's hard to target, and- if we're being honest- because it's not really a threat, so it likely gets ingored in favor of better targets to begin with. Sometimes being a bad design can actually make you a little more durable in that regard.

It also puts the IIC in perspective, which ends up being a surprisingly difficult-to-kill little bastard sometimes.
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Starfury

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #22 on: 17 February 2024, 13:49:11 »
That's why the Clint works great en masse.  A lance of 4 3Us is throwing 4 ER PPC shots at a target per turn, and that adds up quickly.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #23 on: 17 February 2024, 15:35:05 »
Woo the Clint! I got my intro to BT through MW2, but my first box set was the 4th edition one with the standees. They had some bizarre art at times, but some of it I feel is top tier as far as style and imagination is concerned.

https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/thumb/c/cc/BattleTech4e-Clint.jpg/800px-3zoscj5wupy4pj7pymvham6xoji7lea.jpg?timestamp=20180515204358

Well, to my 19 year old brain, that was one of the cool ones. The armor layout, the proportions, that huge ammo feed line. Plus I like the overall aesthetic of a big gun in one arm, with a normal arm opposite of it.*
It certainly was rough learning just how poor its performance was, but that box set lacked some of the 'Mechs that easily outclass it, so it featured frequently in my earliest (and error-strewn) fights.


Great article! I’d never heard of the dual AC/2 variant (probably for good reason)

Back in the dark days, the rules for Partial Cover gave you a whopping +3 defensive modifier (vs +1 now) but all shots that connected would be resolved on the deadly Punch Table. No full chart, ignore any leg hits. I certainly much prefer the current rules, but back in the day, this provoked niche ideas like having a 'Mech with an AC2 wait for someone to take Partial cover, run to 8 range, and get some Short Range shots given the high chance of getting Head hits if successful. A fast Mech with 2 AC2s excelled at that idea, and there werent many who had two AC2s, that also were fast.
But generally you get successful with that trick once, and the Clint goes back to its normal state of existence: scrap... =)


* other favorites of mine from that set from an art perspective:
Assassin
Awesome
Catapult
Dragon
Hermes
Hunchback (It looked more modern somehow)
Trebuchet
Vindicator
Zeus

Yep, I definitely had a 'type'. Didnt care for the Panther art since it just looked to spindly.
Others, more modern art looks way better. IE Grasshopper.
The solution is just ignore Paul.

gyedid

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #24 on: 20 February 2024, 22:10:09 »
Its armor sucks, no doubt. A few solid hits to a Clint and the Clint goes away, simple as that. The idea is that as a mobile, generally long-range oriented, jumpy little monster, it won't take many hits... both because it's hard to target, and- if we're being honest- because it's not really a threat,

Points taken, but in an era where pulse lasers and tarcomps become reasonably common (mid-3060s onward), this 'Mech will die quickly.  The Lyrans at least seem to have recognized that and beefed up the armour accordingly.

By the way, it's really quite funny how the Lyrans reverse-engineered the design and built it at a factory that had never produced it before, while the Fed Suns, who set up a dedicated refit yard on the ruins of the original factory, never saw fit to upgrade it to a full factory.

cheers,

Gabe
So, now I'm imagining people boxing up Overlords for loading as cargo.  "Nope, totally not a DropShip.  Everyone knows you can't fit a DropShip in a WarShip!  It's...a ten thousand ton box of marshmallows!  Yeah.  For the Heavy Guards big annual smores party."
--Arkansas Warrior, on the possibility of carrying Dropships as cargo in Warship cargo bays.

TERRAN SUPREMACY DEFENSE FORCE.  For when you want to send the SLDF, but couldn't afford the whole kit and kaboodle.

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #25 on: 25 February 2024, 14:32:47 »
I agree that the Clint 3U is a gem.  The armour isn't great but with a good gunner it's quite the sniper, and if someone tries to rush it with something fast the pulse lasers are the ideal weapon to fend them off.

I fell out of favour with heaven somewhere, so I'm here for the hell of it now...

JadeHellbringer

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #26 on: 26 February 2024, 09:02:32 »
I agree that the Clint 3U is a gem.  The armour isn't great but with a good gunner it's quite the sniper, and if someone tries to rush it with something fast the pulse lasers are the ideal weapon to fend them off.

It's definitely not going to win awards for durability, but a good sniper doesn't really need to be tough- the whole idea is to engage at a distance that keeps return fire at a minimum. (The later Gyrfalcon is a great example of this mentality, as well as the Pack Hunter). For the job, its armor is plenty- and a reminder to the pilot to stick to what he does best and not try to dash in and brawl. Bad Mechwarrior, you know better than to throw punches.

Oddly, this really is one of the very, VERY few times I am okay with the IS medium pulse laser. I loathe this weapon- always have. The -2 is great, of course, and the slight boost to damage over a standard medium laser isn't bad to have, but.. ye gods, 33% reduction in range? AND it weighs twice as much? Very few situations call for an MPL over a pair of standard mediums, in my experience. Here though, it works perfectly. Partly because those -2 numbers are great here- if something is able to chase down a Clint- itself no slouch when it comes to mobility!- it's going to have pretty heinous to-hit numbers, and that -2 comes in huge at that point. It also is a couple of accurate hits, but only two of them- I'm far less likely to be tempted to brawl (again, bad Mechwarrior, TRO to the nose!) with two 6-point hits at my disposal than if I have four 5-point hits. Four MLs, I'll go dancing with my opponent, even if it's a bad idea- but here, it's just too risky. That's a weird way of looking at a shortcoming as a feature rather than a flaw, but it encourages you to stick to what the Mech is good at.
"There's a difference between the soldier and his fight,
But the warrior knows the true meaning of his life."
+Larry and his Flask, 'Blood Drunk'+

"You know, basically war is just, like, a bunch of people playing pranks on each other, but at the end they all die."
+Crow T. Robot+

Empyrus

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #27 on: 26 February 2024, 15:12:32 »
...only now i understand the Clint is named after Clint Eastwood...

JadeHellbringer

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #28 on: 27 February 2024, 08:00:46 »
...only now i understand the Clint is named after Clint Eastwood...

So, I'm not 100% certain of that- mostly sure, but not absolute. I suspect it's the case, but didn't bring it up in the article (humor image aside) as a result. To the best of my knowledge and research, there's nothing that's ever definitively stated where the Clint's name comes from- certainly open to anyone else's evidence (actual evidence, not fan theories- we have plenty of those).
"There's a difference between the soldier and his fight,
But the warrior knows the true meaning of his life."
+Larry and his Flask, 'Blood Drunk'+

"You know, basically war is just, like, a bunch of people playing pranks on each other, but at the end they all die."
+Crow T. Robot+

Empyrus

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Re: MotW: Clint/Clint IIC
« Reply #29 on: 27 February 2024, 10:11:01 »
Certainly seems plausible, given that early FASA named other mechs and vehicles after people too. J. Edgar hover tank...

Speaking of the images, i love that pic of the Clint crouching in woods.



Can't say i'm happy with the Clint variants, only of them really appeals to me beyond the original.
The energy ones, Denton, 2-3U and 2-3UL, 5U, 6S are obviously improvements but in the boring way. To be sure, pretty much all of them are pretty nifty, but that usually happens with ballistic to energy swap.
The early autocannon variants are questionable (i'll take JJs and AC/5 of the base one instead).
I do like the 3-3T as a militia/backwater mech though it dearly hopes no one's bringing infernos or plasma.
The latest variant is too eclectic mix though i suppose it is Taurians trying to appear technologically sophisticated. Would have preferred incremental improvement of the 3-3T rather than whatever this is.

Oh and a funny thing about the Denton variant. It is oddly similar to the Wolfhound. A bit larger, trades armor for JJs. Feels like TRO3039 even lampshades this, given that Denton appears to enjoy fighting Panthers, a bit like how the Wolfhound is noted at excelling against Panthers.