Author Topic: MechWarrior: Destiny  (Read 128329 times)

Sartris

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #690 on: 29 September 2019, 10:35:18 »
Daryk  should get a minor writing credit at the end of this

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Daryk

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #691 on: 29 September 2019, 10:44:58 »
Thanks Sartris!  I managed to get myself into the "Special Thanks" of a couple of the core rulebooks, and would be ecstatic to continue that into the future!  :thumbsup:

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #692 on: 29 September 2019, 13:17:08 »
Yeah I was surprised to see I got in the BMM that way

The bar must have been set very low



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Daryk

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #693 on: 29 September 2019, 13:19:39 »
I don't think the bar is "low", though it's not exactly "set", either.  I wasn't entirely in favor of the concept of the BMM, so I wasn't disappointed to (ahem) NOT be there.

EDIT: Forgot a negative...  :-[
« Last Edit: 30 September 2019, 15:44:23 by Daryk »

wolfspider

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #694 on: 30 September 2019, 13:33:47 »
So has anyone took a chance and tried the Cue system yet? I know there has been a lot of back and forth about this and that and I did like the example using ST Wraith of Khan but I am wondering has anyone tried to run it and what are your thoughts? ( If I need to move this question to another thread please let me know?)
« Last Edit: 30 September 2019, 15:42:03 by wolfspider »
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Maelwys

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #695 on: 30 September 2019, 17:48:05 »
Worth suggesting adding the Ab/Flak armor to the game?

Daryk

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #696 on: 30 September 2019, 18:10:56 »
Yes... Though I'll add that pretty much applies to ANY equipment Destiny is lacking compared to AToW...

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #697 on: 30 September 2019, 19:02:49 »
Worth suggesting adding the Ab/Flak armor to the game?

Definitely
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #698 on: 30 September 2019, 19:15:25 »
Worth suggesting adding the Ab/Flak armor to the game?
Not too difficult to imagine--take the Infiltration Suit and add 2 pips, if you must have it.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #699 on: 30 September 2019, 20:07:34 »
One thing that doesn't fill me with too much hope for Destiny...

https://www.catalystgamelabs.com/cosmic-patrol/

Go down and follow the link under "Getting Started"

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #700 on: 30 September 2019, 23:05:34 »
One thing that doesn't fill me with too much hope for Destiny...

https://www.catalystgamelabs.com/cosmic-patrol/

Go down and follow the link under "Getting Started"
Cosmic Patrol didn't get the same support as BattleTech, obviously. Obviously the CP site hasn't been updated recently, and the domain was allowed to lapse. I don't see such a thing happening to a BT supplement--unless you think these forums are going to disappear anytime in the next few years. . . .

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #701 on: 30 September 2019, 23:07:38 »
accept your new future as a scammy online casino, peasants

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #702 on: 01 October 2019, 08:50:23 »
I will post more when I get home, but from my perspective as a founder of a group and longtime GM for many years a rules-lite game with a system inplace for the players to outright take control from the GM in certain conditions/pull equipment from the magical anal bag of infinite gear will only really work with a very certain set of players and will, in most groups, lead to a break down as players seize control of the plot and lead to a full derailment, often pursuing something utterly stupid, or otherwise using the control to either save a mary-sue self inser OC donut steal character or to kill off an NPC they dislike or even to strike against another player. I admit I am jaded by some recent years of bad players, but handing over GM control is a nope. Having a player tank control and save their character at a moment when you wanted it to die off, or kill off a character they are bored with is counter productive, as is a proxy war between two PC's using NPC's.

And before anyone asks, sometimes things need to happen for decencies sake. Midget prostitutes are funny in some settings, but not in a group that is playing in a public place.
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Maelwys

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #703 on: 01 October 2019, 08:57:14 »
Cosmic Patrol didn't get the same support as BattleTech, obviously. Obviously the CP site hasn't been updated recently, and the domain was allowed to lapse. I don't see such a thing happening to a BT supplement--unless you think these forums are going to disappear anytime in the next few years. . . .

Sure, but it doesn't inspire confidence in the system. I don't know how Cosmic Patrol is doing, but it gives the impression that the main game has failed, and that makes me question the foundation of Destiny.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #704 on: 01 October 2019, 09:11:28 »
Cosmic Patrol didn't get the same support as BattleTech, obviously. Obviously the CP site hasn't been updated recently, and the domain was allowed to lapse. I don't see such a thing happening to a BT supplement--unless you think these forums are going to disappear anytime in the next few years. . . .

What support?
The corebook is not even out of beta yet.
The system that the game was made for appears to be dead or so back burner its domain lapsed.
And the still active version of the Cue system, SR:A only has one supporting book since 2016.
With the only plans for a clan sourcebook I don't see this support.


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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #705 on: 01 October 2019, 10:14:37 »
What support?
The corebook is not even out of beta yet.
The system that the game was made for appears to be dead or so back burner its domain lapsed.
And the still active version of the Cue system, SR:A only has one supporting book since 2016.
With the only plans for a clan sourcebook I don't see this support.

We haven't even released the book yet, and already it's not getting enough support?
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victor_shaw

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #706 on: 01 October 2019, 10:33:28 »
We haven't even released the book yet, and already it's not getting enough support?

The poster I was responding to was stating that it was getting more support then Cosmic Patrol.
My point was since it was still in beta how could that judgment be made.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #707 on: 01 October 2019, 10:38:28 »
The poster I was responding to was stating that it was getting more support then Cosmic Patrol.
My point was since it was still in beta how could that judgment be made.
Because it's still in beta testing and the commitment for one more book is already here. You're also talking about BattleTech and not Cosmic Patrol, which has almost no fan base. MW:D as a product is about bridging miniature wargaming and role-playing.
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #708 on: 01 October 2019, 10:45:43 »
Because it's still in beta testing and the commitment for one more book is already here. You're also talking about BattleTech and not Cosmic Patrol, which has almost no fan base. MW:D as a product is about bridging miniature wargaming and role-playing.

Fan-base and support tend to be to separate thing in the RPG industry.
Again my point is you can't claim something has more support when it isn't even out yet.
But that neither here nor there, back to the threads intent.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #709 on: 01 October 2019, 11:59:45 »
Cosmic Patrol didn't get the same support as BattleTech, obviously. Obviously the CP site hasn't been updated recently, and the domain was allowed to lapse. I don't see such a thing happening to a BT supplement--unless you think these forums are going to disappear anytime in the next few years. . . .

IIRC, Cosmic Patrol wasn't ever slated to have as much support as BT or Shadowrun. I think the plan was to release 3-4 books total and then move on. I don't know exactly why that was the plan or that I'm remembering correctly so take this with a grain of salt.
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #710 on: 01 October 2019, 12:28:16 »
I will post more when I get home, but from my perspective as a founder of a group and longtime GM for many years a rules-lite game with a system inplace for the players to outright take control from the GM in certain conditions

In fairness, there could be a few more rules on how to handle disruptive narrations, but disruptive players are easily dealt with. "This group/game isn't a fit for you, you're disinvited."

/pull equipment from the magical anal bag of infinite gear

Four-six items max does not a hammerspace-ex-machina make.

 
will only really work with a very certain set of players and will, in most groups, lead to a break down as players seize control of the plot and lead to a full derailment, often pursuing something utterly stupid, or otherwise using the control to either save a mary-sue self inser OC donut steal character or to kill off an NPC they dislike

It looks like the game takes that into account, and even encourages all of this in a limited manner. Granted, there are times where a full derailment would be bad, but any game has to be open to the story going in directions the GM wasn't intending it to go. Either the GM can say "all as planned, this is what I wanted to happen", roll with it, or gently get the game back on track (again, using judicious application of the banhammer if a player is hell-bent on causing trouble). What you see as a bug is in limited doses actually a feature, IMO.

I admit I am jaded by some recent years of bad players, but handing over GM control is a nope. Having a player tank control and save their character at a moment when you wanted it to die off,

That's not a GM's job, IMO. Character death isn't something that should be actively sought by the GM (unless you're playing Paranoia, but there, it's pretty much everybody vs. everybody else played for laughs). if it happens, it happens, but I wouldn't want to play with a GM who wants to kill characters.

And before anyone asks, sometimes things need to happen for decencies sake. Midget prostitutes are funny in some settings, but not in a group that is playing in a public place.

Really, it depends on the group. As a GM, I'd put my foot down because I like to keep my games generally to a PG-13 level, even in a private setting. And that's one thing that this does have to take into consideration, the comfort level of the different players. Again, that goes back to the ultimate sanction for a player who continues to violate whatever consensus exists in the group as to content.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #711 on: 01 October 2019, 13:07:11 »
If you played a rifleman could you use the arm flip for a mech that gets behind you?
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #712 on: 01 October 2019, 13:11:46 »
If you played a rifleman could you use the arm flip for a mech that gets behind you?

Don't see why not.

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #713 on: 01 October 2019, 13:17:36 »
Cool I plan on doing some arm flipping madness then!  >:D
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #714 on: 01 October 2019, 13:24:33 »
I will post more when I get home, but from my perspective as a founder of a group and longtime GM for many years a rules-lite game with a system inplace for the players to outright take control from the GM in certain conditions
In fairness, there could be a few more rules on how to handle disruptive narrations, but disruptive players are easily dealt with. "This group/game isn't a fit for you, you're disinvited."

as someone that's spent a fair amount of time teaching new groups how to play, this is frequently not even remotely an option. a lot of the time, i was teaching highschool to sixth graders the ropes and they were all friends/classmates. telling them to GTFO led to more problems than it solved, as the bad player would cause the rest of the group trouble afterwards.


-will only really work with a very certain set of players and will, in most groups, lead to a break down as players seize control of the plot and lead to a full derailment, often pursuing something utterly stupid, or otherwise using the control to either save a mary-sue self inser OC donut steal character or to kill off an NPC they dislike
It looks like the game takes that into account, and even encourages all of this in a limited manner. Granted, there are times where a full derailment would be bad, but any game has to be open to the story going in directions the GM wasn't intending it to go. Either the GM can say "all as planned, this is what I wanted to happen", roll with it, or gently get the game back on track (again, using judicious application of the banhammer if a player is hell-bent on causing trouble). What you see as a bug is in limited doses actually a feature, IMO.
your "feature" is honestly just GM experience. if they don't have a very good GM, he's very likely to get browbeat and lose all narrative, which has always led to the game getting stale as the players get lost in personal squabbles and number-chasing. Something i've noticed about these "theater of the mind" game systems is they assume a very high skill level on the part of the GM but then fail to take the poor kid aside and drop the high hopes and give them some real talk about just how bad the players can get and how they're gonna have to take it.

Character death isn't something that should be actively sought by the GM (unless you're playing Paranoia, but there, it's pretty much everybody vs. everybody else played for laughs). if it happens, it happens, but I wouldn't want to play with a GM who wants to kill characters.

you sometimes need to dispose of characters if you're running games where the player isn't someone you can remove. it's not the ideal resolution, but it is what it is.
« Last Edit: 01 October 2019, 13:26:04 by Orin J. »
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #715 on: 01 October 2019, 15:36:07 »
We haven't even released the book yet, and already it's not getting enough support?

Yes. Could you release some supplements first, then the game?
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #716 on: 01 October 2019, 16:22:22 »
...
It looks like the game takes that into account, and even encourages all of this in a limited manner. Granted, there are times where a full derailment would be bad, but any game has to be open to the story going in directions the GM wasn't intending it to go. Either the GM can say "all as planned, this is what I wanted to happen", roll with it, or gently get the game back on track (again, using judicious application of the banhammer if a player is hell-bent on causing trouble). What you see as a bug is in limited doses actually a feature, IMO.
...
just as a side note, there is a difference between "the story going of the rails because of characters doing unexpected stuff" and "the world going of the rails because of player choices". In the first, while having to improvise when in unknown territory, the GM can still shape the world in a structured and consistent way (within his improvisation skills and general world building). In the second case the GM has to let the player have his agency and maybe slightly correct the way without undoing anything directly or go directly to the meta level and reign a player in.

Personally, in the second case is too much referee for me while in the first case all but the real hard cases can be dealt with within the game world or discussed between sessions, but that's just my personal opinion. :)

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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #717 on: 01 October 2019, 18:40:44 »
You know... for 'Mech combat. Do all weapons in a group hit the same location or do you roll per weapon?
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #718 on: 01 October 2019, 19:47:30 »
Orin hit on most of my points, but hey, its my OP so might as well.

In fairness, there could be a few more rules on how to handle disruptive narrations, but disruptive players are easily dealt with. "This group/game isn't a fit for you, you're disinvited."
Sadly it is not always that easy. Actually, often it is not so. Doing so, especially amongst friends, can sour relationships.

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Four-six items max does not a hammerspace-ex-machina make.
No, but plotpoints does. I 'plotpoint' a spare reload I forgot about or a old respirator someone left down here or a sodding Mech ripe for salvage. Its openly a bad system, and those "4 items" can be anything from a pocket knife to a fusion charger!
 
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It looks like the game takes that into account, and even encourages all of this in a limited manner.
This is not a good thing. I am no rules layer and run open world games, but outright letting players take control is not a good thing, especially for a newbie GM. All the players and the GM have to be on the same page and that is a rare thing.

 
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Granted, there are times where a full derailment would be bad,
Aye. All the time.

 
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but any game has to be open to the story going in directions the GM wasn't intending it to go.
Agreed again, but not down some routes, and not in some venues. There is shit members of my group decided to pull that I do not want to ever have to deal with again. Leastwhys, not in full public.

 
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Either the GM can say "all as planned, this is what I wanted to happen", roll with it,
You described 60% of GMing

 
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or gently get the game back on track
Well, there is another 20%

 
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(again, using judicious application of the banhammer if a player is hell-bent on causing trouble).
Unless you are on Discord this is not always an option, at least no immediately. Trust me on this.

 
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What you see as a bug is in limited doses actually a feature, IMO.
A feature that lets players weasel around obstacles or outright fight one another via proxy or just decide to derail the game for fun repeatedly. Bonus points if the problem player has home field advantage.


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That's not a GM's job, IMO. Character death isn't something that should be actively sought by the GM
Depends. Midget prostitutes. Minmaxed murder hobos. Edgelords. Stuff that needs nipping in the bud, or sometimes it is time for the players to take a loss or two because they are getting too cocky and need to be reminded of their own mortality or its a suitably dramatic moment to take a loss. Likewise some players need to be forced to play the character they brought and now want killing off because its boring. Especially if it is the same bloody brain damaged/****** character design that licks everything and does stupid things because "muh low int" that they brought the last 4 times.

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but I wouldn't want to play with a GM who wants to kill characters.
Murder GM's are bad and a blight on the community but read what I wrote above.

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Really, it depends on the group. As a GM, I'd put my foot down because I like to keep my games generally to a PG-13 level
You are lucky your group accepts this.

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, even in a private setting.
Meido RPG is Discord only, right?

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And that's one thing that this does have to take into consideration, the comfort level of the different players.
Yes. And for the GM. Forget the players actually, the GM is key to the entire game. If the GM is uncomfortable then sod the players and whatever they want to run. Rocks fall, get out and roll something sensible.

 
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Again, that goes back to the ultimate sanction for a player who continues to violate whatever consensus exists in the group as to content.
Not as easy as all that in most groups. You play at their house, they are a longtime friend or friend of a friend, other relationships make dealing with them awkward, etc.
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Re: MechWarrior: Destiny
« Reply #719 on: 02 October 2019, 03:58:32 »
It really boils down to the players.  I have had groups that go dead silent when I queue them.  I stare awkwardly for a minute, then feel bad for offering suggestions on possible actions they may take.  I ask them if there's anything I can improve and they always answer "No, I'm having fun."  I often feel I'm asking the sitcom question, "Does this dress make me look ugly?" and the players aren't expressing their feelings.

Then, in my current group, they have me describing half a city, an entire dinner menu, names of professors and students, as well as academic departments and who might've donated money to get buildings built on campus.  The most Mech action they've had is one of the players using a Powerman to unload crates from a dropship.  The sheer level of detail they love, and the fact that they just want to RP their characters based on all their AToW skills has been amazing.  Perhaps they'd be good in a narrative game, but I think they enjoy testing my improvisational limits.

 

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