Author Topic: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign  (Read 4590 times)

Karack Blackstone

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Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« on: 24 October 2019, 16:24:56 »
Hello all, refit / Clan design of the Marauder, if kept at 75 Tons.

Marauder C X1 is the final design. Here it is:
Code: [Select]
Marauder C X1

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3040
Cost: 16,707,250 C-Bills
Battle Value: 3,109

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  Gauss Rifle
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    1  Light Active Probe
    1  ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 1 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             17(34)                    7.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LA, 2 RA
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12.00
    Armor Locations: 1 HD, 5 LT, 1 RA
    CASE Locations: RT                                                     0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           36       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2.00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2.00
Gauss Rifle                                  RT        1         6        12.00
Light Active Probe                           CT        0         1         0.50
ECM Suite                                    CT        0         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (16)                            RT        -         2         2.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             LT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 31
4j         6       6       4       0      3     1   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: LPRB, RCN, ECM, CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Inspired by Greatclub's twin AC/5 Marauder. Yes, the Clans can do it better; the cost is always an issue as well.

Code: [Select]
Marauder C

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 15,971,375 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,619

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  ER PPC
    2  Gauss Rifles
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    3  Micro Pulse Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 1 HD, 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             14(28)                    4.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12.00
    Armor Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA
    CASE Locations: LA, RA                                                 0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           36       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gauss Rifle                                  RA        1         6        12.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2.00
Gauss Rifle                                  LA        1         6        12.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2.00
ER PPC                                       RT        15        2         6.00
Micro Pulse Laser                            RT        1         1         0.50
Micro Pulse Laser                            LT        1         1         0.50
Micro Pulse Laser                            CT        1         1         0.50
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             RA        -         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             LA        -         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             RT        -         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             LT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 4

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 26
4          7       7       5       0      3     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Edit: Removed 1 point of armor, freeing up a half-ton. Swapped the Small pulse laser for three Micro Pulse Lasers instead.
« Last Edit: 23 December 2019, 20:04:04 by Karack Blackstone »

Nightsong

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #1 on: 25 October 2019, 00:52:07 »
Actually feels like someone put a Nightstar 9J on a diet.

Sabelkatten

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  • Posts: 6959
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #2 on: 25 October 2019, 03:28:37 »
Sudden inspiration because AC/5! :D

Code: [Select]
Marauder C 2

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 16 205 438 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2 298

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43,2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64,8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  ER PPC
    2  Large Pulse Lasers
    2  LB 5-X ACs
    1  ER Small Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4,00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LA, 1 RA
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9,50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             19(38)                    9,00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LT, 2 RT, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               3,00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12,00
    Armor Locations: 1 LT, 3 RT, 1 LA, 2 RA
    CASE Locations: LT, RT                                                 0,00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           35       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  10       
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER Small Laser                               HD        2         1         0,50
ER PPC                                       CT        15        2         6,00
LB 5-X AC                                    RA        1         4         7,00
Large Pulse Laser                            RA        10        2         6,00
LB 5-X AC                                    LA        1         4         7,00
Large Pulse Laser                            LA        10        2         6,00
@LB 5-X (Slug) (20)                          RT        -         1         1,00
@LB 5-X (Cluster) (20)                       LT        -         1         1,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 23
4          5       5       5       0      3     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, FLK 0/1/1

Nightsong

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #3 on: 25 October 2019, 04:34:14 »
So a 9FC on a diet  :D

Karack Blackstone

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #4 on: 25 October 2019, 12:34:43 »
Is this a thing that should be looked into?

The Clan Marauder C and C 2, a 75 Ton Nightstar line?

Nightsong

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #5 on: 25 October 2019, 13:13:34 »
Was just a joke, but it said NSR to me because of the inversion of ballistics and energy weapons that the NSRs have in comparison to MADs, and the swapping of gasses for LB-Xs on the 9FC, s’all. I do like both versions you posted here.

fallen

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #6 on: 25 October 2019, 16:01:01 »
I like them both!  Karack Blackstone's design has the sheer firepower and range of twin gauss rifles, and Sabelkatten's design has the lovely combo of LB-X autocannon and large pulse lasers for the target modifier.   I would hate to face either design in a table top game. 

I wonder, since there are multiple variants of the Marauder IIC in the Battletech universe, should there be clan variants of the other designs in the Marauder family (Nightstar, Maelstrom, Dragon Fire, etc.)?

Karack Blackstone

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  • Posts: 990
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #7 on: 21 November 2019, 13:41:56 »
Edited the OP.

Dropped one plate of armor, freeing up a half-ton of space.

Swapped the SPL for two McPL's and added a third McPL to boot.

And, why not? I think there's something to this design class idea, might as well see what some of us can smurf up. I mean, Skunkwerk up. Yeah...

Daryk

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  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #8 on: 21 November 2019, 21:07:04 »
All they're missing is jump jets...  ^-^

Firesprocket

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #9 on: 22 November 2019, 23:08:39 »
All they're missing is jump jets...  ^-^

Because you wanted jump jets

Code: [Select]
Marauder MAD-2R (C)

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Dark Ages
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3132
Cost: 8,004,500 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,487

Chassis: GM Marauder Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Vlar 300 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Valiant Lamellor Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  ER Large Laser
    2  Micro Pulse Lasers
Manufacturer: General Motors, Independence Weaponry
    Primary Factory: Kathil (GM), Quentin (Independence)
Communications System: Dalban Micronics
Targeting and Tracking System: Dalban Hi-Rez

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LA, 1 RA
Engine:             Fusion Engine                300                      19.00
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 CT, 1 LT, 1 RT                                   4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             24(48)                   14.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LT, 3 RT, 2 LA, 2 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 211                 11.00
    Armor Locations: 3 LT, 3 RT, 1 RA

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           30       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  8         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           21       
                                             L/R Leg     16           29       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6.00
Micro Pulse Laser                            RA        1         1         0.50
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6.00
Micro Pulse Laser                            LA        1         1         0.50
ER Large Laser                               HD        12        1         4.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      7    Points: 25
4j         5       4       4       0      3     0   Structure:  6
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA


Daryk

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  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #10 on: 23 November 2019, 06:20:36 »
Nice!  :thumbsup:

Karack Blackstone

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #11 on: 12 December 2019, 14:44:25 »
My answer.

Clan XL Engine; maybe not as great as not a Zombie, but still going to bring the hurt!

Code: [Select]
Maraucer C X1

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-D-D-A
Production Year: 3025
Cost: 15,857,188 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,780

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  ER Large Laser
    2  ER Medium Lasers
    1  ER Small Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                     114 points                7.50
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LL, 2 RL                                         4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             25(50)                   15.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 5 LT, 5 RT, 1 LA, 2 RA
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV - 231                 14.50

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           35       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  11       
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6.00
ER Medium Laser                              RA        5         1         1.00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6.00
ER Medium Laser                              LA        5         1         1.00
ER Large Laser                               CT        12        1         4.00
ER Small Laser                               HD        2         1         0.50
                                            Free Critical Slots: 7

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 28
4j         6       6       4       0      3     0   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Firesprocket

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2960
  • 3601 S Broad St. Phila. PA 19148
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #12 on: 13 December 2019, 02:04:38 »
That's exactly what I started with KB before I rolled it back to be more of a zombie.

Hptm. Streiger

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 968
  • 3d artist, spread sheet warrior, KTF
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #13 on: 13 December 2019, 03:07:40 »
Duno, that marauder is clearly oversinked - you can go the route of speed or cheap zombi instead:

speed:
Code: [Select]
Marauder MAD-C

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Total Cost: 19.411.000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2.963

Chassis: Endo-Steel
Power Plant: 375 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 54,0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86,4 km/h
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  Large Pulse Laser
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    1  Active Probe

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4,00
    Internal Locations: 1 LT, 2 RT, 1 RA, 1 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             375                      19,50
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         4,00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             17(34)                    7,00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               4,00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 201                 10,50
    Armor Locations: 2 LT, 1 RT, 2 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           31       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  7         
                                           L/R Torso     16           26       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     12           20       
                                             L/R Leg     16           25       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Active Probe                                 HD        0         1         1,00
Large Pulse Laser                            CT        10        2         6,00
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6,00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2,00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6,00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 14


Code: [Select]
Marauder MAD-C

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Total Cost: 7.868.000 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2.600

Power Plant: VLAR 300 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43,2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64,8 km/h
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  Large Pulse Laser
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                     114 points                7,50
Engine:             Fusion Engine                300                      19,00
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         4,00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             16(32)                    6,00
    Heat Sink Locations:
Gyro:               Standard                                               3,00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3,00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 201                 10,50
    Armor Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT, 2 LA, 1 RA

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           31       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  7         
                                           L/R Torso     16           26       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  6         
                                             L/R Arm     12           20       
                                             L/R Leg     16           25       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Pulse Laser                            CT        10        2         6,00
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6,00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2,00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6,00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2,00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 30


Karack Blackstone

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 990
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #14 on: 18 December 2019, 18:00:22 »
A 60 tonner at 100% armor has 201 Armor Value.

A 75 tonner should, to me at least, START at 230 or so plates in terms of Clan tech.

I know it's a bit of a rub, but there's a delicate balance with every single 'Mech. And, that's the fun part of this game; a Zombie is fine, but the armor keeps the shots out. 29 or 30 more armor plates will only aid the design before the punches start to count.

Food for thought.

Cannonshop

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 10497
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #15 on: 18 December 2019, 19:59:41 »
i don't get it.  why be a diet-grade Nightstar, or an obsessive compulsive energyboat/icebox 'mech?  we've GOT lots of those.

Why not...


just keep the basic layout of the Marauder, but upgraded with Clantech and double heat sinks?  Maybe a TC to eat up some of the weight savings?

The 'basic recipe' MAD-3R uses 2 PPC's, 2ML's, an AC/5 and moves 4/6 at 75 tons with good armor layout for a heavy.

So? why not actually base off of that instead of off the FWL large laser model or a weight-reduced Nightstar?

Convert:

Heat Sinks to doubles.
PPC's to Clan ER models
ML's to Clan models (ER or pulse)
AC/5 to either Ultra or LBX
ADD CASE

Sink weight savings into ancillary systems like, Oh...targeting computers, ECM rigs, etc etc?

Take what the base model Marauder is, and make it do that better, is all I'm suggesting here.
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

Atarlost

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 559
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #16 on: 18 December 2019, 21:08:53 »
There's no reason to fixate on PPCs in a Clan upgrade.  Both the CERLL and CERPPC are strictly upgrades to the SL era ERPPCs used by the MAD-2R the SLDF took on the exodus.  They just upgrade different things.  If what you wanted out of the MAD-2R was the longest range energy armament possible you pick the CERLLs.  If what you wanted was the largest damage groupings from energy weapons you pick the CERPPCs, but if what you'd wanted was big energy weapon damage groupings you'd pick three PPCs over 2 PPCs and an AC-5 and the MAD-2R would look rather different. 

Cannonshop

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 10497
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #17 on: 20 December 2019, 09:42:45 »
There's no reason to fixate on PPCs in a Clan upgrade.  Both the CERLL and CERPPC are strictly upgrades to the SL era ERPPCs used by the MAD-2R the SLDF took on the exodus.  They just upgrade different things.  If what you wanted out of the MAD-2R was the longest range energy armament possible you pick the CERLLs.  If what you wanted was the largest damage groupings from energy weapons you pick the CERPPCs, but if what you'd wanted was big energy weapon damage groupings you'd pick three PPCs over 2 PPCs and an AC-5 and the MAD-2R would look rather different.

I'm lookin mainly at a straight-across-trade out, rather than a complete and total redesign.  we see enough total redesigns (Phoenixhawk IIC anyone?).

a "C" design, to my mind, would be a first iteration upgrade based on the original's basic profile.  thus, double heats, ERPPC's and a ballistic combination fits the original profile and design paradigm.  a slight improvement in hit probability would likely also occur, and protection from ammunition explosions is almost an assumed, but all-energy configuration? seems more like moving from "improving an existing design" into "building an icebox custom" territory.
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

Karack Blackstone

  • Lieutenant
  • *
  • Posts: 990
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #18 on: 20 December 2019, 10:25:50 »
Tinkering...

Code: [Select]
Marauder C X1

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3040
Cost: 16,707,250 C-Bills
Battle Value: 3,109

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  Gauss Rifle
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    1  Light Active Probe
    1  ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 1 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             17(34)                    7.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LA, 2 RA
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12.00
    Armor Locations: 1 HD, 5 LT, 1 RA
    CASE Locations: RT                                                     0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           36       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2.00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2.00
Gauss Rifle                                  RT        1         6        12.00
Light Active Probe                           CT        0         1         0.50
ECM Suite                                    CT        0         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (16)                            RT        -         2         2.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             LT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 31
4j         6       6       4       0      3     1   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: LPRB, RCN, ECM, CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 37351
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #19 on: 20 December 2019, 17:14:20 »
I'm lookin mainly at a straight-across-trade out, rather than a complete and total redesign.  we see enough total redesigns (Phoenixhawk IIC anyone?).

a "C" design, to my mind, would be a first iteration upgrade based on the original's basic profile.  thus, double heats, ERPPC's and a ballistic combination fits the original profile and design paradigm.  a slight improvement in hit probability would likely also occur, and protection from ammunition explosions is almost an assumed, but all-energy configuration? seems more like moving from "improving an existing design" into "building an icebox custom" territory.
Well, there was the Marauder II...

Cannonshop

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 10497
Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #20 on: 20 December 2019, 22:24:47 »
Tinkering...

Code: [Select]
Marauder C X1

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-E-A
Production Year: 3040
Cost: 16,707,250 C-Bills
Battle Value: 3,109

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    2  ER PPCs
    1  Gauss Rifle
    2  Medium Pulse Lasers
    1  Light Active Probe
    1  ECM Suite
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 1 RA, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine:             XL Fusion Engine             300                       9.50
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 LT, 2 RT                                         4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             17(34)                    7.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LA, 2 RA
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12.00
    Armor Locations: 1 HD, 5 LT, 1 RA
    CASE Locations: RT                                                     0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           36       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER PPC                                       RA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           RA        4         1         2.00
ER PPC                                       LA        15        2         6.00
Medium Pulse Laser                           LA        4         1         2.00
Gauss Rifle                                  RT        1         6        12.00
Light Active Probe                           CT        0         1         0.50
ECM Suite                                    CT        0         1         1.00
@Gauss Rifle (16)                            RT        -         2         2.00
@Gauss Rifle (8)                             LT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 31
4j         6       6       4       0      3     1   Structure:  4
Special Abilities: LPRB, RCN, ECM, CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

This is more or less what I'd imagine a Marauder-C would look like. fair durability and a hell of a lot of firepower with a small upgrade in mobility, but basically familiar to anyone who cut their teeth on a Marauder's base model.
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

Daryk

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #21 on: 21 December 2019, 06:04:17 »
"Fair" durability? ???

It's only one point of armor short, and has CASE...

Hptm. Streiger

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #22 on: 21 December 2019, 06:08:50 »
Already get in a range where I might consider to choose the initially not optimized Marauder IIC.
Ok Minus the JumpJets

the fascinating about the Marauder IIC is that it would work good enough as a 75t Mech as well.... 22 DHS, and a 229 of 230 possible armor points, of course, no Small Lasers. - for vanilla, simple drop the ERPPCs in favour of LPLs and add TC and jumpjets (although the MPL have to go for ERMs)
« Last Edit: 21 December 2019, 07:50:31 by Hptm. Streiger »

bluedragon7

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #23 on: 21 December 2019, 12:13:12 »
Isn’t there already a C model? I remember CLPL replacing ISPPCs relatively early in the invasion as a second line refit of captured Marauders (and other IS mechs)

Karack Blackstone

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #24 on: 23 December 2019, 19:40:07 »
"Fair" durability? ???

It's only one point of armor short, and has CASE...

I built that variant with an LAP and ECM, those can easily be traded out for an ER Small Laser and a DHS if it's an issue. The design is pretty solid; more responding to the user you're responding to as well. That MAD C X1 is NOT a mech that's a trifling foe. Trust me, it's a rather potent Sniper and can also somewhat mix it up in close.

The most common weakness of Wolf mechs is they ain't got hops. No Jump Jets. This thing actually does. If it ever came up, drop the 4 JJ's and that's four tons for more toys to pew pew with across the battlefield. I have as of late been making designs assuming that at least one person in universe can Skunkwerks up a design on the drawing board and have an idea of what comes beforehand. Throughout this entire thread, the Marauder C X1 is the only one I'd honestly consider worthy of being actually built.

Daryk

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #25 on: 23 December 2019, 19:46:54 »
The only "weakness" I can remotely conceive of is that it has an XL engine, but a clan XL isn't an instant kill with the loss of a side torso, so I'm really not sure where they were coming from.

Karack Blackstone

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #26 on: 23 December 2019, 19:52:39 »
The only "weakness" I can remotely conceive of is that it has an XL engine, but a clan XL isn't an instant kill with the loss of a side torso, so I'm really not sure where they were coming from.

Agreed, however I don't normally read minds, so I won't.

If anything, do you have further points to add? I'd say build that MAD C X1 and expect it to kill things that normally just look at a Clan mech and say, "Okay, seen one, seen 'em all." As a Clan design, it's pretty much a slight rework of the new 3048/3050 MAD-4R; Gauss Rifle for the pain, and to boot, three tons of ammo instead of just one!

Yeah, this thing would SUCK to face; it hits hard, can take the hurt equal to a Mad Cat, and can JUMP. Even with a Clan XL engine it's basically near-Zombie, just +10 Heat if either Side torso is popped and can't lose both. For a Clan mech, to go Zombie it'd at LEAST lose that GR. And that I think is worth keeping both; the GR backing up Paired Clan ER PPC's is going to seriously hurt, especially when it can volley fire 24 times with the GR and not care about ammo for the C-ER PPC's because LOL Fusion Engine.

I initially read that and at first it seemed okay, the Fair did rub me the wrong way; it took your post for me to make sense of why.

Daryk

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #27 on: 23 December 2019, 21:24:10 »
The only think I have to add would be this alternative with LPLs vice PPCs...
Code: [Select]
MAD-CXP

Mass: 75 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Advanced Rules
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D-A
Production Year: 3070
Dry Cost: 7,744,625 C-Bills
Total Cost: 7,784,625 C-Bills
Battle Value: 2,402

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 300 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
    1  Gauss Rifle
    2  Large Pulse Lasers
    2  ER Small Lasers
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel                   114 points                4.00
    Internal Locations: 2 LT, 1 RT, 1 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Engine:             Fusion Engine                300                      19.00
    Walking MP: 4
    Running MP: 6
    Jumping MP: 4 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 2 CT, 1 LT, 1 RT                                   4.00
Heat Sinks:         Double Heat Sink             13(26)                    3.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               3.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA    R: SH+UA+LA
Armor:              Ferro-Fibrous                AV - 230                 12.00
    Armor Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LA, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
    CASE Locations: LT                                                     0.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            9         
                                        Center Torso     23           36       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  9         
                                           L/R Torso     16           24       
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  8         
                                             L/R Arm     12           24       
                                             L/R Leg     16           32       

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gauss Rifle                                  LT        1         6        12.00
ER Small Laser                               RA        2         1         0.50
Large Pulse Laser                            RA        10        2         6.00
ER Small Laser                               LA        2         1         0.50
Large Pulse Laser                            LA        10        2         6.00
@Gauss Rifle (16)                            LT        -         2         2.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 15

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      8    Points: 24
4j         5       5       4       0      3     0   Structure:  6
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Cannonshop

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #28 on: 24 December 2019, 12:44:01 »
"Fair" durability? ???

It's only one point of armor short, and has CASE...

XL fusion-it can lose one side torso, but not two. LOL.
"If you have to ask permission, then it's no longer a Right, it has been turned into a Privilege-something that can be and will be taken from you when convenient."

Daryk

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #29 on: 24 December 2019, 16:28:21 »
That's what I mentioned above, but I think that's still somewhere north of "fair"...

Wolf72

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #30 on: 24 December 2019, 18:54:25 »
I got lazy on mine, stuck with 75 tons, but went 3 ER PPCs as only weapons.
"We're caught in the moon's gravitational pull, what do we do?!"

CI KS #1357; Merc KS #9798

"We're sending a squad up."

Daryk

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Re: Marauder C - 75 Ton Second Line Clan Redesign
« Reply #31 on: 24 December 2019, 19:00:06 »
That seems to work... and it even has room for hands, not that clanners use those...

 

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