Clan Protectorate

[Church14]

And ilClan state, centered on Terra, with a two jump (60LY) buffer around earth, would directly boarder the Clan Protectorate...  if not directly bordering the planet Marik. 

It looks like the 3rd League is occupying most of Prefecture X by the end of 3151.

You’re incorrect regarding the Wolfes by end of June 3152. We know the Bears didn’t concede either planet near Terra. We know DC kept every planet given the DD map’s contours. We see the wolves didn’t expand more than one jump back up the old Falcon territory. They didn’t advance a single planet into the FWL near Terra. There’s only like… 6 or 7 systems near Terra we don’t know about.

Assuming that CapCon get's thrown back or pulls back, there wouldn't be much to stop the ilClan from completing the expansion in what used to be prefecture VII (the FWL slice). With Nicole invading the Empire at New Olympia in mid 3152 and at least part of the Clan Protectorate (Beta Strike Cluster, some Spirit Cats) on the losing side of that Battle, the time to make a decision is fast approaching... if it hasn't already been made by  Petr Kalasa, and he's just forgotten to tell his partners.

I need to have someone sell me on expecting CapCon to lose more than 1 or two planets. Wolves don’t have the numbers.

Spirit Cats aren’t on New Olympia. Beta Strike Cluster lost on Stewart, then lost on Danais, and now sit on Merak. New Olympia is two wolf clusters and some trainees fighting two FWL regiments.

Also, where are Wolfes getting the forces to secure all these planets? Cause it isn’t Terra. Terra’s population is waaaaaay too small to recruit endless legions. Prefecture VII is 26 systems. Prefecture X is 24. How did the wolves, with 25ish clusters, drive back something like 35 regiments? How do wolves garrison hostile worlds while maintaining a garrison on Terra large enough?

The answer is they don’t. If the protectorate sides with the ilclan, they will fight alone. The empire can’t help itself effectively, how would they help the Spirit cats?

[Minemech]

 The choice to focus on the Empire is not so much an abandonment of the Terran Corridor as an acknowledgement of the raw danger the Empire's position poses if left alone in the long term. The League has moved from nearly completely indefensible to a bad position. Not too long ago, Regulus, a powerful Magistracy, the Andies, the Marians, an aggressive Empire and a potent Confederation made the League's borders indefensible. Regulus has (Been) returned home, Andurien is completely distracted on a foolish expedition meant to protect bona fides, the Confederation is distracted, the Marians have been trashed (Though only contained strictly speaking), and it is known that the Empire cannot defend itself from an offensive that has already reclaimed vital League military manufacturing power as well as iconic worlds. Knocking the Empire out of its coreward position will not only regain the League its production capabilities (From which the Empire very recently outproduced the entire League) but place it in a more tolerable position. This is actually better for the Cats and Augustine Alliance alike. It is also enabled by a massive Capellan expeditionary force aimed at Terra.

 As for the Spirit Cats (And mercenary Steel Wolves), they will benefit from the League in the long term. As for the Foxes, they are a bit rapid at the moment. It would be a brilliant twist if the Cats propped up Kenyon for legitimacy on the planet Marik.

[Geg]

You’re incorrect regarding the Wolfes by end of June 3152. We know the Bears didn’t concede either planet near Terra. We know DC kept every planet given the DD map’s contours. We see the wolves didn’t expand more than one jump back up the old Falcon territory. They didn’t advance a single planet into the FWL near Terra. There’s only like… 6 or 7 systems near Terra we don’t know about.

We know from the Alpha Strike box set that in when the NWH were sent to reconnoiter Caph they were expecting to find Capellens, and instead found a garrison of Jade Falcons.  Per Sarna, the Falcons had been on the planet since at least December 3151.  We know from the 2023 WWE that the 3rd League set out from Terra and its first target was New Earth, which puts that conflict in the 2nd half of 3151.  Now I will concede that two planets don't make all of Prefecture X...  but...

I need to have someone sell me on expecting CapCon to lose more than 1 or two planets. Wolves don’t have the numbers.

It looks like CapCon has lost at least New Earth and Caph to the 3rd League.

We also know from the end of Empire Alone that CapCon is getting invaded from both the MoC and the Duchy of Andurien on their Rimward side.  And we have seen art from IKEO that shows Danai Liao-Centrella sitting on the Celestial throne.  Between the these three data points it looks like Liao will be pulling back to deal with there succession crisis.  The Combine has its own issues and likewise might not want to maintain a salient near terra.  We however, know far less about the Combine.  The Bears and the Combine are still holding the 4 planets around Diron and Yorii at the mid point of 3152, but these systems are in the opposite direction of area I was discussing in the original post about the ilClan bordering the Protectorate, and don't directly impact the statement I was making.

Now I am making the OOU assumption that CGL won't declare an ilClan to have it snuffed out before it get's started.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this, and am more than happy to wait for IKEO to see what happens. 

If you have more information on that's happening past mid-3151, that I am missing, please share your sources, because I am sure I have missed something.

Spirit Cats aren’t on New Olympia. Beta Strike Cluster lost on Stewart, then lost on Danais, and now sit on Merak. New Olympia is two wolf clusters and some trainees fighting two FWL regiments.

Kara's Scorchers are sent on a mission to New Olympia to rescue Spirit Cat survivors in Vol 10 of Shrapnel.

Also, where are Wolfes getting the forces to secure all these planets? Cause it isn’t Terra. Terra’s population is waaaaaay too small to recruit endless legions. Prefecture VII is 26 systems. Prefecture X is 24. How did the wolves, with 25ish clusters, drive back something like 35 regiments? How do wolves garrison hostile worlds while maintaining a garrison on Terra large enough?

The answer is they don’t. If the protectorate sides with the ilclan, they will fight alone. The empire can’t help itself effectively, how would they help the Spirit cats?

I hope they tell us.  My guess is that the 3rd League will be pulling from more than the Wolf Touman.

[tassa_kay]

My guess is that the 3rd League will be pulling from more than the Wolf Touman.

Given that IKEO preview art (the Ravens especially got featured quite a lot, in space and on the ground) and the multi-Clan force vs Capellans on New Earth, I'd say that's more than a guess at this point.

[rebs]

That's honestly my biggest worry, and I think your analysis of Cats (of whatever flavor), absolutely distrusting - well, almost everyone - is a concern. All that said, it means the Cats are in an amazing position from a storytelling standpoint! :D

Seyla, warrior.  It's natural and could lead to a very cool and deadly incarnation of the Nova Cats.  Especially getting the Spirit Cat faction back into the fold.  Makes for a deadly brew and enough internal tension to tell some good stories with different levels of action and intrigue.

[Geg]

Seyla, warrior.  It's natural and could lead to a very cool and deadly incarnation of the Nova Cats.  Especially getting the Spirit Cat faction back into the fold.  Makes for a deadly brew and enough internal tension to tell some good stories with different levels of action and intrigue.

Since this is the Protectorate thread,  maybe the Nova will join the "numerically" superior Spirit Cats!

[rebs]

Since this is the Protectorate thread,  maybe the Nova will join the "numerically" superior Spirit Cats!

That's just as good of a prediction, you know! 

[Church14]

It looks like CapCon has lost at least New Earth and Caph to the 3rd League.

CapCon only took New Earth sometime in 3151. If the diorama and WWE still represent a canon battle (I have no reason to assume they don’t), we don’t know how that battle ended.

And Capellans never had Caph to our knowledge. NWH thought CCAF should be there, but that could just be an assumption that CapCon is taking what it can around Terra.

There’s 6 capellan worlds, 1 DC world, a couple ex-Falcon worlds, and like… 3 wolf Empire worlds we don’t know the fate of. If you extrapolate a bit from the EA and DD maps, you can make some guesses on a few of those worlds and none look like wolves took them. There’s always a chance something changes, so reading past the horizon is sketchy.

Now I am making the OOU assumption that CGL won't declare an ilClan to have it snuffed out before it get's started.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this, and am more than happy to wait for IKEO to see what happens. 

I agree with you. Both in universe and out of universe. While the wolves are in a trash fire position strategically, and they aren’t getting anywhere near the help they expected, nobody has the will, strategic reach, and necessary forces to take the wolves out. I just don’t think the Wolves have what they need to expand any time soon. I’m expecting a Faux League of a bare handful of worlds for a while. And I mean like… Terra plus 3 or 4 at most.

I hope they tell us.  My guess is that the 3rd League will be pulling from more than the Wolf Touman.

Agreed as well. Tasha already made one critical point. We see art of a second naval star around Terran corridor. I have an outside theory we’re gonna see the ravens migrate.

I think wolves will gain in total maybe cluster of falcons, a cluster of jags, maybe a cluster of Kisho’s nova cats, 5ish clusters of Foxes, and a couple Raven clusters (2-4). So maybe another ten total, but ones Alaric can’t just spend carefree. I also expect wolves to take meaningful losses in iKEO. Like 5 clusters worth of troops minimum. They shouldn’t be allowed to just dumpster Capellans like the Lyrans, Lyrans again, FWL, Republic, and Falcons all back to back. I have to hope that era of writing is over. Beating back that much CCAF should cost them.

I also think that a few years down the road, they’ll get a supply of Terran recruits. But both in universe and narratively, I don’t think it makes sense for them to get any soon.


Now, relevant to the protectorate, even with those clans contributing, Alaric can’t reach the protectorate to aid them. If the protectorate attacks the league, the protectorate should collapse. Especially with FWL units already inside it

[cmerwin]

Since this is the Protectorate thread,  maybe the Nova will join the "numerically" superior Spirit Cats!

Seyla!

Seyla, warrior.  It's natural and could lead to a very cool and deadly incarnation of the Nova Cats.  Especially getting the Spirit Cat faction back into the fold.  Makes for a deadly brew and enough internal tension to tell some good stories with different levels of action and intrigue.

Well said, trothkin, well said.

[tassa_kay]

And Capellans never had Caph to our knowledge. NWH thought CCAF should be there, but that could just be an assumption that CapCon is taking what it can around Terra.

ilClan shows the Capellans taking Caph and Sirius, actually.

[Church14]

ilClan shows the Capellans taking Caph and Sirius, actually.

Oh. Forgot or missed that. Thanks

[Metallgewitter]

This is the map at the end of the Ilclan trial

https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/1/1a/3151_Inner_Sphere_%28Sarna%29.svg?timestamp=20210905004623

The wolves have no "corridor" to the Bears, the Falcons or even their own Empire. Now let's assume the Capellans decide to expand to encircle Terra and gobble more of Prefecture X. New Earth is known but what about, say, Devil's Rock, Oliver, Graham and so on? Those planets are basically free for the taking as I doubt the Wolves left even a small garrison there. Those planets alone could feed the Capellan military with a lot of material (not to mention the Rhodes Workshops on Devil's Rock unless someone finally found the kill switch). And of course there is also the League that could cut right into the Empire severing that "arm" from Terra. The Protectorate can't do much here unless they decide to migrate to Terra (win / loss benefit analysis and all that). Of course there is always the joker in form of the Lyran Commonwealth who could also do their own reclamation war. And would that be the Foxyes and Cats? I doubt it. The Foxes most likely because they have a lot to loose. but the Cats might say "Marik is our safe haven, the League treats us well why change?"

[Church14]

This is the map at the end of the Ilclan trial

https://cfw.sarna.net/wiki/images/1/1a/3151_Inner_Sphere_%28Sarna%29.svg?timestamp=20210905004623

The wolves have no "corridor" to the Bears, the Falcons or even their own Empire. Now let's assume the Capellans decide to expand to encircle Terra and gobble more of Prefecture X. New Earth is known but what about, say, Devil's Rock, Oliver, Graham and so on? Those planets are basically free for the taking as I doubt the Wolves left even a small garrison there. Those planets alone could feed the Capellan military with a lot of material (not to mention the Rhodes Workshops on Devil's Rock unless someone finally found the kill switch). And of course there is also the League that could cut right into the Empire severing that "arm" from Terra. The Protectorate can't do much here unless they decide to migrate to Terra (win / loss benefit analysis and all that). Of course there is always the joker in form of the Lyran Commonwealth who could also do their own reclamation war. And would that be the Foxyes and Cats? I doubt it. The Foxes most likely because they have a lot to loose. but the Cats might say "Marik is our safe haven, the League treats us well why change?"

This map is wrong. Not by a lot, but off. Imbros and Yori’s fell the the RasDom in ilclan. Apparently Capellans took caph and Sirius. New Earth’s status as of the ilclan trial was not RotS.

The EA map shows Xi Ursae, zavijava, Lipton, and Graham as owned by the wolves in June 3152. There are no notes in EA for any of them, so Capellans could have gone for some and been pushed back. That does leave the fate of Thorin, new earth, Sirius, Rigel kentares, Caph, and some Capellans worlds in general unknown.

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

There's an AMA going on with Ray and Aaron C. on Reddit right now, I asked about the upcoming Spirit Cat Nova Cat novel. My question.

Will Randall N. Bill's upcoming Spirit Cat/Nova Cat novel spend time in the Dark Age between 3137-3150 to show how the Spirit Cats adjusted to ruling/assimilating (or not) Marik? Or will it only be in the IlClan era (3151+)?

Aaron's answer.

More of a Randall question--we haven't seen a draft yet--but iirc there are some elements of "what has Kisho been doing and where has he been?" that hit on that DA era.

[Metallgewitter]

That sounds as if Kisho is hell bent on trying to reach the Clan Protectorate. Not the worst of choices as this seems to be a rather quiet zone of the Is for now. Even with the League going to war at least for a time there won't be much chance of counterstrikes by the Wolves. Only case I see would be if the Protectorate decides to side with the Wolves... Oh dear...

[Geg]

If I had known about the AMA in advance, I would have asked....

Which cat clan makes it in the ilClan era.   Nova or Spirit Cats?

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

If I had known about the AMA in advance, I would have asked....

Which cat clan makes it in the ilClan era.   Nova or Spirit Cats?

Spirit Cats are Nova Cats. There has never been, and probably won't be, a Clan Spirit Cat. Rikkard Nova Cat has never called himself Rikkard Spirit Cat. The Spirit Cats were always a movement of the most motivated Nova Cats in Republic space to find a haven for the Nova Cats.

If/when Kisho does indeed make it to Marik, I have a feeling he will end up the Oathmaster of a reborn Clan Nova Cat, with Rikkard (Bedford, can a man dream?) as Khan.

[Geg]

Spirit Cats are Nova Cats. There has never been, and probably won't be, a Clan Spirit Cat. Rikkard Nova Cat has never called himself Rikkard Spirit Cat. The Spirit Cats were always a movement of the most motivated Nova Cats in Republic space to find a haven for the Nova Cats.

If/when Kisho does indeed make it to Marik, I have a feeling he will end up the Oathmaster of a reborn Clan Nova Cat, with Rikkard (Bedford, can a man dream?) as Khan.

But the Logos.... the logos matter!

[Metallgewitter]

While we are at it: when the Spirit Cats came for Tucker Harvell on Wyatt the Spirit Cat leader told him that he wasn't the man in his dreams (I think he saw him as a kind of saviour or leader). Was that plot line ever continued? Or did this change for finding a safe haven for the Cats to hunker down?

[Geg]

While we are at it: when the Spirit Cats came for Tucker Harvell on Wyatt the Spirit Cat leader told him that he wasn't the man in his dreams (I think he saw him as a kind of saviour or leader). Was that plot line ever continued? Or did this change for finding a safe haven for the Cats to hunker down?

Was Cox Devalis(???) under orders from Rosse?

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

While we are at it: when the Spirit Cats came for Tucker Harvell on Wyatt the Spirit Cat leader told him that he wasn't the man in his dreams (I think he saw him as a kind of saviour or leader). Was that plot line ever continued? Or did this change for finding a safe haven for the Cats to hunker down?

During the Dark Age a lot of Spirit Cats had myriad visions. Malisa Nova Cat had a vision of herself defending a wounded Nova Cat against dozens of barbarians in different colored armor. Cox Devalis (The Spirit Cat who landed on Wyatt) had his vision of a lightbringer of sorts, but decided it wasn't Tucker. He later on rejoined Clan Nova Cat in the DC and fled presumably with Kisho Nova Cat, based on "It Ends in Fire" in Shrapnel #12. Angus Drummond had some sort of vision but I can't remember what it was about.

And of course Kev Rosse had all of his visions, including the one of his own death, or the death of Clan Nova Cat...

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

Thought this might interest the thread. From IlClan Recognition Guide V.9, Valkyrie notable pilot entry.

Star Captain Maren Averitt: Growing up near a major Nova Cat enclave on Cyrenaica, young Averitt was always fascinated by the strange Clan culture. Upon
graduating from Sun Zhang, her unspoken desire was to serve alongside one of the Nova Cat units defending the Combine’s border. She never got that chance, but
the Nova Cat Rebellion of 3141 offered her a different opportunity. Disgusted at the treatment of Nova Cat non-combatants by the victorious Combine forces on
Sadalbari, Averitt convinced her lancemates to defect and escort a group of Clan civilians through enemy lines and former Republic space to safety in the Clan Protectorate. After such a heroic and a perilous journey, Averitt became the only non-Clan officer in the First Protectorate Guardians, where she and her Valkyrie continue to serve.

[Geg]

Thought this might interest the thread. From IlClan Recognition Guide V.9, Valkyrie notable pilot entry.

That's my Canon character.   Absolutely thrilled how it turned out.

[jklantern]

It's always so cool to see someone on here have their character canonized.

[cmerwin]

That's my Canon character.   Absolutely thrilled how it turned out.

Holy sith! Seriously?! That's super cool! Congrats!

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

According to Phil Lee, his next House Marik book, "Letter of the Law" will cover Empire Alone events and will "scratch the Spirit Cats itch".

[Metallgewitter]

According to Phil Lee, his next House Marik book, "Letter of the Law" will cover Empire Alone events and will "scratch the Spirit Cats itch".

Sounds like we get for one the events sorrounding Makina Kays death and possibly the ramifications of the Foxes decision to help the Empire which rankled more then one Spirit Cat. And perhaps the debate to go to war with the Empire at the end.

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

Just got my hands on Letter of the Law, by Phil Lee, lot of Protectorate stuff in there.

The Clan Protectorate has a Council of sorts made up of warriors. Only into Chapter 2 so far though.

[Colt Ward]

And the author forgot that Rikkard had finally gotten something besides a Firestarter.

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

And the author forgot that Rikkard had finally gotten something besides a Firestarter.

He seems to flip-flop between his Firestarter and Shadow Hawk IIC frequently. He was originally a Firestarter pilot in the Dark Age, he got a Shadow Hawk IIC in Pandora's Gambit, went back to the Firestarter in Hunting Season, went back to the Shadow Hawk IIC on his pilot card, and is back to Firestarter in Letter of the Law.