Author Topic: Robotech license renewed  (Read 4062 times)

Luciora

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Robotech license renewed
« on: 05 July 2019, 20:52:03 »
https://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/robotech/282027/the-robotechmacross-license-has-been-extended-exclusive

Mods - I am acutely aware of how touchy this subject is.  Feel free to lock/delete if needed.

Daryk

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #1 on: 05 July 2019, 21:19:42 »
 xp

ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #2 on: 05 July 2019, 21:39:24 »
Also confirmed on Twitter.

I suppose this clears the movie for go-ahead, since they won't risk losing rights during production.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #3 on: 05 July 2019, 22:31:25 »
I saw this on Macross World... is there a Credible news source that can verify this? I want to be crystal clear certain that the end of the world is happening before I jump off the building.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #4 on: 05 July 2019, 23:08:44 »
I saw this on Macross World... is there a Credible news source that can verify this? I want to be crystal clear certain that the end of the world is happening before I jump off the building.

TEOTWAWKI? I doubt it. Remember that HG was pretty definitively told to pound sand by the courts (or, at the very least, agreed to go pound sand and never bother Catalyst/PGI/HBS ever again over these designs)  in Unseen II: Electric Boogaloo last year :)

However, as a Macross fan, it IS kinda galling and annoying (though not sadly, not unexpected) and that's all the mods are probably going to let me say about that...
« Last Edit: 05 July 2019, 23:11:03 by Pat Payne »

glitterboy2098

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #5 on: 05 July 2019, 23:37:51 »
the good news is that that HG and tatsunoko have now admitted before a court that they don't own the art for the "41 characters" (aka the main characters and all the mecha), so attempts to sue battletech over art design should be reduced.

so long as BT continues to use the new Classics, there shouldn't be issues.

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #6 on: 05 July 2019, 23:42:23 »
I wouldn't necessarily count on being openly in the wrong stopping Harmony Gold...
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Tymers Realm

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #7 on: 05 July 2019, 23:47:29 »
so long as BT continues to use the new Classics, there shouldn't be issues.

I imagine HG will try again. Maybe once the Sony project makes it's way out of development hell...
I'm just concerned they'll actually hire competent and aggressive lawyers this time around...

ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #8 on: 06 July 2019, 00:03:11 »
Meant to link this one earlier.

https://twitter.com/RobotechNews/status/1147313462755778560

That's the official PR statement.  Since then, on RobotechNews, there's been a whole series of announcements re the film and further licensing from Sony; what that entails I haven't looked close at yet but that's where we stand post-Anime Expo announcement.
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ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #9 on: 06 July 2019, 00:20:02 »
Well, this is interesting.  The exclusive news article on denofgeek.com explains the situation, but also brings up that Big West is still the owner of the 41 "character" designs which has been a problem for Robotech using them ever since.  Come the San Diego Comic Con, they're going to have a pretty major panel now labeled "Robotech: The Great Transition" which was announced after all the contracts with Sony and other companies signed for the license and for movie deals, plus a rehash of what the movie deal currently stands at without any new info since last year.

Could they be pulling a major retcon with their mecha and character designs, and rebooting the universe to tie in with the film?  Speculation, but possible.  It'd free them of the BW designs, as well as anything of Battletech, and give them the chance to come up with something all new.

I wonder if the Unseen are going to end up that way for both companies...
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Luciora

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #10 on: 06 July 2019, 00:23:56 »
HG should have already had new art in the can for the Macross saga mechs and characters.  There were attempts from Palladium, but so far the current generation of games authorized from HG are still using the Big West/Studio Nue designs. 

ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #11 on: 06 July 2019, 00:26:36 »
Then again they completely canned any and all Palladium product, including the Macross Tactics minis line.  If they ARE "rebooting" the universe with this Great Transition thing, well, they'd need to ditch the entire extant product line and start over with new designs.  So getting rid of the RPG and board games makes sense in that regard.

ENTIRELY SPECULATIVE but it's one possibility that at least loosely fits.  Who knows, maybe they just didn't like Kevin's aftershave.
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Liam's Ghost

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #12 on: 06 July 2019, 00:53:41 »
There are actually two new robotech RPGs in the wild (well, one might still be in development). The cover of one seems to still use the original art.

(I've been struggling with buying one of them because RPGing in robotech is close to my nostalgic heart, but also I don't want Harmony Gold getting any of my money. It's a conundrum).
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Lorcan Nagle

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #13 on: 06 July 2019, 03:58:23 »
Brutal honesty time:  anyone who thought that the BattleTech lawsuit was going mark the end of HG and Tatsunoko's relationship was fooling themselves.  They've been working together for decades, Tatsunoko were happy enough to renew the license before now, after HG's license in perpetuity claims were dismissed.  Why would a failed lawsuit make any difference?
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ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #14 on: 06 July 2019, 04:51:03 »
Primarily because of the ownership over the Big West 41, and the really questionable claims that HGUSA was making in the lawsuit.  Asserting copyright ownership is one thing, but some of those claims were deeply suspect under scenes a faire law.  It potentially showed questionable judgement in the maintaining of the copyright, plus the fact that what they were suing over was (at least in Japanese courts, and legally acknowledged in US courts) never something Tatsunoko owned in the first place.  I was hoping for an update on the whole thing from Leonard French; he'd done one video on the situation and was following it but the settlement (and its private terms) happened before he could follow up on things.

The big thing was not so much the Battletech lawsuit, but the very related arbitration that happened concurrently that nuked their ownership of the characters and mecha; they have legal access to the X hours of anime that exist but that's it - anything new requires new art designs.

Reasons they'd stick WITH HGUSA is, of course, 30 years of active relationship, plus the 8 or 9 figure film deal being kicked around.  Which is still on in a big way apparently, and is something I'm immensely curious about come the Great Transition panel at SDCC.  Which I suspect, as stated before, is likely a reboot announcement.
« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 04:52:38 by ANS Kamas P81 »
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Pat Payne

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #15 on: 06 July 2019, 11:07:41 »
Reasons they'd stick WITH HGUSA is, of course, 30 years of active relationship, plus the 8 or 9 figure film deal being kicked around.  Which is still on in a big way apparently, and is something I'm immensely curious about come the Great Transition panel at SDCC.  Which I suspect, as stated before, is likely a reboot announcement.

Could be definitely an at least visual reboot. As I'd mused earlier, Sony would almost certainly insist on a redesign for at least three reasons:
1) The obvious legal irregularities over ownership of the Macross art that would make it a minefield to screen in Japan -- and let's not kid ourselves, the Macross saga is the one that most people outside the fandom think of when they think Robotech (if they think of it at all), so that's the most likely to be adapted first;
2) The art could look dated to millennial audiences, and they'd want updates that would fit a modern aesthetic (think of how they messed with the Transformers until wiser heads prevailed with the recent Bumblebee movie)
3) Merch. Again, being able to sell Robotech movie merch worldwide, including Japan. NOBODY is going to repeat Twentieth Century Fox's mistake with passing on merchandising for the original Star Wars.

But it may only be a partial visual reboot to suit Sony. Since Tatsunoko would have an absolute interest in shopping Mospeada and Southern Cross (as they are Tatsunoko shows) and a proprietary interest in Macross (as they do own the international distro rights for the actual episodes), they'd be unlikely to let HG totally cast that into the dustbin in favor of whatever Sony might suggest.
« Last Edit: 06 July 2019, 11:12:54 by Pat Payne »

Solarmech

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #16 on: 06 July 2019, 13:45:07 »
(Noticed thread and that some people have made some incorrect assumptions)
Really don't care about the RT license being extended (Though I was surprised), but here are some facts. While it's 100% true that HG doesn't own the artwork for the Macross mecha, that isn't the point. All that means is that HG can't make new material (animation) using those designs. What HG does have license/rights for (through Tatsunoko) is the exploitation of the images in other forms outside of Japan. Comic books, novels, games and the like. Several other companies had rights to importing toys and models (Revel had a license to import some model kits just to give an example.) from Tatsunoko. I have no clue on the status of the importing licenses, but I image that most expired a long time ago. Also HG probably still have the copyright to the name "Macross" as well unless something happened on that front I didn't hear about. And a very important note: A license to import models does NOT give rights for anything else than allowing the importing of models. Also Big West can't grant a license to anyone (outside of Japan) to use the Macross images for anything except new material. So they can't give a license for toys, models or games (like they would anyway). No idea if this makes a real difference to the Robotech movie since it's been stuck in development hell and I really don't think it will ever leave. Which is probably a good thing in my book.

(Goes back to lurking) sm 

Alexander Knight

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #17 on: 06 July 2019, 14:29:04 »
There are actually two new robotech RPGs in the wild (well, one might still be in development). The cover of one seems to still use the original art.

(I've been struggling with buying one of them because RPGing in robotech is close to my nostalgic heart, but also I don't want Harmony Gold getting any of my money. It's a conundrum).

Liam:

https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/273522/Robotech-A-Macross-Saga-RPG-SWAdE

This is a decent one.

ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #18 on: 06 July 2019, 17:53:33 »
Even with the recent Bumblebee movie there's still drastic differences between the cartoon portrayal and the one we got on TV for the little yellow bugbot.  That said, it was evocative enough of the original that it satisfied audience expectations and still looked cool on the big screen.  Same reason we get visual remakes for the Star Trek universe, which has been going on since 1979's Motion Picture reimagined the D7 and the Klingons. 

Hell, for that matter, "evocative of the source material while being legitimately new design work" is something we should all be deliciously familiar and happy about these days.  Look at all the MWO and Shimmy Classics and how great they look, and how much they've updated the look of Battletech.  Time for Robotech to do the same.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #19 on: 06 July 2019, 18:27:37 »
I am, meh. I have my Legacy DVDs, and all but one of the RPG books, I do not plan to get more of the same. I have an AU I ran for a game that the players enjoyed.

It seems to me that, recently, HG has been unable and/or unwilling to create new content. IMHO all they have done is just repackage the same story in different comics.

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Liam's Ghost

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #20 on: 06 July 2019, 21:54:07 »
Liam:

https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/273522/Robotech-A-Macross-Saga-RPG-SWAdE

This is a decent one.

That's the one I was considering. I even bought the savage worlds core book. I just haven't been able to bring myself to pull the trigger on the robotech book.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #21 on: 06 July 2019, 22:34:34 »
Boooooooooooo
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #22 on: 06 July 2019, 23:39:37 »
That's the one I was considering. I even bought the savage worlds core book. I just haven't been able to bring myself to pull the trigger on the robotech book.

It's worth it, imho.  Even has a "quick mission generator" to help the GM.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #23 on: 07 July 2019, 00:15:05 »
(Noticed thread and that some people have made some incorrect assumptions)
Really don't care about the RT license being extended (Though I was surprised), but here are some facts. While it's 100% true that HG doesn't own the artwork for the Macross mecha, that isn't the point. All that means is that HG can't make new material (animation) using those designs. What HG does have license/rights for (through Tatsunoko) is the exploitation of the images in other forms outside of Japan. Comic books, novels, games and the like. Several other companies had rights to importing toys and models (Revel had a license to import some model kits just to give an example.) from Tatsunoko. I have no clue on the status of the importing licenses, but I image that most expired a long time ago. Also HG probably still have the copyright to the name "Macross" as well unless something happened on that front I didn't hear about. And a very important note: A license to import models does NOT give rights for anything else than allowing the importing of models. Also Big West can't grant a license to anyone (outside of Japan) to use the Macross images for anything except new material. So they can't give a license for toys, models or games (like they would anyway). No idea if this makes a real difference to the Robotech movie since it's been stuck in development hell and I really don't think it will ever leave. Which is probably a good thing in my book.

(Goes back to lurking) sm

This is incorrect in at least one case--Big West managed to gain the Macross trademark in the UK, and it's highly likely that EU may follow suit.
https://trademarks.ipo.gov.uk/ipo-tmcase/page/Results/1/UK00003235006

They also have secured trademark protection in Australia.

So the license is renewed in those areas where Tatsunoko has the right to renew it. This likely means that a movie is a dead letter (or changed so much it isn't recognizable as to having any ties to Macross).


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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #24 on: 07 July 2019, 04:19:36 »
Two things

1) Honestly, given all that has happened with the lawsuits and the like, this should have no effect whatsoever on the Battletech franchise forthcoming. Yes, we will never get the original Unseen Artwork back, but at the same time, there's no real need for it anymore either. Battetech can continue using Macross-derived designs in their current form (Anthony Scoggins redesigns or MWO redesigns) from here to eternity and there's nothing that Harmony Gold can do about it. For Battletech fans, this outcome is meaningless. If anything, HG losing the licence could be worse as it could open the way for new parties with their own suits.

2) That Tatsunko chose to renew the licence is no surprise either. Despite the various disagreements (including court cases) between the two, Tatsunko have plenty of reasons to want to keep the licence in Harmony Gold's hands. The mutual bad blood between them and Big West/Studio Nue - one of those situations where both parties are at fault - means that they'd prefer a situation that keeps the licence in HG's hands rather than letting BW/SN potentially get them back.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #25 on: 07 July 2019, 12:09:08 »
Well, this will be long renewed contract for decades to come.  (sigh)
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #26 on: 07 July 2019, 15:20:36 »
Two things

1) Honestly, given all that has happened with the lawsuits and the like, this should have no effect whatsoever on the Battletech franchise forthcoming. Yes, we will never get the original Unseen Artwork back, but at the same time, there's no real need for it anymore either. Battetech can continue using Macross-derived designs in their current form (Anthony Scoggins redesigns or MWO redesigns) from here to eternity and there's nothing that Harmony Gold can do about it. For Battletech fans, this outcome is meaningless. If anything, HG losing the licence could be worse as it could open the way for new parties with their own suits.

As someone who never got into macross/robotech (I was about 3-5 years late) this is the only part that made me clench my teeth a little when I saw the headline. Don’t need that drama again

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #27 on: 07 July 2019, 16:05:56 »
Question comes down to...what happens to us and our game universe. Is the Classics enough cut the mustered with those patent trolls?
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ANS Kamas P81

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #28 on: 07 July 2019, 16:23:42 »
Question comes down to...what happens to us and our game universe. Is the Classics enough cut the mustered with those patent trolls?
As has been determined in the recent settlement, yes.  It doesn't affect BATTLETECH, but there's a lot of how it affects the Macross anime series.  And I imagine a lot of us are at least somewhat fans of Macross and want to see it spread...and maybe there's just a little bit of anger towards the way HGUSA handled things.

But that's been settled (literally) and is done, and BT goes forward without further legal complaint.  Which as was pointed out, if some other company got the rights, they might not be as bound - though any further lawsuit defense would likely cite the last one as prior ruling since it was legally accepted.  Either way, we're in the clear, and the Shimseen are visually the best thing that's happened to Battletech since Loose started things back in '85.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #29 on: 08 July 2019, 01:43:36 »
I'll be honest here.  My only real concern with HG getting the renewal is what will it mean for that Savage World game I linked.  The creators have said they plan to do Southern Cross and Invid Invasion and I really wanna see those eras.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #30 on: 08 July 2019, 02:14:39 »
well for one it means they'll be able to continue making that game. if HG had lost the license they'd lose the RPG sub-license.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #31 on: 08 July 2019, 08:48:50 »
I wonder if there is some animosity between Tatsunoko and Big West / Studio Nue still?  I had seen mention of it, but couldn't track it down.  My feeling is if Sony wants a movie they can market in Japan, the Macross era designs had better change, and that should have been priority once the original Big West / Studio Nue settlement occurred banning HG from future use at the time. 

HG seems determined to bury it if they can't buy it and it looks like a better organized bully tactic, this time only with possible Sony backing.  All the current games being developed using Macross as the base, especially the new minis game should have been using original redesigns as well, to me.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #32 on: 08 July 2019, 10:34:43 »
I wonder if there is some animosity between Tatsunoko and Big West / Studio Nue still?  I had seen mention of it, but couldn't track it down.  My feeling is if Sony wants a movie they can market in Japan, the Macross era designs had better change, and that should have been priority once the original Big West / Studio Nue settlement occurred banning HG from future use at the time. 

HG seems determined to bury it if they can't buy it and it looks like a better organized bully tactic, this time only with possible Sony backing.  All the current games being developed using Macross as the base, especially the new minis game should have been using original redesigns as well, to me.

It's been described as BW hoping that Tatsunoko dies a violent death... in those exact terms. That's why the VF-0 in battroid mode is taller than the production VF-1, the creation of the New UN Spacy (as well as the redesigned kite for Frontier)... even the redesigns from Macross: The First. those were not only artistic updates, they were legal moves as well.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #33 on: 08 July 2019, 10:38:45 »
Aha, that explains alot.

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #34 on: 08 July 2019, 17:23:14 »
This is one of those cases where nobody is the "good guy" and everybody is to blame in some way. The bad blood between Big West/Studio Nue and Tatsunko goes deep, and Tatsunko renewing Harmony Gold's licence is just a part of that feud.

The lack of western Macross releases is as much on Studio Nue and Tatsunko as it is Harmony Gold. Everybody is at fault here.
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Liam's Ghost

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #35 on: 08 July 2019, 17:28:38 »
Yes, but most of the community here has a grudge against Harmony Gold, therefore we're allowed to blame them for everything.

That's how grudges work, right?  :D

One of my reimagined Wasp miniatures fell off a shelf and broke an arm a few days ago, and I had to spend, like, five minutes repairing it and checking to see if it lost any paint. Those Harmony Gold bastards.
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Maingunnery

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #36 on: 08 July 2019, 17:36:48 »

I hope that they are successful in restyling all their assets away from BT & Macross.
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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #37 on: 08 July 2019, 17:40:15 »
+1 Liam... +1...  ;D

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Re: Robotech license renewed
« Reply #38 on: 08 July 2019, 22:29:07 »
Yes, but most of the community here has a grudge against Harmony Gold, therefore we're allowed to blame them for everything.

That's how grudges work, right?  :D

One of my reimagined Wasp miniatures fell off a shelf and broke an arm a few days ago, and I had to spend, like, five minutes repairing it and checking to see if it lost any paint. Those Harmony Gold bastards.

alright, i've fallen behind the times, how do i like a post?  ;D
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