HBS Battletech: Heavy Metal Expansion thread. What do you hope to see happen?

[FedRatCowboy]

Never to early to start talking about the Heavy Metal Expansion due out this "Winter 2019." What are you hoping for to be added to the game?

For me, I am hoping for the following:

1. Mechs, mechs, mechs. I expect that with a name like Heavy Metal, they bring a ton more Battlemechs into the game. I want to see Warhammers, Mauraders, Archers, Phoenix Hawks (PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD PLEASE), Crusaders, Chargers, Wolfhounds, Stingers, Wasps, Dervishes, and any other Battlemech that was is TRO: 3025. Even if that just have the base models, the fun I could have is incredible!!!!

2. Comstar as a reputation faction. As much as I hate Comstar, it might be fun to see what kind of goodies that they have in their stores.

3. Expand the star map as much as possible.

4. I know that this one will never happen, but: Multiple Lance drops. I would like to play a 2 or 3 lance drop on a map with each lance having different objectives. A more strategic feel for the game IMHO would be fun.

5. More moral bonuses. Add another moral bonus to the mix like an aerospace fighter strafing run or artillery strike.

6. More flash points. Include the MoC and the TC in the flash points.

[Jim1701]

Comstar won't sell goodies.  They'll lure you into their store, bash you on the back of the head and steal all your stuff.   :thumbsup:

[NickAragua]

I use mods quite heavily (Battletech Extended 3025: Commander Edition currently), so new mechs and variants aren't that big a deal for me.

I'd definitely like to see multiple lances dropping in. Not too often, as it a) slows down the game and b) probably makes it trivially easy - imagine being able to focus down a single target with eight mechs. Kind of like what the opfor can do now. In order to do multiple lances, they pretty much have to expand the map size, even as is it gets pretty cramped sometimes. And give us a Union or another Leopard.

However, aerospace support or artillery strikes would be pretty cool.

I've also read people's discussions on infantry. And, in my opinion, in the 3025 era, infantry is hopelessly awful. Can't really do any damage, and you're always one stray MG burst from a Locust short of a complete massacre. So maybe bunkers or something, but that's basically just another form of turret.

Honestly though, at this point, I'm kind of done with "minor improvements" to the game, though. Between Flashpoint and Urban Warfare, it feels like HBS has pretty much crammed as much as they could into the game as it is. Now it's time to move that timeline forward and get some serious 4th succession war action going.

[DarkSpade]

Well, aside from the obvious(mechs!)....

- No mechs locked behind flashpoints.

- More variety to the spawn points for me and the enemy.  I'm bored of starting in the same exact spot every time I play on a map and already knowing exactly where the enemy is going to be and where the reinforcements are going to come from.  There's a lot of maps where just having the player spawn at a different map edge would be like playing on a whole new map!

- A revamp of how reputation works.  The factions all take things way too personally.

- A new mission type.  No idea what it could be, but I never foresaw attack/defend or battle+ missions coming so there's no telling what they'll cook up.

- Improvements to how it picks opfor mechs.  Don't drown me in thunderbolts right when I start seeing heavies.  Give me sub par mechs in a class before I start seeing the good stuff.  In other words, don't have me start facing Zeuses and Victors when I've already got a highlander.

[Caedis Animus]

The ability to fight the remnants of the Directorate as a consequence-free loot pinata.

Something they took out when Urban Warfare dropped, for whatever reason.

[Firesprocket]

I believe the ability to add a sub contract ability would be nice.  Hire a lance of tanks, an artillery shot, or something else would seem cool if applied appropriately as some sort of re enforcement.

[Caedis Animus]

I believe the ability to add a sub contract ability would be nice.  Hire a lance of tanks, an artillery shot, or something else would seem cool if applied appropriately as some sort of re enforcement.

I like that idea. Add it in as a special ability you can call in using a sidebar in combat, or something.

Actually, that would allow for a pretty good framework if it was put on a collapsible sidebar in the UI or something. Either pay for a tank lance to drop in (With a C-Bill refund when they survive, or getting the strike back if they all survive), do a few favors and get a backup friendly militia lance if you're friendly with a faction and fighting an enemy in said faction's territory, or just call in for simple Long Tom strikes and the like. Buy the strikes and such before the battle, and call in the favor/vehicle lance/strike as needed and it drops at the end of the turn cycle.

Small additions like that could be routed through talking to Darius and Sumire, actually giving you a reason to talk to them lategame, as well.

[Firesprocket]

And while limited, would probably be feasible without having to rewrite code for the game from the ground up.  That is what would need to be done to have more than 1 PC controlled Lance.

[Triptych]

More of everything really, especially mechs- it kills the canon of the game when an occasional Black Knight or King Crab pops up but the Warhammer, Crusader and Marauder are nowhere to be seen. If the problem is the copyright on their images, then they ought to just do new but similar skins for them.

I'd like the chance to further modify the ship too.

I'd also like a new mini-campaign. Flashpoints are good, but they feel disjointed due to being one-offs.

Also, to be able to install ECM suites on other mechs, not just the Raven because sensor locks and missile barrages are kinda too meta.

[Nightlord01]

More of everything really, especially mechs- it kills the canon of the game when an occasional Black Knight or King Crab pops up but the Warhammer, Crusader and Marauder are nowhere to be seen. If the problem is the copyright on their images, then they ought to just do new but similar skins for them.

I'd like the chance to further modify the ship too.

I'd also like a new mini-campaign. Flashpoints are good, but they feel disjointed due to being one-offs.

Also, to be able to install ECM suites on other mechs, not just the Raven because sensor locks and missile barrages are kinda too meta.

I don't think BT canon is what they are aiming for with the mech amounts, the King Crab is incredibly rare, and we are in the periphery, so assault mechs should be hens teeth.

And while limited, would probably be feasible without having to rewrite code for the game from the ground up.  That is what would need to be done to have more than 1 PC controlled Lance.

A simple insert to provide artillery and airstrikes would be awesome, no need to drop the units, just be able to purchase from the shop. The game is written with only having four units in the players control, that's pretty hard coded from what I understand, so giving us allies we can drop with may be beyond their capacity. IIRC there are missions where you have NPC assets, but you don't control them.

[Caedis Animus]

And while limited, would probably be feasible without having to rewrite code for the game from the ground up.  That is what would need to be done to have more than 1 PC controlled Lance.

Yup. The only 'control' you'd get over the lance is asking for them to drop.

While that's not really optimal, it's probably the best you can do under the game's rules.

[Notsonoble]

Yup. The only 'control' you'd get over the lance is asking for them to drop.

While that's not really optimal, it's probably the best you can do under the game's rules.

Roguetech's already unlocked this for their 1.6 version, so its doable. See Tirak's youtube videos of it, they've upped # of units in the "Lance" to 8.

[Caedis Animus]

Roguetech's already unlocked this for their 1.6 version, so its doable. See Tirak's youtube videos of it, they've upped # of units in the "Lance" to 8.

Sweet, I really don't care about Roguetech, but otherwise, neat.

[Stormforge]

Roguetech's already unlocked this for their 1.6 version, so its doable. See Tirak's youtube videos of it, they've upped # of units in the "Lance" to 8.

That is freaking awesome. The only thing is I do not really like Roguetech as it goes far beyond what I want for a battletech game. If they would do a stripped down version with only Intro or Standard Tech only I would be much more interested in playing. Way too much cheese in some of their custom equipment.

[Lboydmsw]

Roguetech's already unlocked this for their 1.6 version, so its doable. See Tirak's youtube videos of it, they've upped # of units in the "Lance" to 8.

I have mixed feelings about RogueTech.

[Wrangler]

I have mixed feelings about RogueTech.

How come?

I haven't done mods yet so i don't know what its like. I have survive first couple missions first!

[Retry]

How come?

I haven't done mods yet so i don't know what its like. I have survive first couple missions first!

My guess is, part of the reason is that they go way further in equipment than anything on the tabletop.  Basically everything from the table top including experimental equipment is on, and then some.

According to the Wiki you can find such things as Rotary AC/20s and Rotary Gauss Rifles in Roguetech, among other things.

[DarkSpade]

I just never understood why the creator of RogueTech is so hostile toward people making mods of their mod.  It's a normal thing in the fallout community.  That kind of attitude has kept be from getting near RogueTech.

From the sounds of it(Rotary Guass!?) I've made the right choice.

[Caedis Animus]

I just never understood why the creator of RogueTech is so hostile toward people making mods of their mod.  It's a normal thing in the fallout community.  That kind of attitude has kept be from getting near RogueTech.

From the sounds of it(Rotary Guass!?) I've made the right choice.

The Creator's pretty hostile overall, not just over what you said.

Granted, I don't like Roguetech because it's kind of the Marianas Trench of modpacks, but still.

[Starfury]

The rest of the variants for the existing mechs, for one. Two, the remaining unseen (Phoenix Hawk, Valkyrie, Warhammer, Rifleman, Crusader, Archer, Wasp, Stinger and the Maruader.). Three, infantry. Four, better balanced RNG for missions.

[YingJanshi]

https://youtu.be/282NFD5CIFs

So I'm coming up blank on the 'Mech featured at the end of the trailer. I think I know what it is...but if I'm correct, that's the weirdest version of it I've ever seen...

[nckestrel]

It’s called the Bull Shark and it’s new from HBS.  Not a previously existing mech.

[YingJanshi]

It’s called the Bull Shark and it’s new from HBS.  Not a previously existing mech.

That makes more sense than being a Marauder... 😄

[DarkSpade]

That makes more sense than being a Marauder... 😄

 ;D  I think you must be pretty desperate for the Marauder if you thought that might be it! Good news though, it's coming as part of the free patch.

[YingJanshi]

;D  I think you must be pretty desperate for the Marauder if you thought that might be it! Good news though, it's coming as part of the free patch.

Haha, well maybe...

But that and the Stone Rhino were the only two canon 'Mechs I could think of that had even a remotely similar profile...

[omega2010]

It’s called the Bull Shark and it’s new from HBS.  Not a previously existing mech.

It also looks like HBS is adding a new weapon.  Something called Coil-S/M/L.  Based on the small/medium/large naming, it's likely a new energy weapon.

[YingJanshi]

It also looks like HBS is adding a new weapon.  Something called Coil-S/M/L.  Based on the small/medium/large naming, it's likely a new energy weapon.

Or perhaps a lower tech alternative  to a Gauss Rifle?

[DarkSpade]

So far we don't seem to have any written announcement beyond people posting what they saw in the streams so details are all over the place.   From what I've read, it's damage is based on how far you've moved.  Further you move, the more damage it does.

[Snake Eyes]

https://youtu.be/282NFD5CIFs

So I'm coming up blank on the 'Mech featured at the end of the trailer. I think I know what it is...but if I'm correct, that's the weirdest version of it I've ever seen...

:excited: OMG

[omega2010]

Or perhaps a lower tech alternative  to a Gauss Rifle?

I just checked the Paradox site.  It's an electrical weapon that increases the charge the more the Mech moves.  So I was right it's an energy weapon.  As far as I can tell small/medium/large classification is always the laser weapon naming convention so it makes sense it's energy based.

[omega2010]

On a related note, the other new weapon is the Mech mortar.  So we are getting AoE weapons.

[DarkSpade]

Here's a post from someone who got a chance to play at PAXcon.

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/heavy-metal-on-its-way.1261165/page-9#post-25921887

[Jayof9s]

The quirks sound like a pretty interesting addition. Hopefully they went back and added them to all 'Mechs and not just the newest ones. Plenty of old designs that could use a bit of a nudge to make them better or push them to specialize in their niche.

[DarkSpade]

Sounds like they didn't, which would be a real shame.

[Jayof9s]

On the upside, mods should hopefully be able to add quirks pretty easily. Hopefully there's enough variety to keep it interesting if nothing else.

[Deadborder]

The Bull Shark is a 95 ton 'Mech created for a Battletech video game. Clearly it's the arch-nemesis of the Corsair

[Insaniac99]

I'm curious to see the story behind the bullshark.  The loadout seen on the stream is impossible to build unless you use clantech or have absolutely 0 armor.

Much of this expansion seems to be giving you a bunch of things that are intentionally not balanced and the only control on it is that you have to take only 4 unbalanced pieces of equipment out.

2-shot artillery isn't bad, but Call shot bonus and Damage reduction for your whole team?  The mechanics of the game make that incredibly powerful.

 A Laser that fits on a flea, and can do the equivalent damage of 2.8 AC/20 shots to a single location? I don't think there is a mech that can take that and have armor left, and most things will have that section destroyed. Combine that with the ECM module from Urban Warfare and you could probably go without any armor

[Daryk]

It's almost like they're making a video game instead of BattleTech...

[Insaniac99]

I like games to have a challenge and a nice balance between mechanics.  If the only balance is you can only bring a limited amounts of overpowered gear -- I wouldn't exactly call it balanced.  If the challenge is only had by purposely handicapping yourself then that's a game design problem.

I already have the DLC because I bought the season pass (I also backed the Kickstarter, and their Shadowrun ones) but I'm not excited for a collection of unbalanced and overpowered gear that I purposely avoided adding in via mods.

I hope as more information about this stuff comes out, I'm proven wrong about the mechanics.

[DarkSpade]

It's almost like they're making a video game instead of BattleTech...

Video games still require balance.

[Daryk]

Balance is a different game when you can issue a patch in something less than five years...

[Jayof9s]

I'm curious to see the story behind the bullshark.  The loadout seen on the stream is impossible to build unless you use clantech or have absolutely 0 armor.

I'd be curious to see how they'd convert it to TT if it's ever officially attempted.

With IS tech: just to fit 2x LB10X and 2x UAC5 + ammo and 4x Med Lasers with 18 tons of armor, you can still be 3/5 but you need an XL engine. Without an XL it won't fit even at 2/3 movement. And there's not enough space for other weight saving tech. The Thumper is lost completely even at 2/3 with an XL. You also cannot fit an LBX and UAC in each arm, even with the lower arm and hand actuators removed.

With Clan Tech: At 2/3 with an XL you can fit 17.5 tons of armor and all the weapons. Although the Thumper is too big to be contained in just the torso and 5 crits overflow into the arm, requiring 3 ACs to be crammed into the opposite torso/arm, instead of evenly split between the arms.

Either way, it should be a fun unit in HBS Battletech, regardless of being a little illegal by TT construction rules.

[Insaniac99]

With Clan Tech: At 2/3 with an XL you can fit 17.5 tons of armor and all the weapons. Although the Thumper is too big to be contained in just the torso and 5 crits overflow into the arm, requiring 3 ACs to be crammed into the opposite torso/arm, instead of evenly split between the arms.

One small clarification, the crits in the game name it the Thumper Cannon, which changes the crits and you can fit the weapons in the arms.

[DarkSpade]

With the little bit we know of the story and those ++ on so many of the weapons, I'm assuming it's clan or near clan tech.

[Jayof9s]

One small clarification, the crits in the game name it the Thumper Cannon, which changes the crits and you can fit the weapons in the arms.

Good catch and that actually would make more sense. Still won't fit on the chassis with IS ballistics, which brings us back to being at least semi-clan if it was made canon.

That also frees up some more weight since the thumper cannon is only 10 tons. It could either be 3/5 (XL) and have 17 tons of armor or 2/3 with max armor (which it looks like it might hold more than the maximum if following TT rules from the screenshot) and some additional heat sinks.

I'll be curious to see how fast/slow it is when we get it.

[Retry]

I'm curious to see the story behind the bullshark.  The loadout seen on the stream is impossible to build unless you use clantech or have absolutely 0 armor.

I'd be curious to see how they'd convert it to TT if it's ever officially attempted.

With IS tech: just to fit 2x LB10X and 2x UAC5 + ammo and 4x Med Lasers with 18 tons of armor, you can still be 3/5 but you need an XL engine. Without an XL it won't fit even at 2/3 movement. And there's not enough space for other weight saving tech. The Thumper is lost completely even at 2/3 with an XL. You also cannot fit an LBX and UAC in each arm, even with the lower arm and hand actuators removed.

With Clan Tech: At 2/3 with an XL you can fit 17.5 tons of armor and all the weapons. Although the Thumper is too big to be contained in just the torso and 5 crits overflow into the arm, requiring 3 ACs to be crammed into the opposite torso/arm, instead of evenly split between the arms.

Either way, it should be a fun unit in HBS Battletech, regardless of being a little illegal by TT construction rules.

Good catch and that actually would make more sense. Still won't fit on the chassis with IS ballistics, which brings us back to being at least semi-clan if it was made canon.

That also frees up some more weight since the thumper cannon is only 10 tons. It could either be 3/5 (XL) and have 17 tons of armor or 2/3 with max armor (which it looks like it might hold more than the maximum if following TT rules from the screenshot) and some additional heat sinks.

I'll be curious to see how fast/slow it is when we get it.

It may very well be semi-clan.



Exhibit A:

The "LB-X ++" has, in addition to its other bonus, a weight reduction of 1 ton.  The UAC ++ has, in addition to its other bonus, a weight reduction of 2 tons.  As far as I know, no other +/++/+++ weapons has lighter weight as their bonus.

If the regular LB-10X and UAC-5 are the vanilla IS guns, that would put these ++ variants at exactly the weight of a Clan-spec version of those weapons in both cases.

Exhibit B:

I mean... just look at the Bull Shark's fluff text.

[Jayof9s]

Definitely sounds like it could be at least partially clan. The ER Mediums also push that narrative, since they weren't SL tech.

As for the reduced weigh, they added + / ++ versions of other lostech during one of the patches (I think with Flashpoint but maybe Urban Warfare?) and most of the improvements reduced weight. I had a 1-2 ton lighter Gauss Rifle, for instance.

But it does get the ballistics more in line with clan tech.

[wolfcannon]

Retry where did you find the fluff and the pic for the Bull Shark?

[Insaniac99]

Retry where did you find the fluff and the pic for the Bull Shark?

It was from the live stream, people have been taking screenshots of it.  you can see the picture of Mitch Gitelman under the pasted on picture of the thumper canon text

[Apocal]

I've honestly never really felt a pressing need for an AoE weapon in this game.

[Caedis Animus]

I've had one or two, but it was mostly in situations where it had really, REALLY hit the fan and the enemy was conveniently cluster.

If it works the way I think it will, it'll be an extra ability instead of a straight weapon attack, which is very XCOM like.

[Jayof9s]

I saw some details from a recent stream that detailed some more of the units. Apparently there will be a second Bull Shark variant that doesn't include the thumper.

[Caedis Animus]

I saw some details from a recent stream that detailed some more of the units. Apparently there will be a second Bull Shark variant that doesn't include the thumper.

Yes, it uses small lasers and LRM-5s or something, right? At least, I've heard as much.

Kind of makes me hope any later DLCs will start adding new variants and such and new gameplay changes. New pilot abilities or another skill revamp would be nice.

[Apocal]

I'd be curious to see how they'd convert it to TT if it's ever officially attempted.

It is probably a better idea to simply drop one of each ballistic type. Things make much more sense that way. Although ballistics being strong as hell in this game, combining short and medium range brackets and there being a lot more LoS-breaking cover means the flavor is going to be lost once you convert to TT. AC20s are beasts and the AC5 is a decent ranged punisher.

[Caedis Animus]

On the subject of the Marauder giving a damage boon to the team (Reducing damage taken), that should affect the enemy just as well as it affects your lance...

That said, I would love for this game to start pulling out more stops. A full pilot creator, XCOM-style (Able to write backstories for your noobs after you hire them), more events, more options to dress up your pilots (Please just let me put a helmet over my hideous neanderthal person); Mid-misc mission objective changes (A battle turns into a defense mission after mission control notifies you that they found out what the enemy objective was mid-fight), stuff like that.

Hell, even enemy artillery would be great. More miscellaneous instead of mini-story flashpoints, too.

[Daryk]

Having experienced enemy artillery in the campaign, I'm not anxious to see it added to random missions too...

[Caedis Animus]

Having experienced enemy artillery in the campaign, I'm not anxious to see it added to random missions too...

You mean the incredibly obvious 'don't touch here' boxes?

Like, just don't step on them. It's not hard.

[Daryk]

With the load times and crashes my ancient machine inflicts, it took a bit to figure those out.

[Caedis Animus]

Honestly, that's not really the game's fault then.

[Daryk]

True, though I wasn't much of a fan of the idea once I did figure it out.  Area control that can only be avoided is annoying.

[Caedis Animus]

True, though I wasn't much of a fan of the idea once I did figure it out.  Area control that can only be avoided is annoying.

I mean, it's not like bullshark uses INSTAKILL barrages. Certainly won't be the case with non-campaign arty.

[Daryk]

I certainly would hope not, but who knows with HBS?

[Caedis Animus]

Common sense, for the most part. Even PGI's not that stupid.

That said, I do like games that punish you heavily for not paying attention. Instakilling you for stepping in a nonosquare is perfectly apt.

[Apocal]

Annihilator with 20% ballistic damage quirk means headcapping AC/5s are now possible. It is going to be hilarious.

[Caedis Animus]

Annihilator with 20% ballistic damage quirk means headcapping AC/5s are now possible. It is going to be hilarious.

Wait... Does this mean that the default Annihilator is dishing out four headcaps a turn?

[Daryk]

I think the increased armor in the HBS game prevents that (but just barely).

[Luciora]

I wish HBS went with the Devastator instead.  The Annihilator never really resonated with me because of the WD exclusivity when it was introduced to the Inner Sphere.  It would have been nice as another new chassis like the Hatchetman, even though it's as slow as the Urbanmech also.

Annihilator with 20% ballistic damage quirk means headcapping AC/5s are now possible. It is going to be hilarious.

[Apocal]

Wait... Does this mean that the default Annihilator is dishing out four headcaps a turn?

I think the increased armor in the HBS game prevents that (but just barely).

It should dish out four headcaps, yes. 60 damage default with a 20% ballistic damage quirk = 72 damage when heads have 61 armor. They've said that the quirk numbers are subject to change between now and release, but literally any boost to the ballistic damage turns the stock Annihilator to the HBSTech's quad-headcapper.

Get hyped.

I wish HBS went with the Devastator instead.  The Annihilator never really resonated with me because of the WD exclusivity when it was introduced to the Inner Sphere.  It would have been nice as another new chassis like the Hatchetman, even though it's as slow as the Urbanmech also.

The Devastator is way outside of the game's timeline and it doesn't have a readily available model from MWO.

[Daryk]

Ouch... I stand corrected!  :o

[Luciora]

If the king crab made an appearance,  I see no reason why the Devastator couldn't.  Failing that,  how about the Imp?  HBS is perfectly capable of introducing their own models into the game, as the Hatchetman shows, and would help differentiate it from MWO.

[Daryk]

???

How different is the HBS version from any of the various TT versions?

[Retry]

If the king crab made an appearance,  I see no reason why the Devastator couldn't.

Unlike the Devastator (3036), the King Crab (2743) doesn't require a time machine to show up in the 3020s Periphery.

[Luciora]

That is the date for production in the inner Sphere.  It was a Star League design originally.  Fluff says 6 were made in time for the invasion of Terra. 

Games play fast and loose with canon, and frankly I don't see problem with HBS throwing in another SL era unit.  The Atlas II custom shouldn't exist either, but it's there. 

For a long time, the Atlas was the only 100 tonner, and we as gamers only got other 100 tonners as retcons or as part of the Wolf's Dragoons.  There are no other 100 tonners circa 3030 that would be considered standard availability for the IS outside of the Atlas from TRO 3025 and the retcon King Crab.  Davion was producing the lower tech Devastators in that time frame and why not test it in the Periphery first? 

Plus I'm tired of seeing the Annihilator as the premier Wolf's Dragoon assault when we have the Imp and Marauder II.  Sure, the Marauder II has its art problems, which are mostly solved by now, but again, HBS could present the players with a other mech exclusive to the HBS game.

Sure HBS saves money by reusing MWO art, but I feel they should have more mechs original to them.

Unlike the Devastator (3036), the King Crab (2743) doesn't require a time machine to show up in the 3020s Periphery.

[Jayof9s]

I had sort of expected we'd get the Marauder II since it's in MWO (and having briefly forgotten the Anni) but I honestly prefer the Annihilator's hardpoints. The MAD II would be a laser boat and due to space and heat issues, the effectiveness kind of scales off. And we've also been sorely lacking an assault with more than 2-3 ballistic hardpoints.

I'm excited to load it (or the Bull Shark) with a bunch of AC/5s or 2s and unload a lot of daka downfield.

The Imp would have been neat since it's so often forgotten and would be fun just for the overloaded Urbie memes. The hardpoints would at least be a little more varied than the MAD IIs.

If we want to get even looser with the lore (I do love the Devastator but it is a stretch) there's always the Nightstar - which would have fit their bill of wanting a 95 tonner.

There are some interesting alternatives out there but at the end of the day, I'm happy with what we're getting.

Edit: formatting

[Caedis Animus]

Yeah, I can agree with wanting a Nightstar. I am hoping we get the other SW-era MWO mechs someday, like the Dervish and Charger.

[Jim1701]

Would like to see quirks for the original mechs but nothing says they won't do a patch later to add them once they are sure they won't break anything.  HBS seems to be a little more cautious in tossing out new features that could end up game breaking than some game publishers I could mention. 

While I do look forward to seeing the Warhammer and Marauder show up I have to wonder if they will be as effective here as on TT.  I don't use PPC's much anymore as the heat vs. damage profile is a little steeper than I like.  AC's are my go to direct fire weapon these days. 

[DarkSpade]

Only weapon in the game with long range, no ammo, and stability damage, and on top of that they give a debuff when they hit.

[Jim1701]

Only weapon in the game with long range, no ammo, and stability damage, and on top of that they give a debuff when they hit.

With more than 600 hours played the number of times I've ran out of ammo has been incredibly rare.  Add in the fact that it's freaking difficult to actually get a long range shot with a direct fire weapon on most maps.  The debuff is theoretically nice assuming it does anything worthwhile but not worth the heat IMO.  Urban maps do have some long sight lines.  I may have to trot out the K2 the next time I'm on an Urban map.  Still I don't see the Warhammer and especially the Marauder doing as well as they do on the TT.  Their special abilities may make up for it though. 

[Insaniac99]

Still I don't see the Warhammer and especially the Marauder doing as well as they do on the TT.  Their special abilities may make up for it though.

The Marauder's at least will.  A damage reduction for the entire lance is a huge bonus and you just have to have him in your lance for that.

[Jayof9s]

The Marauder's at least will.  A damage reduction for the entire lance is a huge bonus and you just have to have him in your lance for that.

And the Warhammer gets... +20%? damage for energy weapons. So you can get some headcapping PPCs (or the + damage LLs) to make up for any shortcomings.

Maybe not as effective as TT but I could easily see it being better than a lot of the other heavy options with some minor customization.

[Apocal]

Maybe not as effective as TT but I could easily see it being better than a lot of the other heavy options with some minor customization.

Yeah, it feels like these quirks are being put in because the Warhammer and Marauder are riding in on nostalgia and not much else.

[Jayof9s]

Yeah, it feels like these quirks are being put in because the Warhammer and Marauder are riding in on nostalgia and not much else.

I feel like another part is that it's the 3rd and final DLC, so they're trying some new ideas to see what it does for balance and gameplay so they can apply the results to Battletech 2.

[Firesprocket]

I feel like another part is that it's the 3rd and final DLC, so they're trying some new ideas to see what it does for balance and gameplay so they can apply the results to Battletech 2.

That seems logically and I wouldn't be surprised if that is the case.  No sense in reverse engineering what is already out there if it will be obsolete after this expansion runs its life span.

[Wrangler]

Any mentioning of Bull Shark going to MWO?  Since all the models in HBS were essentially imported from MWO.   I figure the door may swing the other way.  Who knows,  HBS may have paid PGI to make new design.  I doubt Saw-off Sniper Cannon will be included unless their planning spend money to add new weapon group to the game.

[Jayof9s]

Any mentioning of Bull Shark going to MWO?  Since all the models in HBS were essentially imported from MWO.   I figure the door may swing the other way.  Who knows,  HBS may have paid PGI to make new design.  I doubt Saw-off Sniper Cannon will be included unless their planning spend money to add new weapon group to the game.

There's a Bull Shark variant without the cannon, apparently.

Hatchetman hasn't made its way to MWO, so who knows. Of course that has a big, obvious reason for not being likely to show up in MWO. So we know they are capable of making their own models.

[Apocal]

I feel like another part is that it's the 3rd and final DLC, so they're trying some new ideas to see what it does for balance and gameplay so they can apply the results to Battletech 2.

For what it's worth, I think that the game's core gameplay loop is rock-solid. There are certainly enhancements and quality of life improvements that can be made but overall it is right where it needs to be. Maybe scaling it up would be better, but maybe it would be worse, if it raises mission times or makes defeating mechs trivial (training AI to make intelligent use of cover without gimmicks is difficult and it is already far too easy to lure them into position for all four of your short-ranged brawlers to blast away) or otherwise breaks something fundamental.

That being said, the stars of the show are mechs, but the TT construction rules (while good for their time and place) are far too simple and result in gunbags. Hardpoints help, but now it is a situation where you find an ideal speed and hardpoint distribution and you're done. Giving mechs further character probably helps ease further away from gunbagging and provide a reason to not just field 4x Hunchbacks.

Past this DLC, I hope we get a few more flavor quirks but nothing that chips away at build diversity, more like broad enhancements than specifically targeted stuff that tends to shoehorn designs in one specific direction or another.

[Wrangler]

The Devastator is way outside of the game's timeline and it doesn't have a readily available model from MWO.

Actually not its not.   The early versions of the Devastator had AC/10s and standard lasers and standard engine. It was semi-failed prototype but they made alot of them for prototypes. 

[Apocal]

Actually not its not.   The early versions of the Devastator had AC/10s and standard lasers and standard engine. It was semi-failed prototype but they made alot of them for prototypes.

In 3025?

edit: The in-game timeframe runs from about 3022-3028. It stops just short of the 4th SW.

[Wrangler]

In 3025?

edit: The in-game timeframe runs from about 3022-3028. It stops just short of the 4th SW.

True, the mech was prototyped in 3036 with Gauss Rifle version being put into use by 3044. 

[FedRatCowboy]

Giving mechs further character probably helps ease further away from gunbagging and provide a reason to not just field 4x Hunchbacks.

Agreed on this first point, but not the second. Running 4 Hunchies in the lance is a waste of time, money, and pilots. Weak armor, short ranged, a tendency to have ammo explode, slow, and a lackluster performance all around makes the Hunchback not worth running 4 in a lance.

[Caedis Animus]

Agreed on this first point, but not the second. Running 4 Hunchies in the lance is a waste of time, money, and pilots. Weak armor, short ranged, a tendency to have ammo explode, slow, and a lackluster performance all around makes the Hunchback not worth running 4 in a lance.

Someone hasn't used a 4P.

[Apocal]

Agreed on this first point, but not the second. Running 4 Hunchies in the lance is a waste of time, money, and pilots. Weak armor, short ranged, a tendency to have ammo explode, slow, and a lackluster performance all around makes the Hunchback not worth running 4 in a lance.

I've never had an issue with the short range weapons in this game, HBK-4Ps don't suffer ammo explosions and being slow only matters for a few mission types. I do run a breaching shot HBK-4G though, just because sometimes you need that hole-punching.

[Fat Guy]

And the download fianlly begins...

[Wrangler]

Im getting mine tonight.

[Jim1701]

Only played a few minutes.  First thing you notice is that you get a "box" of free stuff if you want it.  You get one of the new mechs and some weapons.  This happens even in existing games.  What you get seems to be tied to the general level you are at in the game.  In my existing I was finishing up last night I got an Assassin, a UAC-10 and a LB-10X.  In the new game I started after I got a Vulcan and a UAC-5 and LB-5X.  Got some ammo for the new systems too. 

Haven't installed them yet but it seems the UAC will double tap while the double  tap does X * 8 damage.  I assume the damage in either case will act like missiles do in which case those suckers will hit HARD. 

Also the system I started in had both a Marauder piece and a Warhammer piece for sale.  Very interesting start I have to say. 

[Luciora]

And it looks like trying to mod your starting mechs via .json might get you stuck in the infinite loading loop.  I'll have to start fresh, and see what I broke haha.

[Firesprocket]

Only played a few minutes.  First thing you notice is that you get a "box" of free stuff if you want it.

What is this free box of which you speak?  I saw nothing resembling that last night when I fired up the game after the download.

[DarkSpade]

i got mine the first time I traveled.

[Firesprocket]

i got mine the first time I traveled.

That's clear as mud.  Did you get from a randomly tripped event or in some other fashion?

[DarkSpade]

That's clear as mud.  Did you get from a randomly tripped event or in some other fashion?

First time I traveled to another planet i was offered the box. It popped up like an event, but was not an event. It was clearly marked with a large Heavy Metal logo. It's not subtle at all.

[Jim1701]

First time I traveled to another planet i was offered the box. It popped up like an event, but was not an event. It was clearly marked with a large Heavy Metal logo. It's not subtle at all.

For me it happened right after my first contract.  I hadn't traveled at all.  It does pop up like a random event does but as he says it is clearly marked with the Heavy Metal logo.  It is also optional too so those that prefer to do it all the hard way can skip it.

Also, for the first time I got an offer to join the Black Market BEFORE they loathed me so it didn't cost a fortune to join.  All kinds of Star League Equipment is available now.  Don't know if that stuff if part of Heavy Metal or the free patch or both. 

[DarkSpade]

Perhaps it's timed?   I did all the contracts on my starting planet without advancing the time.

[Jim1701]

I may have advanced time for a repair so I could another mission before traveling. 

[Fat Guy]

Got mine after most of the missions on my starting planet.

Assassin, LB-5X, LB-10X, and a ton of ammo for each.

I've ben to 3 planets, and saw gauss ammo for sale in the regular store on two of them.

[Wrangler]

Anyone had bad download? I downloaded it through humble and thing keep acting up and won't extra properly.

[Jim1701]

No problem with the download though I use Steam. 

Last night I saw a Gauss Rifle ++ in the Black Market Store.  -2 tons, -1 slot.   :thumbsup:

Now if I could just afford it.  :(

[Daryk]

Sounds pretty sweet... did it have any adjustments to damage or range?  ???

[The_Livewire]

I will say without spoiling much, while the proliferation of tech may beyond the range of the tabletop Canon we all know and love, it *does* have an origin that I've enjoyed unfolding.

That and it is hilarious to use the thumper on "destroy the caravan" missions.

[Daryk]

An AOE weapon would certainly make those missions simpler...

[Jim1701]

Sounds pretty sweet... did it have any adjustments to damage or range?  ???

Not that one but who knows.  I don't know about the House Stores but the couple times I've perused the Black Market Store there's been a stupid amount of advanced tech and a lot of of it upgraded (mostly ++ from what I could see.)

I'm playing a career game ATM. 

[Daryk]

Rog... I'll be interested to see what else you turn up...  :thumbsup:

[Wrangler]

Humble has bad one i guess.  No update for me.