Orion or Zues

[Empyrus]

The Zeus is an overgrown heavy. As for it the Orion being a better infighter, sure. But the Zeus hangs back, it is a sniper (as much as 3025 'Mechs can be). Park it on a hill with forest and it is really painful to deal with. Once it runs out of ammo, it can approach and use its lasers without worries.

[ANS Kamas P81]

Yeah, though with an Awesome and Marauder I'd say he's got the long-range fire support already handled.  Another point in the Orion's favor is that it can share SRM ammo with the Victor, so if you happened to be playing with any rules for reloads that can help.  Same with spare parts/replacements...but more than that, it means you've got two SRM platforms for smoke, infernos, fragmentation, or any other silly ideas you can find.  And while the Victor has that big AC/20, the Orion's arguably a bit better in the anti-vehicle role since it has the extra clusters - they both share two lasers and four SRMs, but the Orion's got the LRM and AC to back it up while the Victor only has the can-opener. 

[Alsadius]

I've always liked the Orion - it's a decent unit at any range, and well-protected. Runs a touch hot, but not grossly so(particularly by 3025 standards). The additional 3.5 tons of armor over the Zeus makes it far more survivable, even with the extra ammo slots, and their firepower is similar.

[JadeHellbringer]

For two cents... I'm a huge Orion fan in almost every iteration (not you, ON-1M). If you're looking to upgrade to each Mech's 3050 standard though... yeah, no.

The Zeus went from beast to... well, more-beast in '50, improving in some subtle but useful ways while not taking on a lot of the negatives other designs sometimes were saddled with. The old PPC vs. AC-5 question got answered with a big boost to the PPC's range, the ER large is a great backup to it, the pulse lasers lose range but gain accuracy (nice against fast Clanners), there's just nowhere that this design didn't get better. A bit warm, yes, but not to the point that it's impossible to deal with. There's no downsides or negatives here to speak of.

And the poster child for those negatives is the Orion, which was made into a mess of a design. I'm a firm believer an XL engine is a worthwhile upgrade if it really helps your design do something useful it couldn't have done before. Well... the Orion gained that useful LBX gun, so that's good, and the extra LRM tubes aren't unwelcome, but then... what, a Narc beacon? Seriously, THAT'S the tonnage use? Ugh.

Now, if you're going beyond that, the Zeus has some later handy versions, but Marik wisely tried again on the Orion with the 2M, and... yeah, this is what the Orion wanted to be all along. Gauss and LRM are a good start, three pulse lasers in close are a good backup (I prefer six standard mediums, personally, on the tonnage), tough as all hell, etc.? Yes please. And what do you know? There's nowhere this isn't better than the 1M, and while we're at it there's no unusual tech- you could build this in 3050 just as easily as '60.

So... intro tech, it's a punt, both are great designs. If you're upgrading to 3050 variants, the Zeus is a clear winner. And if you're willing to go straight to a 3060 variant in '50, the Orion is a great choice.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

The ZEU-9S is one of the best upgrades in 3050.  Every single thing about it improved and unlike so many other mech upgrades from the same time, there's no part of it that you look at and say "what the hell were you thinking?"  All the upgrades it received were useful, and that's something to be proud of.

[JadeHellbringer]

The ZEU-9S is one of the best upgrades in 3050.  Every single thing about it improved and unlike so many other mech upgrades from the same time, there's no part of it that you look at and say "what the hell were you thinking?"  All the upgrades it received were useful, and that's something to be proud of.

Bingo. Many were gaining something at the expense of something else (weapons at the expense of durability, usually, like the Shadow Hawk), or an 'upgrade' that neutered the Mech's effectiveness (Grasshopper, Goliath), something that was trading off one thing of some value for something else of similar value (Whitworth), or just totally nonsensical ideas that likely were made out of engineers not really understanding the equipment (Trebuchet, Panther, Orion, Trebuchet again because I'm THAT OFFENDED BY IT)...

...and occasionally there's just a design that gained new and enhanced abilities with none of the bad news. There aren't a lot of them, and most of them are on the smaller end of things, but the Zeus is a big-time exception to the rule there. It's easy to make a better Wasp, Locust, Clint, etc.- but an assault Mech (okay, a big heavy, shaddup) that just beefed up for no cost in effectiveness? Glorious. If the Clans hadn't shown up when they did this would have given DCMS and FWLM units fits.

[Rainbow 6]

Has to be the Zeus, probably not as effective in 3025 but as time goes by it eclipses the Orion.

[Minemech]

 In 3025, the lack of LRM 15 ammo can be disconcerting for the Zeus.

 The Orion is simply a solid mech. You can hate its large magazines of ammo, but it does perform.

[mrbooth]

So after taking the advice on the Zues I went with that for my first game out. It was working very well with the lance right up until it a PPC  in its face ended this particular debate. We did salvage the machine but now need a new pilot and some spare cash for fix it.

[Getz]

Funnily enough, I was using a Zeus 9S in a game on Wednesday evening.  That was also killed by a PPC to the face (admittedly it had already been tagged on the head by a cluster of LRMs).

It was an odd game, all four of my mechs took at least one hit to the head and I lost both the Zeus and an Axman to headshots - despite neither of us packing any headchoppers.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Funnily enough, the last time I used a Zeus it killed a Thor via PPC to the face.

[Colt Ward]

Well, this is what I get for being gone . . .

My question now that its lancemates were determined would have been . . . when you can upgrade, will it be piecemeal or conversion kits?

Because I have always considered it a shame the ON-1K never got a upgrade that just gave it DHS, CASE and turned the AC/10 to a LB-10X and the MLs maybe go ERML.  IMO it was the logical step up instead of the ON2 series mess.  Since I just love that clustergun.  And I would have said go with the ON-1VA so you can crit seek all those holes your buddies up front made with their PPCs and AC/20.

But yeah, the 9S Zeus is solid if uninspiring jump into L2.

[Hellraiser]

So after taking the advice on the Zues I went with that for my first game out. It was working very well with the lance right up until it a PPC  in its face ended this particular debate. We did salvage the machine but now need a new pilot and some spare cash for fix it.

LOL,  well at least you know that no matter which mech you choose, a PPC to the face is the great equalizer.

[Major Headcase]

 :-X

[JadeHellbringer]

🤣🤣🤣
Ouch... Bob, git the hose...
But you can't blame the Zeus for that! 😂 it would have died just as fast as an Orion in the same case. Hire a new pilot who has mastered the "duck and weave" maneuver. 😉

A fair point. Sucks, but even the most terrifying Mechs like a Daishi would drop from that same hit. Few Mechs walk away from a PPC to the noodle. Maybe something like a Great Turtle with hardened armor, or a Gyrfalcon with its reflective armor, but you're getting into cutting-edge tech at that point.