Causes of Blackout and mobile HPGs

[Minemech]

 If mobile HPGs were immune, Comstar would have deployed Magellans to critical systems.

[Liam's Ghost]

Personally I still think it has to do with where you are rather than what type of HPG you're using. My pet theory is that an old blakist Super HPG was used to fire disruptive pulses (using KF SCIENCE!) to different places around the Inner Sphere, specifically targeting HPGs and screwing up local KF space as an after-affect. Others were taken out more conventionally because either the super HPG couldn't target them properly, or because it burned out before they were finished.

We also know there are places that aren't affected (including Terra). At least one of the Republic's warships still has a functioning HPG, too, and was using it while they were chasing Comstar down.

[truetanker]

Except there aren't to many Magellans left.

What about a possible sabotaged program or worm fitted to the old DRUM Network?

TT

[Frabby]

Except there aren't to many Magellans left.

What about a possible sabotaged program or worm fitted to the old DRUM Network?

Not sure about how many Magellans were built to begin with, and how many are left. But apparently, not too few either. After all, we've seen a vessel dubbed "Magellan MkII" with a big honkin' Spirit Cat logo on the jump sail. Official word is that it's not a full-blown new ship type but rather a variant of the Magellan class. In any case, if enough existed to dub them "Mk II" the overall impression is that there is still a good number out there.

As for a virus distributed by DRUM or similar satellites: I doubt it.
Remember how the HPG network works. It's not a WLAN. The links are not bidirectional. Every HPG sends its information as a radio wave that is "jumped" to a certain point in space. Could be a jump point, or the known location of a fleet. Or a ComStar receiver room on a planet. But not another HPG. They don't connect to each other, they don't do handshakes for protocols. They are just one-way transmitters.

So in order for malware from within the network to affect a new HPG, the sending (infected) HPG would have to know exactly where the receiving HPG is, plus there would have to be some connection to the operating system (as opposed to merely the data stream being handled). That's so unlikely as to be essentially impossible for newly-built HPGs fired up for test purposes.

[Minemech]

 By simply deploying the Magellans to critical worlds, Comstar would have applied sufficient pressure to cause the Inner Sphere governments to invest in more such vessels. Mobile HPGs are not immune.

[CrazyGrasshopper]

As for a virus distributed by DRUM or similar satellites: I doubt it.
Remember how the HPG network works. It's not a WLAN. The links are not bidirectional. Every HPG sends its information as a radio wave that is "jumped" to a certain point in space. Could be a jump point, or the known location of a fleet. Or a ComStar receiver room on a planet. But not another HPG. They don't connect to each other, they don't do handshakes for protocols. They are just one-way transmitters.

I doubt that there is no interaction with transmitted information at all. A passing through message, that should be re-transmitted to another HPG should be read for its destination at least.   

[Col Toda]

The black box idea is as good as any . Just because of Com Star interdiction The DC and FC after reintroducing the black box Never Stopped Using them . Uncle Chade"s Colation used a black box network . The Republic of the Sphere used them for intelligence work as well . If they never stopped using them someone would notice putting out an overstrong signal to mess up the HPG . As spy services would notice all the black boxes were getting noise before gray or black days happened . So that theory does not make as much sense as an exspantion equation  hardcoded in the system that produced accurate enough targeting for a couple of hundred years would eventually not be accurate enough at some time . It exsplains all observable issues . The places that were attacked had the records of the future replacement equations archived . The HPG that still work  are postioned that the equations are still valid . I had the idea that the ones that still work had a slightly better and updated targeting software but that would have been dicovered quicky in any in depth analysis between a HPG that worked and one that did not .  My scenario has the blackout an expected thing . The Malice was burying that it waa going to happen and eliminate the solution to get some kind of gain out of it.

[roosterboy]

Correct.  However, he mentions the chants descended from the original HPG techs.  The sidebar on War of 3039 is what alleges that the black boxes were responsible for interfering with HPGs at that stage...which would have been what necessitated the chants.  (Which is why I said I had no proof - just supporting evidence)

That’s a leap unsupported by the texts. Tucker doesn’t mention anything about interference being the reason for the chants, just that the HPGs needed “tuning” during installation and operation. That could be due to anything, not necessarily interference. Maybe the aiming algorithms needing tweaking to take celestial movement into account. After all, "HPGs are meant to target objects light-years distant for which they have exceedingly exact coordinates." (StratOps, p251)

Only... "Receiver HPGs" don't exist. You don't need a HPG to receive signal. HPGs just "jump" radio waves to a destination point from which they emerge as plain standard, well, radio waves.

While technically true that you don't need an HPG to receive a signal, the usual procedure is to "jump" the signal directly into the HPG core at the receiving station to minimize effects on the surroundings, usually a rather populated area. So, in that sense, yes there are "receiver HPGs" that can be part of such a test as Buhl's people conducted.

[Charistoph]

Just my theory, as the writers could well go with giant space hamsters in the final reveal, but it meets my threshold for internal consistency, and would explain why Tucker was able to fix one using ancient chants, why mobile devices and new devices are hit as well, and why some stations stayed online.

What if they were miniaturized giant space hamsters?  After all, they are known for going for the eyes.

[SD501st]

What if they were miniaturized giant space hamsters?  After all, they are known for going for the eyes.

The resulting creature would be capable of dimensional/time travel and be known as "Boo".

[sadlerbw]

The resulting creature would be capable of dimensional/time travel and be known as "Boo".

I see what you did there...and I am amused  :thumbsup:

[russtarvin]

I seem to remember the Battlecorps story about the rediscovery of Jardine (the unfinished story) had a scene with the fake Thomas Marik/Halas getting a report of a shift in the center of the HPG network based on traffic patterns. I may be mis remembering the wrong story, but that interaction always stood out to me about the HPG network.  No clue as to what it could mean or if it is any way related to the blackout.

[Frabby]

It was another BC story that you're remembering here - Shadows of Faith, I believe. (Which, as published on BC, were the first few chapters of an upcoming novel that we still haven't seen even though Loren Coleman may finish it someday after all.)
From how I recall it off-hand, it was somehow important that the "ComStar Clock" that basically led the entire HPG network was not where ComStar had moved to (Tukayyid), but was in WoB hands (Terra or Gibson, iirc). That was somehow considered an important insight in-universe but I never understood the implications either. But the impression I had was that it had something to do with the ComStar/WoB conflict and nothing with the Dark Age, Blackout, or Fortress.

[Liam's Ghost]

If I were to guess, Comstar archives records of all HPG traffic at a central location, and they discovered that those records were being routed to Terra first before passing on to Comstar's actual headquarters.

It would be a huge security breach.

[roosterboy]

It was that the focal points of the Blakist network and ComStar’s network should have been different during the years that WoB was headquartered on Gibson and it wasn’t. There weren’t two separate focal points until ComStar lost Terra in 3058 and shifted their operations to Tukayyid.

I believe that’s meant to indicate that the true center of Blakist power during those years was not, in fact, located on Gibson but rather in the Terran system, i.e., on Mars where Real!Thomas was chillaxing. The Master was pulling the strings, even though the rank and file of WoB thought Gibson was their baseworld and the First Circuit there was running their organization.

[SteelRaven]

The problem with Com Star, as with all clandestine organizations, there are so many layers that it is quite possible that Point A has no idea Point Z even exist (case in point, Fotch had no idea about the Master) Com Star had become such a cloak and dagger operation by the time of the schism, their may have never been one true 'center' for such a murky organization.     

[HABeas2]

I seem to remember the Battlecorps story about the rediscovery of Jardine (the unfinished story) had a scene with the fake Thomas Marik/Halas getting a report of a shift in the center of the HPG network based on traffic patterns. I may be mis remembering the wrong story, but that interaction always stood out to me about the HPG network.  No clue as to what it could mean or if it is any way related to the blackout.

You're thinking of Coleman's story, not mine. Can't even recall its title any more, but it was set just before the last Whitting Conference.

- Herb

[Mendrugo]

Shadows of Faith