Mechs That Surprised You

[House Davie Merc]

GHR-5H Grasshopper .

Probably one of the biggest early surprise mechs in the game .
It just seems so average compared to other designs until you use it .

[Kos]

Phew, a lot of mechs fit this question for me. I've always liked seeing what I can get out of sub-optimal mechs, and have had surprisingly good results out of them many a time .

Charger: Yeah, it has popgun armament, but it is good in it's intended heavy recon role. It makes a great physical attacker though, and being cheap as chips can handle the hand to hand while more suitable mechs lay down the firepower.

Quickdraw: Again, not the best mech on paper but it does work well for heavy recon and physical attacks.

Crusader: Always favored the 3k, but even the 3r has done well for me in the past, as long as it sticks to missile support and dumps its ammo when appropriate.

Dragon: The Ac5 is a turn off, but if you take advantage of its cool-running nature you have a good skirmisher that can consistantly provide long range support on the move.

Whitworth: Only really 'bad' in the fluff, actually a great medium mech.

Cyclops: Compared to the Atlas, it's pants, but pretend it's a heavy and presto, you have a pocket Atlas. I've had it perform well as a bodyguard for my comander's Warhammer many a time.

Honorable mention: The Loki. Yeah it's not great. However when you've never seen Clan mechs before and one pops over a hill and slags your prize Warhammer at age 12...well yeah that was surprising.

 

[Feenix74]

Jagermech-6S - I have never been a fan of the Rifleman-3N (not enough armour, not enough heatsinks to be able to use the firepower, and shallow ammo bin to boot). The fluff for the Jagermech-6S is that it was built as an improved replacement for the Rifleman but review the stats and it has even thinner armour, better on the heat but the popgun AC/5s augmented by bb-gun AC/2s means that you have compromised the firepower the twin large lasers offered on the Rifleman, and still have the problem of shallow ammo bins.

When playing OPFOR for a mate's Megamek campaign, I rolled one on a RAT. I was not trying to make life difficult for him, so with a sigh and a shrug I added it to the ORBAT for the pirate band that I was playing. During the battle I was able to get it onto a wooded elevation to provide fire support for the pirate battle line.  It made life hell for my mate's unit, consistently plinking from distance while my mate could not afford to devote the turn of concentrated fire on the Jagermech to bring it down because he had to concentrate on my line of battle. I was impressed by its performance, I guess the trick is to have a battle line of brawlers and trooper mechs that effectively become mobile armour for the Jagermech. The paired AC2/AC5 look weak on paper but parking the Jagermech at the right range means it can get consistent hits that add up over a number of rounds.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

In a reverse surprise...the Thunderbolt.  On paper it's a good 'mech.  People swear by it in actual play.  I get creamed when I use it.  :-[

I have a similar issue with the Orion.

[Empyrus]

Jagermech-6S - I have never been a fan of the Rifleman-3N (not enough armour, not enough heatsinks to be able to use the firepower, and shallow ammo bin to boot).

I recall that in the Rifleman MotW, there was discussion about how the Rifleman's weaknesses cancel each other out, in a way.
Initial fire pattern should go like laser-AC-AC, until the bin is empty (no heating up if you're stationary). At that point, you don't need to worry about heat anymore, and you can just fire all the lasers. Low amount of ammo is also a boon given that the 'Mech has thin armor.
The 'Mech is a battlecruiser really, more firepower than durability and sense.

That said, neither 'Mech is really not meant for line combat. They do fine in their intended task, though i'm not saying they couldn't be better even in that role.


As for the JagerMech and the Clint mentioned earlier (and most likely other similar "this looks kinda shit" units), i'm thinking they do well because opponents are likely to dismiss them as irrelevant due to their low damage output. Low armor doesn't matter if you aren't getting hit, and this gives time for their low damage output to add up.
Personally i'd be inclined to make some effort (but not too much) to take them out, if only to force them to be careful.

[SteveRestless]

It is the AC5. It puts people off. There are a few good Mechs in this list hiding behind an AC5.

It absolutely is. Saw that and thought "We don't need a clan Clint, the Clint IIc is already a clan clint, and its better than the clint." but I was wrong.

[Rorke]

The fluff for the 12C Longbow, describes the 7V as somewhat lacking.

The truth though, it's a fine long ranged support mech with a vicious
surprise for the unwary flanker.  I often take issue with fluff, when it's
patently false.

[SteveRestless]

I often take issue with fluff, when it's patently false.

Amen to that.

[SteelRaven]

In a reverse surprise...the Thunderbolt.  On paper it's a good 'mech.  People swear by it in actual play.  I get creamed when I use it.  :-[

First qestion is which Thunderbolt and second would be whats your play style.

Allot of great mechs use LRMs but I'm crap with LRMs. For example; the Orion is a great mech as long as it's piloted by anyone but me. ;)

[Fat Guy]

It is the AC5. It puts people off. There are a few good Mechs in this list hiding behind an AC5.

It's the T1 with the AC/5. The T2 has a ProtoMech AC/8, Clan mediums, ECM, and AES on the arm with the Retractable Blade.


The ProtoMech AC/8 was a surprise all it's own. It was way more effective than I thought it'd be.

[Alexander Knight]

First qestion is which Thunderbolt and second would be whats your play style.

ALL of them.  I have tried the vast majority of TDR variants over twenty years of play, and except for two times, it ends in sadness, tears, and an ammo or engine explosion.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

One mech that's really surprised me in a negative way has been the Daishi.  Every time I take one of those things out it either suffers a TAC to the gyro or ammo bin that cripples it at the start of the fight or it winds up being unable to hit the broadside of a barn from the inside.

[monbvol]

Going the other way I got one.  Any Victor that doesn't have CASE or can't fight past nine hexes(twelve if using extreme range rules).

Even in environments where you'd think not being able to fight past 9 hexes wouldn't be a big deal Victors have performed terribly for me.

If they at least have CASE or can fight past nine hexes I get a lot better mileage out of them.

[Iron Grenadier]

ALL of them.  I have tried the vast majority of TDR variants over twenty years of play, and except for two times, it ends in sadness, tears, and an ammo or engine explosion.

Lol it's Crusaders for us that seem to end that way. Thunderbolts on the other hand are just the opposite. As players we love them and as the GM they hate it when I use them as part of an opposing force.

[Hellraiser]

It is the AC5. It puts people off. There are a few good Mechs in this list hiding behind an AC5.

That is because so few mechs are built to properly utilize it.

They either have too many of them (2+) or not enough (0) when the key to the AC5, IMHO, is to compliment it with some other weapon (PPC, LL, LRM15, etc etc) so that you get a nice combo of heat v/s damage v/s tonnage that is in balance instead of something with horrible stats that I swear was only built to match the art.  (looks at Rifleman)

[Daemion]

ALL of them.  I have tried the vast majority of TDR variants over twenty years of play, and except for two times, it ends in sadness, tears, and an ammo or engine explosion.

Sounds like you need to run a pair. I've had interesting moments where one Mech will get all the bad luck, and all the good luck would fall on the other.

[JPArbiter]

The JM6-S Jagermech. Even before it became a mainstay in a sword and Dragon campaign my wife and I played. I was surprised at how few players regarded it as a thrwat, only to have armor peeled away steadily at PPC range over multiple turns while they were focusing on “real” threats like my P Hawks, Vindicators, or Centurions.

It led to a little Idiom “You may not fear the Jagermech, but by God you will respect it”

[Jellico]

Lol it's Crusaders for us that seem to end that way. Thunderbolts on the other hand are just the opposite. As players we love them and as the GM they hate it when I use them as part of an opposing force.

Crusaders, Thunderbolts, Orions, Highlanders, Stalkers, all of those famous powerhouses are just ammo bombs in my hands.

[Empyrus]

is to compliment it with some other weapon (PPC, LL, LRM15, etc etc)

AC/5 to PPC: "Oh man, you're so much better than me"
 :D

[Elmoth]

He can also claim that this companion is hotter

[Greatclub]

AC/5 to PPC: "Oh man, you're so much better than me"
 :D

AC5 is less effective and efficient that PPC. On the other hand, it's also 7 tons lighter than PPC+single heat sinks.

It's indefensible after DHS, but definitely has it's place in introtech. 2 fully sinked PPC are 24 tons, accounting for engine mounted, as opposed to 17 tons for the PPC+ ac/5

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

That assumes you're going for full heat neutrality.  Or that you're not going to use those heatsinks for something else, like an array of short-range weapons.

[Empyrus]

Who needs heat neutrality? Something like the Warhammer or Marauder works just fine. Fire all long-range weapons, you heat up a bit but you can do that a round or two in row without issues. Heck, -1 MP isn't necessarily a big drawback anyway (at least from 4/6 to 3/5, 5/8 to 4/6 is bigger deal), but i don't really push past 8 heat without at least a veteran pilot though. That's large margin for using twin PPCs.

2 fully sinked PPC are 24 tons, accounting for engine mounted, as opposed to 17 tons for the PPC+ ac/5

But with the latter combo, you also lose 25% damage, and introduce an explosive component to your 'Mech and limit your maximum endurance.
For lower weight and better range you could just use PPC+LRM-10 (deals a bit more damage than the AC/5 usually), assuming minimum range is not an issue. A bit more heat, but easy enough to manage, and you get a left-over ton or two for other stuff.

I can't actually recall any (intro level) 'Mechs with a PPC and AC/5 that isn't the Banshee 3E. And that 'Mech doesn't make good use of that combo, thanks to being way oversinked. PPC+AC/5 with a 'Mech with 11-13 heat sinks? Sure, why not. But i don't think that's an option.

[Mattlov]

The Hellbringer C.  ATMs, LB-20X, assortment of lasers.  I looked at it and thought, "what the hell are you supposed to do?"

Stomp face, is the answer.  Despite the armor, it just kinda beats the hell out of things.  Beats them up very, very well.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Yeah, that's a mech that runs up to your face screaming "one of us is going to die."

[Firesprocket]

I can't actually recall any (intro level) 'Mechs with a PPC and AC/5 that isn't the Banshee 3E.

The Striker STC-2C has both.

[Valkerie]

I have to throw down two that surprised me, and it was going up against them that was the surprise.  Classic 3025 mechs, the GHR-5H Grasshopper and the VTR-9B Victor.  My brother used those both in a two on two battle against me back in the day.  I was shocked at how effective they were (and still are.)  They are mechs I look to when it's going to be a medium to short range battle.

[Nightsong]

Another Raptor lover here. The two variants with dual large lasers (the A and the R, even if that one is a cheat) are vicious little monsters. Also surprised how decent an Ostscout can be. Sure, the original only had a ML, but it was an 8/12/8 ML. And the two CS variants are surprisingly scary. I still laugh at one of my favorite Osty moments. We were about to be shooed out of the store (was closing for the night), so as the last move of the night, I pulled a 10 hex charge into the back of an Avatar and tore its engine out, only taking armor damage in return. Not bad to take out twice your weight in one turn, no?

[Daemion]

I can't actually recall any (intro level) 'Mechs with a PPC and AC/5 that isn't the Banshee 3E. And that 'Mech doesn't make good use of that combo, thanks to being way oversinked. PPC+AC/5 with a 'Mech with 11-13 heat sinks? Sure, why not. But i don't think that's an option.

Wait. You forgot the Marauder already?

[R.Tempest]

 Thunderbolt. My cousin loved them. Every time he used one it destroyed whatever I was fielding. At least twice to a cockpit critical from a flight of LRM's.