Author Topic: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z  (Read 88657 times)

Crow

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #270 on: 24 July 2019, 06:19:52 »
Yeah, that would help ensure that mobile Clanners can’t just back up and keep your Basilisks at 4-5 hexes where they get chewed up before delivering any EDP mods.

But I also worry that because the EDP attack has to be delivered point-blank, that it’s often a death sentence that turns the Basilisk into a one-shot weapon.  The nice thing about the Boggarts is that they can stand off at six or 12 hexes with their plasma cannons, maintain some movement modifiers, and hopefully make multiple attacks before they go down.

Well the idea was something like, never deploy in open terrain, and first deploy lots of saturation Arrow IV and mines scatter the enemy battle formation. Then attack a straggler with  Arrow IV/LRM/SRM smoke rounds, Fluid Gun paint, ECM ghost targets, Plasma/Inferno induced heat, EMP iATMs.... and THEN close in to attack with EDP Basilisk attacks. I intend to use Boggarts more as mid-field interdictors to keep from getting flanked.

A problem I have is that there aren't many iATM units that I like. And I'm adverse to customs. I kind of wish that there was a Procyon with iATMs, that would have been nice. I've mostly gravitated around the Batu Z and Osteon prime as my iATM delivery systems of choice

Hobgoblin - too slow to get in range, not enough endurance
Sprite 3 - ditto, I'd rather take the vanilla Sprite
Mist Lynx Z - with that armor it will last maybe a turn, I'll pass
Viper Z - very mobile, but only one ton of ammo
Septicemia A - meh, it could have been way better
Stormcrow Z - quite acceptable actually
Summoner Z - blow off the left arm and the pilot is cooked
Timberwolf Z - runs too hot to get the most out of the iATMs
Osteon prime - my preferred iATM boat, yes its slow but you enemies will come to you and you have Nova CEWS
Savage Coyote Z - decent, but kind of wish it had more HAG30 ammo, probably an expensive paperweight
Turkina Z - holy death, but too many eggs in one basket perhaps
Batu Z - love this
Sabutai Z - delicious if you can pull it off, but no tail guns makes me nervous

I’d just add that their Clan-grade ER support lasers are longer-ranged than many BA weapons — out to 12 hexes (at a +4) and 8 hexes (at a +2).  And they can jump 2 hexes with those lasers (3 if they dump them and rely on their Mausers), and it will take 40 points of damage to destroy the point (20 members with an armor divisor of 2).  They are vulnerable to AI weapons like any unarmored infantry.

With the Society’s weirdo organization, you could probably play with “squad” and “platoon” size to enable larger numbers of more dangerous support weapons.  The Clan-grade ER _heavy_ support laser shoots out to 21 hexes (+4) and 14 hexes (+2) and does about a quarter more damage the the plain version.  But it requires a crew of 3 instead of 2, so to pack in the same number of support lasers, the Society “platoon” has to grow to at least 24 (I think), instead of the 20 in the Clan Assault Infantry Point/“Platoon”.

What would be really interesting is virotherapies and combat drugs that alter BT infantry stats for Society units.  I’d like to think that the dermal armor virotherapy would add another armor divisor to standard Clan infantry armor, and that a combat drug could effectively add another by letting the infantry fight through pain and wounds that would sideline regular Elementals.  That would be a total armor divisor of 4, requiring 96 points of damage to take out that 24-member Society “platoon”.  Exactly the kind of horrifying zombie-ish capability you’d expect out of Society infantry experiments.  But alas, no such rules exist in the canon.

It's hard to decide between Clan Heavy Jump Infantry, Assault Infantry and Clan Hover Infantry here. I guess it depends on the terrain

One, use the Bandit Caste to man the support vehicles you were interested in upthread.  Think real-world “technicals” and modify things like the Flatbed Truck from TRO 3060 to deliver mines, remote sensors, mortar rounds, smoke, etc. that aren’t affected by the bandits’ poor skills.

Two, desperate bandits — or the brainwashed bandit subjects of Society experiments — could pilot faster support vehicles in kamikaze attacks.  These could be ramming attacks at mech legs or jury-rigged with booby traps (or mix of both).  Even something as simple and cheap as a J-37 can be relatively dangerous if its pilot is suicidal.  Charge of 50 tons moving up to 8 hexes or an 80-rated engine if booby trapped.  Neither requires gunnery skill rolls and only the former requires a piloting skill roll (I think).  (The Society version would be the drones discussed upthread.)

I really like this idea  :thumbsup:
« Last Edit: 24 July 2019, 09:58:09 by Crow »
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Weirdo

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #271 on: 24 July 2019, 08:34:47 »
Bear in mind, aero units are not allowed to use most alternate munitions. Your iATM birds will be limited to the three regular ammo types.
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Xeno426

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #272 on: 24 July 2019, 09:06:36 »
A problem I have is that there aren't many iATM units that I like. And I'm adverse to customs.
Well, keep in mind that for an omnimech, customs are pretty damn easy to do. And if it's a small swap, that can make the custom a lot easier to stomach. Take some of these, for example. The Summoner I have there makes the thing rather less of a pilot death trap on the arm, while the Mist Lynx is suddenly a lot more survivable thanks to the ability to hit the 4+ TMM values. I don't have it here, but if you dropped the LAMS of the Viper Z you could put in another tonne of ammo, which is a very minor change.

And if you want to use any Society-themed vehicles, you're going to have to do some customs, because we never got any Society vees.

Sprite 2 - ditto, I'd rather take the vanilla Sprite
Don't you mean Sprite 3? The Sprite 2 just has an ERLL; it's the Sprite 3 that has the Fusillades.

It's hard to decide between Clan Heavy Jump Infantry, Assault Infantry and Clan Hover Infantry here. I guess it depends on the terrain
Heavy jump is my go-to force, since they have maximum mobility and can keep hitting the +2 TMM.

Bear in mind, aero units are not allowed to use most alternate munitions. Your iATM birds will be limited to the three regular ammo types.
One of the dumber rules in the game, IMO, especially when you intend to do some mud moving. They needed to make special exceptions just to let the ATM even mean anything to Aerospace.

Weirdo

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #273 on: 24 July 2019, 09:25:11 »
Well, keep in mind that for an omnimech, customs are pretty damn easy to do.
An easy custom is still a custom. Please bear in mind that some folks stay away from ALL customs as a matter of principle.
Quote
One of the dumber rules in the game, IMO, especially when you intend to do some mud moving. They needed to make special exceptions just to let the ATM even mean anything to Aerospace.
It is what it is. Unless your group wants to use house rules(another form of custom), not liking it doesn't make it go away.
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Crow

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #274 on: 24 July 2019, 09:58:52 »
Bear in mind, aero units are not allowed to use most alternate munitions. Your iATM birds will be limited to the three regular ammo types.

Wow, that's really lame, but thanks for pointing that out. I guess I'll have to be munchy in other areas to make up for it.
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Crow

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #275 on: 07 September 2019, 08:25:17 »
Does anyone have any ideas for what they would use a Septicemia Z for? (the one with the mobile HPG)
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Maingunnery

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #276 on: 07 September 2019, 09:35:48 »
Does anyone have any ideas for what they would use a Septicemia Z for? (the one with the mobile HPG)
1. Communication between various cells.
2. Use it to perform a EMP attack on the enemy.
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Weirdo

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #277 on: 07 September 2019, 12:15:52 »
That's very much a strategic unit, or the centerpiece of a scenario. Stop/protect the HPG before it fires, kind of stuff.
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Maingunnery

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #278 on: 07 September 2019, 12:33:45 »
almost forgot.

3. Transmitting a computer virus to an enemy WarShip.
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truetanker

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #279 on: 07 September 2019, 15:09:32 »
To send a message to hidden units in space about when to start an attack.

Pre-arranged signal.

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #280 on: 10 September 2019, 13:27:48 »
So I'm trying to plan out minis for my Society force, but am coming up with blanks in many slots. Here's what I've got locked in so far:

1st Sept:

Osteon
Savage Coyote
Mad Cat
?? (Probably a second heavy. Likely to remain unknown until Kickstarter stuff comes in.)
Septicemia
Septicemia
Cephalus

2nd Sept

Command Protomech Un
Sprite
Minotaur
Minotaur

Protomech Trey
1st Un
??
??
??

2nd Un
??
??
??

3rd Un
Basilisk Quad
Basilisk Quad
Basilisk Quad

Support Trey
1st Infantry Un
Arrow IV Platoon
Arrow IV Platoon
?? (Must fit in a Heavy Tracked APC)

2nd Infantry Un
?? (Must fit in a Heavy Hover APC)
?? (Must fit in a Heavy Hover APC)
?? (Must fit in a Heavy Hover APC)

Vehicle Un
Heimdall Monitor Tank
??
??
??
??
??
??

Any ideas to fill in the open slots?
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truetanker

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #281 on: 10 September 2019, 14:34:45 »
Infantry Uns are 3 Points...

A Heavy Hover carries 6 tons, unless your going old SLDF variant...

TT
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That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
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Weirdo

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #282 on: 10 September 2019, 14:39:42 »
Ah, was unclear. Each point will get its own APC. But the APCs are non-negotiable. It's hard finding a faction that deploys APCs in odd numbers, so I can FINALLY get the 5th hover and tracked APCs my Marians need.
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truetanker

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #283 on: 10 September 2019, 18:27:50 »
Well...If I was running this:

3 Points of these: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Clan_Assault_Infantry using these as transportation support: https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Indra.

But since you are...then how about these instead: 1x Hemdall,2x Marksman ( AC ), 2x Ballista, 2x Royal Burke.

Same speed bump but more firepower at rage.

Ballista acts as the " muscle " of the unit, Burke as the range master while the Marksman ( AC ) provides bodyguard duties. Rushing in with that AC/20 and LL combo... That Heimdall acting as a mobile missile system, an A-Z variant if you will, using iATMs.

TT
« Last Edit: 10 September 2019, 18:30:08 by truetanker »
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That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
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Weirdo

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #284 on: 10 September 2019, 19:55:40 »
No customs or customization of any kind, please.

And to slightly alter the above lists: The infantry units marked ?? don't all have to fit in the APCs, so long as in total there are an odd number of Heavy Tracked and Hover APCs when all is done.
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"...I was this many years old when I found out that licking a touchscreen in excitement is a bad idea." - JadeHellbringer
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Xeno426

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #285 on: 10 September 2019, 20:42:44 »
For one of your protomech Uns, the Boggart 2 is almost a must.

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #286 on: 11 September 2019, 09:54:31 »
For the Protos, I would go with one Un of a Sprite 2 and a pair of Sprite 1s. For the second Un, I would have a pair of Boggart 2s and a single Boggart 1.

For your last 'Mech, what about the Summoner Z? These are Society forces, so having the 8x AP Gauss to backup the iATM 12 should work well as the finisher for the other 'Mechs of the Sept.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #287 on: 11 September 2019, 11:11:36 »
I like the Boggarts idea, but I'd rather my Protos be faster than a pure Sprite Un. Maybe I'll look at Rocs or Centaurs.

I do like the idea of a Summoner Z. That'll depend on what I end up with in the Kickstarter.
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wantec

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #288 on: 11 September 2019, 13:22:11 »
I like the Boggarts idea, but I'd rather my Protos be faster than a pure Sprite Un. Maybe I'll look at Rocs or Centaurs.

I do like the idea of a Summoner Z. That'll depend on what I end up with in the Kickstarter.
The Sprites are slow, but you're talking LRMs and an ERLL, so not exactly short ranged.

Another option is going for a mechanized Un. Minotaur Zs and Hobgoblin 2s would provide some strong punch once dropped off at the party.
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truetanker

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #289 on: 11 September 2019, 14:00:27 »
No customs or customization of any kind, please.

And to slightly alter the above lists: The infantry units marked ?? don't all have to fit in the APCs, so long as in total there are an odd number of Heavy Tracked and Hover APCs when all is done.

Fair enough, the ATMs would work well any way.

On the infantry question: they weigh in @ 4 tons each for 20 troopers. So yeah, they can fit as long as your not using the variant that has less transportation space.

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That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #290 on: 11 September 2019, 14:02:56 »
Hmmm... how about 1 Minotaur and 2 Rocs? They can be carried by a Trey of the two Septicemias and any heavy Omni without slowing them down, and can also maneuver just fine on their own if no Omnis are available.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #291 on: 11 September 2019, 17:57:05 »
I do like the idea of a Summoner Z. That'll depend on what I end up with in the Kickstarter.
Problem with the Summoner Z is that it really needs more ammo for those APGRs. Without doing some kind of small custom swap, it's hard to recommend it. Picking one of the regular Summoner variants would probably serve a unit better.

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #292 on: 11 September 2019, 19:59:35 »
How much does it have per gun? I'm away from my files.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #293 on: 11 September 2019, 21:51:18 »
Eight guns, one tonne (40 shots) of ammo. If all guns fire, it's only got five rounds to shoot.

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #294 on: 11 September 2019, 23:57:59 »
Acceptable, given that the Society only beats the Clans when fighting from ambush and quickly withdrawing. Short ammo loads mean you're not tempted to stick around long enough to get killed.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #295 on: 12 September 2019, 07:31:09 »
Hmmm... how about 1 Minotaur and 2 Rocs? They can be carried by a Trey of the two Septicemias and any heavy Omni without slowing them down, and can also maneuver just fine on their own if no Omnis are available.
That could work. Personally I don't like the Roc Z, the Medium Chemical Laser seems like a waste to me, especially given 30 rounds of ammo, but it's not a horrible choice.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #296 on: 12 September 2019, 08:44:45 »
The Summoner Z has only 5 shots for its 8 APGRs, sure, but do you ever think about the implications of a critical hit when the left arm gets hit? The pilot is gonna turn into meatloaf.
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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #297 on: 12 September 2019, 08:51:38 »
The Summoner Z has only 5 shots for its 8 APGRs, sure, but do you ever think about the implications of a critical hit when the left arm gets hit? The pilot is gonna turn into meatloaf.

That seals the deal. It's so funny I can't *not* deploy it!

As long as at least one Warrior goes down with him, and the Scientists get to poke said meatloaf a bit, it's still a victory for SCIENCE!

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Xeno426

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #298 on: 12 September 2019, 09:17:46 »
The Summoner Z has only 5 shots for its 8 APGRs, sure, but do you ever think about the implications of a critical hit when the left arm gets hit? The pilot is gonna turn into meatloaf.
That's the other reason I don't much care for it. The Society has issues with getting enough warriors, so you'd think they'd make use of things like CASE II on the APGRs to help reduce the chance that a single APGR getting knocked out cascades into all of them frying the pilot.

Crow

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Re: The Society's Ultra Top Secret Evil Volcano Lair IIC Z
« Reply #299 on: 12 September 2019, 12:37:08 »
Weirdo, have you ever considered using the Maultier? There's probably loads of them laying around in Brian Caches, and they don't have much in the way of weapons to make them attractive to your average Clanner.

The vanilla Maultier has 3 tons of space and the MG version has 4 tons for infantry, enough for a Clan Jump Platoon
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