’Mech of the Week: BLR-** BattleMaster

[Alexander Knight]

There is another advantage to the BLR's weight over say...a Warhammer or Marauder.

Your arm gets hit for 35 damage.  What do you do?

WHM & MAD:  "I'm gonna sit here and cry a bit."

BLR:  "Oi!  I still got internal structure left.  COME GET SOME!"

[SCC]

Jj's are easy. Drop the ppc to a ll, drop the mg's and thats enough tonage for jj's

TacOps page 293 is a better option

[Col.Hengist]

It's not a bad option.

[SCC]

This leaves the personal variants. While we don’t have the personal configuration of the Fox, Hanse Davion (whether it was a custom job or a standard config and he was just That Damn Good©)

Hanse is part of the fluff, in the fluff the PPC of a BattleMaster was hand carried and if the pictures are telling the truth it doesn't matter which hand does the carrying, so maybe he went guns akimbo

[Weirdo]

It's probably not a Hand-Held Weapon per se, but has the jettisonable quirk. I'm 90% sure that if/when CGL releases quirks for older designs, things like the Beemer, Griffin, P-Hawk, and whatnot will get that quirk.

[SCC]

Actually I believe that the classic BattleMaster, the BLR-1G, now has the jetisionable quirk on it

What I am describing aren't HH weapons as the BT rules have them, but close, the only difference is that the ones I'm postulating can use the 'Mechs HS

[Weirdo]

So...either Quirk[Jettisonable] weapons, or something that has no current rules support. Am I correct?

[George_Labour]

In the original TRO 3025 the battlemaster was stated as being able to disconnect its PPC as needed. But of course there were no real rules for this, it was just one of those tidbits from the "old" days.

In several other novels set before the unseen debacle Bmers often drop their PPC before engaging in hand to hand combat. Notably in the Grey Death novel the young Alex Carlyle is caught off guard when a battlemaster does just this very thing before punching him out of the simulated fight he was in.

Also as to someone's statement about JJs. Doesn't a post jihad kurita variant mount improved jets? Or does that not count since it drops the speed to 3/5/5 instead of 4/6/4?

[Arkansas Warrior]

In the Warrior trilogy, Hanse pistol-whips a griffin in the face with his PPC, which destroys the PPC, so he drops the shattered remnants and starts punching.

[Orin J.]

the Battlemaster is, in all likelihood, the design that best weathered the whole "unseen" debacle.  #P the weapons are all there, and are all largely in the same shame (the loss of the "fiberoptic" embedded laser slots probably only being a loss in my eyes), the body retains much of what made the original design so striking with the broad torso lines, bubble canopy and the "rifle" placement of the gun. a very striking appearance to be sure, and a suitable choice for being the "face" 'mech of CGL.

It's probably not a Hand-Held Weapon per se, but has the jettisonable quirk. I'm 90% sure that if/when CGL releases quirks for older designs, things like the Beemer, Griffin, P-Hawk, and whatnot will get that quirk.

this makes perfect sense to me. being largely handheld in design but have a few couplings that connect the weapon to the targeting/power/coolant systems that can be disengaged to allow for full use of the hands would only be reasonable, and properly connecting something that would be like ten minutes for a tech is probably still FAR out of reason for the mitts of even a 20-ton battlemech.

[blitzy]

In the Warrior trilogy, Hanse pistol-whips a griffin in the face with his PPC, which destroys the PPC, so he drops the shattered remnants and starts punching.

That's almost like saying Chuck Norris.  Hanse was that dang good back then.

[SCC]

So...either Quirk[Jettisonable] weapons, or something that has no current rules support. Am I correct?

Quirk[Jettisonable] weapon might model what actually happens in the books better, no one seems to talk about people picking dropped PPC's back up, but it goes against what people seem to remember/imagined the situation. Of course this (Quirk[Jettisonable] weapon) doesn't deal with the fact that the original image of the BattleMaster (in TRO:3025) was holding the gun in it's left hand, which is why I suggested that Hanse went with 2 PPC's, in universe it might have been possible.

[Arkansas Warrior]

Except that we've never seen that in stories that show Hanse in the cockpit.

[Col.Hengist]

On the last forums that crashed Herb suggested to me that the ppc may have been retractable or would fold back.

 Also something to consider is the artwork for the original wolverine thats holding what looks like a magazine clip for the AC.

 Good thing we know art is trumped by recordsheets.

[SCC]

Except that we've never seen that in stories that show Hanse in the cockpit.

It was a suggestion

On the last forums that crashed Herb suggested to me that the ppc may have been retractable or would fold back.

Also something to consider is the artwork for the original wolverine thats holding what looks like a magazine clip for the AC.

Good thing we know art is trumped by recordsheets.

Until Herb and the other PTB start adding new rules so that the recordsheets match the art

And I'm getting rather OT, lets stop

[cray]

I thought the Battlemaster was cool because of its tonnage and name until I was about 14, and then realized the BLR-1G was really undergunned for the size. 1 PPC and some short-ranged weapons? Bleh.

I found the Battlemaster had, however, huge improvement potential, once a friend thumped the potential of bracketed weapons fire into my head. Ditch the MGs and SRM, switch the rear MLs around, add a PPC, and you've got a hugely tough Marauder or Warhammer with improved short ranged firepower. Of course, lots of 'Mechs benefit from customization.

The Penetrator came first, but then I got to make the Warlord. (Which was supposed to be a 75-ton version of the BLR with twin HPPCs, but ended up at 80 tons by line developer directive. XTRO:Phantoms let me finally introduce the 75-ton version.)

[ANS Kamas P81]

Also something to consider is the artwork for the original wolverine thats holding what looks like a magazine clip for the AC.

One ton of ammunition carried as bulk mass under the external cargo rules.  The pilot's just waiting for a reloading vehicle to be free.  Where's the problem?

[Col.Hengist]

One ton of ammunition carried as bulk mass under the external cargo rules.  The pilot's just waiting for a reloading vehicle to be free.  Where's the problem?

 When did i say there was a problem?

[ANS Kamas P81]

Your comment "Good thing art is trumped by record sheets" seemed to suggest that the art was wrong somehow.  To me, anyway; I simply came up with a way that the art isn't "trumped" in that particular image.

Anyway, this is about BLRs, not WVRs.

I thought the Battlemaster was cool because of its tonnage and name until I was about 14, and then realized the BLR-1G was really undergunned for the size. 1 PPC and some short-ranged weapons? Bleh.

Biggest thing I see for the original Battlemaster is its mobility - it equals most of the current 50 tonners and heavies, and is outmatched by things only much lighter than it is.  This lets it come charging into a battle line, rather than plod along and be constantly outmaneuvered, and bring that big close-range firepower to bear in all directions.  And the 14.5 tons of armor lets it get there before it gets shot to bits.

To me, the Battlemaster is a wolverine in a wet sack that you throw in someone's window, and either they deal with it and get chewed up badly in the process or scatter away and into the guns of your long-range combatants.

[Martius]

Funny thing is that a 4/6 movement profile for an assault is nothing special in this era. Check TRO 3039.

Victor, Zeus, Banshee, Cyclops, Battlemaster, Goliath, Longbow- all moving 4/6.

Only the Awesome, Stalker and Atlas are slower, the Charger even faster and Marauder II can jump.

[Kit deSummersville]

Well, the 4/6 Longbow is the one we snicker at. The 3/5 Longbow is actually sought after.

[Arkansas Warrior]

Well, the 4/6 Longbow is the one we snicker at. The 3/5 Longbow is actually sought after.

Ditto the Banshee, more or less.

Worthwhile Chargers are are no faster than 4/6.


Also, jump jets aside, the Marauder II is slower.

[Martius]

Ditto the Banshee, more or less.

More less I guess. I doubt the Steiners shared them a lot and other variants move 4/6.

Worthwhile Chargers are are no faster than 4/6.

What is worthwhile and not was not the point of my posting, was it?  ;)

And yeah, those Chargers move at avarage assault 'Mech speed (for that era) as well.

Also, jump jets aside, the Marauder II is slower.

I never said it is not. But it jumps, giving it an edge in mobility over the other 3/5 'Mechs.

So regardless at what we might snicker at (sadly there is no other Longbow in TRO 3039 ;) ) or what configuration we prefer to play with- 4/6 is nothing special for an assault Mech.

[DoctorMonkey]

I thought the Battlemaster was cool because of its tonnage and name until I was about 14, and then realized the BLR-1G was really undergunned for the size. 1 PPC and some short-ranged weapons? Bleh.

I found the Battlemaster had, however, huge improvement potential, once a friend thumped the potential of bracketed weapons fire into my head. Ditch the MGs and SRM, switch the rear MLs around, add a PPC, and you've got a hugely tough Marauder or Warhammer with improved short ranged firepower. Of course, lots of 'Mechs benefit from customization.

The Penetrator came first, but then I got to make the Warlord. (Which was supposed to be a 75-ton version of the BLR with twin HPPCs, but ended up at 80 tons by line developer directive. XTRO:Phantoms let me finally introduce the 75-ton version.)

The Warlord is wonderful, thank you

[Arkansas Warrior]

I never said it is not. But it jumps, giving it an edge in mobility over the other 3/5 'Mechs.

You said only the Atlas, Awesome, and Stalker are slower, and only mentioned the Marauder II in the context of it jumping.  I figured I'd mention it in case someone thought it was 4/6/4 or something.

[Col.Hengist]

@Cray... you designed the penetrator?

[Martius]

You said only the Atlas, Awesome, and Stalker are slower, and only mentioned the Marauder II in the context of it jumping.  I figured I'd mention it in case someone thought it was 4/6/4 or something.

Only the Awesome, Stalker and Atlas are slower, the Charger even faster and Marauder II can jump.

Let me try again then.

Only the Awesome, Stalker and Atlas are slower. The Charger is even faster. The Marauder II can jump.

[rlbell]

Funny thing is that a 4/6 movement profile for an assault is nothing special in this era. Check TRO 3039.

Victor, Zeus, Banshee, Cyclops, Battlemaster, Goliath, Longbow- all moving 4/6.

Only the Awesome, Stalker and Atlas are slower, the Charger even faster and Marauder II can jump.

This is what has always bugged me about the TRO:3039 4/6 assaults:  Except when they get involved in physical combat, they are, at best, no worse than a 75t heavy.  I have not had the chance to make good use of it, but I have this silly idea of a corrupt factory manager selling remodelled Orions as bogus Longbow, Zeus, Battlemaster, Victor, and Cyclops mechs (even with identical weapons and armor, the c-bills cost of the Orion is much cheaper).  Most units were quite upset by the fraud, but the one-eyed Orion actually had some fans, as they still had the B2000 battle management computer and had thicker armor.

[Neufeld]

My reaction to the found tech Beemers is that they don't impress me much.

BLR-2C & BLR-3M: Whoop-de-do, we have gained some range on the PPC.

BLR-3S: Oh great, another non-jumper giving away range by using MPLs. Anemic firepower outside six hexes.

BLR-4L: Now, this one has some potential, especially as a long-range annoyance. Not great, but usable.

BLR-4S: OK, this one is a decent upgrade of the original. Still, only decent.

BLR-5M: Finally a variant combining the durability of a SFE with an acceptable level of long-range firepower. (4L & 4S both use light engines.)

BLR-6X: XXL Large engine, and it costs how much? Probably one of the most expensive mechs in existence.

BLR-10S/10S2: Fail. 3/5 and short-range specialization does not work on todays battlefield.

BLR-CM: Well, it is one of the few dual C3 master mechs.

BLR-K3: A bit too hot running, but it can contribute at all ranges.

BLR-K4: Situational. A nightmare when it has cover, but is hurt badly by open terrain.

BLR-M3: OK, this one is decent.

C: Honestly, I liked the Corsair's toy better. Its saving grace is that Clan mediums has more range. Still, needing Clan-tech to be a good mech says much.

So, some of them are decent enough, but in the end, the ones I would be interested in fielding are:
- If needing C3Masters: CM, K3 & M3.
- As a generalist: 4L & 5M.
- In single scenarios set in cities/forests: K4.
- Acceptable if they come up in a RAT/as salvage: 2C, 3M, 4S, C.
- Sell and buy something better: 3S, 6X, 10S, 10S2.

[cray]

@Cray... you designed the penetrator?

No. I meant the Penetrator came along and embodied many of the ideas of a well-designed Battlemaster before the Warlord.