Inventions regarding heat management

[Aotrs Commander]

BT armour has to be designed to RESIST heat, since it's ablative and has to be proof against energy weapons that deliver heat. And thermodynamics don't really let you have it both ways, so in order to keep the lasers from easily melting through the armour, the armour isn't going let heat out the other way.

Is there an arguement that there ought to be a minor factor that as you punch more holes in a mech and blow bits off, it might cool easier? Sure, but a) that would be insanely complex and b) it could easily be such a comparitively small value that is doesn't matter. (Ditto the reverse for residualy heat from getting pummellled by repeated PPC fire ought to make it harder to shed heat.) Does that arguement break down a birt when you consider fire still heats mechs and that water doesn't evaporate a lot when a hot mech stands in it? Yeah, little bit, but you're then getting to the point of balancing a realistic thermodynamic situation without unknown technology or having an actually playable game.

As my Dad (a former aerospace engineer who did mathmatical modelling for a living) says; all simulations are wrong; some simulations are useful.

[CarcosanDawn]

Modern military equipment does absolutely have heat problems - anyone with a computer with a GFX processor who plays high-end games will tell you that electronics generate huge amounts of heat.

There are even computer brands that have notoriously bad heat management in their electronics (Dell, not to name names) for certain (not all!) products.

For this reason, rooms dedicated to electronic systems are often cooled past what is comfortable for humans - I wear a sweater in my building's server room or else I am shivering, and I *like* the cold.

[General308]

Plot.

Because the people in charge consider it a crucial part of the gameplay fun to have to manage heat.
I strongly agree with them, as do many players.


Then select 'Mechs that are heat neutral. Plenty of those.

I think you summed it up perfectly.       And like  you said if you don't want to deal with Heat their are plenty of  Heat neutral mechs.

[General308]

So why is heat still a thing 600+ years after the invention of mechs?
I am really curious from a gameplay standpoint why heat management hasn't been cured in the game.
From a gameplay standpoint I think it would help newer players get into the game.

Here is a question for you why cure it?    Your only reason given is you seem to think newer players are not able to learn the rule for heat.   Why would that be a problem for anyone to learn?   Why would you want to remove game balance?   Why would you not just pick heat nuteral designs if dealing with heat is hard for you?

[Caesar Steiner for Archon]

I think OP is borrowing the idea from video games, where maximum engine power is a common limiting factor. In Front Mission you start out with access to the worst parts, and over the course of the story, you get better and better stuff until you are running around in Zenith Mk V chassis with ten times the health and 20 times the reactor output as the junker you started in. That's good for a video game because those are built around a progression track. The point of BT isn't "start out with the worst equipment and play until you have the best equipment then kill the final boss" though, so it doesn't fit. It's not a game with a single linear experience that you gain power steadily while playing.

[BrianDavion]

I think OP is borrowing the idea from video games, where maximum engine power is a common limiting factor. In Front Mission you start out with access to the worst parts, and over the course of the story, you get better and better stuff until you are running around in Zenith Mk V chassis with ten times the health and 20 times the reactor output as the junker you started in. That's good for a video game because those are built around a progression track. The point of BT isn't "start out with the worst equipment and play until you have the best equipment then kill the final boss" though, so it doesn't fit. It's not a game with a single linear experience that you gain power steadily while playing.

Indeed, and to a degree it CAN be, in that you can start out in a campaign in a basic stinger or wasp and slowly work your way up, but the tech progression from say.... a introtech STG-3R to a  100 ton clan tech customized  iron cheetah (just to use one of the latest 100 ton mechs we've gotten) can be pretty big. but battletech is also a war game so balancing factors are needed for those NOT playing a campaign play

[VanVelding]

I think OP is borrowing the idea from video games...It's not a game with a single linear experience that you gain power steadily while playing.

You can imagine OP is using a concept which doesn't hold up to examination, but that sounds a lot like a straw man argument.

OP was straightforward about how they feel that heat was a technologically solvable problem and that it was a hurdle to new players they experience when teaching new players.

The first is a reasonable argument which the equally-reasonable world of Battletech has eschewed.

The second is an observed obstacle to introducing new people to the game.

OP is asking questions about a reasonable shift in the technological paradigm and challenges they face in getting new players into the game. Is the answer to that "OP probably plays too many power fantasy video games"?

Hint: it isn't

[RifleMech]

Heat is a balance thing like armor vs guns. Bigger guns results in better/more armor which results in bigger guns and so on. It's the same with heat. Better heat sinks results in higher heat generating weapons. We've seen that with SLDF and Clan tech. I don't see why that wouldn't continue with triple and quad heat sinks or whatever.

As for playing, as others have said, the OP should use heat neutral designs until the new players get more experience. If they just skip heat flashbulbs end up completely dominating everything. That'll take away from the fun.

[Caesar Steiner for Archon]

You can imagine OP is using a concept which doesn't hold up to examination, but that sounds a lot like a straw man argument.

OP was straightforward about how they feel that heat was a technologically solvable problem and that it was a hurdle to new players they experience when teaching new players.

The first is a reasonable argument which the equally-reasonable world of Battletech has eschewed.

The second is an observed obstacle to introducing new people to the game.

OP is asking questions about a reasonable shift in the technological paradigm and challenges they face in getting new players into the game. Is the answer to that "OP probably plays too many power fantasy video games"?

Hint: it isn't

Wow, you sure are straw manning hard by attaching moral judgments to my words there. Welcome to ignore.

[General308]

Wow, you sure are straw manning hard by attaching moral judgments to my words there. Welcome to ignore.

In fairness to him you are not really replying or answering peoples questions to you.  Which kind of creates a situation were people have to make their own judgement of were you are coming from.

[Moonsword]

Enjoy your thread lock for moderator review, and I hope the enforced cooling off improves your heat management.