Rate That Mech; The Quckdraw

[Drewbacca]

I have to say, there is something about this mech. I think it is too much of a generalist, but I have always wanted to use it. The 5A seems to speak to me and I am planning on using it in my next game. What is the general opinion of it?

[JadeHellbringer]

...it does an excellent job of showing that not all heavy Mechs are winners. Most versions just don't really compete against others in their class- hell, it's hard to see a scenario where one beats a Mech ten tons lighter in a lot of situations. The weapon choices on-paper are solid overall, but the placement (rear lasers, ARGH) are often just bizarre. I'd use one over a Jagermech, but even then I'd not be too happy about it.

I did have fun running the MRM version in a game years ago in Dover, but overall Quickdraws are Mechs I'm happy to leave alone.

[Fear Factory]

If the medium lasers were flipped forward it would be a nice heavy medium.  I like the 'Mech because I'm crazy.

Alpha Strike though....  suprisingly good.

[Wildonion]

+1 for forwarding mounting all the guns on the earlier versions of the 'Mech. At least we got something solid in the Dark Age with the QKD-9M!

[Kos]

I'm a fan. It is rather over-engined and under-everything else but I play Kurita cavalry so it's very faction appropriate and I tend to bring one along for flavour.

Usually I'll put my high piloting skill mechwarrior in it, skirmish, and just go to town with physical attacks on the opfor. It actually makes a pretty serviceable hand-to-hand combatant, good manouverability to close, and good weight/speed for charges and DFAs. I concur with your choice of the 5A, it's probably my favorite variant. It's not an optimised mech by any stretch of the imagination but I've always had fun with it.

The clincher was a formative BT game where I faced down a Wolf's Dragoons Warhammer in my humble little Kuritan Quickdraw. I figured I had been dealt a bad mech for the scenario but persevered: I kept outmaneuvering the WHR with my jumpjets, shooting and kicking, whittling away it's armour and legs before finishing it off with a lethal DFA. Great BT memory and it gave me an enduring affection for the Quickdraw.     

[Sartris]

When I roll one on an FWL rat I immediately try to figure out if I can justify swapping it out for a Wolverine 6M

[sadlerbw]

In most configurations I’d say it is a very solid 50T design...unfortunately it weighs 60T.

Like another poster said, it’s nicer in Alpha Strike. The PV system is reasonably kind to it, and being a low end heavy has some advantages for physical attacks.

[Drewbacca]

Could it be that it is a heavy that is more on par with the upper end Mediums? Say the Classic 55s. It would seem to match up well there if a bit under-armored?

I could see it being paired with any of the Classic 55s. Also the weaponry and mobility make it seem like a match for the Ost 60s.

[klarg1]

Could it be that it is a heavy that is more on par with the upper end Mediums? Say the Classic 55s. It would seem to match up well there if a bit under-armored?

I could see it being paired with any of the Classic 55s. Also the weaponry and mobility make it seem like a match for the Ost 60s.

I can't say I'm a fan, but, like everything that's been in the game for so long, I'm sure there are variants I would like.

It is trying to be a heavier version of the classic 55's, yes, but while being bigger makes it slightly better in physical combat, it comes it under-gunned, and under-armored in comparison. (Fundamentally, going from 55 to 60 tons as a 5/8/5 is a bad deal under intro tech rules.)

Now, none of this means I wouldn't use one in a game. I am all about constructing scenarios with non-optimal canon units, and seeing how to get the most from them. The Quickdraw is full of flaws, but that too has a certain amount of charm.

Heck, among my favorite 'mechs are the humble RFL-3N, and BNC-3E, so I am not casting any stones at anybody's favorite ride.  :D

[SteelRaven]

I could have cared less about this mech until QKD-8X/QKD-8P, no other mech has pulled off hand-held weapons so well. Plus the mental image of a Quickdraw caring a RAC/5 like Old Painless just makes me chuckle ;D

[klarg1]

I could have cared less about this mech until QKD-8X/QKD-8P, no other mech has pulled off hand-held weapons so well. Plus the mental image of a Quickdraw caring a RAC/5 like Old Painless just makes me chuckle ;D

Yeah, the 8x/8P has all kinds of "breakin' the conventions" cool factor going for it.

[Fear Factory]

I'm a fan. It is rather over-engined and under-everything else but I play Kurita cavalry so it's very faction appropriate and I tend to bring one along for flavour.

Usually I'll put my high piloting skill mechwarrior in it, skirmish, and just go to town with physical attacks on the opfor. It actually makes a pretty serviceable hand-to-hand combatant, good manouverability to close, and good weight/speed for charges and DFAs. I concur with your choice of the 5A, it's probably my favorite variant. It's not an optimised mech by any stretch of the imagination but I've always had fun with it.

The clincher was a formative BT game where I faced down a Wolf's Dragoons Warhammer in my humble little Kuritan Quickdraw. I figured I had been dealt a bad mech for the scenario but persevered: I kept outmaneuvering the WHR with my jumpjets, shooting and kicking, whittling away it's armour and legs before finishing it off with a lethal DFA. Great BT memory and it gave me an enduring affection for the Quickdraw.   

A lot of the big engine 'Mechs play the same way.  They're awesome for physicals, play them like a weight class lower for ranged combat and maneuvering but play them like their weight class with physicals.

I like your story.  The same kind of thing happened to me while I was playing an Assassin for the first time.  Made me love the design ever sense, and I got to relive that old feeling recently when I punted the head off a Cyclops.  It doesn't happen a lot, but when it does, it feels good.

[Kos]

Yes, that's the idea drewbaca: It usually finds it's place alongside other 'fast 60s' like the Osts and Dragon and 55t mediums in 'cavalry' lances. My typical lance for 3025 is: A Quickdraw, Grand Dragon, Griffin, and Wolverine K: The Grand Dragon and Wolverine maneuver and support each other on the ground, the Griffin uses it's JJ to get to high ground and snipe, and the Quickdraw flanks and shoots/kicks targets of opportunity.

It can also make a decent heavy scout or scout hunter when fielded with lighter mechs, outarmouring and outranging generic lights (Wasp, Stinger etc.). Sometimes I run Quickdraws with Jenners with good results: The Jenner runs down light mechs and hits them with 20+ damage to force a piloting roll, the Quickdraw blasts them with LRMs then kicks them while they're down.

I have a habit of trying to run at least one 'suboptimal' but faction appropriate mech in every lance, and the Quickdraw is my choice of habit. Just try to focus on what the Quickdraw can do as opposed to its  shortcomings. This has led me to the strategy of 'sweep the leg' with kicks while firing off arm and torso mounted guns. It works well enough (sometimes).

[Kidd]

There's a decent MOTW here: https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=60437.0

I love its looks and a couple of the variants. I'd throw in the OG Quickdraw as a mook Mech just for kicks, but I wouldn't pilot it.

[Tyler Jorgensson]

I dislike the mech. I've got two minis (that are in a lance with two Dragons (Guess which Lance Pack I got two of lol)) that I will probably never Field on the table. Sure it's fast for a heavy, but it's light for a heavy. It's got paltry weapons for its size, and although I use Grasshoppers and Guillotines aplenty, this mech just doesn't seem worth it for me. Tried looking for variants but nothing seems to click.

Who knows though: I might find myself trying it more after the HBS BT game, making a custom variant and trying it in a friendly one vs one.

[Firesprocket]

I'm not particularly fond of most variants of the Quickdraw.  The 9M though I've played on a couple of occasions and find it to be a solid machine.

[Paul]

Yeah, the 8x/8P has all kinds of "breakin' the conventions" cool factor going for it.

Thanks! It was fun to make!

But yeah, the Quickdraw is hard to love.
I think it's one of those designs that:
- Needs to be in large battles. Company+
- Needs to be deployed in lance+ formations

(Remember, fluff wise, Mechs were once designed to be deployed in company, even battalion size formations for the SL.)

If we accept those 2 ideas, then the Q should pretty much always be running around in the thick of things, while other units are putting down lower TTM's than it. If you've played a large game with a JagerMech, you'll notice they survive pretty often: just not enough juice for the squeeze to kill them when they hang back, and you have easier targets in your face. The Quickdraw needs to provoke the same problem. It can do OK when there's easier targets nearby, and the enemy really has to wonder whether it's worth trying to remove a couple of Medium Lasers off the field.
Coupled with large numbers, their job becomes clear. Find something, and kick/charge it to death. Find that Mech that took a stray shot to the dome and punch it in. Distract and disrupt the enemy. Exploit the holes in their formation with a lance of 5/8 frames that have 12 point kicks, 8-16 medium lasers in every direction, and that can deploy their own smoke on the way in or out.


So, generally speaking, the kind of play style you're not likely to see even in a AS game...

[William J. Pennington]

Its just hard to overcome that 55 ton mechs with a similar move profile are better. You save 2.5 tons on Jump Jets, and you only lose one ton of actual weight in usable equipment from dropping 5 tons. Net gain of 1.5 tons by a 5 ton diet.

[Paul]

Pretty much any 60 tonner with JJs is going to have that problem...

[JadedFalcon]

It's a support mech, as stated in TRO3025. It's there to back up the other mechs in the lance rather than be the star of the lance. It can be a solid mech depending on the circumstances, but tends to fare poorly in a duel.

[pheonixstorm]

I tend to use it as a heavy scout for heavy and assault lances due to its speed. There are times when it is not a bad machine though is more limited than most heavies. Once SL tech comes around it is fairly easy to upgrade even if only swapping out its current loadout for higher end items of the same type (ML for MPL etc.). I tend to do just that as a field upgrade. I have even tossed on a hatchet before once, made for an interesting experience.

[Kovax]

I used to dislike the QKD, but came to the eventual conclusion that it made a fairly decent "generalist" as a 50-55 ton Medium, except that it's a few tons overweight.  Run it like an underpowered heavy and it's not very good, but treat it as a medium trooper in need of a diet and it's at least respectable.

If the rear-mounted weapons were faced forward, it would actually be a rather scary piece of equipment.  That would give it quad MLs with 5/8 speed to put them right in your face, and an LRM-10 rack for whenever it's not close enough to be a threat with the lasers, but "throwing away" the 2 tons of MLs by mounting them like that (and still giving the 'Mech the additional heatsinks to use those rear weapons at the same time as the forward guns) puts a sizable dent in its effectiveness.  The really sad part is, since it has MLs in both arms, there are no blind spots it can't cover with the forward weapons by torso-twisting, so it's actually one of the 'Mechs with the LEAST need for rear-mounted weaponry.

Basically, it's not a particularly "good" design, thanks to the "questionable" placement of the lasers, but there are significantly worse ones you could take.

[Straw Boss]

The Quick draw is just makes the cut in my opinion, I have one in my DCMS company (after i realized that i needed another heavy and i didn't need 4 Catapults).

it does mount 4 of the best weapon south of Manaringaine (the mighty medium laser), but making all the weapons front facing is a must in my opinion.

[Garrand]

Going to echo what the others said here in that the Quickdraw would be much more likable if it had all 4ML firing forward. IIRC there IS an official variant that does that (4H) but then switches the SRM 4 to the rear...why??? If you had all weapons forward I could forgive the weak armor for the tonnage. As it is all the stock designs are pretty mediocre for a 3025 machine.

Personally I was never a big fan of the 3025 60t designs (except for the Merlin, which is OK). Pretty much all of them are overengined for their weight. The only ones I see with any favor are the Ostrocs. And even those are a bit of a heat hog (I just tend to do well with them for some reason)...

Damon.

[massey]

I like the Quickdraw.  It isn't optimized, but I've started to think that mechs shouldn't necessarily be.

It's like the Centurion in that it's a kind of generic trooper mech.  I sometimes throw one in to fill out a force (sometimes opfor, sometimes my own).  I think it's a good GM controlled mech in a campaign.  Most players don't love it, but you can absolutely see why an army would want some Quickdraws.  If you think of it as a medium mech that needs to go on a diet, then it's just fine.

[Alsadius]

It feels like it's designed to wade into close combat and laugh at being surrounded, mostly.

That said, I'm amazed that there isn't a MML variant anywhere along the line. Something with a couple MML-5 and front-mounted lasers would be a beast, even if it is five tons too heavy. Combine that with a TSM model like the -9X, and you have something that can punch heads off and that makes the weight choice look really good.

[trboturtle]

The QKD-5Mr was my design, one I came up for my Battlecorps Character, Caith Dystrka. Only thing was that version of the design had all ERMLs facing forward. It was designed as a C3i disrupter, and to hit hard at what it aimed at.

Craig

[Demon55]

I'm not particularly fond of most variants of the Quickdraw.  The 9M though I've played on a couple of occasions and find it to be a solid machine.

Agreed.  I have used the QKD-4G a few times.  Most of them are subpar and weird.  Rear-mounted or OS SRM-4, why?  All of the medium lasers should be forward mounted IMO.

I would drop one of the missile launchers and add more armor.  They can be used effectively but there are better mechs out there for the same weight.

[Arkansas Warrior]

The QKD-5M is begging for someone to switch out the mixed missiles for an MML-9.


More generally, I’d say the Quickdraw is a lot like the Charger: too over-engined for the tonnage, leading to big sacrifices elsewhere.  Of course, it isn’t as bad as the Charger, but it’s a difference of degree, not of kind.  Unlike the Charger the Quickdraw still has its uses, you just have to pretend that it weighs about 40 tons.

[RoundTop]

The 8K is my jam. I have a weird soft spot for MRMs though. Nothing says "hello" quite like an MRM30 exploding up close. The +1 to hit can be annoying, but I consider it a heavy mech deterent. It isn't there to shoot at lights. That is what the 4 ER MLs are for.  The MRM30 is for the slower heavies that you want to put a world of hurt on so your team can exploit.  (LBX do a good sandblasting job, so do lots of LRMs. The MRM is quite optimal, like getting hit with 2 LRM15s)