Author Topic: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?  (Read 14312 times)

pheonixstorm

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #30 on: 08 February 2019, 18:30:26 »
If CGL did new lance packs using newer more modern sculpts with units that haven't been in plastic before or additional classics it is certain they will sell. Especially the new Marauder and Warhammer. I would buy packs of those all day. 4 mechs for $20 in plastic is a good buy. Being able to buy the 8 units from the GoAC box in 4 packs for $20 would be an excellent buy too.

Darzoni

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #31 on: 08 February 2019, 18:35:18 »
Having just gotten my box of stompy robots today, I certainly hope CGL is able to produce more plastic miniatures.

Heck, if IWM said "We're investing in plastic injection machinery and going to make molds for the top 10 best-sellers, here's our Kickstarter page." I'd be all over that.

Sartris

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #32 on: 08 February 2019, 19:08:19 »
I just noticed IWM has a 10 pack of Omnis up for sale on line.

I think it was 9 of the Originals & a Kingfisher?? 

Pricey in metal but a solid starter Binary.

There’s a coupon code in the box that lowers it to $90.

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #33 on: 08 February 2019, 19:15:51 »

Myself, yeah, I feel $49.99 would be the best target price.  And I know I'd have been a lot happier if the 8 minis didn't have 3 duplicates from the last several sets in there.

Swapping the Awesome, Catapult, & Commando for a Wasp/Stinger, Mad/Hammer, & Stalker or even tossing in the Griffin/Wolverine from the Beginners set so you got both in the same box or something like that would have really been spot on for me.


Bear in mind when these boxes were in development there was this little lawsuit going on you may have heard of. So there was no way in hell any of the Macross designs were going to be included.


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Gigastrike

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #34 on: 08 February 2019, 21:08:46 »
If CGL did new lance packs using newer more modern sculpts with units that haven't been in plastic before or additional classics it is certain they will sell. Especially the new Marauder and Warhammer. I would buy packs of those all day. 4 mechs for $20 in plastic is a good buy. Being able to buy the 8 units from the GoAC box in 4 packs for $20 would be an excellent buy too.

Oh, my gosh.  If they released a bunch of 4 mech sets for $20, I'd buy every single one of them.

(SMD)MadCow

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #35 on: 08 February 2019, 21:19:59 »

Or you do a kickstarter and you presell those mini packs and you solve the problem.

I agree, just look at the sucess of Reaper Miniatures and their Bones line, they've done 4 and one for CAV.

Empyrus

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #36 on: 08 February 2019, 22:25:08 »
I'd be wary of hoping for 4x'Mechs for $20, the reason being that the starter box costs that but has only 2x'Mechs. Yes, it contains other stuff as well, but still...

I mean, it'd be nice but just seems unlikely to me.

Cache

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #37 on: 08 February 2019, 22:35:56 »
I'd be wary of hoping for 4x'Mechs for $20, the reason being that the starter box costs that but has only 2x'Mechs. Yes, it contains other stuff as well, but still...

I mean, it'd be nice but just seems unlikely to me.
I believe that is what the original metal Beginners Sets cost, before they were repackaged as lance packs. So... it isn't unheard of.

Foxx Ital

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #38 on: 08 February 2019, 23:50:37 »
I wouldn't mind plastic clan mechs but I know I'm a vocal minority on that.
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pheonixstorm

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #39 on: 09 February 2019, 01:08:22 »
I'd be wary of hoping for 4x'Mechs for $20, the reason being that the starter box costs that but has only 2x'Mechs. Yes, it contains other stuff as well, but still...

I mean, it'd be nice but just seems unlikely to me.

Why? We already had $20 lance packs, there would be no new investment, and there would be no need for anything in the box beyond the mechs and a plastic bed to keep them safe. Maybe AS cards as well. It would be an expansion which would require either BMM/TW or one of the box sets to play.

Doesn't matter if the starter is $20. If you buy the lance you then have to buy a rule book. By then your up to 60 and unless you buy into Alpha Strike you need maps, which means you need one of the boxes (for now). Overall if I had never played BT I would buy the starter, then toss it or buy the books and more mechs. Can't do much except paint if you have no rules to go a long with the minis.

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #40 on: 09 February 2019, 01:11:40 »
I wouldn't mind plastic clan mechs but I know I'm a vocal minority on that.
I'd like 'em as well.
Namely the 16 original Omnis (and some Elementals), less interested in others.

Bigkahuna

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #41 on: 09 February 2019, 03:22:53 »
I don’t think there is any question or doubt that Lance Packs would sell like hot cakes if they where of the equal quality to the new box set and they where unique molds (different from the box sets).

The previous Alpha Strike Lance packs didn’t sell for many reasons, the fact that the sculpts were garbage was no doubt at the top of that list. 

The books are an issue too.  The core Battlemech Manual for example should never be out of print, even if you have to overstock that thing and sell it at a loss.  Its the main book.  Without it, your game is officially ”out of print” no matter what else is available for the game.

I introduced Battletech to a friend this week, he like me is a consumer of games but a decade younger then me and had never played Battletech.  We played and his opinion was ”this game feels like a game from the 80’s”, mind you he was born in 85.  Suffice to say, I think that is the one other issue Catalyst needs to address.  I know that the fact that the game is unchanged in 35 years is a kind of point of pride, but, I have to agree with my friend.  It was a nice side trek for us, but the game mechanics are too unsophisticated and the design is from another time, its not something we can play and get into.  Not with modern designs like Bolt Action, Armada, Legion... etc.. I mean there are so many fantastic, modern miniature games that can be played in 2 hours that give you a full robust highly tactical and very strategic experiance.

Battlemech is what I would call a feather light tactical game that takes a minimum of 6 hours to play even if you use the shortcuts and speed through the rules.

This game needs a 2nd edition.. one that focus on tighting up and modernizing the mechanics.  Fancy miniatures arent going to solve the games problem of getting a new generation into the game simply because we get very fancy miniatures from all companies for all games, this is the standard and expectations of todays games... Battletech making a 8 mini box sets of plastic is not some gift, its a requirement and expectation to compete in todays market, but its not enough to expand the line.
« Last Edit: 09 February 2019, 04:37:40 by Bigkahuna »

Crimson Dawn

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #42 on: 09 February 2019, 04:04:59 »
For me the biggest issue with the lance packs was the amount of redundancy of mechs in my intro box.  I would have to debate whether it was worth buying the lance pack even though really only 1 or 2 of the mechs were new for me and at that point I better really like the new mech or mechs I was getting.  IN one instance I bought one only because on of the mechs was a wolfhound and that just happened to be the mech my wife wanted to play so that worked out great.

If they made new plastic lance packs made up of mostly new mechs (or perhaps have a common mech but in a different mold) then I would be very interested.

MoffMalthus

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #43 on: 09 February 2019, 06:30:10 »
I don’t think there is any question or doubt that Lance Packs would sell like hot cakes if they where of the equal quality to the new box set and they where unique molds (different from the box sets).

The previous Alpha Strike Lance packs didn’t sell for many reasons, the fact that the sculpts were garbage was no doubt at the top of that list. 

The books are an issue too.  The core Battlemech Manual for example should never be out of print, even if you have to overstock that thing and sell it at a loss.  Its the main book.  Without it, your game is officially ”out of print” no matter what else is available for the game.

I introduced Battletech to a friend this week, he like me is a consumer of games but a decade younger then me and had never played Battletech.  We played and his opinion was ”this game feels like a game from the 80’s”, mind you he was born in 85.  Suffice to say, I think that is the one other issue Catalyst needs to address.  I know that the fact that the game is unchanged in 35 years is a kind of point of pride, but, I have to agree with my friend.  It was a nice side trek for us, but the game mechanics are too unsophisticated and the design is from another time, its not something we can play and get into.  Not with modern designs like Bolt Action, Armada, Legion... etc.. I mean there are so many fantastic, modern miniature games that can be played in 2 hours that give you a full robust highly tactical and very strategic experiance.

Battlemech is what I would call a feather light tactical game that takes a minimum of 6 hours to play even if you use the shortcuts and speed through the rules.

This game needs a 2nd edition.. one that focus on tighting up and modernizing the mechanics.  Fancy miniatures arent going to solve the games problem of getting a new generation into the game simply because we get very fancy miniatures from all companies for all games, this is the standard and expectations of todays games... Battletech making a 8 mini box sets of plastic is not some gift, its a requirement and expectation to compete in todays market, but its not enough to expand the line.

They already tried this with Mechwarrior about 15 years ago and it was a disaster. The only games for me that take 6+ hours are those that get up to company vs company. Lance vs Lance we usually average 2 to 3 hours. We have two new Battletech players in our group both in mid 20's age range and they love the rules. They are both 40k players who think the battletech rules are a breath of fresh air in comparison. I guess it just depends on the player...
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General308

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #44 on: 09 February 2019, 11:15:27 »
Having just gotten my box of stompy robots today, I certainly hope CGL is able to produce more plastic miniatures.

Heck, if IWM said "We're investing in plastic injection machinery and going to make molds for the top 10 best-sellers, here's our Kickstarter page." I'd be all over that.


I don't think IWM would ever do that.  To be  honest it is expensive.   Look at Reaper with all the kickstarter money they have raised all they have been able to get the machinery to make are the bases.  All the minis are still made in China.    Honestly I think to make that Happen all the US mini companies would have to go in together and do a super kickstarter and create a new company to control the machinery.   It is so sad we can't do this here in the US.

Bedwyr

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #45 on: 09 February 2019, 17:11:01 »
Hey guys. Injecting some modlyness here. The subject is getting a bit off course from the plastic miniatures discussion into a general "how do we change the game rules and save Battletech?" subject. Please steer the discussion back towards the plastics. If you want to continue the rules adjustment discussion, please start another topic.

I want to say one word to you. Just one word. Plastics.


Alright. I went ahead and split the conversation. Plastic minis and musings about minis releases here. For rules modifications and streamlining discussion go here: https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=64346.msg1480898#new
« Last Edit: 10 February 2019, 10:39:40 by Bedwyr »
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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #46 on: 10 February 2019, 12:02:18 »
Gods, how I hope so!
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Bedwyr

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #47 on: 10 February 2019, 12:07:31 »
Gods, how I hope so!

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« Last Edit: 10 February 2019, 14:48:56 by Bedwyr »
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rkhigdon

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #48 on: 10 February 2019, 13:12:28 »
I'm sure I'm in the minority, but I'd love to see sets of the cardboard standees, ala the Pawn boxes that Paizo sells.  Being able to get a large number of mechs, with various house/unit paint schemes, and all easily storable would be a big plus for me.

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #49 on: 10 February 2019, 13:21:37 »
You’re not the first to voice a desire for such a product. The lineup from TRO: Succession Wars would be a welcome addition for me

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rkhigdon

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #50 on: 10 February 2019, 18:56:26 »
That would be a great start.

ArchonDan

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #51 on: 10 February 2019, 20:58:13 »
I think the new plastic miniatures look great and the line up to date. The style, pose and bulk really bring them out of the 80s. Plus the new reseen look great!

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #52 on: 12 February 2019, 11:54:48 »
Just a quick check-in, because I keep seeing the phrase "the Lance Packs didn't sell well." The word "well" needs a bit of qualification.

My understanding, and based on past comments from management elsewhere, is that against a very large initial print run they didn't sell fast enough. I've beaten this drum of sales velocity a couple times in the past, but it's a big part of understanding why things do and don't happen.

Money is invested up front to produce a product, which then needs to sell briskly to get the maximum amount of profit back into the company coffers to go make more stuff. The longer it sits in the warehouse, the longer your investment is a sunk cost--and worse, that warehouse space ain't free, and that cost scales to the amount of product you have sitting in it.

With a large initial order, the pressure on fast sales is that much greater--you've put that much more money in upfront, and have that much more stuff sitting. My sense is that the Lance Packs sold about on par with other BattleTech product in terms of speed. And they sold through, finally, but it took years. I don't see numbers and neither do you, but draw your own conclusions on the impact that had on the initial investment.

Would some different choices in the composition of the product have aided its sales velocity, like the ideas being thrown around here? Maybe, maybe not. But within that discussion, I don't want it to be lost that speed vs. initial order size is an important factor, possibly more important even than product contents.

I'd be wary of hoping for 4x'Mechs for $20, the reason being that the starter box costs that but has only 2x'Mechs. Yes, it contains other stuff as well, but still...

Don't underestimate the production costs of that "other stuff." You may see it as just a bunch of throw-in paper, but the factory isn't throwing it in there for free. All of those costs have to be factored into the final MSRP of the product. The Lance Packs don't have those elements, so their composition and costs were different.
« Last Edit: 12 February 2019, 11:56:52 by Cubby »
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Church14

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #53 on: 12 February 2019, 14:34:07 »
I for one wholeheartedly would get behind more lance packs. I buy them usually whenever I see them on a shelf.

If the models exist for CGL somewhere, please do so. Please please please organize them by TRO and weight class. Gimme a 3058 IS lights, 3058 Clan lights, 3060 IS mediums, etc. Call them whatever you want.

Marc C

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #54 on: 12 February 2019, 15:55:34 »
I'm thinking Catalyst could sign a deal with Wizkids. They do a very good job for D&D and Pathfinder/Starfinder models. Let them worry about the cash flow, production and only take a royalties on each models. Is that something that could work?
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Colt Ward

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #55 on: 12 February 2019, 16:09:34 »
As has been mentioned, Iron Wind Metals has the rights to miniatures- like Micro$haft has the rights to electronics/gaming, its part of the fallout of the FASA collapse.  To try to hold on, they sold off assets and rights to their IP which leaves us with a fragmented IP that makes it difficult to get any synergy in the various mediums.
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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #56 on: 12 February 2019, 16:19:26 »
As has been mentioned, Iron Wind Metals has the rights to miniatures- like Micro$haft has the rights to electronics/gaming, its part of the fallout of the FASA collapse. To try to hold on, they sold off assets and rights to their IP which leaves us with a fragmented IP that makes it difficult to get any synergy in the various mediums.

Crap... that is sad.  :'( xp
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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #57 on: 12 February 2019, 16:27:00 »
Its a problem, but IWM is honestly a great company.  All my experiences with them have been positive.  For the complaints about the 'old minis' that is the artwork though it is faithfully rendered.  I personally had a problem with a lot of the minis around the TRO Pro Phoenix timeframe b/c of the parts.  The 'new' 3145/50 stuff is done by a lot of the current artists that produced what is in the box set.  We also have a lot of Mechwarrior video game minis, part of what makes the Timberwolf and Atlas iconic.
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Church14

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #58 on: 12 February 2019, 16:54:18 »
I'm thinking Catalyst could sign a deal with Wizkids. They do a very good job for D&D and Pathfinder/Starfinder models. Let them worry about the cash flow, production and only take a royalties on each models. Is that something that could work?

Wizkids “Dep Cuts” line seems to be pretty good. They would probably do well with mech minis

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Re: Will Catalyst produce and sell more plastic miniature sets?
« Reply #59 on: 12 February 2019, 16:55:39 »
...We also have a lot of Mechwarrior video game minis, part of what makes the Timberwolf and Atlas iconic.

Where can I get these models?
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