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Author Topic: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do  (Read 2293 times)

YingJanshi

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A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« on: 21 April 2013, 17:58:44 »
This is one thing I've always wanted to do but have never had the time (or the players frankly): has anyone ever done a company on company match where a player only controls one unit? Have someone as Team lead give out over all objectives, and Lance leaders and so on. Always thought it would be fun...

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nerd

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #1 on: 21 April 2013, 18:41:25 »
Yeah, about 10 years ago at a BattleTech night at a game store.

However, instead of individual 'Mechs, we were lance commanders.
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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #2 on: 21 April 2013, 19:09:46 »
Yeah, about 10 years ago at a BattleTech night at a game store.

However, instead of individual 'Mechs, we were lance commanders.

I've done this a lot too - give each player a lance to control, with one of them serving as a company commander.

I've also run individual players running a mech each but always in units that were no larger than a lance and a half - if you've got 12 players I could just see the game going on all night... and day.
Plus, while the majority of people I've played BT with where excellent people - I can see how one moron involved either: as a mechwarrior or a captain could ruin it either by just ignoring everyone's commands and going off on their own or being a knob at the top and giving dumb orders, etc


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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #3 on: 21 April 2013, 19:14:07 »
We've never been able to assemble that many players in one place for a game .

The most we could get was 8 players at once and we each played 1 mech for
a lance on lance game .

I liked the way we set that one up .

Everybody was given X BV to buy a mech and their skills .

Nobody knew who was on what side when we showed up .


We drew lots from a hat to see who was on each side and we
went to it .

The surprise of not knowing what the rest of your group would field
until you were there made for a great game .

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #4 on: 21 April 2013, 21:32:55 »
I have. While your specific experience may vary, mine lead to lots of very bored players, that were not having any fun. Granted, most of them were relatively new to the game, and coming from ccg backgrounds, were not super familiar with how long games could last. However, I do believe if the players in question have sufficient experience, there should not be much of a problem.
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Mohammed As`Zaman Bey

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #5 on: 21 April 2013, 23:14:05 »
  My group does this all the time to train commanders to come up with a battle plan, lead units and give orders instead of letting subordinates do as they wish.

Colt Ward

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #6 on: 22 April 2013, 00:21:15 »
Sort of did this with Savage Coyote a few years ago.  Each player brought 2 mechs under the BV limit for a total of 8 mechs a side . . . I had a Arctic Wolf I had finished painting . . . and something standing in for the RAC Jagermech.  The Jager played fire support with the AWolf moving around the edges.  As our time was drawing to a close, I figured why not.  I rushed the AWolf into the opposing force, right next to a Sagittaire that had sucky skills IIRC, 5/5(?) to fit in the BV.  A Stormcrow B moved up next to the AWolf, then I think a heavy and maybe 1 more mech.  The AWolf had some infernoes IIRC, and unloaded on the Sagi.  Pummeled it with SRMs, I think the Sagi KO'd.  Then the Artic Wolf got laid into.  Lost an arm, most of the armor over the torso, a SRM launcher or two crit.  Survived the concentrated fire from the cluster, then comes physical phase.  Kicked the Sagi, it fell over.  Took a kick from the lightest one in contact.  The Stormcrow missed and fell over, same with anything else.

The Artic Wolf would have been able to run away for cover after wreaking havoc in the center of the enemy line, KO to the Sagi and at least one other mech on its but for the heavier machines to blast.  After that, I decided to keep the pilot 'name' I had just put on the record sheet to have one.  Thus was born Athena Winson of the Warden Wolves.

Pretty sure it got the 'lucky mech' vote of the game.
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Col Toda

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #7 on: 22 April 2013, 05:50:20 »
Not realistic the best possible in company on company is not much better than one
person for each lance ie 6 people for company on company fight . This is why I moved
to the following . Very good heat balance mechs .The  Naganata only builds up heat
by movement .  Ammo based mechs tend to run cooler  as a hot one as they have to
worry about heat based ammo exsplosions . The Dragon Fire 4F  has a very good
heat balance as well .  Modifications to remove heat .  Replace med laser with C3
Slave ( Field Kit ) .  Remove IS med pulse lasers with er med laser and a heatsink
in engine or some where else space permitting .  Replace a ER Large laser with
a light PPC  and 2 heat sinks .  These techniques and replacements do a great deal
to improve heat balance . In the case of the Med laser replacement it increases the
BV .

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #8 on: 26 April 2013, 18:22:36 »
A game with a single CO  can be fun   as long as the CO doesn't do silly things.  At one of the mega game one year a Con,  One sides CO  was sending mechs one or two at a time.   The other side by the lance.   The first CO had the tickets and stayed in command  for most of the day.   That side LOST  The CO of the losing side refused to listen to his Lance commanders.
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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #9 on: 28 April 2013, 11:56:29 »
A game with a single CO  can be fun   as long as the CO doesn't do silly things.

I had this happen a few years ago in the mercenary campaign I am currently in. This guy, and his friend joined our group of four players. We had been playing 3v1, with myself acting as company commander, the other two as lance commanders, and the most experienced player GMing. When the others joined, I moved to OpFor with the GM, the two new players were "recruited", and the company expanded to four lances. The guy in question was elected by all the other players to be the new unit commander. Over the next several sessions, he bribed every single opponent faced in order to complete objectives, to the point of bankrupting the unit. All this because he did not want to fight against the standard technologically superior, but numerically, and skillfully inferior opponents one would normally expect to face in an attempt to grow the PCs unit. The result, the two new guys leaving, because none of the rest of us wanted to play a wargame where there was no fighting, and having to reboot back to before they joined.
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stoicfaux

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #10 on: 28 April 2013, 14:21:41 »
If there's one player per mech, how do you compensate for Free Will, i.e. the individual's desire not to die? 

CO:  Wasp mech, scout ahead and find the enemy.
Wasp Pilot:  No.  It's too dangerous for a light mech.  Scout with the Atlas.  It has 19 tons of armor.
CO:  ...!  You're a scout mech!  You're fast and agile!
Wasp Pilot:  So help me, if you say "speed is armor" I'm leaving, and you'll need to get a ride home with someone else.


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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #11 on: 28 April 2013, 14:31:13 »
This is one thing I've always wanted to do but have never had the time (or the players frankly): has anyone ever done a company on company match where a player only controls one unit? Have someone as Team lead give out over all objectives, and Lance leaders and so on. Always thought it would be fun...

Not exactly but similar.

Most of our games involve 1-4 units per person at a set BV & then splitting everyone into 2 teams.
So a few might only have 1 unit, rarely does anyone have more than 6 (usually in the form of Vees/Infantry).

I find the games are very slow w/ a lot of discussion & at times we can get as little as 4 turns in a 5 hour game.
Most the time its about 6 turns which means the store is closing right about the time everyone is in melee range & the carnage is about to start.
Winners were often desided on who had gotten an early round kill in.
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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #12 on: 28 April 2013, 14:33:28 »
Played the Battle of Mount Diabo scenario over in Scotland where everyone only used one mech.
It was a fun game watching till the causalities started to mount up and we started to get regulated to the side of the game and cheer on our sides.

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #13 on: 28 April 2013, 14:39:50 »
If there's one player per mech, how do you compensate for Free Will, i.e. the individual's desire not to die? 

CO:  Wasp mech, scout ahead and find the enemy.
Wasp Pilot:  No.  It's too dangerous for a light mech.  Scout with the Atlas.  It has 19 tons of armor.
CO:  ...!  You're a scout mech!  You're fast and agile!
Wasp Pilot:  So help me, if you say "speed is armor" I'm leaving, and you'll need to get a ride home with someone else.

Well, then that player clearly hasn't bought into the game in the first place. I mean, the basic premise here is that (a) you're trying to play an actual MechWarrior, not just an accountant who climbed into a cockpit by mistake and (b) for at least this particular scenario there actually is such a thing as a chain of command, right?

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #14 on: 28 April 2013, 15:44:30 »
Well, then that player clearly hasn't bought into the game in the first place. I mean, the basic premise here is that (a) you're trying to play an actual MechWarrior, not just an accountant who climbed into a cockpit by mistake and (b) for at least this particular scenario there actually is such a thing as a chain of command, right?

Putting aside the point of chain of command, the question I would ask is... what's the difference in this case between having 1 player as CO with the rest as their subordinates and having 1 player control ALL assets... if they're micro-managing.  I know the OP stated "Have someone as Team lead give out over all objectives," but "scout over that hill" implies a certain control of their movement as well.

Basically, would it not devolve into a game where effectively the unit CO was doing everything but rolling the dice for the players under them?

I have to agree with other posters.  Give a lance or so to each player and THEN you can give some actual objectives and how to get there.  ie:
"Scout lance, recon the building - and do some varmint hunting with their infantry.  Fire lance, bombard the crap out of that stupid Atlas advancing across open terrain using our spotters.  Vtol lance, see if you can get some backstabs in or take out their hovers.  I'll cover you all from 18 hexes away in my heavy woods..."

Giving objectives to guys with a single mech makes it pretty tough. 
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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #15 on: 28 April 2013, 15:47:09 »
I know right now in the rebirth of my BT Group we have 1 person as the lance commander and the rest of us are under his command however with the players we have we are more than a lance.  But it seems to be doing pretty good

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #16 on: 29 April 2013, 10:56:14 »
I think what makes this fun is seeing how people play differently when they have only one mech.  If you’ve got 4 mechs, you’ll take risks you wouldn’t with just one.  I think playing a big meat grinder in this style would be fun. 

The way to speed up the game is to move and declare fire a lance at a time rather than just one unit.  The CO could decide which order the lances go in. 

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #17 on: 29 April 2013, 16:09:39 »
it could be interesting but you would have to do lots of "measures to keep things moving" like when your turn comes around you have "30 seconds - a minute" to do your turn if you take too long you do nothing (or you only do what got done)
or similar

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #18 on: 03 May 2013, 00:00:08 »
i've done the 3 players to a side each running a lance thing.  The fun part was we alternated who go to control the air support when it was on table.  The company comander determined by roll off, go to control the artillary
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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #19 on: 03 May 2013, 09:43:45 »
Been part of a game that size but not recently. Can't assemble the players anymore.  :P

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #20 on: 04 May 2013, 14:44:37 »
They generally do this at GenCon. When players are few, they might have a person handling more than one. Normally, at GenCon, the tables at the storyline events are packed. Yes, generally each side has a nominated commanding player, or group of players. It was kinda neat.

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Re: A Game Idea I've Never Been Able To Do
« Reply #21 on: 05 May 2013, 00:42:47 »
Putting aside the point of chain of command, the question I would ask is... what's the difference in this case between having 1 player as CO with the rest as their subordinates and having 1 player control ALL assets... if they're micro-managing.  I know the OP stated "Have someone as Team lead give out over all objectives," but "scout over that hill" implies a certain control of their movement as well.

It's the difference between the CO seeing something that needs to be done and deciding which of his subordinates should do it... and micromanaging by giving them exact grid coordinates. The former still leaves the subordinate enough lee way to decide HOW to carry the order out (run over the hill, sneak and peak, jump straight up, etc etc). The latter has the CO spending too much time doing his subordinates jobs (and likely doing them badly) and not enough time doing HIS job.

The difference between the in-universe CO managing his people and a player running a lance/company/whatever is that the player has all the time in the world to make decisions because he's playing a turn based game AND that his "subordinates" are in fact not sentient, self aware beings capable of making their own decisions and translating vague orders ("go look over that hill") into discrete action ("run to grid x, react as situation warrants").

Meanwhile, the in-universe CO though only has 10 seconds to issue out orders while deciding where his own self should move and what he should be shooting. He doesn't have TIME to do the kind of micromanaging that out-of-universe players do, nor does he need to. His subordinates are not his brainless marionettes, and are quite capable of fighting on their own (assuming he trained them properly) and he only needs to provide only the more general orders ("go there, shoot that, protect this") without having to tell them the specifics ("walk, run, Step on THAT rock, fire these weapons at this range, etc etc"). His battle management gear AT BEST provides his with increased situational awareness of what's going on outside his immediate line of sight.

Okay, now I'm imagining an in-universe CO trying to fight like a BT player plays. The end result being that the enemy (who isn't so limited) shoots up and destroys his entire unit because he's taking forever to decide how each and every one of his subordinates should move and fire. His unit barely fights back because he can't decide where they should move and what they should fire fast enough and the units themselves are completely lacking in self initiative.