Author Topic: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born  (Read 59074 times)

Colt Ward

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #180 on: 03 July 2023, 19:21:46 »
Well, the Jing was produced after Operation Bulldog, right?
Colt Ward
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #181 on: 03 July 2023, 21:27:21 »
Yes, but its development started a few years before IIRC.
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Minemech

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #182 on: 03 July 2023, 22:30:54 »
 Good use of stylistics in article composition. I particularly remember them from Mechwarrior 2 Mercenaries. It is rare that the employment of a mech in a video game holds up so well compared to the board.
« Last Edit: 03 July 2023, 22:33:19 by Minemech »

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #183 on: 04 July 2023, 18:14:24 »
MODERATOR NOTICE

Folks, take any further discussion of new podloads to Fan Designs, please.

Natasha Kerensky

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #184 on: 04 July 2023, 18:32:36 »
MODERATOR NOTICE

Folks, take any further discussion of new podloads to Fan Designs, please.

They did.  Two days ago.

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/battlemechs/configure-the-picture-ebon-jaguar-from-invading-clans/
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #185 on: 08 July 2023, 12:55:16 »
The Cauldron Born is a solid mech, it is cool to see it getting some love. The new art work is incredible! It finally makes me want to get the minis!

As I typically play Invasion / Fedcom Civil War period (at the latest) the Prime, A, B and C get the most playtime when we roll with clans. It is honestly one of my favorite clan Omnis and while the stock configs can be a little weird most play pretty well and you can build some really nasty customs using the pod space.

The "light" armor never really bothered me, playing it similarly to a Mad Dog Prime (Hang back and soften up targets and then come in for the kill) it plays well. I think you have to compare it to its contemporary designs as well, (mainly the Mad Dog & Hellbringer). Compared to these two similar weight / BV designs it compares well. The Mad Dog offers some configs that I think are superior and I am of the opinion that the Hellbringer is a waste of tonnage / BV. It isn't a strictly "optimized" omni like a lot of the clan designs but with a little careful bracket fire the Cauldron Born can more than pull its weight. The Prime is like an IS Shadow Hawk got a free Gauss rifle, sure the armament is a little "kitchen sink" approach, but it also deals well with all types of threats at all ranges, and thats something that few clan Omnis in their primary config can do. Further the design is just well laid out for what they did stick in there between the crit padding, location of equipment etc.

The A Config is my personal favorite, you have 2 clan ERLL head-cappers with a 25 hex range that you can shoot all day long while running.  You can get in some solid hits at range and really be a pest, your opponent will eventually have to come deal with you, and when they do that UAC/20  is going to put them in the dirt. The extra "anti infantry weapons" are kind of useless in a mech on mech fight but versus combined arms provide the Cauldron Born with something that so many clan mechs lack. This is a mech that forces your opponent into a tactical dilemma and is something that no one wants do deal with but they are going to have to.

The B model is a superior Hellbringer Prime in every sense to me. You have the 2 Clan ERPPCs, same speed and heat sinking but gain some solid armoring. The Pulse laser backup exceeds the Hellbringers secondary weapons and tarcomp in my opinion and provides you the ability to melt another mech (and yourself) with an alpha strike, but unlike the Hellbringer you don't have to worry about cooking off ammo and you can survive more than a stiff breeze.

The C is a solid support mech and I would take it over any other similar weight / BV clan design (of the same era) when it comes to LRM support. (It is no Nova Cat B) This config is a major BV bargain coming in at only 1831 which puts it in the same BV range as most clan Mediums. The utility of the Ebon Jaguar is way better than something like a Crossbow Prime. The deeper bins for the LRMs when compared to its contemporaries are something that many clan Omnis lack. It is also fast, and has a solid "back up" weapons array. The UAC/2's can lawn dart VTOLs or provide some long range crit seeking and the extra SRM ammo lets you pack infernos. Considering you can shoot everything on a run for no heat hitting with a potential of 62 (heat free) damage is nasty.

My Jag forces pair them with Mad Dogs and Storm Crows to nasty effect. Given a token "brick mech" like a Warhawk or Dire Wolf for your opponents to focus fire on the Ebon Jags can go to work. Few mechs in the Clan Toumans Heavy weight class are able to adequately deal with IS Combined Arms as well as the Ebon Jaguar can. Admittedly using Zell or fighting with clan Honor in place, the Ebon Jaguar does not play as well considering it is more of a generalist rather than a duelist.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #186 on: 08 July 2023, 16:36:24 »
The A Config is my personal favorite, you have 2 clan ERLL head-cappers with a 25 hex range that you can shoot all day long while running.  You can get in some solid hits at range and really be a pest, your opponent will eventually have to come deal with you, and when they do that UAC/20  is going to put them in the dirt. The extra "anti infantry weapons" are kind of useless in a mech on mech fight but versus combined arms provide the Cauldron Born with something that so many clan mechs lack. This is a mech that forces your opponent into a tactical dilemma and is something that no one wants do deal with but they are going to have to.

Clan ER Large Lasers don't headcap.  they're a 10-damage 12-heat weapon. 

I also think the Prime configuration is a very inefficient use of pod space, but I'd take it over a Gargoyle Prime. 

I agree with everything else you mentioned :)
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #187 on: 09 July 2023, 14:39:58 »
Clan ER Large Lasers don't headcap.  they're a 10-damage 12-heat weapon. 

I also think the Prime configuration is a very inefficient use of pod space, but I'd take it over a Gargoyle Prime. 

I agree with everything else you mentioned :)

Headcap might be a bit of a stretch terminology wise but I consider a 10 point gun a potential "headcapper" sure it doesn't blow it off but a free crit to the head can hit the cockpit or mess up your day. To my minds eye AC/10s and PPC's also count in the potential headcapper squad but that is more semantics than not.

The prime could be more efficient for sure, but its a practical inefficacy reminiscent of the Shadow Hawk, jack of all trades stuff.

Either way cool mech.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #188 on: 14 July 2023, 05:49:37 »
Yeah that was the thing that struck me about the Prime, it was a real kitchen sink loadout, more a case of "What do we have in the weapons lockers to put on it before we show it off."

But I like the idea that its basically a bigger Shadow Hawk with a free Gauss Rifle :D
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #189 on: 14 July 2023, 06:29:03 »
Yeah that was the thing that struck me about the Prime, it was a real kitchen sink loadout, more a case of "What do we have in the weapons lockers to put on it before we show it off."

But I like the idea that its basically a bigger Shadow Hawk with a free Gauss Rifle :D
I find it interesting that TRO 3058U says that the A config is more popular than the Prime.
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marauder648

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #190 on: 14 July 2023, 07:14:14 »
I find it interesting that TRO 3058U says that the A config is more popular than the Prime.

Makes sense, the A's a very hard hitting 'Mech, 2 x ER larges to poke pretty decent holes at very long range and if you try to 'get under the guns' and close the distance, there's Mr UAC-20 sitting there going "HELLO BOYS!" As well as an ER Med and Med Pulser and a brace of MG's. Its exceptionally well armed and more focused than the Prime which is all over the shop, and you don't have to worry about ammo so much.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #191 on: 14 July 2023, 07:36:11 »
I find it interesting that TRO 3058U says that the A config is more popular than the Prime.

Good point, considering the Prime is supposed to be the most-common config encountered, right?
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #192 on: 14 July 2023, 08:49:18 »
Good point, considering the Prime is supposed to be the most-common config encountered, right?

At the time C* published the original TRO during the clan invasion, that was the way they ranked them.

Things could have changed over time however and by 58U more of the A were seen.

It's also interesting to note that the #s attached to each 2nd line mech is the order they were identified by C*.

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wantec

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #193 on: 14 July 2023, 13:06:58 »
At the time C* published the original TRO during the clan invasion, that was the way they ranked them.
Do you happen to have a reference for this? I'm not trying to be nit-picky, I've heard the same thing in the past and despite looking for it, I can't seem to find where it actually says this. If that's true, its possible some of these wacky OmniMech configs were created just for Operation Revival and weren't the main versions used in the Clan homeworlds.

(I'm looking for it as a justification for why the Gargoyle Prime is the Prime and not the A, C, or D as the main config).

Makes sense, the A's a very hard hitting 'Mech, 2 x ER larges to poke pretty decent holes at very long range and if you try to 'get under the guns' and close the distance, there's Mr UAC-20 sitting there going "HELLO BOYS!" As well as an ER Med and Med Pulser and a brace of MG's. Its exceptionally well armed and more focused than the Prime which is all over the shop, and you don't have to worry about ammo so much.
I totally get why the A would be more popular and I agree.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #194 on: 14 July 2023, 15:11:58 »
Do you happen to have a reference for this? I'm not trying to be nit-picky, I've heard the same thing in the past and despite looking for it, I can't seem to find where it actually says this. If that's true, its possible some of these wacky OmniMech configs were created just for Operation Revival and weren't the main versions used in the Clan homeworlds.

(I'm looking for it as a justification for why the Gargoyle Prime is the Prime and not the A, C, or D as the main config). 

My books are locked up atm, but, from memory I think it's from the opening intro paragraph of TRO:3050 just before the Clan Mechs.
The writer/author tells you they are named by frequency.
You see this later in a couple of the specific mechs when something like the D configuration of some mech has only been seen 1 time w/ the Ghost Bears.

IIRC the A-Gargoyle is similar to an older Woodman configuration.
With that in mind, yeah, I would not be surprised if the Garg-Prime was created just for Operation Revival, like the S configurations, or at least was more rare in the homeworlds.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #195 on: 14 July 2023, 15:18:39 »
Makes sense, the A's a very hard hitting 'Mech, 2 x ER larges to poke pretty decent holes at very long range and if you try to 'get under the guns' and close the distance, there's Mr UAC-20 sitting there going "HELLO BOYS!" As well as an ER Med and Med Pulser and a brace of MG's. Its exceptionally well armed and more focused than the Prime which is all over the shop, and you don't have to worry about ammo so much.

Overall it's very mean, but I just can't get over those rear mounted ER Mediums.  I can just about accept rear mounted weapons on a slow assault mech - but on a lean, lithe heavy cavalry design like the E Jag, to me at least they're anathema.

I'm also not keen on the full ton of MG ammo either.

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Colt Ward

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #196 on: 14 July 2023, 15:47:11 »
If I was fielding it in a campaign, I might remove the MGs for SPL- or into the late 3060s at least APGR- but I can see the reason for the rear ERML.

Where is the safest & best place to use ML & SRM on a Hunchback?  Three hexes or less BEHIND the Hunchback . . . something needs to get in close but wants to avoid the UAC/20 can opener?  It is going to get behind, well your probable light or medium mech will be menaced by two ERML.  It also works if your Cauldron Born has lost or damaged the arms- shoulders or ERLL crit- and you wish to shove the UAC/20 battering ram down your opponent's throat.  You are surrounded, you have the enemy right where you want them.

Did we get a late Republic config with a supercharger?
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #197 on: 14 July 2023, 19:14:10 »
I don't believe there are any canon Cauldron Born variants that use a supercharger.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #198 on: 14 July 2023, 22:01:43 »
None that jump either.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #199 on: 15 July 2023, 06:45:44 »
None that jump either.

It might be awhile before we get one too.  See how long OOC it took us to get a canon jumping Mad Dog? :tongue:
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Colt Ward

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #200 on: 15 July 2023, 11:30:45 »
While I do not frequently go in for jumpjets . . . we really should have a 'S' for all the Omnis w/o them fit standard.  We should also have a supercharger config for 4/6 or faster Omnis IMO.
Colt Ward
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #201 on: 15 July 2023, 15:24:08 »
There is also the distinct possibility that the popularity of a given variant can change over a machine's lifetime. The prime itself is useful for environments where enemy air superiority is the rule. That it is also good against tanks is a nice addition. For Luthien, I would expect the prime to see good use.

Tyler Jorgensson

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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #202 on: 15 July 2023, 18:19:17 »
It might be awhile before we get one too.  See how long OOC it took us to get a canon jumping Mad Dog? :tongue:
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #203 on: 06 October 2023, 00:23:31 »
So I have a question for people  who still follow this thread: what kind of firing pattern are you supposed to use with the B?  That serious lack of heat dissipation for its weaponry has me stumped.

Also, I used a C in a game a couple weeks ago.  Got attacked by a Grizzly and lost its left side to an ammo explosion.  Not a great performance.
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Re: (Another) Mech of the Week - The Cauldron Born
« Reply #204 on: 06 October 2023, 02:51:40 »
Like many other mechs in the early days, a 2-1-2 pattern.
Run on the 1,  Park on the 2.
At some point your close enough to be 1 PPC & some Mediums.
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3053: Star Colonel Rexor Kerensky: The Silver Wolves

"I don't shoot Urbanmechs, I walk up, stomp on their foot, wait for the head to pop open & drop in a hand grenade (or Elemental)" - Joel47
Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

 

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