Author Topic: Clan Artillery Star  (Read 3581 times)

Rtifs

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Clan Artillery Star
« on: 06 June 2013, 08:53:35 »
So I’ve been mulling over how to put together a generic artillery star for a clan cluster.  Time period would be late Jihad/early ROS.  But possibly into DA as well.  Here’s what I’m thinking:
Naga
Naga
Bowman
2 points of protos
I need some advice with the protos.  I would like them to provide security for the mechs, but I also want spotters. 
For spotters I’m looking for ultra fast units.  Firepower and armor aren’t a concern.
For security, speed is not a great concern, but survivability and firepower to deter or defeat attackers is. 
However, I fear I’m asking too much of protos to do both missions with just two points.  Am I right about that?

snewsom2997

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #1 on: 06 June 2013, 09:21:49 »
For an Artillery Star/Nova I would use this
Bowman                                  Point 1
Bowman                                  Point 2
Huitzilopochtli AAA                    Point 3
Huitzilopochtli AAA                    Point 3
Asshur w/TAG                          Point 4
Asshur w/TAG                          Point 4
Chaeronea 4 w/Light TAG          Point 5
Chaeronea 4 w/Light TAG          Point 5

I would go one further and make this a Nova and add 25 Elementals or Protomechs (Roc) for Defense.
Leave the spotting to the Hovercraft and ASF, This star will get you 6 Arrow Launchers, and enough Ammo for multiple Ammo Types.
Between the Bowmans LRMs, the HAGS of the Huitzilopochtli AAA, and the Elemental or Protomechs Star, you should be able to pick a spot and defend it.
« Last Edit: 06 June 2013, 09:32:40 by snewsom2997 »

truetanker

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #2 on: 06 June 2013, 20:01:41 »
First, which clan?

And then I can help you. See every clan has specific flavor. You do realize that the clans also used the SL-era artillery as well? Just mothballed them until needed.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Category:Artillery_Combat_Vehicles Just forget the Danai, Teppo, Padilla Arty and Schiltron. Demolisher Arrow is a possibility only if you are not using Homeworld forces. The only suggstion I have is follow what your clan your trying to use.

If by generic generic, meaning anybody... More Star League era mechs, like the Helepolis-3H ( 2625 model ) and the Bombardier-O5A ( Outworlds Alliance model ).

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Natasha Kerensky

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #3 on: 07 June 2013, 00:11:55 »

It doesn't make sense to combine the spotter role and the bodyguard role in the same unit.  A spotter is suppossed to range far from the artillery unit, while a bodyguard is suppossed to stay close to the artillery unit.  The only situation when one unit can perform both functions at the same time is a bad one -- when an opponent is getting too close to the artillery unit.  You don't want your standard operating procedure for an artillery unit to be based on a situation that puts your artillery at risk. 

So I'd separate your spotter and bodyguard roles into two different sets of units, i.e., a spotter proto point and a bodyguard proto point.  The best spotter proto is probably the Satyr 4 with 6/9 speed, Light TAG, and AP Gauss.  A Satyr 4 point will put five spotters into the field for you.  The best bodyguard proto is probably the old Minotaur with 3/5/3 speed and dual ER Medium Lasers.  A point could put ten ER Medium Lasers into an opponent that gets too close.  (Against fast-moving opponents, the five Pulse Medium Lasers on a point of Delphynes or Gorgon 2s may be better.)

That said, personally, I'd stay away from mechs and protos in artillery units.  Mechs are too survivable to be relegated to duty behind lines, and none available to the Clans except the insanely expensive Naga can throw two Arrow IVs per turn.   Protos, at least the ones (one?) with TAG, are slower than vehicles for spotter duty, and lack the firepower or physicality of mechs or battle armor for bodyguard duty.

To maximize the number of units available to me, I like to use a vehicle/battle armor nova for Clan artillery units.  Since vehicle points consist of two vehicles, I can pair an artillery vehicle with a spotter vehicle in a single point, while the nova battle armor point provides security for the artillery vehicle.

I prefer the Huitzilopochtli AAA for the artillery vehicle.  Five Hueys can throw ten Arrow IV missiles downrange while protecting themselves with ten HAG-20s.

There's lots of fast, TAG-equipped choices for the spotter vehicle:  Asshur Artillery Spotter, Donar Assault Helicopter (Recon Variant), Odin Scout Tank (Spotter Variant), Balac Strike VTOL (Spotter Variant), Epona A, Epona C, Hephaestus Prime, Hephaestus Jump Tank, etc.  (The Epona and Hephaestus omnitanks, although munchy for their firepower or accuracy alone, are especially nice since the nova battle armor points can ride them onto the field.)

The battle armor points are a static but mean picket/speed bump intended to slow down or even fix an opponent to make them easy prey for the Hueys' ten HAG-20s.  Elemental suits work well if you're comfortable with kneecapping and swarm attacks.  Otherwise you want firepower, which means Coronas, Golems, etc.  Given how slow they are, be careful how you spread out the battlesuit points.  You want to make it hard for an opponent to penetrate the picket without getting kneecapped/swarmed or hit by a massive number of pulse medium lasers or SRM-6 packs (while also getting whacked by multiple HAG-20s).

Hope this helps.
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Diablo48

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #4 on: 07 June 2013, 00:59:24 »
I agree that you should be leaning heavily on the Huitzilopochtli (especially the AAA variant, although the original works too for variety) for your artillery, although I would also have to recommend the Hellbringer, especially among Clans that do not normally make heavy use of it.  It is such a disappointing design that many better off Clans may not want to use it in direct combat, and it is an omni so it can easily be reconfigured to carry an Arrow IV to make salvaged frames useful so it is something I would expect to see among the more pragmatic Clans.

Natasha Kerensky already covered most of the other units, although I would like to make a general suggestion to look into the heavily armored heavy/assault BA for pickets because they are hard to remove from range even when they cannot find good cover.

It might also be a good idea to consider a point of heavy/assault tanks for escort duty because those things can pack some incredible armor and firepower which is never a bad thing in a defensive unit.


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Col Toda

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #5 on: 07 June 2013, 10:08:55 »
Artillery is rarely used by the Clans as it's use breaks Zelbrigen .
It can be used against static locations and  Inner Sphere forces ,
but to use it against other Clan forces particularly in any Trial
will get that Star Commander in a Circle of Equals with blades
with elemental stock . The men in such is desgra or will be.
Artillery is a weapon for and of Soldiers not Warriors . This subject
should not have come up . The rare Naga is a very mission
specific item  ; missions that do not come up often enough to
justify a permanently formed unit of such .

mike19k

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #6 on: 07 June 2013, 10:39:52 »
Artillery is rarely used by the Clans as it's use breaks Zelbrigen .
It can be used against static locations and  Inner Sphere forces ,
but to use it against other Clan forces particularly in any Trial
will get that Star Commander in a Circle of Equals with blades
with elemental stock . The men in such is desgra or will be.
Artillery is a weapon for and of Soldiers not Warriors . This subject
should not have come up . The rare Naga is a very mission
specific item  ; missions that do not come up often enough to
justify a permanently formed unit of such .

And yet if I remember in the twilight of the clans and I think some of the other books that list Clan units they have full time Artillery stars. I do not have my books here with me, but know that I have seen them in several books.

Ferrosol

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #7 on: 07 June 2013, 10:45:51 »
And yet if I remember in the twilight of the clans and I think some of the other books that list Clan units they have full time Artillery stars. I do not have my books here with me, but know that I have seen them in several books.

Artillery is there for bandit hunting, or as a back up if some dezgra warrior (on the other side of course...) turns your nice neat trial into a free for all. Also it's there for those occasions when the clans discard their honour rules like when fighting for something really important or when fighting the Innersphere.

False Son

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #8 on: 07 June 2013, 10:50:08 »
The attitudes might be changing.  The Falcons were using it against other clans in the lead up to the Wars of reaving.  They even went so far as to defend it's use by citing Nicholas K as the one responsible.
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cold1

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #9 on: 09 June 2013, 20:08:06 »
Artillery can and has been used in trials.  Actually it's almost ALWAYS included in the first bid.  Why?  Cuz if your opponent breaks his bid or breaks zell, you can call in your original bid.  Star commanders/captains may not worry about it but Star Colonels and Galaxy Commanders probably have it on stand by.  Maybe it's just the Adder in me, but I want some as a support unit in every cluster.

As for the star:
Make it a nova with BA, if they're bodyguards mix in Elementals and Coronas
3 x Huey of various flavored
2 x Eponas
2 x elemental
3 x Corona

The Corona stay with the Huey's and the Eponas and Elemntals act as a rapid response force.

Not the best way to get artillery on the field but if you want a self contained unit with tubes and body guards, it'll work.


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A. Lurker

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #10 on: 10 June 2013, 02:46:44 »
Despite the noise frequently made about zellbrigen and "Clan honor" and similar attitude problems in general, even the Clans understand that not every battle is going to be just a series of formal duels. Artillery's got its uses, it just gets no respect until suddenly somebody desperately needs it after all. ;)

Rtifs

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #11 on: 10 June 2013, 08:31:49 »
Exactly my thought, especially by the late Jihad/early ROS period I don’t think there is going to be a problem with its use.  During WoR, the Jade Falcons destroyed an entire cluster with artillery. 

My intention is to make a JF star since I paint all my clan stuff in JF Delta Galaxy colors.  While we JF don’t really like protos, I wanted to include them, because I wanted to try protos somewhere.  I still have icky feelings about vehicles in a clan unit, but I’ll check out this Huitzilopochtli and the others mentioned.  What TRO are they in?

Col Toda

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #12 on: 10 June 2013, 10:17:23 »
I said rarely not ; not used at all .  Static Walls ;  a Fortress in the middle of nowhere ; a drop Ship
landing site . They are a host of places where the mission makes it both desirable and useful.

Most of the Naga encountered are planetary defensive stars that use it against Spheroids and
Bandits that attack a owned position in an objective raid or a non- batchal conflict. They are
references on which Clans adherence to Zebrigen  is or is not strictly observed and against
what enemies.  They are almost never seen in an offensive action that does not intend to
take out a fixed location .  The Jade Falcons and the Hells Horses are the Clans I have seen
use Artillery the most and the latter is because it gives their defensive hover tanks a TAG
unit makes perimeter defense against the enemy much easier . Mission Specific or Garrison
defense seem to be what I have seen that work out well for the Clans.  To use it in the
same way that the Inner Sphere group would use it does not work well with the tactical
doctrine they use and the lack of experience of using it shows a lot .  Wasted BV if the
do a hash job of tactics and Concept.

snewsom2997

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Re: Clan Artillery Star
« Reply #13 on: 10 June 2013, 10:31:48 »
Exactly my thought, especially by the late Jihad/early ROS period I don’t think there is going to be a problem with its use.  During WoR, the Jade Falcons destroyed an entire cluster with artillery. 

My intention is to make a JF star since I paint all my clan stuff in JF Delta Galaxy colors.  While we JF don’t really like protos, I wanted to include them, because I wanted to try protos somewhere.  I still have icky feelings about vehicles in a clan unit, but I’ll check out this Huitzilopochtli and the others mentioned.  What TRO are they in?

(Huitzilopochtli Artillery Tank) TRO 3060, (Asshur Artillery Spotter) TRO 3060, (Bowman Artillery Mech) TRO 3067, (Naga Omni Mech) TRO 3055, (Chaeronea 4 ASF) Record Sheet 3067U, (Epona Omni Tank) TRO 3060, (Roc Proto) TRO 3060. Battle Armor (Gnome BA(H), Elemental BA(M)) is in the TRO 3058U, (Corona BA(H)) is in TRO 3075.

After the Jihad and Reaving, vehicles become more popular with the IS Clans, out of simple need.