Mech of the Week - Onager.

[mbear]

Was the write up any good though? :)

I'd like to have seen the tonnage of the Onager mentioned, but it was good otherwise.

[Kojak]

The Jupiter appears to be the more popular Assault for the Falcons at the time just going by how often we see the mech but we see some aspects of the Onager in later Falcon designs so the ideas behind the mechs left a impact at the very least. The Falcons would take the lessons learned from the Onager and Flamberge then apply them to Shrike and then the Jade Phoenix.

The Onager hopped so the Jade Phoenix could fly.

[Jal Phoenix]

I disagree with IJJs on 90-100 ton assault 'Mechs. TRO 3085 is full of examples why it should not be done. The Onager isn't as egregiously bad as the Trebaruna, but it's up there. At least it has Clan weaponry to make up for it, though even these are sandblaster guns instead of a heavy hitter.

I don't get the hate for the micro pulse lasers. It's one ton out of ninety. If that's bothering you more than paying 14 tons for two more jump MPs, then you have mixed up priorities.

I designed the Onager 2 for one of the NTNU sections. My first priority was to rip out those awful IJJs. Then I looked at the 'Mech's strength, which was survivability, and double down on that by adding the HarJel systems. Oh, and I gave it some actual guns. Paired Large Pule Lasers to punch some holes that the HAG and SRMs can exploit. I would have used ER PPCs, but then it would run too hot. And all it lost was two Jump MPs.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

The only mech in the 90-100 ton range with IJJs that I actually like is the WoB Marauder II variant, because it's an unkillable C3i spotter.

[BrianDavion]

I disagree with IJJs on 90-100 ton assault 'Mechs. TRO 3085 is full of examples why it should not be done. The Onager isn't as egregiously bad as the Trebaruna, but it's up there. At least it has Clan weaponry to make up for it, though even these are sandblaster guns instead of a heavy hitter.

I don't get the hate for the micro pulse lasers. It's one ton out of ninety. If that's bothering you more than paying 14 tons for two more jump MPs, then you have mixed up priorities.

I designed the Onager 2 for one of the NTNU sections. My first priority was to rip out those awful IJJs. Then I looked at the 'Mech's strength, which was survivability, and double down on that by adding the HarJel systems. Oh, and I gave it some actual guns. Paired Large Pule Lasers to punch some holes that the HAG and SRMs can exploit. I would have used ER PPCs, but then it would run too hot. And all it lost was two Jump MPs.

as others have noted, the Onager seems like a stepping stone as the jade falcons refined mech theory. the falcons have always valued vast mobile jumpy heavy designs. the Thor  was long considered the pinnicale of Jade falcon mech design theory. past the thor, the jade falcon heavy design process seems to consit of trying to take the general idea and up the firepower, the Turkina and the Night Gyr both reduced the speed for more armor and firepower, and  where damn good designs, but I feel the jade falcons still hungered for something "big and jumpy" but where restricted by the technology of the time, improved jump jets offered the potential and they tried them out with the Onager and after awhile decided it was decent eneugh but not what they where looking for. eventually they developed the partial wing and tried that on the shrike, which clearly suited their design views a bit more and was eventually adapted into the jade pheonix omnimech

[garhkal]

So why are improved JJ worth the cost on lighter designs, but not on assaults?
I reckon it's pretty damn hard to put down with 5 Jump making it hard to hit.
It just lacks some firepower.

Weight..  Just like regular jump jets, for light/medium mechs, they can be had for .5 tons each, or 1.5 iirc for improved JJ's..  SHIFT that to an assault, and you're paying 4 tons each..  THAT IS A BIG chunk of it's armor/weapon allowance gone..

I quite enjoy inefficient mechs.
This one has personality.
Good article, BTW.

IMO Its not just how inefficient it is, but how STUPID the designers were, to waste 20 tons of what could have been used to give it MORE weaponry AND max out its armor...

Aye Onager was a form of catapult :)

Thanks for the history lesson..  In that case, wouldn't it have made more sense for the weapon loadout to be ERLRMS or the like.>?

[GreekFire]

The Trebaruna has a bad rep that it certainly doesn't deserve. Sure, it's inefficient, but's a really solid 'Mech. I've rolled plenty a person with one.
I don't have anything nice to say about the Onager, though. The 2 looks interesting, but I've never played with it.

[Jal Phoenix]

The Trebaruna has a bad rep that it certainly doesn't deserve. Sure, it's inefficient, but's a really solid 'Mech. I've rolled plenty a person with one.
I don't have anything nice to say about the Onager, though. The 2 looks interesting, but I've never played with it.

Inefficient is one word. It pays ten tons to gain one extra Jump MP. It doesn't even gain any heat benefits or extra target movement modifiers from that. At least the Onager maxes out the IJJs, and gets into that +2 TMM bracket. The Trebaruna's weaponry is much better for punching holes, but honestly there's an Enforcer III variant that can do the same, with better mobility and cost. When it comes to the Onager vs Trebaruna, it's kind of like comparing doggie-do to horse manure.

[GreekFire]

Sure, it's ten tons, but I really don't care about that in my largely BV-centric games.

What I do know is that it has the manoeuvrability to quickly move behind partial cover on a level 3 hill, the range and accuracy to constantly contribute without needing to reposition, and the ability to rapidly disengage and/or keep the range open if a slower bruiser like a Hunchback comes to play. Sure, there's an Enforcer III that deals more damage, even, but at the expense of the durability that makes the Trebaruna so hard to put down and the range/TargComp that makes it a reliable contributor throughout the game.

Your experience might vary, but like I said, it's wrecked a lot of faces in my games. Definitely not a 'Mech to underestimate in my eyes.

[wildkadabra]

I disagree.  Having play tested the Mk. 1 model of this thing against the MM bot, have found it lacking.  While there are loser configs of the Kingfisher, I'd probably want the Kingfisher in most instances.  The Prime, A, C, and F look like they would be superior choices to the Onager Mk. 1.  Exceptions such as heavily built up areas and/or badlands might alter the balance, but, as is, it makes me think of a confused Highlander. 

The Mk. 1 seems to use the least efficient propulsion systems in tandem.  It then goes on to blow additional tonnage on a Hag 30.  Did the Falcons pick up the "taint" of more speed than brains from the Ice Ferrets?  And, apparently the Falcons were having problems with their scientist class... if the "micro" weapons were garbage on the protomechs, why would anyone think they get better on real 'mechs?  Sounds like some scientists need to be taught a lesson in dial-a-yield lasers, starting from their peripheral appendages and slowly working in toward the gooey center. 

Quirky, eclectic, eccentric, "flavorful," etc. don't win wars.  Functional wins wars, lots of functional hard-hitting units win wars.  With some of the designs coming out of clan-land, it's amazing they actually get anything accomplished militarily.

I find them very similar:

Long Range: Both mechs get 30 points of possible damage at long range HAG30 for Onager, 2 Large Pulse Lasers and LRM10 for Kingfisher

The Kingfisher has a more concentrated punch from the pulse lasers, but the HAG 30 about evens out by virtue of being more likely to get a KO or TAC from multiple hits, the increased accuracy of the pulse lasers is countered by the HAGs superior range to get similar numbers so overall by staying one bracket away. The HAG suffers performance penalties but at long range it can fire outside of a range the LPLs can reply. In my book I find their long range performance is somewhat similar.

Medium Range: Things start getting a little bit more interesting here both mechs have a very similar short range armament: Including their long range guns, they begin to bring 2 medium pulse lasers each, and srm6s. The Kingfisher has a bit more range with the more efficient streak but the Onager somewhat makes up for it with paired srm6s with 2 tons of ammo. Those two tons allow for flexibility by bringing infernos or tandem charges.

Short Range: Both mechs get to add a tiny bit more firepower, this this regard the Onager comes slightly on top with increased maneuverability to get into rear arcs or avoid the KF getting in its rear arc and a few more small lasers.

This analysis is of course comparing it to the PRIME variant. Are there better mechs? Yes. Is the Onager a bad mech? Probably not. Optimized far from it, but it makes it quirky while still remaining effective. It is no Jade Hawk but then again few mechs are. And as a Jade Falcon I do love my Jump Jets so the 5 jumping is not strike for me, even when not necessarily efficient! And I do love bringing me a ton of infernos in my Onagers and Flamberges!  :D

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Remember that the HAG gets a -2 penalty on cluster rolls at long range, so it can't actually deal 30 damage.

[wildkadabra]

Yes I did mention this but it somewhat makes up for it by being able to fire beyond a range where the Kingfisher can reply. Though most mechs at long range will be missing quite often. Once they get into overlapping ranges the Kingfisher has an accuracy advantage but the Onager has the mobility to quickly get the HAG into Medium while keeping the Kingfisher at long to even things out.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I'd still take 2 LPLs over 1 HAG 30.  The -2 to hit means you're looking at the same effective range modifiers, the lack of ammo means you can take every shot that presents itself, and the bigger damage clusters push through the armor faster.

[Empyrus]

The Onager 2 has LPLs and HAG-30.
Honestly it looks pretty good, the original Onager is the type of 'Mech i hate.