Author Topic: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion  (Read 6003 times)

Church14

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #30 on: 31 July 2023, 11:33:15 »
I'm trying to remember the book, but there was one where you had to make a Morale role based on if you lost a certain percentage of your forces in one turn, or if you had lost a certain percentage overall.

With Clan weaponry, that percentage lost every turn would be happening every turn.

This. This is where I went with the topic question.

Soldiers run into weird and hard to explain things often. They get hit by artillery and other weapons where they can’t respond. In a vacuum, clan don’t really don’t do anything worse than what IS forces face. What clans would do is rack up casualties much faster amongst the IS forces and that feels like it would be the shock that breaks morale.

Colt Ward

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #31 on: 31 July 2023, 11:54:20 »
Sure, and I did use the gauss on the head from a real example- Blackjack vs Falcons- where the lance commander was reporting in some shock.  But they also lost another mech in the lance and one was half dead.

It is when expectations are broken- a unit takes a shock- that morale is in danger.
Colt Ward
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Church14

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #32 on: 31 July 2023, 12:09:01 »
Yeah. The rate of loss of combat effectiveness (BV?) is what I would use if using morale. Especially quick losses early one like the mentioned headshots.

Sir Chaos

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #33 on: 31 July 2023, 14:45:40 »
If we´re using morale on a per-unit basis, we could force a morale check any time anyone higher in the chain of command than the unit itself is taken out (losing officers demoralizes the soldiers; Lyran social generals and similar individuals could have a command "ability" where their demise actually increases morale instead), and also in any round where a unit takes at least one hit while no enemy unit is within range of its own weapons (it is demoralizing to be shot at while you can´t shoot back).
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Failure16

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #34 on: 31 July 2023, 18:00:17 »
This. This is where I went with the topic question.

Soldiers run into weird and hard to explain things often. They get hit by artillery and other weapons where they can’t respond. In a vacuum, clan don’t really don’t do anything worse than what IS forces face. What clans would do is rack up casualties much faster amongst the IS forces and that feels like it would be the shock that breaks morale.

And yet, being subject to indirect fires, CAS, or snipers (or tanks against light infantry) in situations where the targeted unit has no means of response are primary factors in morale erosion. The Clans brought direct fires at ranges hitherto unheard of--essentially a situation that the average Inner Sphere MechWarrior or tanker would be accustomed to (a direct-fire engagement) with a twist they could not reply to and had no immediate response to. That is a recipe for panic.

For a fictional example, see Aliens. Now, would real soldiers have done better in that scenario? I'd like to think they would have. But there are plenty of real-life situations where soldiers have broken (to various degrees) when faced with a situation that was within the realm of their experience but whose minutia was ratcheted up past their ability to cope and respond. Think of the British defense of Singapore, the initial US/Allied response to Wacht Am Rhein (the Battle of the Bulge), or the blunted attack by the VC on the US Embassy on Saigon during Tet '68. All situations that, in and of themselves were within the normal scope of planning, and where the responses might have been different, but weren't because of myriad factors, morale (of individual troopers and commanders at all levels throughout the spectrum) being a vital one of them.
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Daryk

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #35 on: 31 July 2023, 18:46:38 »
I'll also note that the break in morale wasn't universal in those situations.  I'm particularly recalling the Intelligence Platoon that fought a German Battalion in the Battle of the Bulge.  That delayed battalion contributed to the ultimate failure of the attack: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Lanzerath_Ridge

Failure16

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #36 on: 01 August 2023, 21:09:16 »
Morale breaks are almost never universal. In my own rules, for example, I kept them limited to Elements (think squads or AFVs) or Units (think platoons) vice the whole playing Force (think company-plus) for that reason.

Of course, to really model morale on a tactical level, you need to have some kind of suppression mechanism in place as well. Unengaged elements rarely lose their resolve (though they might break upon the shock of first contact, but that is still facing fire) in a tactical sense. Operationally or even strategically, a given force's morale can certainly wither. The French had a term called la cafard ("the bug", colloquially) for forces facing monotonous garrison duty in inhospitable locales where forces would degrade over time.

Regardless, the action outside Lanzerath is an excellent example of small unit leadership, but also how an elite unit--in comparison to the units around it--can power through due to esprit de corps and just plain cussedness. There are plenty examples of that in history, too, but they are more widely known. Good find!
Thought I might get a rocket ride when I was a child.          We are the wild youth,                                And through villages of ether
But it was a lie, that I told myself                                          Chasing visions of our futures.                   Oh, my crucifixion comes
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Colt Ward

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #37 on: 01 August 2023, 22:37:50 »
Morale breaks are almost never universal. In my own rules, for example, I kept them limited to Elements (think squads or AFVs) or Units (think platoons) vice the whole playing Force (think company-plus) for that reason.

Which is why I mentioned the IO level rules because it has it break down into smaller units and only after a specific event trigger a force wide check along with the gradient of shaken/broken/retreating/routed/surrender.

FREX, 1st Icar battle a merc battalion of meds/heavies/assaults meets the Clan force and I plan to give them some supporting armor companies.  This means there are 5 different companies that could have a morale roll . . . and if X circumstances happen, the whole force could have a roll.  Say one mech & one armor company is in forced withdraw, one mech company is shaken, and the last mech company + command lance & second armor company are fine.  Say the command lance gets dropped in 1 turn to trigger a force wide roll that fails by a small margin . . . the forced withdraw group could go into rout, shaken mech company could transition to retreating, and the last group becomes shaken which gives a -1 to morale rolls.  This would all be on mixing TO and IO's Abstract game that talks about combat forces that are made up of significant sub-units.

Second battle could have up to 4 mech companies, a BN command lance, and regimental command lance . . . with matching or more armor companies.
Colt Ward
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"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Minemech

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #38 on: 03 August 2023, 21:05:08 »
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Minemech

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #39 on: 04 August 2023, 09:43:44 »
 One thing to note about the Clan invasion was that a major part of its success was in fact due to location. It was hitting a region where the units were more focused on countering piracy rather than engaging properly supported line units. Furthermore, the first periphery state the Clans fought was not exactly in close communication with the Successor States through legitimate channels. That region of Inner Sphere space is where you would normally deploy regiments to safely rest and refit. I am not saying that there were not important worlds there, Twycross and Alshain are obvious examples, but they expected at most they would fight a raid.

Colt Ward

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #40 on: 04 August 2023, 10:12:04 »
One thing to note about the Clan invasion was that a major part of its success was in fact due to location. It was hitting a region where the units were more focused on countering piracy rather than engaging properly supported line units. Furthermore, the first periphery state the Clans fought was not exactly in close communication with the Successor States through legitimate channels. That region of Inner Sphere space is where you would normally deploy regiments to safely rest and refit. I am not saying that there were not important worlds there, Twycross and Alshain are obvious examples, but they expected at most they would fight a raid.

For Falcons and Jags, yes . . . but the Wolves & Bears were fighting straight down a border, and while they may have started out in the periphery by Wave 2 were far enough in to start hitting some serious garrisons.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Minemech

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #41 on: 04 August 2023, 10:26:41 »
 The Free Rasalhague Republic was intentionally created by Theodore Kurita to have a safe front. Its line units were focused on fighting pirates. 

Colt Ward

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #42 on: 04 August 2023, 11:07:08 »
The Free Rasalhague Republic was intentionally created by Theodore Kurita to have a safe front. Its line units were focused on fighting pirates.

In the 3030s.  The LC portion of FedCom has units on the FRR border, the Dracs have units on the FRR border, and the Republic has their own units and mercs facing both of those.

Theo did not create a 'safe' front, but rather a buffer state that knows they exist on the Combine's sufferance- w/o political support of the Lyrans, Rasalhague has a chicken-bone defense . . . until the Clans came along.  Yeah, the Lyrans and Dracs may have posted weaker units along that border initially, but if you look at WCSB & ICSB those are not tiny formations since they eventually built up.

The two close borders created a 'density' of units unlike what the Falcons & Jags faced.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Charistoph

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Re: Reflecting Morale during the Clan Invasion
« Reply #43 on: 04 August 2023, 18:17:15 »
And when one considers that the heirs of the Commonwealth and Combine were in the path of the first wave of the Falcons and Jaguars, respectively, they won't have them in the green units.  They may not necessarily be elite units, but they wouldn't be ones that just fall over themselves, either.
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