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Author Topic: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt  (Read 17571 times)

Greatclub

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #60 on: 14 May 2020, 14:10:08 »
Are you sure? Just searched the current Strat Ops errata for' case' and couldn't find what you're talking about.

there are three Stratops errata. main one, refit section, and battleforce

https://bg.battletech.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/StratOps-Refitting-Revised-Final.pdf   <- this is probably the one you want

https://bg.battletech.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Strategic-Operations-2019-07-04-v3.01.pdf
https://bg.battletech.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/StratOps-BF-QS-Update-Errata-2017-12-05.pdf

Daryk

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #61 on: 14 May 2020, 17:41:51 »
Class D is better than Class E, at least.  Thanks!  :thumbsup:

Trailblazer

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #62 on: 14 May 2020, 23:58:12 »
Thanks!!!

Hellraiser

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #63 on: 15 May 2020, 10:56:35 »
Oh wow,  I like several of these changes.   Other, NO.

Armor is now Class-A which makes a bit of sense given you have to repair armor damage in the field already.

Turret Weight is huge clarification now too.  That was one my GM treated as factory since it was "structure"

Gyros was also huge since it made sense to be D like Engine Size, but a question in the rules forum had it come back as F just like Gyro Type, which was annoying!

That said however, they moved Engine Size from D to E which totally counters Gyro size moving from F to D,  UGH.
Charger-1A into Charger-SB.   Fluffed as being done by Mercs in the field. (bay)
Say it with me now, they BOTH need to be set at class-D to make that possible.
I guess the note about refit-kits helps that, but really, the above change was basically a "custom" job when they did it where actual "kits" are something that a mech factory produced & sold as a package.

So is there a factory making Refit-Kits for the SB model?  In universe, probably not.


Finally "endo/ferro" slots got an annoying ruling in the rules questions forums & is now appears improved maybe, if they call it "move a component" but I think that is why I asked before,  clarifying if a "Ferro" slot was considered a component or not.
Might need to re-ask this question.

« Last Edit: 15 May 2020, 10:59:47 by Hellraiser »
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UnLimiTeD

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #64 on: 16 May 2020, 06:54:18 »
I would assume not, given that "besides armour" is mentioned in D.
I don't envy the people writing the new rules, having to go through history of anecdotes and trying to fit the rules to as many of them as possible.  xp
Still, one can always imagine a specific circumstance. We'll just have to assume the mechs discussed here exist.  ^-^
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Trailblazer

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #65 on: 16 May 2020, 12:22:55 »
So it sounds like removing CASE is class A now?

Hellraiser

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #66 on: 16 May 2020, 13:43:34 »
Yes, it seems as if its nicely clarified that "YANKING EVERYTHING" is now Class A.   

So the ripping it out part is all very condensed to something you can do with a repair truck in the field.

Which sort of makes sense.

Its the INSTALLING things part that has all the tiers really.

And I'm liking that part for simplicity.

3041: General Lance Hawkins: The Equalizers
3053: Star Colonel Rexor Kerensky: The Silver Wolves

"I don't shoot Urbanmechs, I walk up, stomp on their foot, wait for the head to pop open & drop in a hand grenade (or Elemental)" - Joel47
Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

LastChanceCav

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #67 on: 16 May 2020, 18:59:41 »
Thanks for sharing the updated errata, its been awhile since I checked. Not sure when the change came, but I'm glad to see omnis can bnow be legally refit without losing their magic omni sauce.

Now back to the point of the thread ... I've always thought the TDR was one of the best designed of the early generations of mechs which allowed it to compete effectively against its heavier peers.  Back when I first started playing you had to go up 20 tons to the Beemer to get beefier armor.

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LCC

Edit: Thinking back that far reminds me of how mind blowing TRO3025 was - they make 100 tonners now  :o
« Last Edit: 16 May 2020, 19:10:58 by LastChanceCav »
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Hellraiser

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #68 on: 16 May 2020, 20:45:38 »
Back when I first started playing you had to go up 20 tons to the Beemer to get beefier armor.

Not quite.

70-Warhammer-6D
75-Orion-1K
80-Awesome & Goliath

But agreed this thing has some solid maxed out armor which was not at all common in TRO3025 to be sure.

3041: General Lance Hawkins: The Equalizers
3053: Star Colonel Rexor Kerensky: The Silver Wolves

"I don't shoot Urbanmechs, I walk up, stomp on their foot, wait for the head to pop open & drop in a hand grenade (or Elemental)" - Joel47
Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

Daryk

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #69 on: 16 May 2020, 20:48:33 »
Don't forget.. the OG record sheet for the Thunderbolt had a misprint that gave it two extra internals in the arms.  It's reputation as tougher than it looked was a little more than just talk...

Luciora

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #70 on: 17 May 2020, 00:55:34 »
I like how it turned out. 

Liam's Ghost

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #71 on: 17 May 2020, 01:16:30 »
Not quite.

70-Warhammer-6D
75-Orion-1K
80-Awesome & Goliath

But agreed this thing has some solid maxed out armor which was not at all common in TRO3025 to be sure.

Pretty sure he's referring to a time before those mechs were released.
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Greatclub

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #72 on: 17 May 2020, 02:47:14 »
I like how it turned out.
Mostly perfect. If you could just get a bit of green stuff behind the missile launcher to change the angle it would be perfect.

Hellraiser

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #73 on: 17 May 2020, 14:42:07 »
Pretty sure he's referring to a time before those mechs were released.

Sorry, I always forget about Battledroids era since 3025 was my first purchase.

Though the comment about 100 tonners seems to ignore the Behemoth doesn't it?
3041: General Lance Hawkins: The Equalizers
3053: Star Colonel Rexor Kerensky: The Silver Wolves

"I don't shoot Urbanmechs, I walk up, stomp on their foot, wait for the head to pop open & drop in a hand grenade (or Elemental)" - Joel47
Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

Luciora

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #74 on: 17 May 2020, 14:46:14 »
I did a bit more work on it, it looks a bit better now, thanks!

Mostly perfect. If you could just get a bit of green stuff behind the missile launcher to change the angle it would be perfect.

Greatclub

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #75 on: 27 May 2020, 04:44:00 »
OK, just realized that the 3145 t-bolt probably wasn't covered earlier.

Here we have the -10S. It appears somebody looked at the Thunderbolt IIC and decided to make their own version, barely missing the inclusion cutoff for TRO 3085 by a year. Not being clantech there were sacrifices, but it's hardly a bad mech.

Armor is a hair lighter than the Thunderbolt standard; it misses a couple unfortunate thresholds, but is still more than acceptable for a heavy. It's also a jumper with endo steel, feeling very much like a Light Horse (RIP) model. From there we get to the guns. We have an ER PPC in one arm and an ER Large laser in the other. On the shoulder is a LRM 15 and the other torso has a trio of ER Medium lasers. It's a solid mix, slightly ruined by having a hair too little heat management.

It has 14 doubles. That lets it walk and fire both energy weapons at the same time. The LRM launcher isn't covered, adding it in while moving leaves you with a penalty next turn. I can't really see any natural volley patterns either, though you can substitute it in for the laser while jumping. Thus, I'd suggest switching one, or maybe even both, tons of ammo over to utility munitions. Smoke, thunder, mine clearance to screw BA or fragmentation for PBI elimination.

Still a solid heavy, and worthy addition to the T-Bowl family. It just isn't first tier among them.

« Last Edit: 02 June 2020, 04:46:23 by Greatclub »

SteelRaven

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #76 on: 27 May 2020, 14:00:44 »
One of my buddies who occasionally streams MWO on Twitch recently lamented on how underappreciated the Thud is. It's one of the oldest mechs in the IS still production, has a insane number of variants and when a 'replacement for the ancient mech' was designed (Tempest), the Thunderbolt ended up beating it in a one on one match for production rights. Combined with the number of famed units who have fielded the machine, it really does deserve to be on a few more covers.     
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Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #77 on: 27 May 2020, 15:01:20 »
One of my buddies who occasionally streams MWO on Twitch recently lamented on how underappreciated the Thud is. It's one of the oldest mechs in the IS still production, has a insane number of variants and when a 'replacement for the ancient mech' was designed (Tempest), the Thunderbolt ended up beating it in a one on one match for production rights. Combined with the number of famed units who have fielded the machine, it really does deserve to be on a few more covers.     
???   The Thunderbolt is one of the most storied and beloved mechs in the game.  I’ve always found its fans to be a little bit over the top in the way they talk about it.  You’d think it was the best heavy in the game to hear a lot of people talk about it.
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SteelRaven

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #78 on: 27 May 2020, 16:27:35 »
I honestly hear few talk about about it out side this forum, I guess it depends on what game circles you run in.

It was featured prominently in fiction next to the Warhammer, Archer, ect. up until the Unseen debacle, then other mechs got the spotlight for obvious reason (my friends and my self became fans post MW2) and post Phoenix, I still feel I hear more about, I don't know, the Charger by certain people. Not dunking on other mechs by any means. I really hate it when a fellow fan gets all hipster on me when I talk about the Warhammer ( 'oh, of course you like the mech on the box cover... ' ) but the mech does at time gets lost in the crowd because there are so many good heavy designs (again, Archer, Warhammer, Orion, ect) and maybe it deserves to be on one more cover... you know, where it's not getting shot up ;D
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Luciora

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #79 on: 27 May 2020, 17:13:17 »
Armor weights are funny.  13 seems like a lot on a 65 tonner, yet 3 mechs off the top of my head carry 10 tons, and all 3 are treated differently.  2 of them have essentially the same role, yet one is lauded as a tank, one is regarded mostly positively and one is extremely polarizing.  Hunchback, Victor and Charger.

Also the Dragon carries 10 tons yet people still regard it over the Charger.  This probably boils down to weight efficiency of engine vs mass.

The Thundebolt is a happy medium place for weapons and armor.

MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #80 on: 27 May 2020, 17:58:39 »
The Dragon can also fire at an opponent at a range beyond spitting distance.
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Arkansas Warrior

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #81 on: 27 May 2020, 18:44:26 »
Armor weights are funny.  13 seems like a lot on a 65 tonner, yet 3 mechs off the top of my head carry 10 tons, and all 3 are treated differently.  2 of them have essentially the same role, yet one is lauded as a tank, one is regarded mostly positively and one is extremely polarizing.  Hunchback, Victor and Charger.

Also the Dragon carries 10 tons yet people still regard it over the Charger.  This probably boils down to weight efficiency of engine vs mass.

The Thundebolt is a happy medium place for weapons and armor.
The Dragon has guns.
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SteelRaven

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #82 on: 27 May 2020, 18:58:42 »
I get the Charger is popular because it's a meme but it often gets talked about more than the Dragon or say, the Thunderbolt (trying to keep us on track, that's all)
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MoneyLovinOgre4Hire

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #83 on: 27 May 2020, 19:04:48 »
It gets talked about because it's a meme.  If it were merely a bad mech instead of one that's aggressively, stupidly awful, it wouldn't get much attention.
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Hellraiser

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #84 on: 27 May 2020, 19:12:13 »
  Hunchback, Victor and Charger. 

Victor carries 11.5, not 10.

Quote
The Thundebolt is a happy medium place for weapons and armor.
I'd say its a BRICK for armor given its size.  You can only put like 3 more points on it IIRC.
3041: General Lance Hawkins: The Equalizers
3053: Star Colonel Rexor Kerensky: The Silver Wolves

"I don't shoot Urbanmechs, I walk up, stomp on their foot, wait for the head to pop open & drop in a hand grenade (or Elemental)" - Joel47
Against mechs, infantry have two options: Run screaming from Godzilla, or giggle under your breath as the arrogant fools blunder into your trap. - Weirdo

Starfury

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: TDR-* Thunderbolt
« Reply #85 on: 27 May 2020, 19:13:34 »
Ah, the T-Bolt. It's another excellent heavy trooper, and pairs well in Marik formations with the Orion and the Crusader.  It's interesting to see how almost all of the later variants decided to incorporate jump jets or faster movement profiles while still maintaining one or two heavy direct fire guns, one large missile rack, and a bank of medium lasers for infighting. The Thunderbolt is also notable for being a great example of effective field refits with lostech, given the 7M..

 

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