Clan Widowmaker: Caught in a Spider's Web

[Stormlion1]

At least Nicky K accomplished something.

What, Betrayed Clan Wolverine? Possibly set his brother up to die? He did so many things, some good-like creating the Clans, and some bad-setting the Wolverines up to fall, even though he possibly had guessed they had been set up? The only thing good he did for the Widowmakers was stepping back so Hallis had one good shot.

[Fear Factory]

What, Betrayed Clan Wolverine? Possibly set his brother up to die? He did so many things, some good-like creating the Clans, and some bad-setting the Wolverines up to fall, even though he possibly had guessed they had been set up? The only thing good he did for the Widowmakers was stepping back so Hallis had one good shot.

You have it backwards.  Wolverines betrayed the Clans.  It was their decision to do what they did.

[Stormlion1]

From the way I read the story, they were pushed into it. And the primary person pushing the agenda was the Widomaker Khan. They took the best of the worst choices and ran with it.

[Daishi411]

You have it backwards.  Wolverines betrayed the Clans.  It was their decision to do what they did.

this isn't quite how it went down. the wolverines were set up as a fall guy for the clans, and this was all exacerbated by karige who had put a spy in the wolverines lower castes, and had put into place a plan that would make the wolverines look like the bad guy by saying the wolverines were withholding new tech from the clans. when things started to go wrong went mcevedy put her escape plan into motion. so really nicky k and the clans betrayed them, i do believe the story was very biased however in an attempt to make them into the victims   

[Fear Factory]

From the way I read the story, they were pushed into it. And the primary person pushing the agenda was the Widowmaker Khan. They took the best of the worst choices and ran with it.

this isn't quite how it went down. the wolverines were set up as a fall guy for the clans, and this was all exacerbated by karige who had put a spy in the wolverines lower castes, and had put into place a plan that would make the wolverines look like the bad guy by saying the wolverines were withholding new tech from the clans. when things started to go wrong went mcevedy put her escape plan into motion. so really nicky k and the clans betrayed them, i do believe the story was very biased however in an attempt to make them into the victims   

They were pushed into throwing a hissy fit over sharing the Brian Cache they found?  Pushed to declare independence?  Sabotaged?  No.  They were stupid.  They lost BOTH of their trial of refusals (one for the Raven incident and the other for the Jade Falcon incident).  Under Clan law and tradition she had lost, PERIOD.  SHE made the decision to make her Clan independent and sealed their fate herself, rather than succumb to Kerensky's plea for a Trial of Grievance, where she probably could have won.  The Clan was strong, no doubt about that, but they chose a childish way to deal with it (AMERICA IN SPAAAAAAACE!!!!).  Her statements complain about torture and overthrowing the pentagons but she had no problem fighting under the Clan banner.  I don't believe either side of the story, but I'll tell you one thing, Wolverine did it to themselves.

[Hawkeye Jim]

How you view the Wolverine's fall depends on what you read. Pardoe's "Betrayal" series puts a different spin on it.

[Stormlion1]

The Brian Cache was a part of it, what started it all really was that the Wolverines had gained a tech edge over evryone else too quickly, they deployed three new designs, and at least one new weapon system while the rest of the Clans were still using old Star League designs and equipment, plus they were winning trials they should have lost. Karrige himself had a vendetta against Mcvedy from the original Pentagon campaign which gave him cause to hate Mcvedy and her Clan. He even smuggled a nuke into one of the Wolverines citys and detonated it, then placing the blame on the Wolverines for nuking themselves. Very sneaky, very Widowmaker.

[Daishi411]

HJ's right, it all depends in how you interpret BoI. For me its a two way street, both parties (wolverines and clans) contributed to the separation and ensuing conflicts

[Hawkeye Jim]

If you read "Fall From Glory", Sarah McEvedy is introduced as a rebel who betrayed her original commander. That makes her seem like someone who should never have been trusted to command in the first place.

[Daishi411]

If you read "Fall From Glory", Sarah McEvedy is introduced as a rebel who betrayed her original commander. That makes her seem like someone who should never have been trusted to command in the first place.

she probably got command of a clan because of her (ambiguous) relationship with the kerensky boys

[Istal_Devalis]

If you read "Fall From Glory", Sarah McEvedy is introduced as a rebel who betrayed her original commander. That makes her seem like someone who should never have been trusted to command in the first place.

That would have invalidated more then a few Khans...

[Stormlion1]

Nicky K made his choices based on who went with him on the Second Exodus, I bet there were more than a few Khans and SaKhans he regretted.

[Alan Grant]

Some info for the Widowmaker fans.

Aerotech 2 Revised, in the Warship Fleet Color Schemes that start on page 32, says this about the Wolf's Dragoons warships.

Bringing six ships captured during the Absorption of Clan Widowmaker out of mothballs, Clan Wolf outfitted the Wolf's Dragoons for their fateful covert reconnaissance mission. The Warships use the classic Dragoon Black with red trim-which fortuitously matches the Widowmaker's colors.

[ShockaTime]

huh, that's pretty cool.

[Sid]

They were pushed into throwing a hissy fit over sharing the Brian Cache they found?  Pushed to declare independence?  Sabotaged?  No.  They were stupid.  They lost BOTH of their trial of refusals (one for the Raven incident and the other for the Jade Falcon incident).  Under Clan law and tradition she had lost, PERIOD.  SHE made the decision to make her Clan independent and sealed their fate herself, rather than succumb to Kerensky's plea for a Trial of Grievance, where she probably could have won.  The Clan was strong, no doubt about that, but they chose a childish way to deal with it (AMERICA IN SPAAAAAAACE!!!!).  Her statements complain about torture and overthrowing the pentagons but she had no problem fighting under the Clan banner.  I don't believe either side of the story, but I'll tell you one thing, Wolverine did it to themselves.

What you're going off is the fabricated history by Nicholas Kerensky.  Everything we had on the Wolverine Annihilation was a lie.

In short:

-McEvedy was in love with Andery Kerensky.  She used to be great friends with Nicholas as well, but grew distant once she believed he murdered his brother to secure power over the Clans.
-The caste system was supposed to be temporary, and Nicholas promised to relax it.  When they began to let their civilians pick their own castes, Nicholas came down on them.
-The Wolverines had the best economy and the best warriors.  They also advanced their tech base over the other Clans, making the prototypes that would become the Clan ER PPC and Omnimech
-McEvedy saved the Widowmaker Khan during Klondike.  Because he was embarrassed, he pulled strings and, combined with the jealousy the other Clans had over the advantages the Wolverines had above, turned the Clans against the Wolverines.
-The Brian Cache had nothing to with the Ravens.  The Jade Falcons actually invaded Wolverine territory and stole the cache, claiming it as theirs.  The Wolverines allowed it to remain peaceful.
-Nicholas went along with the beatdown of all the Clans ganing up on the Wolverines, and created the Trial of Absorption to get rid of the Wolverines.  When it became clear their Clan had no hope of having a fair trial, they decided to leave.
-Widowmaker warriors dressed as Wolverines steal a nuke from the Brian Cache the Jade Falcons illegitimately took from the Wolverines.  The Widowmakers then hide it in a Wolverine city and detonate it, murdering untold Wolverine civilians and making it look like the Wolverines nuked their own people.
-Nicholas orders a Trial of Annihilation and orders the Snow Ravens to nuke the Wolverines.  When the Wolverines shoot down the aerospace fighter, it blows up on the Ravens.  The Ravens nuked themselves.
-It turns out Nicholas knew what was going on the whole time, and let it all happen...because, you know, he's evil.

There's a lot of other things the Clan books outright lie about, but that's the gist.  For example, there never was any Bear/Wolf rivalry.  The Ghost Bear let some Wolverines go because they're children- not out of spite.  There's also the fact that the Watch was created 200-300 years earlier than stated, and were conceived to spy on the Wolverines...the Wolverines resist making their own Watch because it's dishonourable.
 

[abou]

Really interesting stuff.  For reference, is this all in the BattleCorps publications?