Advanced C3

[evilauthor]

Advanced C3 comes in two forms: a firmware patch for existing C3 Systems, and new equipment that takes full advantage of the possibilities made by the patch.

Firmware Patch: Dynamic Linking
This firmware patch allows for dynamic battlefield linking of C3 systems in order to improve the network's resilience to having it links cuts. If for whatever reason a C3 Slave is cut off from its Master, it will automatically attempt to link up with any friendly C3 Master unit that has a free Slave port available. By the same token, if a Master loses contact with one of its sub-units (Slave or sub-Master), it's Slave port is now open and available for any free Slave/sub-Master to take.

The C3 Network is still limited to 12 units in the network however.

Dynamic Linking can be disabled or overridden if the user so chooses. However, if this is done on the battlefield, only the pilot using the C3 Master involved will be required to make a skill roll while doing nothing else in order to "fix" the network topology.

C3 Advanced
Based on studies made of C3i units captured during the Jihad, the C3 Advanced unit is basically a C3 Slave upgraded with extra functions. These functions are chosen and locked before combat begins. These functions are:

1) Link to Lower - The C3a links to a C3 unit lower on the C3 net. This can be a C3 Master, a C3 Slave, or a C3a set to Link to Higher.

2) Link to Higher - The C3a links a C3 unit highter on the C3 net. This can be a C3 Master, or a C3a set to Link to Lower. Also note that the Link to Higher function is what provides the unit's sensor data to the C3 network.

3) Network Management - The C3a manages multiple C3a units that are on the same platform it is. These units are required when using multiple C3a units on the same platform. A C3a manager can manage up to four units. C3a Network Managers can only manage C3a units. They do not manage standard C3 units.

A classic C3 Lance Master that is part of a company can be emulated by C3a by stacking together 5 C3a units: 1 Manager, 1 Link to Higher, and 3 Links to Lower.

Similarly, a classic Company Master can be emulated by using 1 Manager with 3 Links to Lower.

A Lance Master that is not part of a company net can dispense with the Link to Higher.

A C3a can act as a pure C3 Slave simply be setting it to Link to Higher.

C3a is compatible with standard C3 networks. As such, even in a C3 net composed purely of units with C3a, the net can only have 12 members.

Any network topology may be allowed so long as the units in it adhere to the above linking rules.

Even a C3i net can be emulated using 1 Link to Higher, 1 Link to Lower, and a Network Manager on each mech in a company, and then arranging the links into a "Ring" network. A Slight flaw in this design is that if a mech drops out of the network due to ECM, dynamic relinking will "close the gap" in the ring and prevent dropped mech from rejoining as there would be no open ports available. For the isolated mech to rejoin the network, it and the two mechs it would be "sliding in-between" need to make skill check rolls as described above in dynamic linking.

A C3a unit is 1 ton, and 1 crit. When carrying multiple C3a units on a single platform, the C3a units do NOT all have to be in the same location. Their functions must be designated before combat begins however.

Edit: In the event a C3a unit suffers a critical hit, only the hit C3a unit stops functioning. For Links to Lower and Links to Higher, the associated Link is destroyed until another C3a unit set to the same function can take it over. If the Network Manager suffers a critical hit, only one other onboard C3a (a Link to Higher by default) stays usable unless there is a backup Manager onboard. Changing this requires a Manual Topology Change roll.

While a mechwarrior can manually change what C3 units his C3a connects to, he cannot alter a C3a function mode on the battlefield. Altering function mode requires the services of a trained tech and 10 minutes of work.

[CloaknDagger]

That is WAY too complicated. Try just the first part man.

[evilauthor]

That is WAY too complicated. Try just the first part man.

Okay, to sum up the most basic C3a rules:

1) Compatible with regular C3 Network.

2) C3a comes with 3 modes:
2a) C3a in Link to Higher mode only links to C3a in Link to Lower mode or a C3 Master. This mode is also the only one that lets the carrying unit provide targeting data to the network.
2b) C3a in Link to Lower mode acts as a Master end of a Link for a single C3a in Link to Higher mode, a C3 Slave, or a subordinate C3 Master.
2c) C3a in Network Management is required if you're using more than one C3a on a single platform (ie, a mech, vehicle, or anything else you can install C3 on).

3) Which mode a C3a unit is in is determined when the mech is in maintenance (ie, before play) and cannot be changed during combat.

4) Only 12 units total can be on the C3 Network

5) One C3a costs 1 ton and 1 crit.

6) One C3a in Link to Higher mode can act as a C3 Slave. To act as a Master of anything in the C3 Network requires a C3a in Link to Lower mode. But for the "Master" to participate in a network, they need another C3a in Link to Higher mode, which makes at least 2 C3a, which means the Master needs a third C3a in Network Management mode.


Hmm... maybe I need better terminology for the modes. How about Link to Master, Link to Slave, and Network Manager?

Edit: Oh yeah. You can create any kind of network topology (ie, the pattern of Master/Slave relationships) you like so long as you adhere to the posted rules.

[Prince of Darkness]

I agree with CnD, the second idea is far too complicated for my liking.

I also think the "update" first one should come at a cost of some extra heat to give it a downside.

[evilauthor]

I agree with CnD, the second idea is far too complicated for my liking.

I guess. The general idea though was to be able to build your own C3 systems and network architecture out of 1 ton modules.

I also think the "update" first one should come at a cost of some extra heat to give it a downside.

Why would dynamic linking cause extra heat? I know BT computer systems aren't all that efficient, but come on...

[Prince of Darkness]

Why would dynamic linking cause extra heat? I know BT computer systems aren't all that efficient, but come on...

Mostly because it requires the C3 module to do more processes outside of it's norm, and would thus generate more heat like the Nova CEWS.  Now, that one also acts as an Active probe and ECM, but it's also a clan device and thus made out of ground-up unicorns and diamonds.

[evilauthor]

Mostly because it requires the C3 module to do more processes outside of it's norm,

Actually... it ought to be doing LESS than the norm because no data is being passed over the link... because ESTABLISHING the link is the entire point of the exercise. I find it difficult to believe that doing something my laptop does every time I turn it on in Starbucks requires more processing power or bandwidth than passing around targeting data from 12 different combat units.

and would thus generate more heat like the Nova CEWS.  Now, that one also acts as an Active probe and ECM, but it's also a clan device and thus made out of ground-up unicorns and diamonds.

As opposed to the armor being made out of vampires, ballistic ammo being holy water, and fusion engines being fueled with dragon sh... er, breath?

[GreekFire]

I like your first idea. Would it allow a previously unnetworked c3 slave to join up with a functioning c3 network? Because then I might see issues with new c3 spotters constantly coming in to replace ones that get destroyed.

[evilauthor]

I like your first idea. Would it allow a previously unnetworked c3 slave to join up with a functioning c3 network? Because then I might see issues with new c3 spotters constantly coming in to replace ones that get destroyed.

Sure.

Technically speaking, all you'd need is the equivalent of the network encryption key and an open slot in the network and you'd be let in.

Of course, this would also mean you'd need to guard these keys to keep the Enemy from using your own network against you, but wouldn't that be true for regular C3 net as well? You don't need to be part of the network to "eavesdrop" on it after all. All encryption does is make sure the enemy can't understand what's being transmitted.

Hmm... now I'm wondering if every network uses a different key, even what all the network users on ostensibly on the same side.

[CloaknDagger]

If you want an Advanced C3 system, use this:

C3 Advanced

C3 Advanced weights 3 tons and consumes 3 critical spaces.

When in use, the C3 Advanced functions as a C3 Master, C3 Boosted Master, and iC3 all at once. That is to say, it can link up with any other type of C3 system without difficulty.

A network with C3 advanced may have no more than 12 units, as per standard C3 rules, but when also used to link with iC3 systems, there may be no more than 6 iC3 systems in the network total. Additionally, if the network has multiple types of C3, including iC3, then the C3 Advanced acts as a type of master unit connecting the iC3 systems to the rest of the network. Should the C3 Advanced be disabled, the iC3 units are booted from the network unless another C3 Advanced is available.

C3 Advanced has the same resistance to ECM effects as C3 Boosted.


How's that?

[idea weenie]

I'd offer an advanced C3 system, that treats enemy ECM as being 2 hexes less in radius. More along the lines of a comm system that is more rugged vs extraneous signals, but enough garbage and it will still crash.


The other option would be a laser comm system that is immune to enemy ECM, however only the units directly linked to the immobile unit and with line of sight get the benefit.  I.e. is the unit with a C3 slave stands perfectly still (i.e. immobile target), the C3Master connected to it will always be connected (no motion for it to deal with).  If the C3Master stands still, all C3 units directly connected to it will benefit.

The primary use for this is a command unit on a hill, firing LRMs, while spotters get close.  Enemy ECM has no effect, but if they get within range of the command unit they will likely kill it.  Or just toss smoke clouds between the two to disrupt line of sight.

[Cybra]

My C3 Advanced system was more of a rearrangement of parts producing an improvement over standard C3 networks, but with a severe limitation.

Basically, the IS Houses reverse engineered captured WoB C3i systems in an effort to improve their own.

Tons: 2.0
Crits: 2
Cost: $600,000
BV: +5% to all networked units
Tech: E/X-X-F

Game Rules:
Works the exact same as the C3i system, but can only network a maximum of 4 units

Weighs the same as a lance C3 network and removes the risk of the C3 master, but doesn't work at the company level

[Prince of Darkness]

Actually... it ought to be doing LESS than the norm because no data is being passed over the link... because ESTABLISHING the link is the entire point of the exercise. I find it difficult to believe that doing something my laptop does every time I turn it on in Starbucks requires more processing power or bandwidth than passing around targeting data from 12 different combat units.

But that's not how C3 can work- it has to be connected and transmitting it's positional data constantly, otherwise you don't get it's effects.

[evilauthor]

My C3 Advanced system was more of a rearrangement of parts producing an improvement over standard C3 networks, but with a severe limitation.

Basically, the IS Houses reverse engineered captured WoB C3i systems in an effort to improve their own.

Tons: 2.0
Crits: 2
Cost: $600,000
BV: +5% to all networked units
Tech: E/X-X-F

Game Rules:
Works the exact same as the C3i system, but can only network a maximum of 4 units

Weighs the same as a lance C3 network and removes the risk of the C3 master, but doesn't work at the company level

Hmm... in that case, a variation of one of my C3 Advanced topologies, but now in a simpler, non-modular format:

C3-Ring

Tons: 3
Crits: 3
Cost: $900,000
BV: 10% to all networked units

Game Rules:

C3-Ring as the name suggests creates a "ring" network by allowing a mech to create a C3 link to two other mechs. A properly designed set of links can create a C3 Net of up to 12 mechs with a "ring" topology where every mech is linked to two other mechs. However, there is no dynamic linking, so if two non-adjacent mechs drop out of the net, the net will break up into two independent C3 Nets until one of the lost mechs rejoins the net.

Wikipedia Article on Ring Networks for anyone who has trouble visualizing what I'm talking about.

So, slightly more total tonnage than C3 and C3i. More resilient than C3 but not as much as C3i, but can network whole companies.

But that's not how C3 can work- it has to be connected and transmitting it's positional data constantly, otherwise you don't get it's effects.

Sure it does. But only AFTER a link has been established. We're talking about dynamic linking right? Where an isolated unit is trying to GET INTO the network? Constant transmission is only done once it's a part of the network. I don't see why any kind of C3 system would generate excess heat when no other electronics system does so, even the NARC launcher which incorporates rocket motors into their function.

[Red Pins]

...Interesting.

My own C3P (for Point) system connects two vehicle units (the 'Point'   ::) ), for a +1.  It takes 1 Turn to break a link voluntarily, but if the link is broken by destroying a vehicle, the system can reconnect using a die roll to determine time required (1-3 Turns).

I'm considering another system to link drones, but I'm thinking about an autonomous (sp) system that wouldn't be affected by ECM so badly first, mostly fluff about using laser communication by Phaelan in one of the Blood of Kerensky books.

[Feign]

I kind of see where the second half of the description is going:  A C3A can be set to connect to a single other C3A unit, which is hard-coded out of combat.  So a 2-mech unit can simply mount a single unit in each mech and get along fine.  The network management setting is where things get muddy, so I suggest a different wording:

-If a unit wants to have a C3A that connects two or more other units together by two degrees of separation, it requires a C3A computer to internally connect these network branches together.
-If it wishes to share connections through another two degrees of separation, it requires a second dedicated computer for increasingly complex management.
-Routing further degrees of separation is impossible.
-The number if active C3A computers in a single unit is limited to five.  If more are mounted, they may act as a backup for any computer destroyed on the unit.

This causes the C3A to really shine over a standard C3 in smaller networks, but at the network's maximum limits, it starts to resemble a standard C3 net.

[evilauthor]

I kind of see where the second half of the description is going:  A C3A can be set to connect to a single other C3A unit, which is hard-coded out of combat.  So a 2-mech unit can simply mount a single unit in each mech and get along fine.  The network management setting is where things get muddy, so I suggest a different wording:

Yes, exactly. I guess I made things a bit more complicated than they needed to be because I insisted that the two way link had to have two modes: an "upstream" and a "downstream" and which one a C3a was depended on whether it linked to a C3a that was closer or farther away from the central hub. I suppose that strictly speaking, that wasn't really necessary.

This causes the C3A to really shine over a standard C3 in smaller networks, but at the network's maximum limits, it starts to resemble a standard C3 net.

Yes. Grouped C3a on a single platform can perform a Master role, but because they come in one crit modules are more resilient to critical hits. The C3a modules can be spread throughout the mech into any nook and cranny you can find room for it. And a critical hit on a module will only sever the one link and leave the others up... unless it's the module you're using for network management, in which case you'll lose ALL your links except one (the one to a higher Master by default).

...

And now for another C3 idea: The Battalion C3 Master

Fluff: The Battalion C3 Master is an experimental device intended as a Proof of Concept. BnC3 allows for three standard company sized C3 nets to be linked together into a single Battalion C3 net. BnC3 took the modular concept of C3a and applied it to the C3 Master. As such, a BnC3 "unit" is really multiple C3 Masters working in parallel, a necessity given the amount of processing power and bandwidth a Battalion sized C3 net requires.

Although the BnC3 unit has been constructed and is proven to work, it is considered far too heavy and bulky to be deployable on the tactical battlefield as any opponent with even standard EW monitoring capability (which is basically anyone better equipped than unarmored infantry) will be able to quickly identify it.

Due to its size and experimental nature and the complexity of its operation, a BmC3 system must be entirely located on one platform and even then is sensitive to damage.

Tonnage: 30
Crits: 30 (splittable into 5 crit units that may be placed independently)
Cost: 20 million CBills
BV: +30% to all units in the net.

Rules:
BnC3 acts as a Master for up to 3 "slaves". The "slaves" can only be C3 Masters which can be acting as either Lance or Company Masters.
BnC3 can manage a C3 Network of up to 36 combat units.
BnC3 can be disabled by a single crit due to is complexity and experimental nature..

[Col Toda]

Firmware . Dedicated links that are only set before the fight seem safer.  I know that it is
somewhat doable by shooting a C3 Remote  for a newly opened channel .  But what you
are proposing may allow a fast ecm mech to cut off an enemy channel and have the
network hacked  and have your enemy target your mechs with ranges from the closest
of your mechs . To put enough safe guards to prevent this would slow down the whole
network . The Evil in the name is correct .

[StCptMara]

Bah...Just use the rules for the Nova CEWS, but make it weigh 3 tons,  and can be jammed by ECM, and acts as a light active
probe.

[garhkal]

I'd offer an advanced C3 system, that treats enemy ECM as being 2 hexes less in radius. More along the lines of a comm system that is more rugged vs extraneous signals, but enough garbage and it will still crash.


The other option would be a laser comm system that is immune to enemy ECM, however only the units directly linked to the immobile unit and with line of sight get the benefit.  I.e. is the unit with a C3 slave stands perfectly still (i.e. immobile target), the C3Master connected to it will always be connected (no motion for it to deal with).  If the C3Master stands still, all C3 units directly connected to it will benefit.

The primary use for this is a command unit on a hill, firing LRMs, while spotters get close.  Enemy ECM has no effect, but if they get within range of the command unit they will likely kill it.  Or just toss smoke clouds between the two to disrupt line of sight.

I could get behind that sort of AC3 option..  where its not jammable by ECM but can be blocked by LOS.
But to make it a little better, i would also allow the gunners benefiting from it to not just use the range of the closest (or most optimum mech) but gain a bonus to targeting itself from having more mechs in the loop..
Say AC3 as a 4 mech lance, +1 to hit
AC3 as a 6 mech IC3 style link up, +1 to hit, +1 to missile cluster chances
AC3 as a 12 mech company +2 to hit..

C3-Ring

Tons: 3
Crits: 3
Cost: $900,000
BV: 10% to all networked units

Game Rules:

C3-Ring as the name suggests creates a "ring" network by allowing a mech to create a C3 link to two other mechs. A properly designed set of links can create a C3 Net of up to 12 mechs with a "ring" topology where every mech is linked to two other mechs. However, there is no dynamic linking, so if two non-adjacent mechs drop out of the net, the net will break up into two independent C3 Nets until one of the lost mechs rejoins the net.

Wikipedia Article on Ring Networks for anyone who has trouble visualizing what I'm talking about.

So, slightly more total tonnage than C3 and C3i. More resilient than C3 but not as much as C3i, but can network whole companies.

I like it..  As someone who worked on fiber token rings, that would work out great...  Not so much for the lights, but better for the heavies/assaults.