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Author Topic: Customs vs Stock Variants  (Read 5345 times)

jackpot4

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Customs vs Stock Variants
« on: 14 January 2015, 12:03:05 »
     Hi, I am fairly new to the game and since starting to play at the local store we have been using a lot of customs.  We stick to tournament legal tech and just run BV based games.  A few issues have arisen such as pulse boats with targeting computers and I'll need to say something if one of the newest players brings his list of mechs that only have pulse weapons and targeting computers.  This is one of the problems with customs obviously.  (I only have one or two pulse weapons in a force at most for example, so I can recognize and dont want to be part of the problem)

My question to everyone is how do they play?  Customs or stocks? 

     As I mentioned we use a lot of a customs and I nearly always have break even heat dissipation, sacrificing an extra gun or two for max armor and maneuverability.  because after having played all the computer games thats mostly what I did with my mechs there.

     I am still only a few months into playing the game but I am looking at stock designs from solaris skunk werks and some of them look horrendous.  One example is a Battlemaster variant that has its left arm's MG ammo in its right torso next to the right arm's PPC.  If the mech survives the hit to the ammo the PPC is gone and the left arm is useless.  It seems logical to CASE the left torso and keep the ammo there.  Then you lose the SRM which may or may not do its full damage rather than losing a longer range and consistent damage weapon like the PPC.

     Another thing I see is that some mechs like Atlas variants dont even have enough heat sinks to fire off even just two of their main weapons before going over their heat sinks.  One variant I saw, if alpha striking went up to 28 heat over their heat sinks (may have been another mech).  I get that heat issues make the game a bit more tactical, but with a +1 and +2 mod right there in the starting overheat I fear that I wouldnt hit anything the entire game with my typical rolls.

     Finally, one other thing I noticed is how many empty critical slots are open.  The empty slot in the head is often left open on stocks and same with the center torso.  On my customs I always put either a small energy weapon, heat sinks, or jump jets in the center torso/head (not jump jets in the head of course haha).  I tend to lose a mech once a game to a head shot, often in the 60-85 ton range so I try as hard as I can to give a little buffer.

     These are just things I am seeing that don't make sense to me and maybe its because I still fairly new they dont make sense; so if you guys could offer me any insight into how you run your own games, how you handle stock variants, or any other tips that might be useful, I'd appreciate it. 
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bugman

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #1 on: 14 January 2015, 12:22:11 »
Everything is relative to the type of game you are playing. If the game is based on just maximizing combat effectiveness of mechs. Then custom mechs will just kill stock stuff in general.

So if your games are gun fights don't bring a knife.


You seem to be in a open type of game situation. Where BV and design are at a premium. Also I believe the Targeting Computer is now under several restrictions, no pulse and mulit fire guns.

This pluse and TC thing was a killer back when Fasa introduced the Clans. Turned many old players off.

You might need a different set of ground rules or private campaign to experience the fun of stock design play.

My personal campaign started stock and progressed to some modding. Then more advanced modding. But it is controlled and scripted. So it can be used as needed or wanted.

In a open event format you just need to set the ground rules. Like tech era and say all primary stock class. You just need to have the format set that all abide by. People can get real child like when they are forced to accept rules they don't like. But it needs to be fair for all.


Good luck. Your open form of BT can be fun. Just make sure you all have a good understanding on the format/rules.

You can choose to accept the old Fasa rules with no restrictions to the Targeting Computer if you want. If all agree....




« Last Edit: 14 January 2015, 12:24:52 by bugman »

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #2 on: 14 January 2015, 12:25:18 »
Depends on what I'm playing.
Tournaments, events, pick up games with another group than my usual one or something similar: Stock models. A campaign that evolves over time: whatever works and is fun. :)
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Frabby

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #3 on: 14 January 2015, 12:33:28 »
Of course, there's always the ultimate balancing procedure (attributed to King Salomon): Let one player/side put together both lineups for the battlefield; then let the other player/side chose which side has to play with which lineup...
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #4 on: 14 January 2015, 12:42:58 »
And never forget the basic rule of all: whatever works for your game.
Personal enjoyment has to be the top priority. If you feel you need one way or the other to have fun, play that way. If you have different opinions in your group then try to balance it by doing it one way for one game and the other for the next. Keeps everybody happy and is a fair compromise. :)
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #5 on: 14 January 2015, 12:47:19 »
As you're seeing, I often find that allowing players to use customs in a loose fashion often leads to abuse of certain mechanics. It only takes one player to make it not fun for everyone else. If it is a continuing issue, I would suggest bringing up Reflective Armor (in Tactical Operations, IIRC); while you'd be stretching beyond TW rules, it is a hard counter to laser/pulse-boats. Even if you don't outfit your entire force with it, the threat of having his firepower halved will either make the pulse-abuser change his builds, or throw a fit. If he throws a fit, throw him out. The point of getting together to play is for everyone to have fun. If one person's "fun" isn't fun for everyone else, something has to change.

I think that once people get used to playing with stock designs, it generally allows for more balance. Since most 'Mechs have both flaws and advantages, it becomes a question of being able to pit your strength against your opponents weaknesses, while shielding your own weaknesses from their strengths. Bringing the right mix of forces becomes more effective than who has the most Clan LPLs on a design.

As to your comments on poor designs... yep, there are some really bad ones. There are some that look really bad, but perform better in a given role. There are also some that can be absolutely devastating when used well - and absolute crap when used poorly. Take the Nova (Blackhawk) H; with 10 Heavy Medium Lasers, it will overheat to a gross degree while firing all of them. Putting 100 damage into someone's back will also ruin their day. You can't stand back with it a 9 hexes and blaze away with everything every turn. You've got to maneuver and pounce when you get an opening. It's a matter of breaking out of your comfort zone and learning different tactics. Consider that if you do the same thing all the time, your opponents know what you're going to do as well as you do and can take advantage of that. Throw them off balance, and seize the advantage for yourself.

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #6 on: 14 January 2015, 12:50:37 »
There's nothing wrong with a design which goes slightly over its heatsinking ability if all of the weapons for a given range band are fired, as long as it's not far enough over to seriously impact the unit next turn (still not a problem if you can jump into cover, or if you vaporize the opponent with the "alpha strike").  It's also fine to have a sharp distinction between long-ranged and short-ranged weapons, with only enough sinks for one or the other, since you normally only need one at a time (sure, we'd all LIKE to use both, but prioritizing is half the challenge).  That frees up a few extra tons which can go toward more weapons/armor/speed instead of heatsinks.

As pointed out, it can be a lot of fun learning how to get the most out of a "flawed" design, rather than trying to create the "perfect" unit.  Some of my favorite units to run have serious design issues, which makes it "interesting" to use them to maximize their strengths while covering for their weaknesses, instead of everything being "optimized".  As long as you're playing against other players who are out to play rather than win at any cost, it's fine.  When you add one or two "munchkins" who have to use every advantage in every game or they won't play, then you've got little choice but to either follow suit or play elsewhere.  Also, depending on your play style, the mapsheet, and your opponents, what works great in one case may be all but useless in another, so it's all subjective.

Col.Hengist

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #7 on: 14 January 2015, 12:53:36 »
I love stock mechs. There are some great ones and some turds but they all have flavor. Tac and pulse boats... Yawn.

Sure, the stick designs overheat, that's part of learning how to ride a heat curve. Some of these mechs are bracket fighters which have weapons meant to becfired at long range, medium then short. Some examples are the Penetrator ( a personal favorite ) which has the erll's at long until you get close then the 6 mpl's up close. Another is the stalker. Something for all ranges. You just have to learn how to use them.

As far as the tc+pulses... You can still use them for the -3, just not for targeting a specific location for the -3
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bugman

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #8 on: 14 January 2015, 13:05:10 »
The computer games as I remember allowed for lots of custom and move up in mech design and tonnage. The Board game is much more than that. The original game really was all stock class 3025 tech.

So your perspective will be different from a old timer or even someone that has chosen to play stock units. It is all BT, just different types for different people/groups.

The old stock stuff had lots of issues that could be tweaked. I love tweaking it. But it is also just plain fun to play a Rifleman. Even against a Mad Cat. Not every time though.

Anyone can design better than the Designers of the game. Even they could have chosen to. They did not for I guess reasons, like adding character to the game.

My first game was with a Crusader vs a Marauder from a box set with card board mechs. Maybe the funnest game I ever played. All stock.

Many Clan era or newer players with all the new tech will have a different perspective on the game. But no matter what era stock will be at a disadvantage to custom. Any stock design can be made better in another players eyes.

Its fun to redesign and play them. But keep in mind that BV2 is not fool proof. A well designed custom should have a advantage.

PS I was thinking in the old terms of using them with no restrictions. Not currently playing with the Clan+ era. So I missed that detail.

jackpot4

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #9 on: 14 January 2015, 13:18:31 »
     A lot of what is being said makes sense to me, but I just hate having my guard down for a turn.  My mindset is to advance, stay mobile, and keep pushing forward.  I'm in no way trying to brag, but I just got out of the USMC infantry and that is where that mindset comes from.  Against one regular opponent I tend to make contact and push him back or force him to bring his forces together and take cover behind a mountain/cover.  Another opponent I play who has far more experience than I tends to end up being a wall of mechs slamming into a wall of mechs until one side collapses.

     Thinking I may be sacrificing mobility or accuracy for a turn or even having to fall back after dealing heavy damage just seems like giving up ground and giving the other side a chance to breathe.  For example I threw some improved jump jets on a karhu, brought it up to 8 jumping MP for 4 heat with a retractable blade.  Sure it gave me a high to hit defense mod but people scattered before engaging in close combat.  So I had to reduce it to regular jump jets was able to put a TC, two large lasers, two mediums, and keep the blade all while breaking even heat wise.

     My custom Battlemaster has a Gauss, LBX 10, 4 medium lasers, SRMs, and a small laser, so the range bands are all covered, and while the max damage only gets up to just under 60 points, he can keep moving and shooting aggressively. 

I'm just trying to give you guys a good understand of my train of thought to give you a better understanding of the type of stuff I am looking for.

     Do you guys have any suggestions for stock mechs that keep in this even heat exchange range?  I have been going through my collected mech models and their stock variants on solaris skunk werks but havent seen all the intro box set variants yet.  I have intro mechs, Victor, Blackjack, Marauder IIC, Grizzly, Bruin, Karhu, Kodiak, Warhammer IIC, Hellbringer, Fire Moth, and Valiant.  Any suggestions for stock variants to check out would be more than welcome!
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #10 on: 14 January 2015, 13:49:00 »
I use custom stuff for one-off events, or as cobbled-together refits for a campaign (that Blackjack lost its right-arm AC/2 and we don't have a replacement, but we can hammer and tape a large laser and some heat sinks in its place, etc.), but I tend to stick to canon mostly. It reduces the cheese factory considerably.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #11 on: 14 January 2015, 13:52:40 »
I tend to find that newer, or less-experienced players, tend to gravitate toward customization. Finding and eliminating faults is one of the first things people do when they get ahold of construction rules. As you grow in experience or have a depth of knowledge of the game, you'll find that the challenge is lacking as it becomes brinksmanship: "Who can cheese the other guy out of a win?"
 
Stock variants are lacking in quality and require a bit more skill to operate. When you win, you earned it by using a less-than-optimal design. There's something to be said for that challenge.
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bugman

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #12 on: 14 January 2015, 14:25:11 »
I am more attuned to the 3025 tech era, so I can't really help with the specs your using. Without going to rule books and manuals. Maybe the other guys will have a suggestion on stock mechs for your tech era.

In general I would say that you will be at a disadvantage in a custom mech game, no matter the tech level. If in your mech mix you have some decent stock stuff, they will be playable. But you most likely be at a disadvantage with equipment, but not in fighting spirit. So you are not guaranteed to lose.

From your list the Victor is not going to over heat. With the new version carrying a Gauss it is a dangerous mech. The Warhammer IIC looks fun and pretty good with heat. The Marauder IIC looks like a model you need to balance your heat though. Thats my  quick look. Let the real experts on it chime in though. for this era.

The big issue I see is if your mix needs to be improved ask for suggestions and buy a couple of new mechs. Or get the group to try a limited format. Sometimes.

Out playing good players is more than being aggressive. Little luck helps, reacting to what they are doing well, limiting your own mistakes,  and picking the right time to take advantage of their mistakes.

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #13 on: 14 January 2015, 14:52:06 »
Probably the best stock mech for what you're looking for is the hellstar.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #14 on: 14 January 2015, 15:04:24 »
Probably the best stock mech for what you're looking for is the hellstar.

That's a real killer.  with a BV2 of 3084

Jackpot, how do you guys determine the force points your allowed?

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #15 on: 14 January 2015, 15:06:05 »
Jackpot, how do you guys determine the force points your allowed?

Mostly by whatever I would enjoy to do for the game. Allow only a relatively small BV but force people to use more units can lead to interesting games as can doing the exact opposite.
It really depends on what you are in the mood for :)
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #16 on: 14 January 2015, 15:13:16 »
I tend to find that newer, or less-experienced players, tend to gravitate toward customization. Finding and eliminating faults is one of the first things people do when they get ahold of construction rules. As you grow in experience or have a depth of knowledge of the game, you'll find that the challenge is lacking as it becomes brinksmanship: "Who can cheese the other guy out of a win?"
 
Stock variants are lacking in quality and require a bit more skill to operate. When you win, you earned it by using a less-than-optimal design. There's something to be said for that challenge.

I'd back that. My days of enjoying large pulse laser/targeting computer monstrosities are long past- I'll use a beat up old Dervish gladly over something like that these days for the challenge factor.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #17 on: 14 January 2015, 16:03:36 »
I don't.
I've been playing since Battledroids and I still love customs. Admittedly, I don't go for super-cheese unless everyone at the table is doing the same (or they're at least OK with me doing so and they gang up on me >:D ).

Most of my customs are either tweaks to designs (weapon swaps, etc) or are to match a mini from another game (CAV, Heavy Gear, Mekton).

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #18 on: 14 January 2015, 16:20:42 »
That's a real killer.  with a BV2 of 3084

Jackpot, how do you guys determine the force points your allowed?

We kinda just talk the days before the game to determine what we want to use.  the brackets are typically 9k or 15k per side in each game.

I looked at the hellstar and that is almost the same as my custom Marauder IIC only I have a targeting computer on that with 3 PPCs.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #19 on: 14 January 2015, 17:22:56 »
I tend to find that newer, or less-experienced players, tend to gravitate toward customization. Finding and eliminating faults is one of the first things people do when they get ahold of construction rules. As you grow in experience or have a depth of knowledge of the game, you'll find that the challenge is lacking as it becomes brinksmanship: "Who can cheese the other guy out of a win?"
 
Stock variants are lacking in quality and require a bit more skill to operate. When you win, you earned it by using a less-than-optimal design. There's something to be said for that challenge.

I fully agree. I had played with TC+Clan Large Pulse Laser mechs and apologized after the easy victory. I defeated a Black Hawk KU and a Zeus 6S with a Dervish 7D and it is a great victory, much more challenging and interesting.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #20 on: 14 January 2015, 17:35:25 »
While you can't please everyone all the time, you can try to placate everyone.

Set up a rotating schedule.  "Every other Tuesday is Stock Mechs Only."  Or take a page out of some of the Starterbooks.  Only 4 of the 12 Black Widow mechs are nonstandard.  So set a ratio of something like "1 custom per lance."  That is still abusable because they could reform on the field, but its an idea. Maybe put an artificial BV penalty on customs.  "Anything that doesn't come from an official record sheet pays an extra 15% BV."  Put repeat usage limits on a design or theme, "You have to wait a month until you can use a Pulse laser/TC boat again."

The younger players will eventually start to see the appeal in the stock designs and some of the older players might be convinced to tinker a bit more than they might have.

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #21 on: 14 January 2015, 17:44:22 »
Boasting that you took down someone's stock 3025 Warhammer with your cheezed-out semi-custom Daishi is an achievement akin to clubbing baby seals, and the other players look at you funny when you bring it up.  When you take out that same WHM-6R with a standard Locust 1V, then you've EARNED bragging rights.

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #22 on: 14 January 2015, 17:51:54 »
To my knowledge, my group has used exactly one custom mech in a game since about 2001, and it turns out it almost exactly duplicated an existing stock mech.  I'll play with customs using mech design software at times, but feel zero need to ever use one in a game.  My friends use the software to print out record sheets, and never design customs.  We also almost always use the standard variant of a mech, and only use an uncommon variant if it is appropriate for the faction in play.  As far as we are concerned, the construction rules are only there to help with repairs, and are not even close to being a core part of the rules.

We've never done a game based on BV, and I don't think we've done it based on tonnage.  More along the line of pick two mediums and two lights thing, if any picking was to be done at all.  90% of the time the ref picked a force he knew the other player would enjoy using, and then chose something that would give a good fight to it.  The ref prints the sheets out and hands them out at the time of the game, and the players find out what they get at that time.  For each game, the player then choose one or more lances to send on a mission, and you gotta be sure to keep enough back to defend the base, because that might be one of the planned games as well.

It's probably been 12+ years since I last did a pickup game, and given a choice, it'll be at least that long before I ever do it again.  I actually quit a group because all they wanted to play was custom clan monstrosities in pickup games.  Without a campaign background and strong roleplay elements, it isn't worth my time to show up as a player.  I'll do it MegaMek just to mess around for a half hour, but not for a tabletop game.  I was the campaign designer and OpFor most of the time, and so would have a storyline set out that made me happy.  My friends have only minimal interest in that part of the game, and I'd guess they'd be happy with pickup games as a semi-regular thing.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #23 on: 14 January 2015, 21:43:27 »
Since Alpha Strike came out, I've been able to get back into Battletech.  I have a custom card for pretty much everything I field.  On the other hand, I also have at least a stock variant choice for each of those mechs, too.  Considering my chassis run the gambit from 3025 up to 3145, if someone where doing an era specific game, I'd have to pick and choose what I ran, and probably reorganize my companies.  One wonderful thing with Alpha Strike, though, is that those custom mechs really come at a hefty price.  The PV system in AS can turn a stock ~25 point mech into a >40 point mech after being customized.  Because of that fact, even my customized mechs are heavily tempered and are mostly customized to match the mini.  You might be able to field a company in AS for 300 points, out of custom mechs, but the person using stock variants could probably field a company and a half . . . which can make a huge difference if tactically played out right.

Now, way back in the day (about 20 years go), my old group had a solid role playing campaign going that went through (IIRC) 3030ish through the clan invasion.  About the time the counteroffensive was taking place to wipe out Smoke Jaguar, the group fell apart.  Anyway, in that game, the only customizing allowed was if you were using salvage and/or field refits to customize a mech.  Of course when the clans came out this equated into a bit of an arms race to get new gear for everyone to start swapping out parts for anything reasonably compatible.  However, we were also all only using single mechs with our RPG characters as the pilots, and getting that gear was, in essence, also a way of "leveling up" our mechs, so it was a bit of pride to be able to swap out the Flamers on my Firestarter with Clan Flamers and put on some extra heat sinks.

Given the choice, I have no qualms using custom mechs, nor with anyone else using them.  Someone brings a bunch of medium pulses with a targeting computer to cheese it out?  Whittle them apart with long range fire and keep them eternally at bay.  Everything has a counter in Battletech, and no matter how much customization someone does to their mechs, there's always something out there that can beat it.
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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #24 on: 14 January 2015, 22:10:03 »
We kinda just talk the days before the game to determine what we want to use.  the brackets are typically 9k or 15k per side in each game.

I looked at the hellstar and that is almost the same as my custom Marauder IIC only I have a targeting computer on that with 3 PPCs.

That's a lot of BV in one mech, either your Marauder or the Hellstar. These type of mechs put you on the upper end of the power scale imo, no matter the era. That is a high octane game style. Nothing wrong with it since everyone seems to be playing the same way. Because of the way you started, the PC and Clan+ tech for the table top. You are playing a faster and more deadly game. Playing 3025 stock mechs that several have mentioned will be a culture shock to you.lol.... Playing your custom Marauder or a "Stock" Hellstar, is 6 of one and 1/2 dozen of the other. No real difference with those load outs.

But its all BT in the end, whether it takes 5 rounds of combat or 10 to decide the game, still BT. Its just mechs. The main thing is you have lots of choices on how you want to play, the key will be to throw out some options to your group. See if they are receptive to a change of pace. As to the one TC/PLaser guy, well he will either go along with the group or not. Based on your description he won't be missed that much. He might surprise you though. The high octane game your playing might be contributing to all the custom killer builds.

You have the box set so you have some 3025 stuff. I suggest that you try a retro game.

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #25 on: 14 January 2015, 22:21:35 »
I love stock mechs. There are some great ones and some turds but they all have flavor. Tac and pulse boats... Yawn.

Sure, the stick designs overheat, that's part of learning how to ride a heat curve. Some of these mechs are bracket fighters which have weapons meant to becfired at long range, medium then short. Some examples are the Penetrator ( a personal favorite ) which has the erll's at long until you get close then the 6 mpl's up close. Another is the stalker. Something for all ranges. You just have to learn how to use them.

As far as the tc+pulses... You can still use them for the -3, just not for targeting a specific location for the -3

+1 I also prefer stock mechs, they are a lot more fun for me. That being said unless I'm playing in a tournament or a campaign which sticks to stock mechs I don't mind playing against customs.
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cold1

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #26 on: 14 January 2015, 22:30:40 »
That's a real killer.  with a BV2 of 3084

There are some clan assaults that are pricier.  Blood Asp A comes to mind


I like customs but I tend to build either custom variants on existing omni chassis or new mechs that match some canon situation.  i.e. The Adders love the Night Gyr but it's gone, what would an Night Gyr Mk II look like in 3100.  The configs are all similar or in the same vain as the original ( think Thor Mk II) but upgraded (iATMs, superchargers, ferro-lam etc)
« Last Edit: 14 January 2015, 22:36:17 by cold1 »


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jackpot4

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #27 on: 14 January 2015, 23:08:28 »
That's a lot of BV in one mech, either your Marauder or the Hellstar. These type of mechs put you on the upper end of the power scale imo, no matter the era. That is a high octane game style. Nothing wrong with it since everyone seems to be playing the same way. Because of the way you started, the PC and Clan+ tech for the table top. You are playing a faster and more deadly game. Playing 3025 stock mechs that several have mentioned will be a culture shock to you.lol.... Playing your custom Marauder or a "Stock" Hellstar, is 6 of one and 1/2 dozen of the other. No real difference with those load outs.

But its all BT in the end, whether it takes 5 rounds of combat or 10 to decide the game, still BT. Its just mechs. The main thing is you have lots of choices on how you want to play, the key will be to throw out some options to your group. See if they are receptive to a change of pace. As to the one TC/PLaser guy, well he will either go along with the group or not. Based on your description he won't be missed that much. He might surprise you though. The high octane game your playing might be contributing to all the custom killer builds.

You have the box set so you have some 3025 stuff. I suggest that you try a retro game.

O I don't have cheese builds, I just always used the Marauder back in MechWarrior 2 and I remember always having 3 PPCs so I stuck with it.  I built a couple variants of it, one has a gauss and 2 LBX10s.  Most of my mechs have a healthy combination of lasers and ballistic, although I have never really been a fan of missiles.  I hate playing cheese and hate using it.  The Marauder tends to be the long range support/ distraction, when that thing is on the board it becomes the prime target and allows me to flank my enemy a lot of times.

Like I said the player who is potentially going to use a pulse star is new so only sees the value in a -3 modifier.  For example my Battlemaster I used recently had a gauss, lbx 10, medium lasers, and srms.  I like to mix it up to where I keep somewhat near the mechs prime model, but alter it enough to have a break even heat point and max armor.  I just looked at the stock Hellbringers and they have way less armor than my own did, even with just a fusion engine and 2 LBX10s!

At this point I am curious based on the knowledge that I have the intro box mechs, if anyone has suggestions for stock variants they use fairly often.  I play as the Rasalhague Dominion, 16 of my painted mechs are IS and only 9 are Clan.  My last game I used my custom Battlemaster I listed above and a Valiant to defeat two thors, I lost a Hellbringer the second turn in to a headshot, but the two IS mechs defeated the two clan mechs.  They were only using IS and tournament legal tech too.
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Stormlion1

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #28 on: 15 January 2015, 00:13:02 »
Stock primarily to start, but as a campaign goes on they can customize. For one off games stock only.

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TigerShark

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Re: Customs vs Stock Variants
« Reply #29 on: 15 January 2015, 00:19:01 »
That's a lot of BV in one mech, either your Marauder or the Hellstar. These type of mechs put you on the upper end of the power scale imo, no matter the era. That is a high octane game style. Nothing wrong with it since everyone seems to be playing the same way. Because of the way you started, the PC and Clan+ tech for the table top. You are playing a faster and more deadly game. Playing 3025 stock mechs that several have mentioned will be a culture shock to you.lol.... Playing your custom Marauder or a "Stock" Hellstar, is 6 of one and 1/2 dozen of the other. No real difference with those load outs.

But its all BT in the end, whether it takes 5 rounds of combat or 10 to decide the game, still BT. Its just mechs. The main thing is you have lots of choices on how you want to play, the key will be to throw out some options to your group. See if they are receptive to a change of pace. As to the one TC/PLaser guy, well he will either go along with the group or not. Based on your description he won't be missed that much. He might surprise you though. The high octane game your playing might be contributing to all the custom killer builds.

You have the box set so you have some 3025 stuff. I suggest that you try a retro game.

Low end. More BV = worse unit. When you have a force of 15,000 and 5,000 is in one 'Mech, a single head cap can kill 1/3 of your army. And will. I'd just slap together a lame force full of LB-X Carriers and junk like that to play roulette with the Head. Eventually he'll black out.
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