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Author Topic: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST  (Read 136860 times)

nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #450 on: 01 September 2016, 17:23:59 »
Koshi 3 and Dasher II 4 corrected.  Thanks.
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Hussar2

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #451 on: 10 September 2016, 17:00:57 »
The Orion 1C from XTRO:Primitives vol V is missing

cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #452 on: 10 September 2016, 17:54:12 »
Several are missing. I'm still trying to finish uploading them but a sick toddler is interrupting me. I'm hoping to finish tonight and get the images in place. The Orion 1C is being trouble. I think that record is messed up somehow. That one may take a little extra time.

Edit:
Toddler with croup is asleep and the rest are entered. They should all be there except the Orion 1C. We need to see why that record is frozen.
« Last Edit: 10 September 2016, 21:57:03 by cavingjan »

Maelwys

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #453 on: 12 September 2016, 13:08:56 »
http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/7322/thug-thg-11ecx-jose

The Star League era Faction availability lists "Star League Regular," "Star League Royal," "Terran Hegemony," and "Unique."

However, according to the fluff in XTRO Gunslinger, this design was used by a mercenary in the employ of Amaris (p. 7).

The Star League factions should be removed, and replaced with whatever is appropriate. The Terran Hegemony listing should also probably be removed, since according to the MUL, the Hegemony stopped existing in 2767, and the date on the design is 2772.

Not really sure the "Amaris Empire' or whatever he was elected to is part of the MUL :)

cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #454 on: 12 September 2016, 14:42:58 »
I'll get the Thug fixed. Thanks.

There really wasn't a great way of dealing with an occupied Terran Hegemony. The only reason the TH got a faction eentry is to account for some of the militia units that the Star League didn't use like the Mackie and some other items that are planet specific and really not Star League like some of the civilian stuff.


cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #456 on: 12 September 2016, 17:34:30 »
Jose fixed.
Sartis: those have been fixed. I was hoping they would get suppressed once regular data showed up. I'll have to get them deleted en-masse since there are about 1600 TBD entries still kicking around the system and I don't want to have to delete them all by hand.

Maingunnery

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #457 on: 12 September 2016, 17:40:04 »

The primitive Archer has no intro date.

http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3721/archer-arc-1a
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cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #459 on: 12 September 2016, 19:36:34 »
Emperor 5A

TRO is erroneously listed as 3025. I don't know if it is mentioned in a TRO (I see nothing in 3058U), but it isn't TRO3025.


nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #461 on: 12 September 2016, 20:46:18 »
Emperor 5A

TRO is erroneously listed as 3025. I don't know if it is mentioned in a TRO (I see nothing in 3058U), but it isn't TRO3025.

TR3025 p120 lists "EMP Emperor" as an early mech design of same era as BNC and MCK.  That's what that MUL entry was created to reference.  But yeah, now that XTRO Primitives vol 4 has more of the story, it will be the new TR reference.
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Frabby

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #462 on: 13 September 2016, 08:54:02 »
The Cameron battlecruiser has an intro date of 2688 in the MUL and is named accordingly:
http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3890/cameron-battlecruiser-2688

Problem: TRO:3057 and TRO:2750 consistently give its intro date as 2668, twenty years earlier. TRO:3057r gives the date as 2688 in what seems to me may have been a typo.
« Last Edit: 13 September 2016, 08:59:31 by Frabby »
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ColBosch

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #463 on: 13 September 2016, 09:40:30 »
The Cameron battlecruiser has an intro date of 2688 in the MUL and is named accordingly:
http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3890/cameron-battlecruiser-2688

Problem: TRO:3057 and TRO:2750 consistently give its intro date as 2668, twenty years earlier. TRO:3057r gives the date as 2688 in what seems to me may have been a typo.

Newer sources trump old. It may be a typo, but errata is not being accepted for any of those sources at this time, and this is the wrong place to report such an error anyway.
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MrKiasu

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #464 on: 13 September 2016, 12:06:06 »
RFL-3N availability seems very limited in the star league era. It's not even available to the SLDF or TH. Is that righ:t?
« Last Edit: 13 September 2016, 12:08:20 by MrKiasu »

TigerShark

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #465 on: 13 September 2016, 21:32:51 »
How are these availability settings determined? Specific entries in a TRO or Source Book? RATs?

Also, does "availability" means it was available through whatever means? i.e.: manufacturing vs. legal sales from the SLDF or inter-House trade
« Last Edit: 13 September 2016, 21:35:22 by TigerShark »
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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #466 on: 13 September 2016, 21:40:36 »
Yes, and lots up filling in the blanks.
Available means we believe multiple regiments/clusters/etc have (or could have) multiple of that unit in its forces.  We don't care how they would have gotten there (new production, old production, absorbing star league forced, refit of other models, sold by clan merchants, doesn't matter).
Though unless a source specifically mentions large numbers available through salvage, we don't include salvage.
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Bishop Steiner

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #467 on: 14 September 2016, 01:03:28 »
This thread is for all error reports and suggestions for the MUL online database, as found at:


Homeworld Clan and Late Succession Wars data is now available.
Star League and Early Succession Wars data is now available.

In the Master Unit List, the introductory date for the CPLT-K2 variant is apparently retconned to 3033.

I find this a little disturbing, since it is a prominently noted variant, complete with record sheets in the original 1986 edition of the TRO 3025 and it's 1996 Revision. But at some point since CGL took over, it's intro has been retconned to 3033, throwing away 21 years of canon and gameplay.  So I guess what I am asking, is 3033 the official introduction date for the production model of the k2, with it existing as House Kurita's standard refit before that, or is it CGLs stance now that the TRO was just plain wrong, and no PPC Cats before 3033?  (I'd also note your own tables in House Kurita 3025 lists K2 as available)  And if so, when were they first available as a unit?

Any official ruling on that would be greatly appreciated by this long time player.
« Last Edit: 14 September 2016, 01:22:18 by Bishop Steiner »

Xotl

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #468 on: 14 September 2016, 01:32:42 »
We're going over the issue now, and we'll update here when it's been decided on.  Thanks for bringing it up.
3028-3050 Random Assignment Tables -
Also contains faction deployment & rarity info and Quirk lists.

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Hussar2

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #469 on: 14 September 2016, 05:59:40 »
First of all thank you for your great work.
It seems to me that all of the BA from TRO3058U are missing dark age availability.
is this intentional?
 

cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #470 on: 14 September 2016, 06:37:46 »
Most of 3058 is missing many eras. This is an artifact of how long it takes to compile this stuff. Only about 1/3 of the units in the MUL have faction data for the later eras.

Side note: 3058 is the current TRO of units I'm working on. I've been working on it and 3055 for a while now.

Prussian Havoc

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #471 on: 14 September 2016, 11:18:49 »
We're going over the issue now, and we'll update here when it's been decided on.  Thanks for bringing it up.

A number of us over at HBS's BATTLETECH forum are quite interested in the Introduction Date of the K2: https://community.battletechgame.com/forums/threads/3819/comments/67713

Some want a Retcon of a Retcon so as to put the Catapult K2 "in play" for HBS's 3025 BATTLETECH.

And some of support the original CGL 3033 Introduction Date of the K2, with HBS free to introduce the K2 in a future potential expansion to BATTLETECH.


We await your response, Good Sir! :)
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TigerShark

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #472 on: 14 September 2016, 11:42:15 »
Rim Worlds Republic
Field Report:2765 Periphery

Page 18: The Black Knight, Excalibur, Highlander, and King Crab are becoming "more common sights" in the Imperial Divisions.
Page 20: A full company of Atlas were purchased by Taborri Amaris for her Amaris Regulars.
Page 21: Land-Air 'Mechs are available in the Battalion size

- Atlas AS7-D
- Black Knight BL-6-KNT
- Excalibur EXC-B2
- Highlander HGN-732
- King Crab KGC-000

- Stinger LAM
- Wasp LAM
- Phoenix Hawk LAM

Liberation of Terra, Volumes I & II

Missing units from the RATs.

- Bombardier BMB-12D
- Cestus CTS-6Y
- Crab CRB-27
- Emperor EMP-6A
- Exterminator EXT-4D
- Firefly FFL-4A
- Flashman FLS-8K
- Galahad GLH-2D
- Griffin GRF-2N
- Hermes HER-1S
- Hussar HSR-200-D
- Kintaro KTO-19
- Kyudo KY2-D-02
- Lancelot LNC25-01
- Lynx LNX-9Q
- Mongoose MON-66
- Night Hawk NTK-2Q
- Panther PNT-9R
- Pillager PLG-3Z
- Rifleman RFL-2N
- Rifleman RFL-3N
- Sentinel STN-3L
- Shootist ST-8A
- Talon TLN-5V
- Whitworth WTH-1 (TRO:3039, p. 126) - A branch of the Whitworth company existed in the RWR.
- Whitworth WTH-1S (TRO:3039, p. 126) - A branch of the Whitworth company existed in the RWR.
- Wyvern WVE-5N
« Last Edit: 14 September 2016, 20:53:33 by TigerShark »
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cavingjan

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #473 on: 14 September 2016, 20:53:10 »
We typically don't use RATs as a basis for this unless other reliable information is completely lacking. We'll take a look at your list.

Only the Whitworth WTH-0 was produced in the RWR.

TigerShark

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #474 on: 14 September 2016, 21:00:59 »
"The WTH-0 design was fielded exclusively by the Amaris Dragoons and used more as a terror weapon. Only twenty-four were ever made by Whitworth’s Republic branch on some forgotten world."

Seems odd that they'd set up an entire factory for 24 units, since they were made in 2754 and in peacetime. But you guys probably have more info on it than I do.
  W W W . M E K W A R S - D O M I N I O N . C O M

  "You will fight to the last soldier, and when you die, I will call upon your damned soul to speak horrible curses at the enemy."
     - Orders of Emperor Stefan Amaris to his troops

GoldBishop

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #475 on: 14 September 2016, 23:35:02 »
I'd hate to bring up more stuff to "add to the pile" ...but the MUL is not correctly displaying the BV for Clan Battle Armor.

I believe it has to do with the "generic" CAR4 profile which is likely using the "4" troop multiplier instead of "5" from the Tech Manual p.316

Gnome [Standard] http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1216/gnome-battle-armor-standard
. Individual Trooper BV = 83  [per TRO3058_Upgrade p.51 ]
. . with x5 Multiplier = 7.0 or 581  [matches RecordSheet_3058_Unabridged_Clan p.89]
. . with x4 Multiplier = 5.2, or 431.6 BV  [close to MUL error]

Elemental [MicroPulse]: http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/962/elemental-battle-armor-micropl
. Individual Trooper BV = 69  [per TRO3058_Upgrade p.45 ]
. . with x5 Multiplier = 7.0 or 483  [closely resembles RecordSheet_3058_Unabridged_Clan p.82]
. . with x4 Multiplier = 5.2, or 358.8~ BV  [close to MUL error]

Only suggestion I have is to make "CAR5" the default card for these (and other) primarily Clan-fielded battle armor.

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Pa Weasley

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #476 on: 14 September 2016, 23:54:45 »
Just to note, the individual BVs shown in the TROs are rounded. If you're calculating the BV for a squad/point/level I you take the unrounded individual BV, apply the multiplier, then round.

As for the suggestion, it can certainly be taken under consideration but no saying if or when something can come of it.

GoldBishop

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #477 on: 15 September 2016, 00:21:13 »
Just to note, the individual BVs shown in the TROs are rounded. If you're calculating the BV for a squad/point/level I you take the unrounded individual BV, apply the multiplier, then round.

As for the suggestion, it can certainly be taken under consideration but no saying if or when something can come of it.

Agreed, which is why i checked my numbers against the multipliers in the Tech Manual (table on p.316).  While I did not manually calculate each BA, I followed the TRO entries and then multiplied by the respective multipliers.  Anything within 10 BV didn't concern me... but when the difference between the MUL and the Record Sheets  is +100?  I decided to test the "Wrong Multiplier" theory and felt inclined to share my conclusions.

I don't have any reason to believe the Record Sheets, TRO, or TechManual to be in error; the current values on the MUL for [respective] Clan-fielded BA are misleading (undervalued).  Anyone with the Record Sheets will have the right of it; anyone using the Force Builder may have issues.

**Edit** italicized for clarity
« Last Edit: 15 September 2016, 00:23:58 by GoldBishop »

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nckestrel

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #478 on: 15 September 2016, 00:36:15 »
It's a technical issue I believe.  The MUL is supposed to show BV for all three (4, 5 and 6).  It's currently showing PVs instead of  BVs on the "5 trooper squad" and "6 trooper squad" lines, and those are supposed to be BV.
Master Unit List - List of all canon units, faction availabilities, Alpha Strike unit cards, Battle Values
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Weirdo

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Re: Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread II - READ THE FIRST POST
« Reply #479 on: 16 September 2016, 14:30:52 »
Methinks the card for the Leviathan JumpShip needs some work... :)
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