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Author Topic: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold  (Read 93115 times)

Ramseti

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TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« on: 23 July 2017, 13:02:16 »
So, can we finally have an "HG is at it again!" meltdown without people telling us we're being paranoid?  Cause, not for nothing, between this TRO not having these units, and IWM's Wasp debacle and scrubbing the Valk from the coming soon list, it really, really looks like HG is at it again.

Soooo, there's this:  https://dockets.justia.com/docket/washington/wawdce/2:2017cv00327/242820

Yup :( 

ColBosch

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #1 on: 23 July 2017, 13:13:19 »
Soooo, there's this:  https://dockets.justia.com/docket/washington/wawdce/2:2017cv00327/242820

Yup :(

******. Well, there we are, folks. Good find, Ramseti.
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Adrian Gideon

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #2 on: 23 July 2017, 13:17:34 »
And, "I'm not at liberty to discuss any ongoing legal matters at this time."
Next.
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Charbok

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #3 on: 23 July 2017, 13:26:02 »
It's just a fountain of profanity here.

So much hate for patent trolls.

Sorry you guys have to deal with these parasites.

Daryk

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #4 on: 23 July 2017, 13:35:23 »
Looking at the filing, I'm not sure CGL or Topps are part of a case, but it's still probably best to keep their heads down.

ColBosch

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #5 on: 23 July 2017, 13:38:34 »
I've forwarded the information to a particular copyright attorney for review and commentary. If or when he decides to give his views, I'll post a link. Until then, let's remember the forum rules and just focus on the product at hand.
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Ramseti

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #6 on: 23 July 2017, 13:46:30 »
And, "I'm not at liberty to discuss any ongoing legal matters at this time."
Next.

I think it's good that it's finally a known issue, to get rid of all the random conjecture.  I also don't think anyone here is going to try to go down that road (wrt to pesting you), or at least I hope not.  By now I'm pretty sure we're all in the same boat of understanding what "you" are up against and simply wish <everyone not HG> the best.  Ugh, I friggin' hate HG so much.

Sharpnel

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #7 on: 23 July 2017, 13:46:47 »
Soooo, there's this:  https://dockets.justia.com/docket/washington/wawdce/2:2017cv00327/242820

Yup :(
Well, ****** them and the horse they rode in on. Those ****** sucking, shit eating,  thrice damned bastards.
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Frabby

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #8 on: 23 July 2017, 13:48:34 »
 Oooh - Harmony Gold is at it again. Now that's exciting. I mean... we're some 25 years down the line from the last showdown. It'll be interesting to see if HG still has a legal leg to stand on, if they ever had. [watch]
« Last Edit: 23 July 2017, 13:50:42 by Frabby »
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Pat Payne

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #9 on: 23 July 2017, 13:50:42 »
I think it's good that it's finally a known issue, to get rid of all the random conjecture.  I also don't think anyone here is going to try to go down that road (wrt to pesting you), or at least I hope not.  By now I'm pretty sure we're all in the same boat of understanding what "you" are up against and simply wish <everyone not HG> the best.  Ugh, I friggin' hate HG so much.

This. All I for one wanted was for the penny to drop. Now that we know, all the yammer will hopefully subside (other than the rightful curses upon That Real-Estate-Company-That-Shall-Not-Be-Named and their travesty upon a classic Japanese anime franchise). And all the legal inside baseball is emphatically NOT our business. But like I said, now that we actually KNOW why Speck had to pull the Wasp and why some of the Classics are Unseen again, we can deal with it.

Well, ****** them and the horse they rode in on. Those ****** sucking, shit eating,  thrice damned bastards.

Since I gave up that language, I'll let Sharpnel speak for me. These creeps are why I had to shell out over $100 for a copy of "Do You Remember Love" from Japan (all hail Blu-Ray and the more sensible region codes!) because they won't stop their silly little spitting match with the show's creators, Big West and Studio Nue. Now they want to trample over the Classics again? (Insert Sharpnel's response here  >:( )
« Last Edit: 23 July 2017, 13:59:52 by Pat Payne »

Charbok

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #10 on: 23 July 2017, 13:54:40 »
I needed a pick me up, so I went and re-watched the opening scene from the Game Of Thrones premiere.  HG reminds me of the Freys, for some reason.

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #11 on: 23 July 2017, 14:07:36 »
I may have to go shopping on steam for some of the other works of Harebrained Schemes and Piranha Games. I suddenly feel compelled to give them money.
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Sartris

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #12 on: 23 July 2017, 14:29:03 »
Soooo, there's this:  https://dockets.justia.com/docket/washington/wawdce/2:2017cv00327/242820

Yup :(

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« Last Edit: 23 July 2017, 14:35:34 by Sartris »

William J. Pennington

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #13 on: 23 July 2017, 14:31:31 »
Well, ****** them and the horse they rode in on. Those ****** sucking, shit eating,  thrice damned bastards.

You may have unfairly insulted other "shit eating thrice damned bastards". No one deserves to be associated in a sentence with that company.

Wrangler

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #14 on: 23 July 2017, 14:38:04 »
HG..KILLING childhood hobbies and memories one court case at a time.
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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #15 on: 23 July 2017, 15:16:09 »
"I'm not at liberty to discuss any ongoing legal matters at this time."
Last time I heard that was SEC media days.   >:D


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Valkerie

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Re: Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #16 on: 23 July 2017, 15:29:33 »
It was a sad day when those Mordor born hellspawn wrecked the Battletech world the first time.  Robotech is dead here, so they try to sack Battletech out of spite and money??  Again!!??  I said it once before, but bears repeating.  May the fleas of thousand camels descend upon them and their legal team.  Oh, and all the ticks too... }:) 


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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #17 on: 23 July 2017, 16:21:03 »
Perhaps the mods could rename this thread to make it a little more clear as to its actual topic?

Maingunnery

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #18 on: 23 July 2017, 16:24:06 »
I like to see HG crushed in the courts, and forced to pay all expenses and lost profits.
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ActionButler

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #19 on: 23 July 2017, 16:29:51 »
Perhaps the mods could rename this thread to make it a little more clear as to its actual topic?

Splendid idea
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Empyrus

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #20 on: 23 July 2017, 16:39:05 »
I noticed the filing yesterday while pondering about the missing classics, posted about it on another place but didn't bring it up here except for one PM to another member, wasn't sure if talking about this would be appreciated mods and admins. Evidently the discussion is accepted to an extent now.

So, my thoughts on the case and related stuff. I'm not a lawyer nor an expert, this is all guessing and speculation based on common sense and some googling.

The case, a copyright infringement, names Harebrained Schemes and Piranha Games as plaintiffs, along with "DOES 1-10". It seems the term indicates other defendants may be named later or are not identified for now for some reason; not sure how the US law works. Speculation: Other potential parties include Catalyst Game Labs (obviously), possibly Iron Wind Metals, and perhaps Topps and Microsoft as they own BattleTech in its normal and electronic forms, respectively.
The probable cause are the Warhammer, Rifleman, Archer and Marauder in MechWarrior Online and BattleTech video game. An earlier build of BattleTech featured the Marauder but it is missing from the beta and even the game files, which do include stuff that is not available in the beta itself. Probably removed due to case until it is solved one way or another.

My take for missing classics is that CGL and IWM are taking precautions, whether or not they're involved in the case. No Macross-based 'Mechs in new products, no miniatures on sale for now. Better safe than sorry for now.

Should HG lose the case (even if CGL is not involved), it might be safe for Macross-based 'Mechs to appear again in BattleTech, though their artwork could be a separate matter due to medium. Go figure how lawyers think. Should HG win the case, i bet we'll won't see the Macross-based classics until they get artwork that is completely different beyond any doubt (consider the Reseen, that apparently didn't cause any legal issues).
Evidently non-Macross-based 'Mechs are deemed safe to use for now.

CGL's staff being silent on the matter doesn't mean they're involved, it makes sense not to comment on legal matters of other companies. Never know how comments would be taken by judges, lawyers, attorneys and whoever else.


I can't say i like the situation but i wouldn't waste my time panicking or even hating HG (even if the deserve it). Doesn't change anything, and only causes stress (or, well maybe cursing them is cathartic but don't dwell on it). BattleTech will probably continue regardless, and we've been so long without the classics i don't think there should be problems living without them, even if it is annoying.

Liam's Ghost

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #21 on: 23 July 2017, 16:41:44 »
I like to see HG crushed in the courts, and forced to pay all expenses and lost profits.

They got thumped in 2013 when they tried to sue Hasbro over the color of a GI- Joe toy, so we can at least take comfort in knowing that they don't go into these things with a clear head and a cunning legal mind.



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« Last Edit: 23 July 2017, 17:00:03 by Liam's Ghost »
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

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Easy

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #22 on: 23 July 2017, 16:44:55 »
I keep saying the Cronus is a better Wolverine, anyways.

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« Last Edit: 23 July 2017, 16:48:43 by Easy »

Sartris

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #23 on: 23 July 2017, 16:49:18 »
I keep saying the Cronus is a better Wolverine, anyways.



The Wolverine, however, is not involved in this latest act of legal sabotage. Same with the Locust, Ostscout, Griffin, and Battlemaster

Robroy

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #24 on: 23 July 2017, 16:50:15 »
I like to see HG crushed in the courts, and forced to pay all expenses and lost profits.

I would like to see that also. Maybe start by arguing that HG doesn't have standing as the Japanese companies are the ones that own the images, and then show artist were hired to create original designs.

But that requires the American courts to make sense. Form what I have seen, that can be hit or miss.

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Luciora

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #25 on: 23 July 2017, 16:50:31 »
 And I wanted to throw more money at them too just for Tactics.  This is the quandary of a sci-fi robot drama fan.  :(

Daryk

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Re: TRO: Succession Wars (yes, you can buy it now)
« Reply #26 on: 23 July 2017, 16:50:41 »

monbvol

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #27 on: 23 July 2017, 16:58:30 »
The interesting thing is because Microsoft does still actually own the electronic rights they could easily get drawn into this mess but as I understand it they haven't actually been drawn in yet.

It seems rather unlikely for things to go well for Harmony Gold if Microsoft does get drawn in.

Logically CGL and Topps shouldn't get drawn in at all.  If they do, again from a layman's perspective, logically they should be fine and I concur that their caution and silence on the matter are in of themselves not cause for concern.

If logic fails or things go really screwy I'm sure we'll find out soon enough.

lrose

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #28 on: 23 July 2017, 16:58:47 »
For any one interested you can find the actual filing here:
https://www.plainsite.org/dockets/34e3xggza/washington-western-district-court//

Apparently HG is pissed because they think the Atlas is a "derivative copy" of the Armored Veritech (i.e. Crusader), the reseen Locust is a copy of the Officer's Pod (aka Marauder) and the reseen Shadow Hawk is a copy of the Destroid Spartan (aka Archer). 

Basically it looks like Harmony Gold said - "they have giant robots, they must be copies, we're going to sue."


abou

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Re: TRO Succession Wars and Harmony Gold
« Reply #29 on: 23 July 2017, 17:00:17 »
Too bad there aren't any laws against squatting on a property, which is basically what HG has been doing. That Topps and Microsoft could be involved, my fingers crossed for a good outcome on our end. Considering that CGL, HBS, and Piranha had to go through those respective holders to even touch the likes of the Phoenix Hawk, Marauder, et al I imagine that this possibility was discussed at length and various lawyers felt it safe enough to continue.