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Author Topic: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight  (Read 483 times)

Achtung Minen!

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Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« on: 24 April 2018, 11:50:01 »
I want to just make sure that I have this right: the rules in Total Warfare (page 100) for intervening terrain and line of sight are just abstractions to make the game easier to play, right?

Because if they are simulations of line of sight, it doesn't really bear out... for instance, consider the case where 'Mech A is on top of a broad plateau, 6 hexes away from the edge, and 'Mech B could be in the canyon below, two hexes from the wall of the plateau and 6 levels down.

According to the rules, the two 'Mechs have line of sight, since 'Mech A is the same level as the intervening terrain (that is, the flat surface of the plateau) and 'Mech B is not adjacent to the plateau (but rather is 2 hexes over). In the real world, the edge of the plateau would create a huge deadzone blocking 'Mech A's line of sight down into the canyon until he came very close to the edge of the plateau.

So just so I am certain—this is how the rules are meant to work, and this is just to make things easier so you don't have to break out your rusty 8th grade geometry textbook, right?

Edit: Added pic to show the example (although the 'Mech B is only 3 levels down, to make the image smaller):

« Last Edit: 24 April 2018, 12:12:06 by Achtung Minen! »

Weirdo

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #1 on: 24 April 2018, 11:54:11 »
You are exactly correct. :)

If you'd like, TacOps has rules for more detailed determination of LOS.
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Achtung Minen!

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #2 on: 24 April 2018, 13:11:38 »
You are exactly correct. :)

If you'd like, TacOps has rules for more detailed determination of LOS.

Ah ok, thanks, never spotted those rules before.

If I am looking for something more simple, would this work?

**SNIP**
« Last Edit: 24 April 2018, 13:39:42 by Achtung Minen! »

Weirdo

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #3 on: 24 April 2018, 13:17:39 »
Fan Rules have their own dedicated subforum, so they can be safely isolated from the rest of the forum.
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"It's just that the Hegemony had one answer to every naval problem. 'I kills it with my battleships.'" - Liam's Ghost
"...finally, giant space panties don't seem so strange." - Whistler
"The BT universe is startlingly deficient in both wisdom and hindsight." - Cray
"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
There's no shame in designing customs, so long as you keep them private and wash your hands afterwards.

Daryk

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #4 on: 24 April 2018, 13:28:20 »
Before this thread gets moved down to the fan rule section where it belongs, I think it's worth mentioning that your diagram misconstrues the ratio between level height and hex width.

Achtung Minen!

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #5 on: 24 April 2018, 13:39:16 »
Fan Rules have their own dedicated subforum, so they can be safely isolated from the rest of the forum.

Roger, I'll keep the house rules out of it. My real interest is how the rules as written work.

Before this thread gets moved down to the fan rule section where it belongs, I think it's worth mentioning that your diagram misconstrues the ratio between level height and hex width.

EDIT: Ah ok, now I see that. A hex is 30 meters across and a level is 6 meters tall.
« Last Edit: 24 April 2018, 13:45:12 by Achtung Minen! »

Daryk

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #6 on: 24 April 2018, 13:44:48 »
Hexes are 30 meters across, while levels are only 6 meters tall.  Total Warfare, page 31 has that.

Achtung Minen!

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #7 on: 24 April 2018, 14:36:30 »
Hexes are 30 meters across, while levels are only 6 meters tall.  Total Warfare, page 31 has that.

Perfect, thanks!

RoundTop

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #8 on: 24 April 2018, 14:39:31 »
So I did something cruel and unusual... I used excel to re-make this diagram. Cells in excel are by default a ratio of 1:4.   6:30 is the battletech ratio, which is 1:5.  relatively close.

It shows that the line of sight still isn't going to work, but it is a lot closer. Diagramming line of sight rules (TacOps) likely would agree.  TacOps, p.79.


1.From this, Hex X = 3 levels. (A=3)
2.X from the higher unit (B=1)
3. (B-A)*2 = 1-3=-2*2=-4.
4. Range 2 from lower, range 5 from upper. minus upper from lower = 3, add to (3), -1
Any number below 0 is LOS blocked.

Yup, the lower unit would need to be 3 hexes away to not be in dead zone.
« Last Edit: 24 April 2018, 14:47:45 by RoundTop »
No-Dachi has a counter-argument. Nothing further? Ok.
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Daryk

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Re: Intervening Terrain and Line of Sight
« Reply #9 on: 24 April 2018, 14:40:06 »
Perfect, thanks!
You're very welcome!

 

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