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Author Topic: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race  (Read 43799 times)

Maingunnery

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #600 on: 07 August 2018, 20:02:58 »

Edited out of existence.

« Last Edit: 08 August 2018, 13:33:21 by Maingunnery »
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Lagrange

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #601 on: 07 August 2018, 20:22:47 »
I believe there is a maximum of 1 ton of armor/12 tons of structure on a space station.

Maingunnery

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #602 on: 07 August 2018, 20:30:01 »
I believe there is a maximum of 1 ton of armor/12 tons of structure on a space station.
Drat, I might have to fully retire HMA.
I will have to redesign the station design.
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Lagrange

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #603 on: 07 August 2018, 20:52:17 »
Oops, I was wrong---it's 1 ton of armor / 3 tons of structure so a 2.25M ton station could pack that much armor.

Jester Motley

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #604 on: 08 August 2018, 01:36:48 »
CC Turn 5:
tl;dr: Yard upgrades


Budget: $92,000M
Surplus: $0,000M
Total Turn 4 budget: $92,000M
Spent: $91,710M Surplus: $290M
---
Total Maintenance: $26,610M
Fighters @150%* (change from last turn)
Small Craft @120%* (change from last turn)
Light Dropships @120%* (change from last turn)
Jumpships @120%* (change from last turn)

All others @100%  (No change)

Research: $100M
---Building:
Yard upgrades:
New yard: 1
Lv1 to Lv2: 2
Lv3 to Lv4: 1


Losses:
None.  Surprisingly so.  YAY!

End of Turn 4 totals:
Chongzhi: 27
Qinru Zhe: 5
Quzhujian: 4
BoBeer: 1
Wrath: 9
BoShots: 11
-
Fighters: 4119 (Fleet: 3518, 601 Local/Ground based/Training)
Small Craft: 1267 (Fleet: 1126, 141 Local/Ground based/Training)*  (Doctrine will be reducing the # military SC at recharge stations, and allowing Commercial services to utilizes the bays)
Light DS: 87
Jump Ships: 3
-
Yards-
Capella: 1x 1, 1x 2, 1x4
Sarna:   2x 2
Aldebaran: 1x 1, 1x 2
Total:
Level 1: 2
Level 2: 4
Level 3: 0
Level 4: 1


Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #605 on: 08 August 2018, 01:48:41 »
 Yeah, the Taurian design from turn 3 is about as heavily armoured as a small station can be. Armour gets less efficient at 150 ktons, and again at 250 ktons, so you're hard pressed to get any more on without going huge.

It's for reasons like this that I've specified that the Google Docs spreadsheet is the official tool to be used. I know others have been used, but in case of conflict it wins - we can all use it easily(I've never sprung for Heavy Metal, and I suspect I'm not alone in that) and get the same numbers, and aside from that early issue with station costs the numbers seem good. And I've got the ability to fix any bugs we do spot.

Also, Jester, is there a particular reason you're going to 120% on JumpShips? That's a bit unexpected. And you didn't actually say what ships you were building.

(Also, off topic, I'm going full naval geek this week. Just saw HMS Belfast yesterday, and I'm going to see Victory and Warrior today. :D )
« Last Edit: 08 August 2018, 01:52:06 by Alsadius »

marcussmythe

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #606 on: 08 August 2018, 09:53:27 »
Yeah, the Taurian design from turn 3 is about as heavily armoured as a small station can be. Armour gets less efficient at 150 ktons, and again at 250 ktons, so you're hard pressed to get any more on without going huge.

It's for reasons like this that I've specified that the Google Docs spreadsheet is the official tool to be used. I know others have been used, but in case of conflict it wins - we can all use it easily(I've never sprung for Heavy Metal, and I suspect I'm not alone in that) and get the same numbers, and aside from that early issue with station costs the numbers seem good. And I've got the ability to fix any bugs we do spot.

Also, Jester, is there a particular reason you're going to 120% on JumpShips? That's a bit unexpected. And you didn't actually say what ships you were building.

(Also, off topic, I'm going full naval geek this week. Just saw HMS Belfast yesterday, and I'm going to see Victory and Warrior today. :D )

Interestingly, though armor gets less efficient, there seem to be other economies of scale in large stations.  Im in internal debate on the 'right' size for Defense Stations - big bruisers that are hard to kill?  Target saturation just tough enough to bounce fighter attacks, but wasteful to engage with Capital Weaponry?  The mind wonders...

Also, RE:  Victory.  I've been waiting for a chance to have a commander signal "The Commonwealth Expects Every Man to Do his Duty" and "Engage the Enemy More Closely".  *shakes fist*


Jester Motley

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #607 on: 08 August 2018, 12:02:38 »
Also, Jester, is there a particular reason you're going to 120% on JumpShips? That's a bit unexpected. And you didn't actually say what ships you were building.

(Also, off topic, I'm going full naval geek this week. Just saw HMS Belfast yesterday, and I'm going to see Victory and Warrior today. :D )

No new ship or craft construction this turn, its all investment in yards.

With the ongoing discussions within the Navy about the Terran investment worlds, the absolutely stark reality that the Capellan Navy lacked sufficient Naval infrastructure and budget to come within a spitting mile of even the next poorest nation, much less our warmongering neighbors.  Analysis estimates that for every Capellan dollar spent, the other star nations have spent 1.5 to 2 in either hard currency or in infrastructure investments.   

The Capellan navy has achieved its primary goal of a fleet large enough to defend its borders (Estimated 80% tonnage parity).  The Admirals believe this has helped the last 10 years be relatively peaceful if cold-war.  Given this belief, and coupled with the above considerations, it was decided that the Capellan Navy must invest heavily in infrastructure.  Several 5 year plans were drafted, and considered.  The one found most suitable was to increase training and refit/repair budgets to ensure our existing fleets will continue to function at peak efficiency, while spending the lion's share of the budget on shipyard expansion. 
 
CC Naval doctrine is moving to a 120% norm across the board for all non-warship maintenance to use for additional training and repair/refit.  (Thus jumpships included)  Warships will remain at 100% at this point, because budget and they've been largely on a defensive posture at home.  As the primary weapon of our current fleet and system-defenses, Fighter training and maintenance remains higher than the fleet norm, but has been reduced from the previous hot-conflict spending amounts.
--
Enjoy the boat tours!  I'm envious.

Maingunnery

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #608 on: 08 August 2018, 14:08:31 »

Scrapping the space station idea for now, I have been reworking it in google docs, but I need some tech to make it work and I despise google docs.
So as a stop gap more planetary ASFs and Small Craft (Refueling, Point Defense, etc).


FWL turn 5: 2390

[Admiralty]
High Command has ordered an increased spending into infrastructure development. This combined with other recent developments have caused a rethink of how to secure our borders. We are strategically stationing independent ASF Wings on our border worlds to make any invasion very costly to the enemy. These independent commands will be outfitted with their own Small Craft and concealed airfields.


Code: [Select]
Turn 2390

Available Shipyards
Atreus (3-4*)
Irian (3-1)
Loyalty (3-2*)

Starting Assets Qty Total
Fighters 3520 17.600
Small Craft 288 2.880
Dropships 56 16.800
Jumpships 12 6.000
Phalanx (4631) 4 18.524
Heracles (8874) 22 195.228
Eros Station 8 4.760

(All Costs in Millions)
Banked 2.564
Budget 107.000

Maintenance % 10
Maintenance Costs 26.179
Prototype Costs 0
Shipyard Upgrades* 2 65.000
Research 0
Repairs 0

Construction
Fighters 2400 12.000
Small Craft 400 4.000

Total Spent 107.179
Remaining 2.384

 
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Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #609 on: 08 August 2018, 17:13:48 »
You show $65B of shipyard upgrades - which ones are those? It looks like Atreus 3-4 (40B) and Loyalty 1-2 (10B) which leaves another 15B unaccounted for.

Also, I got to see an extra bonus ship - HMS Queen Elizabeth was in dock too. Didn't get to go anywhere near as close, obviously, but it's interesting having the oldest ship in the world and the newest capital ship in the world both be within your field of view at the same time.

Maingunnery

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #610 on: 08 August 2018, 17:57:43 »
You show $65B of shipyard upgrades - which ones are those? It looks like Atreus 3-4 (40B) and Loyalty 1-2 (10B) which leaves another 15B unaccounted for.
Atreus (4->5) 50B
Loyalty (2->3) 15B
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marcussmythe

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #611 on: 08 August 2018, 20:26:21 »
Lyran Commonwealth, Turn V:  2390-2399

Code: [Select]
Lyran Commonwealth, Turn Beginning 2390
Assets:
Starting Shipyards: Alarion: 3/3  New Kyoto: 3/1  Tamar 1  Gibbs 1
Starting Warships:  Heimdaller II FF x 9 45.567
Tyr CA x 9 66.45
Walkure CV x 9 62.523
Starting Stations: Ribe Recharge Station x120 21
Starting Jumpships:  30 15
Starting Dropships:  0
Starting Small Craft: 600 6
Starting Fighters: 11K 55
Maintenance Value 271.54 (27.15)
Cash: 1.904


Expenses:
Income Plus Cash: 100.904
Maintenance: 32.486
(100% General, 120% Warships, 150% Naval Fighters)
Alarion 3->4 40
Alarion 3->4 20
Total: 92.486
Remainder 8.418


Lyran Commonwealth, Turn Ending 2399
Physical Assets:
Ending Shipyards: Alarion: 4/4  New Kyoto: 3/1  Tamar 1  Gibbs 1
Ending Warships:  Heimdaller II FF x 9 45.567
Tyr CA x 9 66.45
Walkure CV x 9 62.523
Ending Stations:         Ribe Recharge Station x120 21
Ending Jumpships:  30 15
Ending Dropships:  0
Ending Small Craft: 600 6
Ending Fighters: 11K 55
Maintenance Value 271.54 (27.15)
Cash: 8.418

Boring turn is boring.  Possible fluff or tactics/doctrine updates, but don't feel a need to hold things on them.
« Last Edit: 08 August 2018, 20:28:23 by marcussmythe »

Kiviar

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #612 on: 08 August 2018, 22:05:56 »
I see we've started a yard race. Welp, guess I didn't need ships this turn.

Now I just need to decide how hard I want to Scipio Africanus the greatest space commander in history when I write the fluff.
« Last Edit: 08 August 2018, 22:09:49 by Kiviar »

marcussmythe

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #613 on: 09 August 2018, 10:07:31 »
I see we've started a yard race. Welp, guess I didn't need ships this turn.

Now I just need to decide how hard I want to Scipio Africanus the greatest space commander in history when I write the fluff.

‘Weve Started’, Mr. “Ive been bulding class 4s for a long time now?”  :D

Kiviar

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #614 on: 09 August 2018, 11:59:34 »
Yeah, but everyone knows that anything the Federated Suns does is specifically for the betterment of mankind.

Just think of how much liberty, dignity, and freedom, a 1.25mt Crucis-II could bring all the huddled masses!
« Last Edit: 09 August 2018, 12:01:35 by Kiviar »

marcussmythe

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #615 on: 09 August 2018, 12:06:13 »
Yeah, but everyone knows that anything the Federated Suns does is specifically for the betterment of mankind.

Just think of how much liberty, dignity, and freedom, a 1.25mt Crucis-II could bring all the huddled masses!

You should totally start naming warship classes that way.

"Democracy" class Orbital Bombardment Monitor
"Freedom" Class Invasion Assault Transport
"Integrity" Class Fast Commerce Raider
"Dignity" Class Prisoner Transport/Reeducation Center

DOC_Agren

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #616 on: 09 August 2018, 19:55:35 »
You should totally start naming warship classes that way.

"Democracy" class Orbital Bombardment Monitor
"Freedom" Class Invasion Assault Transport
"Integrity" Class Fast Commerce Raider
"Dignity" Class Prisoner Transport/Reeducation Center
Let me correct you -
"Llberty" class Orbital Bombardment Monitor
and
"Democracy" class Armed Support Ship
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast, And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill, And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"

Jester Motley

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #617 on: 10 August 2018, 00:51:39 »
Let me correct you -
"Llberty" class Orbital Bombardment Monitor
and
"Democracy" class Armed Support Ship

The Capellan Navy has coded these ships as:

"Liberty" class Ortillary Ship, Extended Range
And
"Democracy" class Armed Merchant Navy Ship

That DAMN ship is reloading the LOSER in orbit.

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #618 on: 10 August 2018, 13:40:23 »
Interestingly, though armor gets less efficient, there seem to be other economies of scale in large stations.  Im in internal debate on the 'right' size for Defense Stations - big bruisers that are hard to kill?  Target saturation just tough enough to bounce fighter attacks, but wasteful to engage with Capital Weaponry? The mind wonders...

Also, RE:  Victory.  I've been waiting for a chance to have a commander signal "The Commonwealth Expects Every Man to Do his Duty" and "Engage the Enemy More Closely".  *shakes fist*

I just noticed this, but you made a mistake in how you expressed yourself there. If you're going to be a naval history geek, the correct phrasing is obviously "The world wonders".  8)

DOC_Agren

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #619 on: 10 August 2018, 23:13:36 »
The Capellan Navy has coded these ships as:

"Liberty" class Ortillary Ship, Extended Range
And
"Democracy" class Armed Merchant Navy Ship

That DAMN ship is reloading the LOSER in orbit.
;D ;D ;D  now I will go back lurker mode
"For the Angel of Death spread his wings on the blast, And breathed in the face of the foe as he passed:And the eyes of the sleepers waxed deadly and chill, And their hearts but once heaved, and for ever grew still!"

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #620 on: 12 August 2018, 09:45:45 »
I'm back from my trip, so let's start working through the backlog. Here's the first one - this is the major butterfly I referenced above.

---

For almost a century, it had been accepted wisdom in the Terran Hegemony that their navy was incomparably superior to any possible opponent, but that confident self-assurance ended with the Battle of Kentartes.

Most of the THN's brass defended the performance of their fleet using assorted technical arguments - the primary issue according to the fleet was that the units had been chosen poorly and that the major issue was a severe shortage of support craft. Intelligence sources also suggested that the Davion fleet had taken serious damage to several ships in the fight, which would make the damage ratio vastly less lopsided than it appeared, and the THN argued that this vindicated Terran doctrine somewhat.

At the meeting where CNO Young was explaining this to Brian Cameron, an exchange took place that rapidly became legendary among those few who were privy to it.

"So, Admiral Young, let me see if I understand this. The primary problem at Kentares was that we didn't bring enough support units to the fight to implement our standard anti-missile doctrine, and therefore we were left unable to defend ourselves properly. Correct?"

"That's pretty much it my lord, yes."

"Why?"

"I'm sorry?"

"Why did we send a fleet into a potential combat situation which was unable to properly defend itself against an enemy attack?"

"Our best support craft carriers are substantially slower than the Federated Suns ships - they'd be unable to bring the enemy to a fight on their own. They're designed to bring the heaviest possible force to bear against fixed targets, not to fight battles of maneuver."

"The mission of this fleet was to escort a convoy to Kentares IV. Was Kentares going to run away on you?"

"We didn't want to escalate the situation too strongly by sending Second Fleet. It was expected that it'd be capable of dealing with anything the Davions could put up against it, and the Black Lions and Dreadnoughts have the best on-board anti-missile defences in the whole fleet."

"So instead of escalating the situation, you got two thousand men and women under your command killed and cost the Hegemony sixty billion dollars by sending a fleet too big to ignore and too small to actually win. Is that about the size of it?"

"Our ships simply weren't designed for this sort of fighting, my lord! The way those outworld scum use their fighter forces is something we never expected to face. When McKenna built this fleet he built it around guns, and we're still the best gun fleet by far."

"James McKenna built it that way because that was what the tech of the day allowed for. Because McKenna wasn't an idiot, and he wanted to win battles. Guns were how a fleet won battles a century ago. How does a fleet win battles today, Admiral Young?"

"Guns still win battles! Look at Tikonov or Irian - both of them were won by weight of metal, not these fighter swarms."

"And what about Rasalhague, or Lurgatan?"

"Those are different! They-"

"Oh, shut up. You thought that guns were the only thing that mattered, and you seem to have sold my mother and my brother on that doctrine. I am not sold, Admiral. You didn't have any issues finding the budget to get those expensive toy "PPCs" of yours onto a station as soon as you could get them out of the lab, but your naval doctrine seems to be decades out of date. And I am sick and ****** tired of your excuses. I'm not saying that you need to scrap the whole fleet and start fresh, but the THN had better start building ships that can deal with "these fighter swarms" a whole hell of a lot better than you did this time. Do we understand each other?"

"I...yes, my lord. We do."

"Good. Now get the hell out of my sight. I'll let you know within a week or so if you still have a job."

---

After substantial study work, including in-depth calculations on the merits of refitting more anti-missile defenses on existing designs, a new design was eventually finalized by the THN. Dubbed the Vincent, it was intended to act as an escort for larger fleets, by offering substantial fighter support, two DropShip collars, and more anti-missile defence than three Dreadnoughts. The main guns are weak, and the cargo bay is extremely small for a Terran ship, but these were deemed acceptable trade-offs for a ship designed to only ever operate in company with a larger fleet. A better sensor system than the THN standard was also equipped - not as advanced as the system on the Bonaventure, but enough to offer improved vision to the fleet without need for poorly-defended dedicated scout ships.

Vincents will be attached to all fleets, regardless of the fleet's maneuverability, in the same fashion as Bonaventures. Significant production resources are being diverted to the Vincent class this turn, in order to build up the fleet's escort strength rapidly. All other ship designs are being produced more slowly as a result, and the Essex and Vigilant classes will be entirely removed from active production due to their poor armour and difficulties finding a coherent role for them to play in the fleet.

Code: [Select]
Class/Model/Name: Vincent
Tech: Inner Sphere
Ship Cost: $6,378,914,004.00
Magazine Cost: $221,760.00
BV2: 19,822

Mass: 250,000
K-F Drive System: None
Power Plant: Station-Keeping Drive
Safe Thrust: 4
Maximum Thrust: 6
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
224 AC 2
16 Naval Laser 55

Class/Model/Name: Vincent
Mass: 250,000

Equipment: Mass
Drive: 60,000
Thrust
Safe: 4
Maximum: 6
Controls: 625
K-F Hyperdrive: None (0 Integrity) 0
Jump Sail: (4 Integrity) 43
Structural Integrity: 65 16,250
Total Heat Sinks: 1550 Single 1,159
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 5000 points 2,040
Fire Control Computers: 192
Armor: 172 pts Standard 325
Fore: 30
Fore-Left/Right: 30/30
Aft-Left/Right: 30/30
Aft: 22

Dropship Capacity: 2 2,000
Grav Decks:
Small: 0
Medium: 2 200
Large: 2 1,000
Escape Pods: 28 196
Life Boats: 28 196

Crew And Passengers:
26 Officers in 1st Class Quarters 260
69 Crew in 2nd Class Quarters 483
60 Gunners and Others in 2nd Class Quarters 420
174 Bay Personnel in 2nd Class Quarters 1,218

# Weapons Loc Heat Damage Range Mass
40 AC 2 Nose 40 80 (8-C) Long 240
40 AC 2 RBS 40 80 (8-C) Long 240
40 AC 2 Aft 40 80 (8-C) Long 240
40 AC 2 LBS 40 80 (8-C) Long 240
16 AC 2 FR 16 32 (3.2-C) Long 96
16 AC 2 FL 16 32 (3.2-C) Long 96
16 AC 2 AR 16 32 (3.2-C) Long 96
16 AC 2 AL 16 32 (3.2-C) Long 96
4 Naval Laser 55 FR 340 220 (22-C) Extreme-C 4,400
4 Naval Laser 55 FL 340 220 (22-C) Extreme-C 4,400
4 Naval Laser 55 AR 340 220 (22-C) Extreme-C 4,400
4 Naval Laser 55 AL 340 220 (22-C) Extreme-C 4,400

Ammo Rounds Mass
AC 2 Ammo 10080 224.00

Equipment and Bays
NCSS Small

Bay 1: 20,000 tons cargo (1 door, Nose)
Bay 2: 3 small craft and 36 fighter (5 doors, LBS)
Bay 3: 3 small craft and 36 fighter (5 doors, RBS)

---

BUDGET: $775B
Maintenance(@100%): $235.949B
Repairs: $4B
Shipyard Upgrades(Terra 6>7): $70B
Vincent R&D: $6.379B

30x Vincent: $191.37B
2x Monsoon: $29.112B
2x Aegis: $21.376B
6x Quixote: $70.596B
2x Lola: $13.264B
2x Cruiser: $15.046B
4x Bonaventure: $20.144B
4x Black Lion: $28.172B

120x DropShip: $36B
600x small craft: $6B
4818x Fighter: $24.09B

Research: $3.502B
« Last Edit: 13 August 2018, 07:48:27 by Alsadius »

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #621 on: 12 August 2018, 17:46:15 »
The United Hindu Collective feels that its current fixed defences are sufficient for the time being. Instead, it has decided to continue its facilities expansion in Panpour to allow the construction of more Maal-class heavy freighters.

BUDGET: $24B
Maintenance (@150%): $8.231B
Shipyard (Panpour 2>3): $15B
Research: $769m

---

EDIT: Removed due to a human player taking over the Taurian Concordat.
The Taurian Concordat has gotten past the worst of their financial pinch of the previous decade now that their fleet has been repaired. However, due to the great disparity in performance between it and the Kutai-class fleet, as well as the remaining tightness of funds, the remaining Independance-class corvette has been removed from active duty and reserved for use as a training ship.

BUDGET: $12B
Maintenance(@100%, except Independence @50%): $5.138B
Kutai purchase: $5B
8x small craft: $80m
225x fighter: $1.125B
Research: $36m
« Last Edit: 20 August 2018, 19:43:18 by Alsadius »

truetanker

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #622 on: 12 August 2018, 17:59:33 »
Turn 4: 2380-2389

2381
Continued aid from the Marian Hegemony to conquered Lothian worlds was resulting in the Lothian populace continuing to slowly warm up to the Marian government. While the rural miners remained irascible, the youth had never known any other government, and the bulk of society was starting to accept O'Reilly rule. The decision in 2381 to give the formerly Lotharian planets full representation in the Marian Senate was a strong signal of goodwill that the Lothian populace responded well to. Malicious compliance effectively stopped, and a new Army regiment was successfully raised entirely from Lothian volunteers.

Ending Balance Turn 4: 4 Billion and 41 Million
TAXES and Loot: 13 Billion
Budget Turn 5: 17 Billion, 41 Million

DCA Loan ( Trojan / Yard ):    3 Billion
Periphery Aid Package:           .500 Million, helping the Lothian League, continue support for more gains
Maintenance:                        3.900 Billion ~ 120% ( or close to that )
Conversion, Trojan ( x2 ):    1.750 Billon
Buying, Ala ( 10 asf each )    .100 Million ( 20 fighters )
End Turn 5 Budget: 7 Billion, 791 million

I'd like to state something, the warship spreadsheet is wrong, I have 7 Scapha I's not 6, otherwise I'm fine. I'm also converting my two Trojans this turn to Block Ib for 1,625,422 for both, but will simplify to 1.750 B total costs ( call it overpayment due to contractural overchargement ). Which should be a Lyran thing... :thumbsup:

Now Story Arc:

Marian Action News Network ( MANN )
Vatnajökull, Lothario
Marian Hegemony Embassy
1158pm local time

MANN Reporter:" I'm reporting from the Hegemony Embassy, as you can see, there's a very large celebration party continuing from late early yesterday morning as the crowds of young generations are rejoicing the Marian Embrace, as they are calling it. Early this week the Senatus Marian, or Marian Senate, decreed and voted on the inclusion of the Lothian League onto the senatorial floor. As the results can be felt late this evening, many Lothians youth have joined the ' Service equals Citizenship ' program of the HMAF. With such a massive influx of new and raw cooptatione ( recruitment ), the MHAF has designated a Lothian Legio of four Cohorts of Infantry and Armour, including a few Ala, or wings of ten aerospace fighter.

Recently the MHAF expanded their Collegium program to include a Lothian Chapter. While only on Alphard, an Officers Scholarship program kicked off with over one hundred Lothians attending it. Current curriculum includes Leadership Management and Conduct becoming of an Officer of the MHAF. So far scores are in their mid-high levels. "

End broadcast: Would you like more?

TT
* Modified to add this :

Code: [Select]
Class/Model/Name: Trojan
Tech: Inner Sphere
Ship Cost: $4,844,088,000.00
Magazine Cost: $4,200,000.00
BV2: 16,433

Mass: 100,000
K-F Drive System: Compact
Power Plant: Maneuvering Drive
Safe Thrust: 3
Maximum Thrust: 5
Armor Type: Standard
Armament:
1 Naval AC 40
96 AC 5
96 Machine Gun (IS)
12 Naval Laser 45

Equipment: Mass
Drive: 18,000.00
Thrust
Safe: 3
Maximum: 5
Controls: 250.00
K-F Hyperdrive: Compact (4 Integrity) 45,250.00
Jump Sail: (3 Integrity) 35.00
Structural Integrity: 30 3,000.00
Total Heat Sinks: 1047 Single 813.00
Fuel & Fuel Pumps: 40000 points 4,080.00
Fire Control Computers: 692.40
Armor: 48 pts Standard 60.00
Fore: 12
Fore-Left/Right: 11/11
Aft-Left/Right: 11/11
Aft: 10

Dropship Capacity: 1 1,000.00
Grav Decks: Small: 1 50.00
Escape Pods: 0.00
Life Boats: 22 154.00

Crew And Passengers:
20 Officers in 2nd Class Quarters 140.00
45 Crew in Steerage Quarters 225.00
51 Gunners and Others in Steerage Quarters 255.00
399 Bay Personnel 2,793.00
1st Class Passengers 0.00
       2nd Class Passengers 0.00
0 Steerage Passengers 0.00

# Weapons Loc Heat Damage Range Mass
1 Naval AC 40 Nose 135 400 (40-C) Medium-C 4,500.00
12 AC 5 Nose 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) Nose 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
3 Naval Laser 45 FR 210 135 (13.5-C) 2,700.00
12 AC 5 FR 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) FR 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
3 Naval Laser 45 FL 210 135 (13.5-C) 2,700.00
12 AC 5 FL 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) FL 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
12 AC 5 LBS 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) LBS 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
12 AC 5 RBS 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) RBS 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
3 Naval Laser 45 AR 210 135 (13.5-C) 2,700.00
12 AC 5 AR 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) AR 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
3 Naval Laser 45 AL 210 135 (13.5-C) 2,700.00
12 AC 5 AL 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) AL 24 (2.4-C) 6.00
12 AC 5 Aft 12 60 (6-C) 96.00
12 Machine Gun (IS) Aft 24 (2.4-C) 6.00

Bay #1 - Fighters (10) - 1 Door ~ Ala = 10 ASF
Bay #2 - Small Craft (5) - 1 Door
Bay #3 - Infantry (Motorized - 8 Platoons) - 2 Doors ~ 200 troopers
            - Light Vehicle (10)
            - Heavy Vehicle (10)
Bay #4 - Cargo (2426 Tons) - 2 Doors
Ammo Rounds Mass
Naval AC 40 Ammo 20 24.00
AC 5 Ammo 4800 240.00
Machine Gun (IS) Ammo 48000 240.00

Small NCSS    100.00

Fixed the mistakes.

TT
« Last Edit: 13 August 2018, 21:08:00 by truetanker »
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Smegish

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #623 on: 13 August 2018, 03:32:06 »
That 8 platoons is assuming 25-man units, not 100. So total should be 200 men.

Also if future budgets could be just the hard numbers, OOC to make it easier to understand, that would be appreciated.

RE: the Vincent - I was unaware AC/2s worked as Point Defense... I imagine they aren't terribly effective to make up for the longer engagement range compared to AMS/MGs
« Last Edit: 13 August 2018, 03:40:40 by Smegish »

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #624 on: 13 August 2018, 04:36:07 »
Truetanker: I'm with Smegish on this. Fluff is appreciated, but try to keep the actual budget straightforward and a bit more out-of-character. It can sometimes be hard to follow what you're doing. Also, just a reminder that your "recruitment drive"/"retirement funding"/""school upgrade" expenses are being treated as maintenance for your ships for gameplay purposes. You might prefer to incorporate them into your maintenance expenses, and use the fluff to describe how you're spending them, because it makes your budgets harder to read.

The "Periphery aid package" is what's getting you those events integrating the Lothians into your empire, so that is not mere maintenance. Keep that one split out if you keep spending on it. FWIW, other players who have conquered territory may wish to do the same. That said, remember that it's not very useful unless you expect to keep the territory long-term, and that's harder to guarantee when it's a major power who wants those planets back instead of a defunct bandit kingdom.

Smegish: AC/2 is a hybrid. Rule of thumb, it's half as effective as a MG at point defence, but it can also shoot down fighters. 2x AC/2 is a bit less efficient than MG+AC/5(weighs more, and does a bit less damage to fighters), but it's logistically simpler and makes it a bit harder for enemies to try to take out all of a particular sort of defensive gun. You can really go either way on this, and most nations prefer AC/5+MG, but the THN has mostly used AC/2 thus far, so I kept that habit up. That said, this will probably change when better anti-fighter weapons than the AC/5 come into play, because 2x AC/2 is noticeably worse than MG+LRM-20, or MG+AC/10, or MG+LL.

FWIW, when the AMS tech gets unlocked, AMS will be ~2x as effective as MGs at point defence, but since they're the same mass that's still a big win.
« Last Edit: 13 August 2018, 08:12:19 by Alsadius »

marauder648

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #625 on: 13 August 2018, 07:54:40 »
You folks should do a story updates only thread. I'd love to have been part but work commitments just meant i'd not be able to keep up or give it the attention it deserves.
Ghost Bears: Cute and cuddly. Until you remember its a BLOODY BEAR!

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #626 on: 13 August 2018, 08:14:44 »
You folks should do a story updates only thread. I'd love to have been part but work commitments just meant i'd not be able to keep up or give it the attention it deserves.

I edit the OP with links to the turns, and each turn includes links to player posts. That's intended to let people keep up with the story while ignoring the side discussions. Is that the sort of thing you want, or would something else work better? I'm open to suggestions here.

Smegish

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #627 on: 13 August 2018, 19:39:43 »
And once again we wait for the FedRat

Alsadius

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #628 on: 13 August 2018, 21:16:56 »
And once again we wait for the FedRat

Don't blame him too much. It'll be a while before I'd be ready either way (this weekend, probably), and I can do 80% of a turn without any single player's turn being done. I don't write them up linearly, and all the non-FS events can happen on schedule before he posts his stuff.

Smegish

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Re: Group Design Challenge: WarShip Arms Race
« Reply #629 on: 13 August 2018, 21:48:51 »
I will blame the FedRat for anything I like! 😠😆

*Jabs Kiviar with the Cattleprod of Awakening*