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Author Topic: Recoil of Gauss Rifle  (Read 3347 times)

cray

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #30 on: 06 July 2018, 20:06:30 »
I doubt that the mass of the ammunition entirely comprised of ammunition.  8 shots per ton doesn't mean 1/8th ton per shot. About half the mass is taken up by ammo feed to the gauss rifle

Nope, the ammo mass is entirely ammo or nearly so. Any of the feed mechanism is accounted for in the weapon's mass.
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glitterboy2098

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #31 on: 06 July 2018, 20:22:59 »
so 125kg moving at 7500 m/s

that translates to..

cray

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #32 on: 06 July 2018, 20:43:59 »
so 125kg moving at 7500 m/s

7500m/s?

Well, a Gauss rifle has a long aerospace range: 20 hexes, 360 kilometers. That requires a minimum of 6km/s to cross in 1 turn (60 seconds). So 7.5km/s is possible. But practically speaking you'd want a much higher velocity. Given 60 seconds, even a lumbering bulk like a Behemoth or Aegis can dodge by over 18km. You'd want flight times down to a fraction of a turn, like under 10 seconds to have a chance of hitting a fighter at 360 kilometers range.

That pushes muzzle velocities into tens of kilometers per second.
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**"A man walks down the street in that hat, people know he's not afraid of anything." --Wash, Firefly.
**"Well, the first class name [for pocket WarShips]: 'Ship with delusions of grandeur that is going to evaporate 3.1 seconds after coming into NPPC range' tended to cause morale problems...." --Korzon77
**"Describe the Clans." "Imagine an entire civilization built out of 80’s Ric Flairs, Hulk Hogans, & Macho Man Randy Savages ruling over an entire labor force with Einstein Level Intelligence." --Jake Mikolaitis


Disclaimer: Anything stated in this post is unofficial and non-canon unless directly quoted from a published book. Random internet musings of a BattleTech writer are not canon.

glitterboy2098

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #33 on: 06 July 2018, 20:56:53 »
was using the minimum velocity needed to cross the space distance. i agree it is probably quite a bit higher.

Von Jankmon

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #34 on: 07 July 2018, 06:18:31 »
Nope, the ammo mass is entirely ammo or nearly so. Any of the feed mechanism is accounted for in the weapon's mass.

 8 shots per ton is a balance mechanism.  There is some give on the construction statistics.

Take Arrow IV for example, its a 15 ton launcher plus 5 shots per ton, yet normally depicted as a 5 shot 16 ton missile launcher, rarely with more ammo than that.  Most set ups don't even have a feed mechanism, just five tubes, all full.

Arrow technology possibly varies, the Capcon uses over big rockets on a simpler firing rail in the Catapult, Clan Wolf might use more compact rockets in a more complex mechanism in the Naga. It amalgamates into the same thing.

Or how about vehicle design, the engine mass is for the engine, foot down on canon there, and the transmission is made of thin air.  The additional mass for tracks is calculated indirectly through modifiers to engine mass in suspension levels, and this value is further diluted if the vehicle has a fusion engine, which presumably doesnt effect transmission mass much.  Consequently it is wrong to take anything other than a holistic approach.

Back to the gauss rifle for a further explanation.  If a guass rifle is arm mounted with torso mounted ammo the ammo feed will weigh more and take more space than if the ammo magazine was in the arm adjacent to the gauss rifle.  however this mass is amalgamated and simplified and it works as is.  By it also means that you have to accept that the mass of the weapon and its ammo is the mass of the weapon and its ammo and it might not be possible to subdivide this down.  With so many variables to add we cannot just take the mass of a ton of gauss ammo and divide it by eight to get an estimate of shot mass.  Place that ammo two locations away from the weapon and it might take a sizable proportion of the tons allocation for additional feed mechanism to get there.

If this is not enough consider a targeting computer.  Why would a targeting computer for a gauss rifle weigh more than one for a small laser, its software right?  On a computer board in the main control hardware.   targeting computer might cost a lot but its mass is negligible,  however the targeting computers mass comes from the fine control waldos it uses to auto correct aim for you which will weigh more to zero in a gauss rifle for target assist more than it would for a small laser.  We could accurately consider a targeting computer as a 0 mass 0 critical slot component in the head, but with additional mass in fine adjustment waldos all over the mech, but we call it all 'targeting computer'.
« Last Edit: 07 July 2018, 21:09:32 by Von Jankmon »
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Hellraiser

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #35 on: 09 July 2018, 14:52:39 »
Hello, I do not know if this has been ask before but do Gauss Rifles have recoil?  You are shooting a metal object down a gun barrel but it is doing it by magnets field so there is no push back like when you use regular shell

Check out the Hunchback fluff about the 3039 prototype Gauss Rifle variant.

Or this mini for it.

http://camospecs.com/Miniature/Details/4055/hunchback-hbk-4g
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Daemion

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #36 on: 14 July 2018, 01:14:58 »
7500m/s?

Well, a Gauss rifle has a long aerospace range: 20 hexes, 360 kilometers. That requires a minimum of 6km/s to cross in 1 turn (60 seconds). So 7.5km/s is possible. But practically speaking you'd want a much higher velocity. Given 60 seconds, even a lumbering bulk like a Behemoth or Aegis can dodge by over 18km. You'd want flight times down to a fraction of a turn, like under 10 seconds to have a chance of hitting a fighter at 360 kilometers range.

That pushes muzzle velocities into tens of kilometers per second.

Even that's being a little conservative, there, Cray.  Granted, with the advanced sensors and combat computers BT is supposed to have in its combat craft, you might be able to lead a shot like that pretty handily.  But, same said computers can also be put to use calculating course corrections to still dodge that shot, and it doesn't take more than a couple seconds to be out of the projectile's path. So, you're wanting something closer to 1-2 seconds, or faster.

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Arkansas Warrior

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #37 on: 14 July 2018, 15:03:47 »
8 shots per ton is a balance mechanism.  There is some give on the construction statistics.

Take Arrow IV for example, its a 15 ton launcher plus 5 shots per ton, yet normally depicted as a 5 shot 16 ton missile launcher, rarely with more ammo than that.  Most set ups don't even have a feed mechanism, just five tubes, all full.

Arrow technology possibly varies, the Capcon uses over big rockets on a simpler firing rail in the Catapult, Clan Wolf might use more compact rockets in a more complex mechanism in the Naga. It amalgamates into the same thing.
Where are you getting that?  I’ve seen Arrow IV launchers depicted in the art as having 5 tubes, but I don’t think I’ve ever heard them as a 16 ton unit with no ammo feed mechanism.  Besides, as was mentioned earlier, it’s pretty well established in the fluff that Gauss rounds weigh 125kg.  Why not assume that the feed mechanism’s weight is accounted for in the weight of the weapon?
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SteelRaven

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #38 on: 14 July 2018, 15:35:08 »
It's honestly kinda pointless to argue the actual weight and mass of a fictional weapon on a fictional machine, it's not like BT ammo bins follow any logical reloading mechanics to begin with. 

 
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marcussmythe

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #39 on: 14 July 2018, 15:51:54 »
Your saying my LL AC/20 Bins cant feed my RA  AC/20?  Heresy!

Ice_Trey

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Re: Recoil of Gauss Rifle
« Reply #40 on: 18 July 2018, 02:27:25 »
For sure there is, it's just within manageable levels for a Battlemech.

However, not so for the Heavy Gauss Rifle, which actually requires a modified piloting check each time you fire one.

Also, the prototype version of the standard Gauss Rifle had a similar drawback, but was resolved by the time the production model came out.

 

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