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Author Topic: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise  (Read 68873 times)

HobbesHurlbut

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1200 on: 14 August 2019, 11:22:32 »
When the North Koreans seized that USS Pueblo maybe. The USCG has seized some old Russian Subs sold to cartels.
That was a reasearch ship and not an actual warship.
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Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1201 on: 14 August 2019, 11:30:52 »
Well it was a commissioned US Navy ship, so

If non-military is allowed, then this one a couple months ago definitely counts as a capture by boarding IMO


https://youtu.be/7rnVSlcs7_E

Colt Ward

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1202 on: 14 August 2019, 11:31:07 »
But it was a navy vessel . . . and from what I understand, why the USN re-instituted having small arms for the crew.
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HobbesHurlbut

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1203 on: 14 August 2019, 11:38:15 »
But it was a navy vessel . . . and from what I understand, why the USN re-instituted having small arms for the crew.
Well it was a commissioned US Navy ship, so

If non-military is allowed, then this one a couple months ago definitely counts as a capture by boarding IMO

"That leaves me wondering, when was the last time a warship was taken by boarding?"
Was vessel or simple ship mentioned?  xp
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JadeHellbringer

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1204 on: 14 August 2019, 11:42:21 »
Guys...  >:(
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kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1205 on: 14 August 2019, 11:46:47 »
That leaves me wondering, when was the last time a warship was taken by boarding?
Nine months ago, Kerch Straits.

Rule 4 should apply.

Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1206 on: 14 August 2019, 11:53:33 »
Alright alright

HMS Sirius, Dido class light cruiser



"That leaves me wondering, when was the last time a warship was taken by boarding?"
Was vessel or simple ship mentioned?  xp
Depends on your definition of boarding. If the crew surrendered without a shot, probably as recently as Gulf War 1, IIRC. If opposed... hoo boy.

Edit: oh yeah, nice one @kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1207 on: 14 August 2019, 12:01:54 »
Nice pic, looks like she is headed somewhere in a hurry . . . what is that camo pattern?  Is that six 4 inch on the bow?
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Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1208 on: 14 August 2019, 12:18:38 »
Nice pic, looks like she is headed somewhere in a hurry . . . what is that camo pattern?  Is that six 4 inch on the bow?
No idea where she's headed, but that's a very nice camo innit? It's really what drew me to this pic.

Six 5.25 inch or 133mm in, uh, sensible units. They were the heaviest AA guns the RN used and considered effective up till the early 60s because of the terrific burst compared with 4.5 inch.

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1209 on: 14 August 2019, 12:51:44 »
Huh, the barrels just seemed so thin in that turret . . . I knew they were not the same caliber as the HMS Belfast but I also did not think they would be some 3 or 2 inch popgun since IIRC some (most?) destroyers of the time were armed with 5 inchers.

So, think the camo was to upset distance calculations/sighting by simulating waves & crests?
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marauder648

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1210 on: 14 August 2019, 13:29:33 »
The Dido's were a case of trying to do too much on too small a hull. And their topweight and lack of torpedo protection made them very vulnerable to torps and capsizing. There was also a shortage of 5.25 mounts at the start of the War and two ships even completed with their guns being replaced by dual 4.5 inch guns as seen here;



Some also only completed with 8 x 5.25-inch weapons rather than 10 due to a lack of mounts and wartime experience.

The 5.25 wasn't as good as the US 5-inch in the AA role but they were different weapons, the higher caliber of the 5.25 made it a lot faster round and it was a far superior anti-ship weapon for it. And it could get the round up to altitude far quicker. But, the turrets were rather poorly designed and crowded and initially didn't have power loading, making them exhausting to use in sustained fire.
« Last Edit: 14 August 2019, 13:31:34 by marauder648 »
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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1211 on: 15 August 2019, 04:03:20 »
The Dido class was also the inspiration for the HMS Ulysses, from the Alastair McLean book of the same name. McLean served on HMS Royalist of that class.

The book was one of the first real adult books I read, before I learned that my father's beloved brother had died in a convoy escort in WW2. I was named after that brother. I'd found the book powerful before ... it's now a very special book. Yes, I know, it's fiction. But it does make me remember the nameless, faceless casualty statistics are someone's brother, someone's uncle, in a very personal way.

The Didos may be top heavy. But for me, they'll always be about the size of the fight in the dog, not the size of the dog in the fight.

Thanks for sharing the images, Kidd and marauder648. I'm sad, but in a good way. Rest in peace, sailors who never made port again.
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kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1212 on: 15 August 2019, 07:17:23 »
Continuing the remaining corvette-sized vessels...



P71 Serviola.
P72 Centinela.
P73 Vigia.
P74 Atalaya.

Four dedicated OPVs commissioned 1991/92 for general patrol in Atlantic.

1200 tons, 73m long, 46-48 crew.
Armament 1x 76mm gun (3"/50, not a OTO)
Helicopter deck, no hangar. Small medical bay.

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1213 on: 15 August 2019, 07:40:46 »


P360 Viana do Castelo.
P361 Figueira da Foz.
P362 Sines.
P363 Setubal.

Dedicated modern OPVs commissioned in batches 2011-2013 and 2018-19. Two more being built, four additional planned; two of those for pollution control.

1600 tons, 83m long, 38 crew.
Armament 1x 30mm RWS
Helicopter deck, no hangar. Accomodation for 32 troops.

Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1214 on: 15 August 2019, 08:54:47 »

Is... is that unenclosed?!



Which Navy? How much did the recent ones cost?

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1215 on: 15 August 2019, 09:59:43 »
Is... is that unenclosed?!
Yes, that's an original unenclosed, manually loaded 3"/50 Mk22 gun - probably built in the 50s or 60s, Spain has a license for them since the 30s. It's usually under a weather protection tarp and only uncovered if they want to scare some pirates - or the Royal Navy. Or the Canadians. Or the Moroccan Army. The Spanish Armada states they are for "warning shots (shots across the bow)".

Which Navy? How much did the recent ones cost?
Portugal. 60 million EUR per ship for the last deal announced July 2018, the previous pair ordered in 2015 only cost about 78 million EUR for both ships.

They're built locally by West Sea (former ENVC shipyard) in a joint venture with EDISOFT (i.e. Thales) providing the electronics knowhow and integration. The cheap price is due to being not just built to, but also outfitted to civilian standards other than the fire control for the gun.
« Last Edit: 15 August 2019, 10:06:26 by kato »

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1216 on: 15 August 2019, 10:22:11 »

Istal_Devalis

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1217 on: 15 August 2019, 11:19:02 »
The Dido class is a good example of parallel evolution, comparing them to the Atlanta class. They had similar issues with being top heavy, too.


kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1218 on: 15 August 2019, 13:25:29 »
At the lower end of corvette-sized...



P733 La Confiance
P734 La Resolue
P735 La Combattante
P901 Castor
P902 Pollux

Small, light OPVs commissioned 2014-2019. Two smaller units (54m, 570-ton) and three lenghtened units (61m, 750-ton) with otherwise identical dimensions, design and layout. The enlarged version adds accomodation for 14 troops as onboard MPE. Used for general patrol and pollution control. Two units also patrol staging zones (stage drop zones) for Kourou Space Center.

570 or 750 tons, 54 or 61m long, 15 or 24 crew
Armament 1x 20mm RWS or 1x .50cal RWS
No helicopter deck. Slipway for RHIB. Shallow draught of 10.5 ft for inshore use.

(P.S.: Cost - 13 million for small version in 2014, 25 million for latest large version ordered in 2017)

Weirdo

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1219 on: 15 August 2019, 14:11:27 »
Don't suppose you know the class names of all of these gorgeous OPVs, or their operators?
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kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1220 on: 15 August 2019, 16:09:21 »
Don't suppose you know the class names of all of these gorgeous OPVs, or their operators?
Coordination agency for operators listed below is the European Border and Coast Guard Agency FRONTEX, currently responsible for coordinating supporting use of assets where they are needed.

Singular ships

Post #1154 - Carlskrona - Sweden
Post #1167 - Eithne - Ireland

Ship classes

Post #1155 - Holland class - Netherlands
Post #1156 - Meteoro class (BAM) - Spain
Post #1158 - Floreal class - France
Post #1159 - Thetis class - Denmark
Post #1160 - Samuel Beckett class - Ireland
Post #1168 - Minerva class - Italy
Post #1170 - Knud Rasmussen class - Denmark
Post #1171 - Seeadler class - Germany (Coastguard)
Post #1172 - Chilreu class - Spain
Post #1173 - Cassiopea class - Italy
Post #1193 - Luigi Dattilo class - Italy (Coastguard)
Post #1212 - Serviola class - Spain
Post #1213 - Viana do Castelo class (NPO) - Portugal

Multi-classes

Post #1161 - Descubierta / Baptista de Andrade / D'Estienne d'Orves classes - Spain/Portugal/France
Post #1164 - Comandanti / Sirio classes - Italy
Post #1218 - Castor / La Confiance classes - Belgium/France

The last one in Post #1218 is a bit obscure to English speakers. There isn't even an English wikipedia article on either of them.

P.S. Beyond this there's one more individual ship (L'Astrolabe) and four classes in corvette-sized vessels to do.
« Last Edit: 15 August 2019, 16:13:48 by kato »

Weirdo

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1221 on: 15 August 2019, 16:35:43 »
I actually knew about the Castors already, though not La Confiance. :)
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Daryk

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1222 on: 15 August 2019, 16:38:55 »
What?  You're Belgian??  Who knew!!  ???  ;D

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1223 on: 15 August 2019, 17:08:41 »
It's a whole line of OPVs from a French ship design company called Mauric. Same company that designed e.g. the L-CAT landing craft.

They offer a virtually identical design in OPV440, OPV530, OPV535 and OPV600 versions, the numbers designating the length in dm. Differences are mostly visible in the superstructure ahead of the bridge which is differently sized to accomodate different numbers of people under different standards. The OPV440 also seems to lack some space in the back, only carrying two RHIBs on davits.

The two Belgian ships are OPV530, the three French ships are OPV600. France has also bought two OPV440 and one OPV535 for customs duty.

Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1224 on: 15 August 2019, 17:30:13 »
60 million euro doesn't seem cheap. Maybe that's inclusive of support costs.

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1225 on: 15 August 2019, 17:35:24 »
Mostly listing her due to her P pennant...



P800 L'Astrolabe.

Patrol icebreaker for the Antarctic Sea commissioned 2017. Supports the Dumont d'Urville station on the coast and through that Concordia Station inland. Primary mission is "affirmer la souveraineté française aux Terres australes et antarctiques françaises" which i'm not gonna translate.

4200 tons, 72m long, 31 crew
No armament.
Helicopter deck and hangar. May break and ram ice. Carries 1200-1400 tons cargo and 29 passengers.

kato

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1226 on: 15 August 2019, 17:36:38 »
60 million euro doesn't seem cheap. Maybe that's inclusive of support costs.
It's cheap for the size. TKMS will try to sell you about the same thing for twice as much.

Daryk

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1227 on: 15 August 2019, 17:45:08 »
*snip*
which i'm not gonna translate.
*snip*
For which, I'm sure Rule 4 thanks you...

Kidd

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1228 on: 15 August 2019, 17:46:32 »
It's cheap for the size. TKMS will try to sell you about the same thing for twice as much.
Brazil's Amazonas cost them 35 million pounds per, granted that was some time back but inflation can't be that severe.

Ursus Maior

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Re: Naval Pictures VI: A New Enterprise
« Reply #1229 on: 15 August 2019, 17:55:02 »
For which, I'm sure Rule 4 thanks you...
That is definitely the case.

On another note: Most of the OPV work of the Hellenic Navy is done by a hodgepodge of fast attack craft and gunboats. It's quite the collection, with only one thing in common: A 76 mm gun as main ballistic armament. Most of the craft are of French origin, a couple of La Combattante IIa, La Combattante III, La Combattante IIIb and exactly two Osprey 55-class gunboat of Cold War US vintage.

Interestingly the La Combattante IIa used to be German fast attack craft: Ypoploiarchos Votsis ex-Iltis, Antiploiarchos Pezopoulos ex-Storch, and Plotarchis Maridakis ex-Häher. I had the pleasure to see Ypoploiarchos Votsis moored at her pier in Rhodes last year.
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