Register Register

Author Topic: Solaris Nationality?  (Read 551 times)

Maelwys

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4329
Solaris Nationality?
« on: 10 February 2019, 16:18:04 »
I think I know the answer, but I can't quite find it right now, but if you're born in one of the "House sectors" on Solaris, are you considered a member of that House, or are you considered a Lyran no matter what?

Say you're born in the Kobe sector. You go traveling. Are you showing a Lyran passport or a Kuritan one?

What about the International sector?

Frabby

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 3194
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #1 on: 10 February 2019, 16:46:10 »
I seem to recall Solaris isn't technically a Lyran system. It's a free world in Lyran space.
Author of the BattleCorps stories Feather vs. Mountain, Rise and Shine, Proprietary, Trial of Faith & scenario Twins
Sarna.net BattleTechWiki Admin

Orwell84

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 285
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #2 on: 11 February 2019, 04:31:40 »
I seem to recall Solaris isn't technically a Lyran system. It's a free world in Lyran space.

Now under new management - Lupus Imperio management! Had a quick dig through the 3140s sourcebooks and didn't turn up anything about the arenas, but given the Clans' disdain for Solaris VII it wouldn't be a surprise if Alaric ordered the arenas turned into Trial grounds and turfed out the gladiators. Or had his warriors use them for target practice.

“By the Founder’s writ,
Clan Widowmaker is no more.
Its warriors submitted
To the holy crucible of combat
And emerged not through the other side.”
—The Remembrance (Clan Wolf), Passage 174, Verse 12, Lines 1–5

Nav_Alpha

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3351
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #3 on: 11 February 2019, 05:20:38 »
I think I know the answer, but I can't quite find it right now, but if you're born in one of the "House sectors" on Solaris, are you considered a member of that House, or are you considered a Lyran no matter what?

Say you're born in the Kobe sector. You go traveling. Are you showing a Lyran passport or a Kuritan one?

What about the International sector?

I swear I remember reading a reference to Solaris residents “changing their nationality like underwear”. Maybe it was in Illusions of Victoy? A thought from one of the characters’ POV?
But I can’t remember.

The implication being that you might be born technically a Lyran citizen because you were born there. But your parents could quickly have you declared a FedSuns citizen as they’re Black Hills locals. ( and then at the height of the Civil War, you revert back to be a Lyran...)


I seem to recall Solaris isn't technically a Lyran system. It's a free world in Lyran space.

Surely it must be? Otherwise, you’d have literally millions of foreign citizens living in your city. How do you get around stuff like taxes? Rental agreements? Dog ownership?
Solaris would have to have some sort of “open planet” system where you register as a “Solaran resident” rather than a Drac or a FWL’er or a Cappie in lyran space.


"Hold your position, conserve ammo... and wait for the Dragoons to go Feral"
- last words of unknown merc, Harlech, 3067
Avatar by Drewbacca

Colt Ward

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 14534
  • Gott Mit Uns
    • Merc Periphery Guide- Bakunin
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #4 on: 11 February 2019, 16:34:29 »
Now under new management - Lupus Imperio management! Had a quick dig through the 3140s sourcebooks and didn't turn up anything about the arenas, but given the Clans' disdain for Solaris VII it wouldn't be a surprise if Alaric ordered the arenas turned into Trial grounds and turfed out the gladiators. Or had his warriors use them for target practice.

Solaris VII is still operating the arenas though we do not have details on how.  Yulri Wolf's Canid Cooperative and even his involvement has raised interesting questions that have not been answered.

Before belonging to the Wolf Empire, while it might have been a open world it had Lyran forces assigned to the garrison.
Colt Ward

Beware the vengeance of a patient man.

Maelwys

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4329
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #5 on: 11 February 2019, 19:12:08 »
I seem to recall Solaris isn't technically a Lyran system. It's a free world in Lyran space.

I dunno. The history has the Lyrans taking over from the FWL, and for the most part, its the Lyrans garrisoning it.  So I'm pretty sure its a Lyran world.

I'm just not sure if the Districts are still Lyran overall, or if they're considered foreign territory.

Tai Dai Cultist

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7044
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #6 on: 11 February 2019, 20:41:50 »
Nationality doesn't mean the same thing in the BTU as it does in the real world. 

In a Pre-Westphalian sense you're a subject of the English Crown rather than a citizen of the English nation.  It's a difference that the entire modern world is predicated upon, and in the BTU they pretty much dispense with it again (barring those factions that still use the Citizen trait).

So yeah, on Solaris or any world of the BTU, you're just from that world.  You're a subject of whoever currently enforces a claim to that world.  In the case of people from the various House sectors of Solaris City that are (or were, depending on the play era) essentially exclaves of that Great House are subjects of that Great House rather than whoever currently enforces a claim on the planet per se.

truetanker

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
  • Clan Hells Horses 666th Mech. Assualt Cluster
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #7 on: 18 February 2019, 02:38:43 »
Alright Tai... explain this.

3080... your a Clan Freebirth MechWarrior that just so happens to be on Solaris... you hooked up with a another Freebirth of the opposite gender, a baby is born because both of you are assigned to duties here for 2 years... is the baby Lyran or clan sibko?

TT
Khan,Clan Iron Dolphin
Azeroth Pocketverse

That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
Nav_Alpha: That THING... that is horrid
~ Nav_Alpha on 10 October 2016

glitterboy2098

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7878
    • The Temple Grounds - My Roleplaying and History website
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #8 on: 18 February 2019, 03:13:51 »
So yeah, on Solaris or any world of the BTU, you're just from that world.  You're a subject of whoever currently enforces a claim to that world.  In the case of people from the various House sectors of Solaris City that are (or were, depending on the play era) essentially exclaves of that Great House are subjects of that Great House rather than whoever currently enforces a claim on the planet per se.
in the novel Illusions of Victory one character remarks that changing one's citizenship on Solaris is as easy as moving to a new district. obviously there would be legal stuff involved so that remark was at least partly exaggeration, but i suspect that becoming a combine citizen or a League citizen or a Davion citizen, etc would be a lot easier when you their enclaves are all part of one city, and by moving into those areas you could probably simplify the paperwork.

Alright Tai... explain this.

3080... your a Clan Freebirth MechWarrior that just so happens to be on Solaris... you hooked up with a another Freebirth of the opposite gender, a baby is born because both of you are assigned to duties here for 2 years... is the baby Lyran or clan sibko?
well if the kid is freeborn, it would't be part of a sibko. wouldn't even automatically be a warrior. but if the warriors are there as part of an official mission or diplomatic station, the kid would be part of the clan. you might be able to argue it would get dual citizenship.

if the warriors are no longer in a clan and there as part of a stable, the kid would have whatever citizenship the stable arranged for the parents, most likely the same one as the stable's owner. if the stable didn't arrange citizenship paperwork, it would be whatever citizenship the parents had arranged on their own for themselves (probably lyran but with so many enclaves, could be just about any IS allegiance.)
if the parents aren't citizens of anywhere yet, the kid would probably be lyran by default.


Tai Dai Cultist

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7044
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #9 on: 18 February 2019, 10:42:48 »
Quote from: glitterboy2098
in the novel Illusions of Victory one character remarks that changing one's citizenship on Solaris is as easy as moving to a new district. obviously there would be legal stuff involved so that remark was at least partly exaggeration, but i suspect that becoming a combine citizen or a League citizen or a Davion citizen, etc would be a lot easier when you their enclaves are all part of one city, and by moving into those areas you could probably simplify the paperwork.

Well, again, when it's less a question of where you're a citizen of then who you're a subject of... yeah changing "citizenship" is pretty much just moving to a new fief with a new lord.  Or in the case of billions of people across the Inner Sphere: have a new lord claim the same land you've lived on without you moving at all.

Quote from: truetanker
Alright Tai... explain this.

3080... your a Clan Freebirth MechWarrior that just so happens to be on Solaris... you hooked up with a another Freebirth of the opposite gender, a baby is born because both of you are assigned to duties here for 2 years... is the baby Lyran or clan sibko?

Ok caveat up front: the Jihad and its immediate aftermath is the one era of BattleTech lore I don't feel I like a super expert on.  Accordingly, I'm going to answer as if the question didn't include that specific year as a context.

I would say that "generally" the kid's allegiance is owed to whoever is owed the raising parent(s).  If the baby is born between two offworlders, one of three things is going to happen.  Note that I'll save the Clan allegiance wrinkle for a 2nd stage of the answer:

1) neither parent "keeps" the kid and it's left onworld for orphanages (or whatever the world has) to sort out.  In this case, yes the kid is raised as a native to that world.
2) one parent keeps the kid, and the kid is raised as an expat of whatever faction that parent is.  (essentially an "Army Brat")
3) the parents decide to stay together and both keep the kid.  Too many variables to give a neat answer for every case, but generally  if the family is sticking together they're going to probably have to settle in to observing one liege lord or another.  However certain contexts might permit a "mixed" factional family.  They'd have to be rather mobile (e.g. spacers, mercs, etc) because if they put roots down then by default they're subjects of whoever controls the place they put roots down.  But even spacers can end up as subjects of a neo-feudal lord who happens to have their spacecraft as his fief...

Now, Clanners are from a legit different civilization than the Inner Sphere.  It's deliberately broken from the Neo-Feudal model, so that complicates the answer.  In the case of the Clans, it's very much like being enlisted in a post-conscription military.  You have to want to be there.  You're given every opportunity to GTFO if you don't like the rules; the Dark Caste is right over there waiting for you if you don't like being told what to do and how to do it.  So a child born of freebirths would, if kept by one of the parents, probably be raised however Clan kids are raised, but in an expat context.  The kid would have to pick one Clan or the other and test in to the Clan when he's of whatever the appropriate age would be, and he'd have to continue choosing to remain Clan amid the temptations of "soft" life as a Sphereoid.

Lastly, the Freebirth parents, depending on the Clan, might conceivably have to give up their positions as Warriors in order to raise children.
« Last Edit: 18 February 2019, 10:50:11 by Tai Dai Cultist »

truetanker

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 6058
  • Clan Hells Horses 666th Mech. Assualt Cluster
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #10 on: 18 February 2019, 12:05:11 »
Great...

Now I'm thinking of The Parent Trap but the clan Edition!

Thanks Tai...  xp
TT
Khan,Clan Iron Dolphin
Azeroth Pocketverse

That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
If I'm attacking you, conventional wisom says to bring 3x your force.  I want extra insurance, so I'll bring 4 for every 1 of what you have :D ~ Tai Dai Cultist on 21 April 2016
Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
Nav_Alpha: That THING... that is horrid
~ Nav_Alpha on 10 October 2016

Boomer8

  • Corporal
  • *
  • Posts: 50
  • Caballeros Forever!
Re: Solaris Nationality?
« Reply #11 on: 01 March 2019, 18:12:49 »
Great...

Now I'm thinking of The Parent Trap but the clan Edition!

Thanks Tai...  xp
TT

Welcome to Clan life, spheroid.
Victor W. Milan (1954-2018) Taken before he finished.

 

Register