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Author Topic: Satellites Discussion  (Read 3434 times)

RifleMech

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #90 on: 24 February 2019, 23:42:27 »
Reports prior to WWI wouldn't include seismic or hyperspectral data, but would still have use.  It would just be a different use than a more advanced survey.  It depends on what you're looking for.

I don't know what seismic info couldn't be included. And wasn't hyperspectral imagers introduced after the Clan Invasion?

Pre-WW1 surveys aren't effective or safe enough in this situation.

It would be expensive to have experts in every team, it would be cheaper to have the experts in a central location coordinating the work of the field teams. And with all the data that they should get (as I proposed) it would be possible for the experts to make predictions of the location/size/quality of any deposits. They would also be able to determine the optimum use for each type of area, allowing for more effective colony planning.

Also as it is an alien world there could be large number of possible hazards, anything from poisonous soil to crop/cattle eating lifeforms (fauna/flora/fungi). Not testing for this sets the colony up for failure, and if the hazards are found early then they can develop countermeasures.



I didn't say they would be pre WWI surveys, just that a lot of information was transmitted before WWI. There's no reason to believe the same amount or more, using computers, couldn't be transmitted using the same tech.

Itd be more expensive not sending out the experts as they're the one who ate supposed to know what to look for. Without experts in the field you'd get a lot of false positives. The teams would also be busy carrying samples for confirmation than confirming in the field.

And all that is true and not something your going to find out by satellite. You need boots on the ground, with experts to test of things are safe.


It makes sense that there could be satellites used setting up a colony. Keeping the up though depends on a lot of things. Not every planets is equal 2010s. Some aren't even equal to the 1980s. That means the usage of satellites is going to carry wildly

Not having rules for 20th century space tech also complicates things. Not that some planets are going to have that option but it would allow for planets to be space capable without having to resort to more advanced options.

Daryk

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #91 on: 25 February 2019, 06:16:32 »
Check out some of the surveys oil companies do these days with the big trucks purpose built for job.  John Scalzi's Fuzzy Nation includes an interesting way to do it too (seed sensors then use dynamite).  Both methods would generate exabytes of data that would take centuries to transmit via Morse.

Colt Ward

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #92 on: 25 February 2019, 12:00:49 »
Yeah, but for any survey its not a time sensitive job- meaning there are no people sitting on their butts waiting to get to work after word from the experts.  So the survey team takes it plotted path of 'interesting' sites collecting gigs of hard data and then swings back to the central admin site with the computers & few experts to crunch the data.  They are going to have to head back to the central site at some point to resupply . . . or say the supplies come to them, well then they can hand back the data.  Or they can loft a balloon with a high band-width receiver & transmitter to get over the horizon to base camp.

But this is still getting a few things mixed up . . . several different threads are occurring- one for colonization & initial set up, one for a planet's settled period, and one for Lostech era.
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Maingunnery

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #93 on: 25 February 2019, 12:52:31 »
Yeah, but for any survey its not a time sensitive job- meaning there are no people sitting on their butts waiting to get to work after word from the experts.  So the survey team takes it plotted path of 'interesting' sites collecting gigs of hard data and then swings back to the central admin site with the computers & few experts to crunch the data.  They are going to have to head back to the central site at some point to resupply . . . or say the supplies come to them, well then they can hand back the data.  Or they can loft a balloon with a high band-width receiver & transmitter to get over the horizon to base camp.
That is quite wasteful, not only do the experts have to wait for the data, but the field teams would have moved to a new site before the experts can give them feedback for either an altered course or extra points for sampling.
Also Base camp can be on the other side of the planet....
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Colt Ward

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #94 on: 25 February 2019, 16:33:47 »
Really?  b/c while I am not part of oil field survey teams, I have used their work and had to deal with their disruptions.  And they spend months gathering the data that is not immediately used . . . and no matter what, you still have to drill to see if it checks out- though its a lot better than by guess & by God they used to rely upon.

Also, if you only have a single survey team out, are you not already wasting the 'expert' & computer time?
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Maingunnery

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #95 on: 25 February 2019, 16:53:38 »
Really?  b/c while I am not part of oil field survey teams, I have used their work and had to deal with their disruptions.  And they spend months gathering the data that is not immediately used . . . and no matter what, you still have to drill to see if it checks out- though its a lot better than by guess & by God they used to rely upon.

Also, if you only have a single survey team out, are you not already wasting the 'expert' & computer time?
I am assuming that many teams are out in the field, and that experts are processing and evaluating data at near real-time.
This level of efficiency would be necessary to properly survey a new planet.
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Colt Ward

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #96 on: 25 February 2019, 17:43:00 »
Your not going to be able to completely survey a new planet . . . how many of us are here now & for how long, and we are still discovering things in the nooks & crannies of the planet.
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RifleMech

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #97 on: 25 February 2019, 17:51:27 »
I would think that the experts would be busy going through all the data generated at the base camp while the teams were out scouting potential sites for mining and drilling.

Maingunnery

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #98 on: 25 February 2019, 17:55:36 »
Your not going to be able to completely survey a new planet . . . how many of us are here now & for how long, and we are still discovering things in the nooks & crannies of the planet.
Currently that is the case, but the people of BT should have developed the capability & knowledge to survey a planet to a degree that they know: it is relatively safe (or know what is needed to be safe), that they can plan how to develop the colony, and can prove that it is financially viable. Also this process has to be done fast enough (months or years) to allow the effort to succeed.
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RifleMech

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #99 on: 25 February 2019, 18:51:20 »
Is the air breathable? If yes, they'll land and start setting up the colony. If the air isn't breathable then they'll have teams out to see if there's anything on the planet that would make them want to colonize the planet. If there is they build domes to live in.


idea weenie

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #100 on: 27 February 2019, 00:38:00 »
But this is still getting a few things mixed up . . . several different threads are occurring- one for colonization & initial set up, one for a planet's settled period, and one for Lostech era.

One setup might be:
  • Initial Survey - Dropship(s) act as home base, providing main living quarters, medical services, computer processing, communications hub, etc.  SC are used to transport teams around the planet, and about 200 tons of the DS cargo is for high-bandwidth communications satellites.  Navigation is by taking star shots and comparing landing site and elevation with topographic maps generated by the Dropship while atmospheric sampling was done.  Survey crews travel around, performing seismic studies in areas selected by base camp experts, and will often have a list of 3-4 locations to go to before the adjust locations are provided.  Method might be 4 exploration crews, and the base camp has ~20 locations for them to do tests.  The first four locations are selected, tests are done, and the data uploaded while the crew is on the way to site #2.  By the time they have finished running the tests on site #4, the base camp has identified locations that need to be re-surveyed near #1.  Satellites lft behind for long-duration weather mapping scans are solar powered and left in place after the Survey mission is complete.
  • Colonization - Dropships are used to deliver the colonists, living quarters, food, medical systems, basic industrial equipment, mining equipment, and high-tech multi-use components.  Sufficient cargo capacity is available that in case the initial Survey satellites are gone that new ones can be put into orbit by the Dropships and Small Craft.  A full tech base is provided so the colony can up-tech itself easily.  Satellites are used to keep an eye on the weather patterns and provide high-bandwidth communications.  A basic rocket pattern is designed that the local colony can build to replace any losses in the planet's constellation.  Computer space is allocated for storing the weather data to allow for future analysis and prediction.
  • Lostech era - satellites are still useful for global weather monitoring.  The world either has or develops chemical rocket launch capability.  Satellites are built with whatever materials can be developed locally, and launched using locally produced rockets.  Any Dropships that land are hired into service for satellite servicing/orbital cleanup/new launches.
  • Lostech, but dealing with Raiders - satellites use reaction wheels and ground-based computers to keep their sensors pointed towards the Jump Points to avoid being surprised by raiders.  Ground-based telescopes/sensors will confirm/deny any unusual readings.  Satellites will often be put into stand-by to avoid the appearance of value to the raiders.  Some planets put multiple small satellites into orbit, on the theory that expending the fuel to get a satellite worth 5,000 C-Bills on another planet is not worth it for a Raiding crew.

Just my thoughts

DOC_Agren

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Re: Satellites Discussion
« Reply #101 on: 27 February 2019, 19:10:48 »
Hey I once with a friend designed and fluffed a "cropduster" support plan, that could with the right hardware be converted into a lowtech scout and ground attack plane.   They sold well to backwater planets who could use the dual role crafts. 

As long as the pirate in question have no more aerospace assets then Dropship, 1 even Sabre fighter can ruin a whole wings day
In which case the pilot(s) is probably trained as a dual-role operator, not just anyhoo local civilian pilot. I think the only time this could be useful is for a high-level recon flyby knowing the pirates don't have ASF of any kind. But how would one know that?

A whole "Mech lance or company" is what you're trying to say I think, not "wing". Well it's theoretically possible. But I wouldn't take the chance. Even a measly little Leopard has a big enough aft gun to punch out a Sabre.

They were usable for recon, annoying popup attacks, dusting the enemy (pioson, fuel (then either have 1 fire a rocket or drop flare and get a nice firewall yep mechs can cross it, but not vehicles or inf)

and no I meant a wing of these crop dusters, could loose to single Sabre, because 1 hit and these were no longer flight worthy.
Now this Design on the other hand, well might keep if in Squadron might keep a single Sabre in check

but this is really a topic about Satellites, I figure major planets would have a "network" but when you get to backwater worlds, that network might have a weather satellite over the major settlement, but more thinking along the lines of 1960/70 earth.  I don't see unless the world has " Balkanisation" that there are military satellites in orbit, no really needs.  It would be nice to be able to get "data" from the jump points that say, yep we have incoming, but I expect on some backwater worlds, it is either a telescope or they work like some small airports and have you call to say that you are landing. 

I know my Mercs used to use high level "Aerospace Drones" to provide use with "recon/comm" over major battlefields or contracts, just because I assumed that either the local satellite were not worth it, or because we could trust our drones better then local gear.
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