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Author Topic: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)  (Read 466 times)

Sartris

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TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« on: 17 July 2019, 00:24:35 »
I understand why TRO:SW is in the form it is - it was the last release meant to come out on the heels of the first printing of the BMM and would be the last product for nearly a year when tptb went into the lab to work on the box set and the 35th anniversary lineup. It had to be produced quickly and cheaply.  That said... I want to fix it because I think it could do a better job as "the perfect 'first Technical Readout' companion to the BattleMech Manual."  As I am constrained by neither time nor practicality, I took neither into account. because i don't have to. so there. 

Adjustments
*Equivalent exchange - 93 mechs. no more, no less. one gets added, one has to leave. Hello macross mechs. goodbye (most of the) stuff extinct by the succession wars. also a few stinkers. the contents should be playable in a GoAC or Clan Box timeline context. 

*All 2750 mechs included get their original lv2 variant featured.

*A less scatter-shot narrative in the text. purely sorting by weight while mixing units with unannounced narrative perspectives from four different sources spanning 3039-3071 is disorienting - especially to the new player that has no grounding the chronology. 

The hoplite, for example, taken from 3050U references the star league, wolf's dragoons, the battle of Luthien (obliquely), and the sneak attack of Outreach in 3067... to say nothing of the fact that the variant presented in the TRO isn't even from the Succession Wars - it debuted in 3050

Ideally, the narrative would actually be from Loremaster Roshak or one of his subordinate's perspective in 3250. Failing that, the book could be the unreleased manuscript of a comstar adept prepared on the dawn of the jihad. this allows for a discussion of variants that appeared through the clan invasion and even into the civil war (SYNERGY). also background weaved into the famous pilots from different eras.  Regardless, a single voice would make much better sense.

*Weight class intro pages with a short descriptions... maybe some insight into change over time (eg how the XL engine transformed heavy cav)

*New art at minimum for the Duane Loose 3025 gang.

ADDITIONS
Stinger
Wasp
Valkyrie
Phoenix Hawk
Rifleman
Crusader
Archer
Warhammer
Marauder
Longbow
Marauder II
Cronus

DEPARTURES
Thorn
Falcon
Firebee
Icarus II
Kyudo
Talos
Phoenix
Gladiator
Battleaxe
Hammerhands
Rampage
Ymir

The ostroc and ostsol were deliberate omissions as we don't know what their ultimate fate is yet.

thus concludes another Bad Idea™

cypher226

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #1 on: 17 July 2019, 05:17:54 »
This is actually more or less what I thought TRO Succession Wars should have included. I'd be down for a revamp, to be honest. At the moment the Classics don't have a place, unless there were to be a 'mini' universal designs TRO?

RifleMech

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #2 on: 17 July 2019, 05:46:51 »
I can't say I agree with it. Personally I prefer the TROs by year. Succession Wars is to vague as it covers four wars and far too many years. Going by year you knew that those units would be available. Succession Wars gives mechs that had gone extinct so you don't have that reliability TROs by year have.

Yes, I know I can technically use any unit I want and there's always the chance of finding one. But that's like getting into a tank game that's currently set during the Gulf War with a TRO: 20th Century supporting it. Only the TRO lists Shermans and Panzers but no Abrams. Yes, they exist in museums but they weren't used during the Gulf War. So why include them?

Any way. Rant over.

To fix the TRO I'd remove all the Mechs that were extinct by the Third Succession War, with the possible exceptions of the ones used by Wolf's Dragoons. The Dragoons generated so much interest that I think their "lost" designs warrant being included. I think I'd put them in a section "Back from the Dead" or something.

I'd also keep the "First in Centuries" section from TRO:3039. I would include the Merlin in this section though. It deserves to be as the first in centuries.

I'd include the redesigned Macross Mechs.
I'd include the Dougram Quad Mechs. I imagine they'd be redesigned too.
I wouldn't include the TRO:2750 mechs. I would include the downgraded versions though, presuming they were in use during the Third Succession War.
I think I would also include some common FrankenMechs, like the Ostroc one seen in TRO:3025, to illustrate how desperate things had gotten. 
If there was still room, I'd include some Low Tech BattleMechs and some IndustrialMechs. The IndustrialMechs with original and MOD stats. Again to show how desperate things had gotten.

Another thing I'd do is to keep all the fluff in the Third Succession War or earlier. Save the future history for their upgraded variants in future TRO.

Talen5000

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #3 on: 17 July 2019, 06:47:02 »
The TROs aren't exactly perfect.

But perfection needs to be measured against economics and what will sell.

I like the era based format, but if it were to be expanded, then a lot of Mechs from TRO SW arguably should be moved to TRO AoW ( or whatever you call the preSW era)

Same for a TRO based on faction....that'd arguably be the best format but some TROs would sell a lot more than others.

Trouble is that the units aren't exactly spread evenly and there is a lot of overlap between eras. So overall, I don't think it possible to do a perfect TRO.
"So let me get this straight. You want to fly on a magic carpet to see the King of the Potato People and plead with him for your freedom, and you're telling me you're completely sane?" -- Uncle Arnie

MarauderD

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #4 on: 17 July 2019, 14:56:01 »
Sartris!

Excellent Suggestion!  This needs to happen.  We need a Succession Wars TRO for new players that has all the new artwork by Anthony Scroggins with all the classic mechs.  Period. 

Daryk

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #5 on: 17 July 2019, 15:00:55 »
Agreed!  Though I'll say I'd take the Battleaxe or Hammerhands over the Cronus any day...

Sartris

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #6 on: 17 July 2019, 15:33:23 »
Agreed!  Though I'll say I'd take the Battleaxe or Hammerhands over the Cronus any day...

i can't disagree with that, but i held myself to the strict criteria of replacing as many extinct mechs. look at it this way, it was either the Cronus of the Wyvern

MarauderD

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #7 on: 17 July 2019, 15:44:17 »
I think this TRO:SW 2.0 should be a Kickstarter stretch goal.  Sartris:  you seem like an Enterprising guy.  Make is so!

Daryk

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #8 on: 17 July 2019, 15:52:37 »
Cronus or Wyvern is much harder choice...  :P

Sartris

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #9 on: 17 July 2019, 17:28:56 »
yeah, deciding whether to fill the wyvern with trash or recyclables is indeed a tough call

I think this TRO:SW 2.0 should be a Kickstarter stretch goal.  Sartris:  you seem like an Enterprising guy.  Make is so!

while I am excellent at telling people how to spend their time and money, getting them to listen is an ongoing challenge 

RifleMech

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #10 on: 18 July 2019, 08:06:47 »
I don't expect a perfect TRO. I do expect that all the units are available and the information to fit the era. I also expect there to be some overlap. It'd be natural for some units to appear in multiple TROs for various reasons.

Sartris

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #11 on: 18 July 2019, 09:26:12 »
the "perfect" quote comes directly from the back of TRO:SW

also

As I am constrained by neither time nor practicality, I took neither into account. because i don't have to.

additionally

so there. 

RifleMech

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #12 on: 18 July 2019, 17:25:36 »
the "perfect" quote comes directly from the back of TRO:SW

also

additionally

So?  We're all entitled to our opinions. I don't consider it perfect wether "perfect" is on the book or not. If it were perfect would this thread exist?

Sartris

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #13 on: 18 July 2019, 22:59:09 »
That’s a joke son, that’s a joke

But you are always free to go home if you’re not having a good time

RifleMech

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Re: TRO:SW 2.0 (alternate title: a guy can dream)
« Reply #14 on: 21 July 2019, 20:27:00 »
I wouldn't be here if I wasn't  :beer:

 

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