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Author Topic: Painting Help  (Read 1010 times)

CTViper

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Painting Help
« on: 07 September 2019, 12:09:55 »
Hello folks,
so I am still new to painting, and I tried a new color scheme for my Wolves Beta Galaxy, however painting white is kicking my butt more then it probably should, so does anyone have any hints at how to highlight white? I tried using a black wash to hit the recessed areas, but sure enough it made it look overly dirty even after I went over it again with some watered down white to clean it up. Anyone have better advise on how to paint white?

ArchonDan

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #1 on: 07 September 2019, 15:19:59 »
The best advice I was given, to paint white, don’t use white. Start with a base coat of gray. Do your wash and then paint using layers of lighter grays. Then highlight the edges with white if needed. I find this a good method and less frustrating when doing whites.
« Last Edit: 07 September 2019, 15:21:49 by ArchonDan »

Lorcan Nagle

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #2 on: 07 September 2019, 16:20:52 »
The best advice I was given, to paint white, don’t use white. Start with a base coat of gray. Do your wash and then paint using layers of lighter grays. Then highlight the edges with white if needed. I find this a good method and less frustrating when doing whites.

This, this, this and this.
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worktroll

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #3 on: 07 September 2019, 18:31:19 »
Do you want high quality, or table ready?

I can't help with the first, but there's a shortcut to the second I immodestly call Worktroll White, which helped me get through two Level IIIs of Blakists ;)

Step 1: Base black
Step 2: Drybrush white all over
Step 3: Go back over panel lines with a black fine-tip pen - not a micro pen, something like a uniball 0.5mm. Doesn't matter if it's a little heavy, because ...
Step 4: Drybrush white all over, with lightly loaded brush, another 2-3 times.

Then detail, as required. It gives a good high-contrast flat white outcome.



For WiE Beta, just do light grey on the legs in step 4.

W.
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CTViper

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #4 on: 10 September 2019, 16:17:41 »
Thanks so much for the help Ive got a few new things to try now  ;D

Samurg

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #5 on: 08 November 2019, 01:19:21 »
The best advice I was given, to paint white, don’t use white. Start with a base coat of gray. Do your wash and then paint using layers of lighter grays. Then highlight the edges with white if needed. I find this a good method and less frustrating when doing whites.

Agree

CranstonSnord

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #6 on: 08 November 2019, 14:44:15 »
For my whites, I usually base with white, then apply a watered down black wash (1:1 water to Secret Weapon Washes Soft Body Black). Not as much staining, still gets into recesses. 2 parts water to 1 part wash is a little too thin, I find.

Bedwyr

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #7 on: 08 November 2019, 15:14:32 »
If you have an airbrush, one of the coolest ways of doing what Worktroll's process involves is to prime black and then spray from a high angle (vertical to maybe 30-45 degrees) in a method that is called "zenithal highlighting", basically adding more and more light colored paint to higher areas and less light colored paint to lower areas, allowing details to slowly emerge. I haven't tried this with 'Mechs yet, but it's a lot of fun on non-robotic minis.
Alas poor Photobucket. I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy.

Tangoforone

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #8 on: 08 November 2019, 17:33:00 »
I have had literally zero luck using white primers.  It might be me, but I have used two separate white primers with no luck. 

The first one I tried was a white spray can primer from an automotive store.  It was the same brand as the black and grey primers that I have had significant success with, but for some reason every single unit that I used the white primer on had a rough, sugar-like texture.  I stripped and am repainting an entire trinary because of this. 

The second is designed for miniatures and I believe is from Games Workshop or one of the other big paint brands.  I brushed it on and it has not applied evenly at all, even after three coats.

While normally I would blame myself, I have great success using black or grey primers so I don't know what the difference is.  And it sucks, because after I am done with my Clan force I have a significant WoB force that I am going to start working on, and a good deal of them will likely be painted in white to represent the militia and/or protectorate forces.

Moral of the story; I'm going to try priming grey when I get around to painting white.

worktroll

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #9 on: 08 November 2019, 18:00:50 »
One of these days, I'm going to base white, then apply a coat of gloss varnish, and then hit it with the magic Nuln Oil. Then maybe it'll do what I want. Alternatively, base with gloss white, ink, then drybrush with matt white.

Most matt whites just soak up the ink like chalk. The surface may make a difference if gloss, is my theory.
* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

Insaniac99

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #10 on: 08 November 2019, 18:08:28 »
If you have an airbrush, one of the coolest ways of doing what Worktroll's process involves is to prime black and then spray from a high angle (vertical to maybe 30-45 degrees) in a method that is called "zenithal highlighting", basically adding more and more light colored paint to higher areas and less light colored paint to lower areas, allowing details to slowly emerge. I haven't tried this with 'Mechs yet, but it's a lot of fun on non-robotic minis.

I do this pretty much exclusively for my miniatures.  I sometimes add a wash and a light drybrush afterwards.  Either way, after this, I spray a translucent coat of the color I want.

This technique is really useful and very Multi-purpose.

For example, this is my "standard job" (warning, large images.  I am not at a computer where I can resize them right now)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/408416036170235904/642215936094633984/1021191949_HDR.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/408416036170235904/642215935440060426/1021191950b_HDR.jpg

Here is how it can work with organics:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/408416036170235904/642216148640727080/0715192050_HDR.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/408416036170235904/642254608714039296/0128192101_HDR.jpg

It even works if you want to do it with metalic pant to have an undershine.  This was my first test with it, I plan to use starker contrasting metallics next time because the two dark colors I picked were too close together.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/408416036170235904/642239006213406729/1107192147_HDR.jpg

One of these days, I'm going to base white, then apply a coat of gloss varnish, and then hit it with the magic Nuln Oil. Then maybe it'll do what I want. Alternatively, base with gloss white, ink, then drybrush with matt white.

Most matt whites just soak up the ink like chalk. The surface may make a difference if gloss, is my theory.
I find a gloss coat before the wash is the way to go.  As long as you are applying the varnishes properly, you can varnish as much as you want, they are like a save button and can be used many times throughout a paint job.

Bedwyr

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #11 on: 08 November 2019, 20:54:16 »
Inks are really good for that. Adding color and saturation without getting too heavy or spattery a coat, especially white ink.
Alas poor Photobucket. I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy.

Ghaz

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #12 on: 09 November 2019, 18:15:54 »
I have had literally zero luck using white primers.  It might be me, but I have used two separate white primers with no luck. 

The first one I tried was a white spray can primer from an automotive store.  It was the same brand as the black and grey primers that I have had significant success with, but for some reason every single unit that I used the white primer on had a rough, sugar-like texture.  I stripped and am repainting an entire trinary because of this. 

The second is designed for miniatures and I believe is from Games Workshop or one of the other big paint brands.  I brushed it on and it has not applied evenly at all, even after three coats.

While normally I would blame myself, I have great success using black or grey primers so I don't know what the difference is.  And it sucks, because after I am done with my Clan force I have a significant WoB force that I am going to start working on, and a good deal of them will likely be painted in white to represent the militia and/or protectorate forces.

Moral of the story; I'm going to try priming grey when I get around to painting white.

There's a reason for that.  The pigment used in white paint (i.e., titanium dioxide) has the largest minimum size so a pure white paint can look rough whereas an off white can 'fill in' between the titanium dioxide pigment with pigment with a smaller minimum size and give you a smoother finish.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/05/31/the-science-of-paintgw-homepage-post-2fw-homepage-post-3/
« Last Edit: 09 November 2019, 18:17:39 by Ghaz »

Bedwyr

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #13 on: 09 November 2019, 18:41:19 »
There's a reason for that.  The pigment used in white paint (i.e., titanium dioxide) has the largest minimum size so a pure white paint can look rough whereas an off white can 'fill in' between the titanium dioxide pigment with pigment with a smaller minimum size and give you a smoother finish.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/05/31/the-science-of-paintgw-homepage-post-2fw-homepage-post-3/

Exactly.


I'll also reiterate the use of something like this:



Offwhite is good, but this is how you get from here to there with smooth white coverage (I've only airbrushed this stuff; don't know what brushwork would be like using it as you would a wash).
Alas poor Photobucket. I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy.

Insaniac99

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Re: Painting Help
« Reply #14 on: 10 November 2019, 13:05:07 »
Exactly.


I'll also reiterate the use of something like this:



Offwhite is good, but this is how you get from here to there with smooth white coverage (I've only airbrushed this stuff; don't know what brushwork would be like using it as you would a wash).

Yes, use the inks, they are great.

As to how to use them with brushes, adding medium will help thicken up the texture, since it is primarily the thin pigment you want.  You can also use it like a glaze, rather than a wash to build up the white layer.