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Author Topic: MASC House Rules?  (Read 241 times)

Goose

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MASC House Rules?
« on: 01 June 2020, 20:53:37 »
MASC is a form of enema in my circles, but it's kind'a nice in MWO: Has anyone some form of house rule to make them desirable, but not a Gimme, in tabletop?
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nckestrel

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #1 on: 01 June 2020, 23:14:05 »
What's wrong with the existing rules?
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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #2 on: 02 June 2020, 01:21:25 »
What's wrong with the existing rules?
A full MASC 'Mech battalion activates the system to try and get a tactical advantage and 1 Mech just freezes (on average).

It's not nearly as bad as, say, HVACs, but it's still an equipment that seems much more appropriate in a Solaris arena than on a battlefield with regiments of 'Mechs, where a minimum ~3% "self-kill" failure rate per activation is not exactly trivial.  Of course, on Solaris you have TSM...

More importantly, the MASC failure system just isn't... fun.  RACs can be interesting to manage since you manage the jam chance with your rate of fire, and the jams are a temporary and fixable issue.  Things like the RISC hyper laser get a pass since it doesn't pretend to be a mature, viable system.  MASC failures though, I can confidently say those have never added to the game's enjoyment when I've played, on either end.

As for house rules, when playing online MM has that unofficial "Kinder MASC" or something which I use.  Basically makes the avoid failure countdown start at 0+, failure-free on the first activation.  Kind of makes MASC a sensible Mech-scale WEP (War Emergency Power) or an afterburner, a nice boost but not something you want to have active all the time.  With that rule, the more conservative players can get good use out of the system, and the daring players can still push their 'Mechs to the limits with all the risks that entail.  Overall it feels more like you're managing a system and if your Mech goes kaput it feels more like it's your fault that you pushed the 'Mech too far and less like you're playing Russian Roulette by activating MASC with your war machines.

garhkal

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #3 on: 02 June 2020, 02:14:28 »
You're using the OLD MASC rules, that lock you up.
As per the revised rules, failig a masc roll just does one crit to each leg...
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lucho

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #4 on: 02 June 2020, 10:59:08 »
agreed, the new rules for MASC improve the usefulness considerably  8)
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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #5 on: 02 June 2020, 21:41:24 »
You're using the OLD MASC rules, that lock you up.
As per the revised rules, failig a masc roll just does one crit to each leg...
Huh.  Didn't know that.

In that case at least the 'Mech can hobble off in the event of MASC failure instead of being effectively a write-off.  That's not as bad as it used to be, but I don't think that changes the fundamental issue that the MASC failure thing isn't much fun for either side.

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #6 on: 02 June 2020, 21:49:07 »
i still like kinder masc where the failure can be reduced to zero again

Atarlost

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #7 on: 02 June 2020, 22:10:50 »
You're using the OLD MASC rules, that lock you up.
As per the revised rules, failig a masc roll just does one crit to each leg...

That's still more likely than not a mission killed mech, and is needlessly punitive to quads. 

I'd suggest increasing MASC heat instead of having a failure chance, or having the failure chance start at 13 or even 14 and drop by 1 for each consecutive round of use past the first. 

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #8 on: 02 June 2020, 23:01:44 »
Seems a bit too much of a "fix".

I don't even understand "starting at 13/14" ?    MASC starts at 2 to fail.

If I was to try to limit the pain of MASC.....

1.  Change the chart to be +1 per added turn instead of the existing chart.

2.  Bigger issue I have is how it adds to BV.  I think they over charge for an item that can't be used every turn.
Maybe calculate the offensive MP max as "RUN MP + [(MASC MP - RUN MP)/2 (Round Down)].
I think that might be a bit kinder to BV calculations than the current formula.

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garhkal

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #9 on: 03 June 2020, 02:25:30 »
Huh.  Didn't know that.

In that case at least the 'Mech can hobble off in the event of MASC failure instead of being effectively a write-off.  That's not as bad as it used to be, but I don't think that changes the fundamental issue that the MASC failure thing isn't much fun for either side.

But if there was no penalty for borking up your MASC roll, it IMO would be potentially TOO potent..

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Kojak

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #10 on: 03 June 2020, 04:32:50 »
Given that MASC rules debuted in 1989, and TW came out back in 2006, it's probably worth noting that at this point, the "new" MASC rules have been the standard for nearly as long as the old were, and will soon overtake them for venerability.
« Last Edit: 03 June 2020, 04:34:39 by Kojak »
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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #11 on: 03 June 2020, 10:05:22 »
But if there was no penalty for borking up your MASC roll, it IMO would be potentially TOO potent..
There's still a penalty with the house-rule, you just can't brick your 'Mech on turn 1 anymore.

Atarlost

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Re: MASC House Rules?
« Reply #12 on: 03 June 2020, 15:05:30 »
Seems a bit too much of a "fix".

I don't even understand "starting at 13/14" ?    MASC starts at 2 to fail.

I'm more used to house ruling d20 systems and avoid 1/36 failure gear like the plague and if it comes up MegaMek handles the math. 

For a roll over you want to start at 1 or 0 and add 1 per consecutive round past the first. 

2.  Bigger issue I have is how it adds to BV.  I think they over charge for an item that can't be used every turn.
Maybe calculate the offensive MP max as "RUN MP + [(MASC MP - RUN MP)/2 (Round Down)].
I think that might be a bit kinder to BV calculations than the current formula.

From a BV standpoint the thing to do is just remove the failure chance entirely.  You're paying for the full run speed so you should get it.  Official MASC isn't safe to use every second turn either so it'll still be overpriced, but it's not at all obvious how much it's overpriced.