Is there an inherent humor to Battletech?

[Vehrec]

Like, we call the 'Mechs 'walking tanks' and talk a lot about how ponderous and heavy an Atlas or even a Flea is, but when you look at the actual densities, you start to wonder if some of these designs could swim if they were sealed.  The armor can reject anything as long as there's enough layers left, and has an advantage against more primitive weapons, which means that say, a meter-and-a-half long rod perpetrator shatters into dust and ablates away maybe a few millimeters.  The clans think it's not a contraction if you don't put an apostrophe in it, Query affirmative?  The greatest empire in human history kept it's currency backed by a rare Metalloid with important industrial uses kept in Fort Knox, and we're supposed to believe it's the element, not the government that backs the money.  There's the mech gladiator planet, at a time when Mechs are rare enough that four can conquer a world.  And there's the old shame of the LAM, which is too soft sci-fi for a setting with FTL, magical fusion, and occasionally, the phantom mech effect.  But if you put wheels on it instead of fusion torches, it's okay.

[DevianID]

There 100% is an inherent humor to clans.  From the inception they had a lot of contradictory stuff put into them, purposefully.

The density thing isnt real, its a result of scale bloat.  Mechs dont float in the rules, the only reason they would float is if you use incorrect art and several assumptions.  So no inherent humor there.

Armor works the way it does cause of game rules, but there isnt anything inherently comical about it.  You can make some assumptions of real world stuff, but how effective armor is, well thats kinda the point.  Like the tiny KE penetrator on the abrams really is too tiny next to the gauss rifle KE penetrator.  The 120mm single shot KE round really would do 0 damage if the gauss does 15, thats the point of the advanced armor and the gauss rifle.  If anything, the game undersells its weapons by a huge margin because of the new take on infantry rules where a gauss slug takes out lke 2 troopers... when in reality a gauss slug would impact like a meteor.  The older rules did a better job keeping weight to the btech weapons, as the new infantry rules are very often the 'problem' when btech and real world are brought up in a comical way.  It was a huge mistake (IMHO) to detail infantry the way they did--ACs are abstract for a good reason, so putting (bad) conversion formulas for specific handguns/small arms, instead of keeping them abstract, added a lot of issues.  If anything, the infantry rules are comical, with 28 people practically shoulder to shoulder in a hex with rules for what a revolver does to mech armor.  Remove the new (bad, again IMHO) infantry rules and make them more abstract again, and its problem solved.

As for the 4 mech thing, well honestly the very initial fluff with mad max trappings was always a joke setting past the first box set when the game moved away from the Dougram/more serious gritty bits.  And it shows with the even more exaggerated rock album art.  The art for the early scenario books was NOT taking itself seriously at all, which contrasts the later setting.  Like, yes fighting shirtless in short shorts is very much a literal joke to put rocker babes on the cover, and they did later go back and put shirts on Natasha and the like, because yeah the OG art is a joke, even back then it was too much and had to be modified.

As for the LAM and Phantom Mech, yeah along with shirtless Natasha they cut those sillier elements pretty quickly.  So again, not a joke, they reduced those elements greatly to make the setting less silly and more serious.  Its still sci-fi, but like you said they didnt want soft scifi or campy sci fi, so they changed those bits.

[BrianDavion]

Like, we call the 'Mechs 'walking tanks' and talk a lot about how ponderous and heavy an Atlas or even a Flea is, but when you look at the actual densities, you start to wonder if some of these designs could swim if they were sealed.  The armor can reject anything as long as there's enough layers left, and has an advantage against more primitive weapons, which means that say, a meter-and-a-half long rod perpetrator shatters into dust and ablates away maybe a few millimeters.  The clans think it's not a contraction if you don't put an apostrophe in it, Query affirmative?  The greatest empire in human history kept it's currency backed by a rare Metalloid with important industrial uses kept in Fort Knox, and we're supposed to believe it's the element, not the government that backs the money.  There's the mech gladiator planet, at a time when Mechs are rare enough that four can conquer a world.  And there's the old shame of the LAM, which is too soft sci-fi for a setting with FTL, magical fusion, and occasionally, the phantom mech effect.  But if you put wheels on it instead of fusion torches, it's okay.

this isn't humor these are contridictions, many of which are in universe contridictions

[Inxentas]

There is humor in the way some rules are written, at least. I don't find the universe to be humorous, what scarce attempts there are to crack a joke just doesn't really pass my (non-American) cultural filter. I do think it can be, but the humor mostly comes from the players and the jokes/memes they make, not the universe. Or maybe I just have funny friends idk

[MadCapellan]

I'd agree - there is an inherent pulp, almost camp humor to Battletech. It's the kind of deadpan, straightface situational humor you used to see in films like The Twelve Chairs or The Producers. Insult comedy kind of stole the comedy crown back in the 90s in the US, so you don't see films like that any more. Thar may be why it doesn't register as deliberate humor, but it is hard to deny a lot of things about the setting & story are humorous!

[Gotthammer]

All contractions have an apostrophe in them. Two words put together is a compound word (eg grandmother). A compound word with letters taken out, but no apostrophe, is a portmanteau*. Which is 100% completely different to a contraction so doesn't count and is fine to say 👍

But anyways, I think there it is an air of absurdity to it all. Like BattleTech can be used as a vehicle for telling stories about the human condition, but it's also an 80's action movie crossed with knights and princesses all wrapped up in giant robots.

*Portmanteaus are also something that is created consciously, like motel, whereas a contraction stems from linguistic drift. Making up weirdo in-group Newspeak style language is very Clan and a further way to separate their society.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I'd agree - there is an inherent pulp, almost camp humor to Battletech. It's the kind of deadpan, straightface situational humor you used to see in films like The Twelve Chairs or The Producers. Insult comedy kind of stole the comedy crown back in the 90s in the US, so you don't see films like that any more.

Which is a tragedy, since it's left comedy in media much worse.

Back on topic: there has to be some inherent humor in Battletech because the idea of a giant walking combat robot is itself silly.

[Pat Payne]

Which is a tragedy, since it's left comedy in media much worse.

Yeah. As much as Don Rickles was a genius (and he was a genuine nice guy without a mean bone in his body off stage from everything I've heard), everybody trying to ape him without understanding why he resonated with audiences gave us a lot of nasty meanspirited "comedy".

Back on topic: there has to be some inherent humor in Battletech because the idea of a giant walking combat robot is itself silly.

FWIW, I always thought a lot of the humor was in the loving easter eggs and shout-outs that littered the pre-Unseen meta (sadly, but understandably, largely discarded after the HG lawsuit to avoid even more IP trouble) -- with units based on Buckaroo Banzai and Tolkein's orcs, or the entirety of Zeta Battalion being largely a laundry list of Mobile Suit Gundam characters. And even post-Unseen, there were some good ones, like Jaime Wolf getting a uniform and depiction straight out of The Hunt for Red October (seriously, for a good long while Wolf was apparently based on Schean Connery), or the TRO for the Wasp in Historical: First Succession War, having a notable WSP-1L pilot named "Rico Cazador" (for those who may not get the joke, "Cazador" is Spanish for "Hunter", and I'll leave it at that )

[Mendrugo]

There's a lot of room in the setting for all kinds of stories to be told, in a variety of genres.  War stories are, of course, the norm.  But there's also room for two-fisted pulp action; body horror; tragedies; inspiring tales of heroism; noir tales immersing characters in seedy underworlds; and so on.

And there's definitely room for wacky hijinks and comical misadventures.

Some of my favorites:
Ambrosia, by the recently departed Steve Mohan, Jr.  A group of mercs discovers a delicious berry on an uncharted world and tries to get a contract to supply it to the Hanseatic League.  Then they run into the waking nightmare that is the Hanseatic bureaucracy.

Johnny Mace, 'Mech Ace (Edward N. Smith, BattleCorps):  A cocky, dumb as dirt MechWarrior seeks fame and fortune through the offices of Leech Contractors & Negotiators on Galatea.  Features a nice "who's on first" routine using the systems of A Place, Here, and Anywhere.

Dispatch (by Liz Danforth and Mike Stackpole, in the original Shrapnel anthology):  The fun of reading others' mail - and seeing a Marik officer's planned ambush get utterly, career-ruiningly obliterated by Cranston and Rhonda Snord.

Painting the Town (by Mark O'Green in the original Shrapnel):  A group of Kurita infantry troops defeat mysterious Marauders with just paint grenades.

And Then There Was the Time.. (by Mark O'Green in the original Shrapnel anthology...seeing a trend here):  A Combine geisha is bored to tears by a fighter pilot's endless war stories.  ("Wolfster goons?")

Tournament of Champions (HBS BattleTech DLC): The ultimate battle to prove one's martial supremacy in the finest, purest expression of military force in human history: the UrbanMech.

One Man's Trash (HBS BattleTech DLC):  The unit is contracted to recover LosTech office supplies by a parrot wearing sunglasses (employer left the filter on)

Ghost of Christmas Present (Michael Stackpole - BattleCorps reprint of promo fiction posted to GENie):  A pirate attack on Christmas eve features "Anti-Nick and the Elves From Hell"

Stitch in Time (Dayle A. Dermatis, BattleCorps): A young girl's obsession with fashion and Melissa Steiner's wedding gown ends up unintentionally foiling an assassination attempt.

Ace Darwin and the Sidewinder Canyon (James Bixby, Shrapnel #6): tall tales of heroic (and somewhat unbelievable) derring do

Blitzernte (Kevin Killiany - BattleCorps): A desperate race by a Saturn Harvester crew to deliver enough sun guavas to the raiders to get them to leave peacefully.

Ace Darwin and the Battle of the Beer Fridge (James Bixby, Shrapnel #8): More Ace Darwin insanity.

Foolproof (James Bixby, Shrapnel #12): The true tale of how Thomas Hogarth created the Heavy Gauss Rifle.  The title does a lot of heavy lifting with various meanings, here.

Ace Darwin and the Second Try Fiasco (James Bixby, Shrapnel #15):  Need I say more?

Storms of Fate - Alternate Chapter Six (Loren Coleman, BattleCorps April Fools):  Vlad and Katrina re-enact the climactic scene from American Pie.

C.U.P.P.S: Civilian UrbanMech Patrol and Protection Service (James Kirtley, Shrapnel #14):  COPS...with UrbanMechs.

Clan Spaniel Saves Strana Mechty (Ken' Horner - BattleCorps AFD product): Cartoon animals battle evil monkeys for the fate of the Clans.

The Great UrbanMech Uprising (Eric Salzman, Shrapnel #8):  The pilots of the Urbie Derby collective band together to teach the Solaris Games Commissioner an important lesson about the meaning of fear.

Escaoe from Castle Wulfensteiner (Herb Beas, AFD product):  RPG action in the Deep Periphery.

Quikscell: Tax Evasion or Typo? (Daniel Isberner, Shrapnel #9):  No, it's not that authors have been making typos all these years.  It's an intentional side effect of Quikscell's tax evasion schemes.

Please Hold for the Clan Sea Fox Customer Care and Service Department (Paul Sjardin and Aaron Cahall - Shrapnel #7):  Read the fine print before signing up for the extended warranty and undercoating.

Reindeer Down (Daniel Isberner, Shrapnel #3):  A scenario where you are rewarded with candy for seizing objective points.

The Curious Case of Colin Coolidge's Cursed Cooling Suit (Josh Perian, Shrapnel #13):  Ancient relics with curious histories.

Mercenaries Entertainment Network Digest: June 3152 (Ken' Horner, Shrapnel #15): The latest in holovid entertainment.

Clan Spaniel Sourcebook (Eric Salzman, AFD product): Yep - canon.

[Pat Payne]

One of my favorite comedy bits, BTW, is a little throwaway bit from the most recent House Marik handbook (2005, IIRC?)

In a sidebar, Max Liao is berating Janos for his lack of support during the 4th Succession War, and demanding that Janos do something in frankly insulting terms.

Janos pulls a Hanse by throwing recent history back in Max's face. He sends some "military supplies" "found" on New Delos, alleged to have been military aid to Anton from Max, including reconditioned tires, a score of left-hand-dress-uniform gloves, toilet paper, expired MREs, and the piece de resistance:

A case of "Hunky Hanse" and "Bellisima Melissa" dolls, and a case of Prozac, notated "hand DIRECTLY to Chancellor"

[Swankmotron]

I think there's absolutely a bit of inherent silliness in it the same way you might think of M*A*S*H. It has a deathly serious side and it can turn on a dime either way.

All one or the other and it wouldn't work, but there are things about the universe that are just absolutely silly, too. And there's nothing wrong with that, either.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Yeah, Battletech is a game where you can have grimdark stories from the Jihad while also having a notable pilot for the Goshawk who’s Darkwing Duck. And that’s a good thing because I think we’ve probably all seen what happens when you get someone who tries to take things completely seriously all the time in a game. Like the 40K players who don’t get that the setting is a parody.

[Vehrec]

You can absolutely tell funny stories in a war setting.

But I was talking more about like, all stories in Battltech having an element of comedy in them from the very facts of the setting.  That the absurdities and facts of the fiction are such that you just gotta have a laugh at it now and again.

[Pat Payne]

Like BattleTech can be used as a vehicle for telling stories about the human condition, but it's also an 80's action movie crossed with knights and princesses all wrapped up in giant robots.

This. It's really a universe created by taking Medieval European history, World Wars One and Two, Chanbara/Jidaigeki films, Mad Max/post-apocalyptic fiction, Seven Days in May, Dune, Gundam, Macross, The A-Team, George Orwell, and Game of Thrones and putting them in a blender.

[butchbird]

You can't talk battletech humour without mentioning Kenyon Marik. Guy's a riot. The things I'd do for a good novel following that merry fellow around...'course the humour might be less well received nowdays, but hey, fictional jerk!

Also, considering world history...I know the medieval period was the main historical inspiration, but more and more I find it ressembles more 17th-18th century period (guess it's 'cause I'm delving more deeply in it as years go by). Things feel like there's more of a constant evolution on the political side, the whole gentleman's war thing going on (depending on periods), and how individual regiments each have a unique personnality.

[Charistoph]

There's some puns, too, like the J. Edgar Hover tank being a play on J. Edgar Hoover, the first American FBI Director.

[Tumult and Travail]

BattleTech is a game about machines just agile enough to be clumsy fighting all over often-slippery battlefields.

Yes.

[Mendrugo]

There's some puns, too, like the J. Edgar Hover tank being a play on J. Edgar Hoover, the first American FBI Director.

And the Caspar drone WarShip is named for Caspar Weinberger, who developed the concept of the Strategic Defense Initiative.  (Double bonus for Terra's space defense system being "Reagan class")

[HABeas2]

It's BattleTech!

Of COURSE it's inherently funny. The founding principles of the game are that 12-meter walking tanks are a practical means of warfare and that large-scale interstellar conquest is somehow cost-effective enough to be viable in a universe stuffed to the gills with life-bearing planets. You don't have to get any deeper in the weeds than that to find more to mock, but it's not like you needn't try if you want to just keep poking holes through it all.

- Herb

[InsolentMyrmex]

I find some humor in the completely preposterous and horrible political machinations of the successor lords, honestly.
Nothing tops Victor Steiner Davion cloning the dead Joshua Marik so he can continue receiving war material from the Free Worlds, it’s so ridiculously amoral that I can’t help but laugh.

[Charistoph]

To be fair, it was Hanse's backup plan in case Joshua didn't make it.  Victor didn't come up with the plan.  He just signed off on keeping it going.

[InsolentMyrmex]

To be fair, it was Hanse's backup plan in case Joshua didn't make it.  Victor didn't come up with the plan.  He just signed off on keeping it going.

Of course it just doesn’t stop the idea from being COMPLETELY CRAZY

[Charistoph]

Of course it just doesn’t stop the idea from being COMPLETELY CRAZY

It almost worked on Hanse, actually.  And it worked with Thomas.

So "crazy" comes with its own metric system in the Battletech universe.

[glitterboy2098]

FWIW, I always thought a lot of the humor was in the loving easter eggs and shout-outs that littered the pre-Unseen meta (sadly, but understandably, largely discarded after the HG lawsuit to avoid even more IP trouble) -- with units based on Buckaroo Banzai and Tolkein's orcs, or the entirety of Zeta Battalion being largely a laundry list of Mobile Suit Gundam characters. And even post-Unseen, there were some good ones, like Jaime Wolf getting a uniform and depiction straight out of The Hunt for Red October (seriously, for a good long while Wolf was apparently based on Schean Connery), or the TRO for the Wasp in Historical: First Succession War, having a notable WSP-1L pilot named "Rico Cazador" (for those who may not get the joke, "Cazador" is Spanish for "Hunter", and I'll leave it at that )

nah, the easter eggs still got added post-unseen (you yourself mentioned several!) they just got hidden a little better. so instead of the dragoon's Zeta battalion having the cast of Zeta Gundam for pilots, they started sticking them behind a an extra layer of references, like that wasp pilot.

[Pat Payne]

It almost worked on Hanse, actually.  And it worked with Thomas.

So "crazy" comes with its own metric system in the Battletech universe.

"Completely bonkers" and "works" are not mutually exclusive. Just think of Inchon (the battle, not the movie), and how we pulled it off and sunk an island with artillery while doing it...

OTOH, the plan with Joshua probably still would have turned out as badly as it did even if Hanse were still alive... nobody reacts well to being lied to about the death of their son...

[Karasu]

Also, considering world history...I know the medieval period was the main historical inspiration, but more and more I find it ressembles more 17th-18th century period (guess it's 'cause I'm delving more deeply in it as years go by). Things feel like there's more of a constant evolution on the political side, the whole gentleman's war thing going on (depending on periods), and how individual regiments each have a unique personnality.

I have to admit that I thought the original historical inspiration was the Wars of the Diadochi, aka the Wars of Alexander's Succesors.  Then the chivalric and condottieri elements were added on top.

[butchbird]

I have to admit that I thought the original historical inspiration was the Wars of the Diadochi, aka the Wars of Alexander's Succesors.  Then the chivalric and condottieri elements were added on top.

Well, "I know"...I mean that's all I've been hearing since I started lurking on the battletech forum long ago, whenever the subjet of the BTU's main historical inspiration came up.But then I'm not initiated to the mysteries of eleusis.

[Inxentas]

For me and my friend the most humorous thing in the game is the average skills of Mechwarriors. 

[Lorcan Nagle]

And the Caspar drone WarShip is named for Caspar Weinberger, who developed the concept of the Strategic Defense Initiative.  (Double bonus for Terra's space defense system being "Reagan class")

And the M-5 Drone WarShip is named for computer that controlled the USS Enterprise in a series of wargames gone wrong in the TOS episode The Ultimate Computer...

[BrianDavion]

Of course it just doesn’t stop the idea from being COMPLETELY CRAZY

I feel I need to add clarification.

VSD didn't attempt to CLONE Joshua, he didn't attempt to replace Joshua in the long term. The plan was to simply have an actor record a few videos, have a few pictures taken of them, so that the fedcom could buy time to receive some extra shipments. There where some risks sure, but let's not act like this was "Doppleganger 2.0"