Wieczorek's Archers mercenary unit and the Wyatt Militia

[Daryk]

Yeah, there should be a way to mount that kind of shovel on a 'mech... 

[ANS Kamas P81]

I can totally picture quads doing it, like a Scorpion with a deployable bulldozer on it like a Centurion AVRE.  Ah well, 'tis not to be.

I replaced the Engineering Vehicle with a Buffel VII so I can have a minesweeper along with my bulldozer, that gives me a nice self-contained engineering lance to attach to the support company.

So if I go with this organization, I've got a command team of two 'Mechs leading the force, six artillery pieces, and two companies with an additional 12 'Mechs, 8 tanks, and 8 squads of motorized troops.  With that organization, hm...if I combined the battalion command element into a singular 14 'Mech company out looking for things to shell, the artillery lance to shell things, and a reinforced FOB defense force consisting of the tanks and infantry, I'd make Chaos Campaign Succession Wars happy with an all-BattleMech company for its missions.  I suppose I could also assign one lance of tanks to bodyguard the Artillery 'Mechs; four heavily armored AC/20 carriers is going to ruin a wayward scout's day - and that's before I get to the LRMs and SRMs on the artillery pieces...

The good news is that it leaves me with about 6.5 million C-bills more than I had before, which will go into padding my paychecks and supplies.  I have enough for four months of funding and supply, in addition to stocking up on spare armor plate and extra ammunition above and beyond monthly expenditure. 

[Daryk]

Might Scarborough Ltd. interest you in a gander at their catalog?   

[ANS Kamas P81]

Might Scarborough Ltd. interest you in a gander at their catalog?   

Next unit I come up with is going to definitely dip into some of those.  Maybe I'll even fill out Kampfgruppe Wieczorek with some extra vehicles, some fast hovers to do ground based recon in force missions.  I'm gonna have a lot to decide once I see where the timeline's moved up to for 3153 and what the 21st Centauri Lancers have been doing all this time...I suppose I'll be going to Scarborough Fair. 

[Daryk]

Awesome, thanks! 

[ANS Kamas P81]

I should beef up my AA forces for the Krazy Ws as I planned, but I'm not sure what to roll with.  Rifleman IICs would be nice, they're just expensive at the 23 million C-bill price and the penalties to maintenance leave me hesitant still.  Recon in force seems to be the next addition, taking the lance of Ferrets and platoon of troopers and adding a pair of mixed lances of Pegasus (3058) and Saladin (Armor) hovertanks.  That should give me some nice fast eyes with teeth in Delta Company.

I suppose it'll be time to after that to order some more Archers and get some Arrow IV artillery in the field.  After that, I think I'm going to want full bodyguard lances for the ARCs, with one of the bodyguard an antiaircraft unit previously bought and...well, more Archers I suppose.  LRMs are good for AA work.

Maybe I should have gone with a Mule class DropShip for a transport, since I'm apparently stocking up fast on small vehicles.  I'll have to see if a Triumph can really cut it or not...  Not sure just how I'm going to afford the Clan tech conversions I had in mind, because those get painfully expensive for an Inner Sphere force.

[Daryk]

In one of the threads linked through the catalog, there's a Gauss Rifle variant of the Saladin... 

[idea weenie]

Maybe I should have gone with a Mule class DropShip for a transport, since I'm apparently stocking up fast on small vehicles.  I'll have to see if a Triumph can really cut it or not...  Not sure just how I'm going to afford the Clan tech conversions I had in mind, because those get painfully expensive for an Inner Sphere force.

A Mule is good to make a good first impression, as the Q-Mules are occurring later.  You are approaching the planet as a merchant trader rather than an obvious attacker, and if you keep communications open with the local spaceport they won't immediately give you the artillery welcome mat.  Carrying the small vehicles as cargo instead of each in their own Vehicle Bay means you can shove a lot more combat capability if the locals are friendly.

You can also carry lots of stuff on board, meaning if you can find expensive stuff a planet needs you can carry it as well to sell. 

Final advantage is that as long as you are heading to a friendly system, you only need a single Docking Collar to travel, compared to Unions or Leopards needing multiple collars.

[DOC_Agren]

I had a thought of converting an Archer into a combat engineer/salvage 'Mech, especially one that could haul off a hundred and forty tons with a battery of lift hoists and a backhoe replacing one hand.  It would still have one LRM15 and one SRM4, plus a couple lasers, so it wouldn't be completely useless in a fight.  I don't feel like paying for the custom machine though, as neat an idea as it might be, so I'll let it go.  Besides, 'Mechs can't mount bulldozers anyway, so boo.

While that archer sounds cool, during 3000 that mod would not make sense vrs a combat machine

[ANS Kamas P81]

So what's the consensus on swapping around the bays of a DropShip and turning a cargo dropper into a combined arms carrier?  I know some folks prefer to stick to canon, and there's mention of the Seeker (and Triumph) being easy to reconfigure, but what about a Mule class?  Just idly wondering.

And yeah, the idea of having the Mule act as a freighter working out of Pandora would be a bonus to my income.  Nothing like profiting on unused assets, right?  Plus if I want I can put bays for everything onboard and still have a cavern to fill for cargo, 8,000+ tons on a stock Mule for stuff to bring along.

So that also explains better how the Wieczorek family evacuated Zoetermeer, I think.  A civilian DropShip is going to find it much easier to sneak out of a recently Trialed planet than a left over military transport, and over the decades to come probably put in solid service for the family and helped restore their wealth on Carlisle.  So it'd be the same DropShip that Mirage 'inherits' in 3150 that was used back in the day for the Archers, refurbished to haul around her new force.

I decided to throw bones and see if I could get myself a JumpShip; after whiffing out on every experience of Merchant I finally got a regular-quality Scout jumper to go with my Mule.  So I have transport where I need to go, at least, and can run cargo around the Tamar Pact as long as the jumper doesn't get too far away from Pandora.

So going over Kampfgruppe Wieczorek and wanting to organize a component of the TOE to handle each general mission I'd expect to be called upon.  So far I've got artillery, artillery scouts, artillery protection, anti-aircraft defense, route recon and security, FOB security, and logistics/engineering.  Are there any roles I should be accounting for?  Each of them is roughly a company in size, which seems to be the right kind of size for a unit in the two-battalion bulk.  The question of expansion comes in; I'm definitely going to bring in Arrow IV Archers for a second firing battery, but I'm left wondering what to do for the protection lances.

The munchtastic goober in me wants to build artillery lances of two artillery mechs with two regular BattleMechs, since I can name them all Artillery Fire Lances and get the Oblique Artillerist SPA for each of my artillery 'Mechs.  I was originally doing that with my tanks, but it feels like a cheap and ugly tactic.  The realist in me says to make each battery of Thumpers and Archers a single lance, and apply the Oblique Artillerist SPA to the lowest skilled gunners, to offset their more common MOF misses.

I don't know, my brain's going all over the place with this.  More coherent thoughts to follow tomorrow I suppose.

While that archer sounds cool, during 3000 that mod would not make sense vrs a combat machine

And there's plenty of IndustrialMechs to do the job anyway, without sacrificing a combat 'Mech for it.

[DOC_Agren]

For your unit...  a civilian cargo hauler is a better fit.   I have suggested them a couple times to you in posts here.   It is not like you need to Combat Land your Support Unit.  If you do, everything has already gone pear shape for that contact.

While Arrow firing Archers can be a nice fit, and shocking there no canon design with it??...   what about this Arrow IV (Combat Vehicle)?

[Failure16]

I ama big fan of modifying DropShips--bays at least. My homegrown regiment has their ASF bays reconfigured for 'Mech cubicles, and I don't care!

DOC_A is right: this outfit should not be doing combat landings, so stick with what is most cost-effective to get your people where they need to go.

[Daryk]

A Mule makes sense, and shouldn't be too hard to modify.

As for missing capabilities, with an actual JumpShip to defend you need some Marines... 

[ANS Kamas P81]

For your unit...  a civilian cargo hauler is a better fit.   I have suggested them a couple times to you in posts here.   It is not like you need to Combat Land your Support Unit.  If you do, everything has already gone pear shape for that contact.

Yeah, I'm not worried about dropping or combat landings, but more in the maintenance bonuses having the Bays for your vehicles gives you.  That plus the cargo space I have should more than account for my supplies, which was starting to overload my Dropper.

While Arrow firing Archers can be a nice fit, and shocking there no canon design with it??...   what about this Arrow IV (Combat Vehicle)?

Hm...well, they did end up on the border with the Falcons, so it's not like they're a Canopian exclusive design.  It's not a bad design, and carries more ammo than the Archers I came up with (only ten rounds, weep and wail) but it's also heavier, which means I'm going to need a heavy recovery vehicle Just In Case.  I'll consider it, but I admit I'm a fan of Archers...but I'm already running enough custom designs in here as it is, I think.

I ama big fan of modifying DropShips--bays at least. My homegrown regiment has their ASF bays reconfigured for 'Mech cubicles, and I don't care!

Frankly I'm of that opinion as well; as empty as DropShips are and as common as mixed forces are, I'm all for customizing things myself.

DOC_A is right: this outfit should not be doing combat landings, so stick with what is most cost-effective to get your people where they need to go.

*nods* Agreed on the combat landings, like I said.  I just prefer to have the cargo space for the various bays to allow maintenance and modification; I probably don't need 100% bays but it means not having to total up my vehicle crews as more foot infantry bays in the ship.  Making sure that everything meets the requirements for maintenance cycles is also pretty important, since the risks of degredation are pretty high and not uncommon.

A Mule makes sense, and shouldn't be too hard to modify.

Mule it is, then, and still has plenty of cargo space outside of the bays to haul freight around and make a c-bill on the side.

As for missing capabilities, with an actual JumpShip to defend you need some Marines... 

Ooh, there's a good one.  Two platoons of marines, perhaps, one for the DropShip and one for the JumpShip.  They'd probably fit in the same company as my platoon(s) of scout/snipers, just for a place to put them on the TOE.

[Daryk]

*snip*
Ooh, there's a good one.  Two platoons of marines, perhaps, one for the DropShip and one for the JumpShip.  They'd probably fit in the same company as my platoon(s) of scout/snipers, just for a place to put them on the TOE.

Glad I could help! 

[DOC_Agren]

As I said much early on modify a dropship

Modify a dropship.. 
like most things Aerotech wise...   if only the "yards" we know of could do maintenance, then IS would have broken down during the succession wars.
I expect there are a # of "Shady Tree Mechanic" who can handle maintenance or "mods" at a number of planets starports.

but what about a new Trutzburg or a old battered Fortress Dropship?  Bring your own extra Longtom(s) to the party as well.

So I'm not seeing a issue "fixing" how you want.

Now a question: more in the maintenance bonuses having the Bays for your vehicles gives you.
I thought you were talking about, renting it out while you were on contract?  Which is not a bad way to work when you are long term deployment.  Which means you only using those bays while traveling between contracts or when it unemployed.

My next question is how are you planning on using ArrowIV units?   I will have to admit I have never had good luck with Mech carriers, yep it has range so I can engage my enemies hopefully before they see me, but you need survivable Tag Unit(s) to be effective.  But as a Base Defense Unit you can mix your load

I sent this much earlier this to

Base Security, I would still look at a lance of Partisan Air Defense Tank C3 Lance with Master backed by a Arrow IV Assault Vehicle or 2 loaded with 2 tons of Air-Defense Arrow Missile, 1 Thunder/FASCAM Arrow Missile, and 1 standard. 

Basicly this setup handles all your ADA requirements, and with add bonus of 4 map range to slow an ground attacker

Marine setup is good, but might a recommand shotguns (so you don't blow holes in the walls)

[ANS Kamas P81]

Okay, so thinking this over further.

Two firing batteries of artillery, one Thumper one Arrow.  Two bodyguard lances of Goblin ISVs to protect them as well as load a foot platoon in for security.  Each battery gets a transport lance of heavy APCs to haul ammo and tech teams with, giving me a total lift of 22 tons of ammo plus six tech teams being deployed to reload.  That gives me two reinforced companies overall, one for each firing battery.  Considering the Arrow IV vehicle's weight, however, it means I can't transport one around with my Uni, in case of damage.  I think I'll stick to another Archer modded into an Arrow carrier, which I'm pretty sure I posted to the design thread.  I'll live with the ten rounds of ordnance onboard, and just keep the tech teams busy and loading more ammo.

Thumpers really are the superior artillery piece.

Scouts are hugely important, for obvious reasons.  I'm keeping the Rangers, of course, and their lance of recon helicopters.  Adding two lances of two Pegasus (3058) and two Saladin hovercraft, with a pair of Pegasus 3058s as a command element for the company.  Another reinforced company, and should be enough to find targets and wreck some face while they're at it.  Keep those TMMs up!

Security forces, I'll need to protect my DropShip on the ground plus protect a FOB of some kind, as well as provide convoy protection for the ammo transports.  The DropShip has a platoon of Marines to protect it, and has whatever the spaceport's security force is as well.  Protecting the FOB is a full company of foot infantry, while convoy protection comes from a reinforced company of two lances of Goblins and two platoons of motorized infantry, which do double duty as base defense. 

Air defenses are a sticking point.  The easy answer is equipping my Goblins with CLPLs, which will generously improve their overall effectiveness.  The upgrade also includes an LRM10, so there's a nice bubble of protection from them.  The alternative is going to the Red Devil production plant, which is making Onagers and I assume Onager 2s; the latter has a HAG/30 and two LPLs which should make for a nasty platform across the board.  Downside to the Onager is that I can't haul one around on a Uni CargoMech.  I keep looking back at Rifleman IICs from the Sea Foxes, which is a 300 year old design by 3151.  No reason those shouldn't be available cheap.  One lance of Rifleman IICs is probably my best bet for AA, attaching one to each firing battery and reserving the other two 'Mechs for base defense.

Logistics have been attached directly to the firing battery in each company, though I should probably consider an extra lance of HAPCs for general usage and moving things from the DropShip to the FOB.  I also bought 20 Bulldog pickup trucks, which provides an extra 26 tons of cargo lift in a serious situation as well, but they're primarily utility vehicles for a motor pool. 

Engineering vehicles are pretty light, a Uni CargoMech which is mostly there as a heavy retrieval 'Mech to haul bogged down or disabled units 85 tons or less, two Buffel VIII engineer vehicles, and a platoon of combat engineers to handle whatever situation required.  I don't see a large amount of need on Pandora for this sort of thing, though if/when the unit gets tapped for a planetary assault they'll come in handy for creating a base.

I haven't done a major increase in the unit's size, but they've got some more teeth to them with the Arrow IV Archers added in.  It feels like it's fitting the logistics trail more appropriately, and still focuses the entire point of existence on the unit as its artillery and elements that directly support that.  Maybe I should rename it to Artilleriegruppe Wieczorek, but then I lose the Krazy Ws name. 

As I said much early on modify a dropshipSo I'm not seeing a issue "fixing" how you want.

Some folks are anathema to the idea of customized units, including DropShips.  I was wondering what the general opinion was, and everyone seems to agree on modify as you like - at least in simple cases like this.

Now a question: more in the maintenance bonuses having the Bays for your vehicles gives you.
I thought you were talking about, renting it out while you were on contract?  Which is not a bad way to work when you are long term deployment.  Which means you only using those bays while traveling between contracts or when it unemployed.

That's frankly a good point...hrm, that's not something that has an easy answer, either.  I suppose I should total up my bay requirements and shop around for a dedicated DropShip that can handle that, and use it as a dedicated troop transport that isn't being used as a cargo runner.  I've got 17 'Mechs including the Uni and Rifleman IICs and 50 light vehicles, not counting the 20 Pitbulls.  That comes to 2,550 tons of 'Mech bays and 2500 tons of Vehicle bays...at this point I think simply converting the Mule into a troop transport and dedicating 2/3 of its cargo space into Bays.  No separate cargo runs for me on the DropShip, though I can still rent out the JumpShip at least. 

My next question is how are you planning on using ArrowIV units?   I will have to admit I have never had good luck with Mech carriers, yep it has range so I can engage my enemies hopefully before they see me, but you need survivable Tag Unit(s) to be effective.  But as a Base Defense Unit you can mix your load

Arrow IV would be a more up-front artillery support unit, several km forward of the Thumper unit to maximize firepower as soon as a target's in range.  Homing missiles I'm mixed on; they do a fair bit of damage and I have TAG units equipped in the recon company (that electronics-filled Pegasus is a sweet ride) - though it's always questionable how survivable hovers are, and that 20/10 splash of regular artillery outperforms the Thumper.  The gripping hand is that ammo restriction; only two tons of ammunition for the Archer variant...I think I'll pull one of the two LRM5s and add two tons of ammo, honestly, deeper bins are gonna take longer to reload but having four tons is going to significantly boost the endurance and ammo selection.

I sent this much earlier this to Basicly this setup handles all your ADA requirements, and with add bonus of 4 map range to slow an ground attacker

I considered it, but with as dispersed as my units are going to be from each other C3 won't help much.  And I'd rather a jump-capable machine that can keep up (mostly) with the Archers, even if it's only a 3/5/3 machine alongside 4/6/4 units.  It'll hurt my strategic speed, but it can follow the artillery units into a lot more terrain than tanks can.

Marine setup is good, but might a recommand shotguns (so you don't blow holes in the walls)

Shotguns can still do damage to walls, but I'll look for something that's suitable in Daryk's lists of Neat Guns.  Granted, I say that as a shotgun lover, which I'll probably end up going with anyway, but I want to look at the infantry options. 

[DOC_Agren]

Okay, so thinking this over further.
I haven't done a major increase in the unit's size, but they've got some more teeth to them with the Arrow IV Archers added in.  It feels like it's fitting the logistics trail more appropriately, and still focuses the entire point of existence on the unit as its artillery and elements that directly support that.  Maybe I should rename it to Artilleriegruppe Wieczorek, but then I lose the Krazy Ws name.

please humor some of us and lay out the TOE in written form because you say you have not increased the unit, but my math skills are saying yes.
and keep the orginal name. 

Some folks are anathema to the idea of customized units, including DropShips.  I was wondering what the general opinion was, and everyone seems to agree on modify as you like - at least in simple cases like this.

Well if you are playing with people who don't like custom units, your force is unwelcome. 

That's frankly a good point...hrm, that's not something that has an easy answer, either.  I suppose I should total up my bay requirements and shop around for a dedicated DropShip that can handle that, and use it as a dedicated troop transport that isn't being used as a cargo runner.  I've got 17 'Mechs including the Uni and Rifleman IICs and 50 light vehicles, not counting the 20 Pitbulls.  That comes to 2,550 tons of 'Mech bays and 2500 tons of Vehicle bays...at this point I think simply converting the Mule into a troop transport and dedicating 2/3 of its cargo space into Bays.  No separate cargo runs for me on the DropShip, though I can still rent out the JumpShip at least.

You could get by with less the full bays.  Once more your force should not be doing Combat Landing so you can take the time to offload.  Plus you if need to "repair" the whole force at once it is time to GTFO of Dodge.  Maybe 6 Mech Bays..  4 Archers and 2 Rifleman IIC and 12 Light Bays to provide a Security Force when they land and off load/reload.

Arrow IV would be a more up-front artillery support unit, several km forward of the Thumper unit to maximize firepower as soon as a target's in range.  Homing missiles I'm mixed on; they do a fair bit of damage and I have TAG units equipped in the recon company (that electronics-filled Pegasus is a sweet ride) - though it's always questionable how survivable hovers are, and that 20/10 splash of regular artillery outperforms the Thumper.  The gripping hand is that ammo restriction; only two tons of ammunition for the Archer variant...I think I'll pull one of the two LRM5s and add two tons of ammo, honestly, deeper bins are gonna take longer to reload but having four tons is going to significantly boost the endurance and ammo selection.

Well here is another ArrowIV unit Chaparral with 3 tons of ammo and it counts as a light vehicle 
But then I was looking at ArrowIV as a defensive unit rather then offensive force for you.  You are looking at advance deploying them..  if you are targeting same area as Thumpers call it 12 boards ahead of the rest of your force.  Now you are looking at having someone engaging one force if found out there and you are not going to be able to rapidly direct support each other.  I'm not full sure what units are out there in this time period, but if you are loaded with clan tech assume your enemy will be as well.  Clan units tend to be faster and hit harder and farther...

I considered it, but with as dispersed as my units are going to be from each other C3 won't help much.  And I'd rather a jump-capable machine that can keep up (mostly) with the Archers, even if it's only a 3/5/3 machine alongside 4/6/4 units.  It'll hurt my strategic speed, but it can follow the artillery units into a lot more terrain than tanks can.

That was to defend your FOB to forward deploy with your units on fire missions.

Shotguns can still do damage to walls, but I'll look for something that's suitable in Daryk's lists of Neat Guns.  Granted, I say that as a shotgun lover, which I'll probably end up going with anyway, but I want to look at the infantry options.

good luck

Also another idea for your Rangers..  1 sniper rifle 1 tag unit.?

[ANS Kamas P81]

please humor some of us and lay out the TOE in written form because you say you have not increased the unit, but my math skills are saying yes.
and keep the orginal name. 

I've got a spreadsheet for it, and I'm keeping it updated as I go, but I said it wasn't a major increase.  One firing battery of 'Mechs plus a lance of AA units is all, as far as that goes.  Original name is kept, because the nickname just works too well.

Oh, wait, I did add some more bodyguard tanks.  Forgot about those, so yes, a size increase overall bigger than I first thought.

You could get by with less the full bays.  Once more your force should not be doing Combat Landing so you can take the time to offload.  Plus you if need to "repair" the whole force at once it is time to GTFO of Dodge.  Maybe 6 Mech Bays..  4 Archers and 2 Rifleman IIC and 12 Light Bays to provide a Security Force when they land and off load/reload.

That's true, but then I still have to balance out the mass being transported and see how much I can get away with as a pure DropShip.  I don't want to go with something cavernous and waste a lot of space, but at the same time I've got plenty of secondary stuff to bring along for the ride as well.  Reminder to self, more Exoskeletons for reloading and repairs.

I like the numbers for 6 'Mech and 10 Vehicle Bays for the Goblin company, that comes to 1400 tons and leaves me with...12 Archers and a Uni for 910 tons, plus 350 tons for the hovertanks, plus 360 for the rest of the Goblins, 20 tons for the Ferrets, and 320 for the Heavy APCs.  Add in a total budget of 100 tons for the infantry and support personnel, and I have a transported mass of just under 3500 tons of cargo.  Adding supplies and such is probably going to be another thousand, so I'm looking at a 4500 ton cargo mass for a DropShip.

Unfortunately there just aren't any smaller civilian ships; after perusing Sarna the best option under the rules comes back to being a Mule-class.  There's things like the Overlord which can easily be refit as a well-armed cargo carrier, having 6300 tons in its 42 bays on board, but there's the justification of it being around in the 3000s as a general-use DropShip...perhaps it was captured on the ground from the FWL or DC and kept under a contract that was judiciously followed to the letter when it came to salvage.  That gives me a reason it'd be around in the original WA days, and it'd still be useful because of all the 'Mechs that the Archers had in the old days.  It stayed in the family after the Zoetermeer evacuation, probably converted into a cargo carrier with the bays stripped out and converted into a pure cargo hold, and when Mirage got her hands on the thing in 3150 she started the process of converting it back into an assault transport while on Galatea.  She didn't stay long enough to finish up with only six 'Mech bays to start with, but managed to fit out the rest of the ship's bays while on Pandora garrisoning the planet.  That explains what it's been doing all this time (sitting in refit), where it came from, and what the future plans are for her ship.

Well here is another ArrowIV unit Chaparral with 3 tons of ammo and it counts as a light vehicle 
But then I was looking at ArrowIV as a defensive unit rather then offensive force for you.  You are looking at advance deploying them..  if you are targeting same area as Thumpers call it 12 boards ahead of the rest of your force.  Now you are looking at having someone engaging one force if found out there and you are not going to be able to rapidly direct support each other.  I'm not full sure what units are out there in this time period, but if you are loaded with clan tech assume your enemy will be as well.  Clan units tend to be faster and hit harder and farther...

I assume the enemy is Clan, because it's either the Falcons, the Bears, the Horses, the AML, or the Lyrans that we're going to be fighting outside of pirate operations.  Four of those five are Clan tech bases, with the Lyrans not far behind - and they're the least likely to do anything to the Tamar Pact, at least early on.  Matter of fact, it seems the Bears are on the way to invading the place, landing troops at Tomans at the very end of the Tamar section in the book. 

Also another idea for your Rangers..  1 sniper rifle 1 tag unit.?

Tempting.  Damn tempting.  I'll look into that, especially now that I've changed the artillery forces to include Arrow units.  Can hidden units spot for artillery without revealing themselves?  I assume they would with TAG, but what about regular spotting?

[DOC_Agren]

I would stick with the Mule, easier to believe that the Falcons let it escape over an Overlord

Glad you like the limited bays Idea, and it has been fun to help you out so far

and on the Tag/Sniper I believe they can from hidden but can someone confirm that?

[Daryk]

I think so too, but honestly I'm not sure.

Another TAG idea: More Ferrets! 

It's a shame you can't mount TAG in a Mast Mount... 

[ANS Kamas P81]

I would stick with the Mule, easier to believe that the Falcons let it escape over an Overlord

Yeah, I can't really justify an Overlord being overlooked and escaping like that.  A civilian ship, sure, what's one more freighter heading elsewhere in the - oops, it rendezvoused with a hidden pirate ship and just jumped out.  Mule it is, and I'm thinking this - while garrisoning Pandora from 3151 to 3153, they used it as a freighter for local transport and short hops away from the system, as a charter transport service.  I won't need the various bays on this particular deployment, because there's a BattleMech and Vehicle factory right there on the planet and that gives even better bonuses to maintenance rolls if I'm allowed to use its facilities.  Maybe if there's another mission that I go on in the future I'll keep the DropShip around but for the current time being it's getting used as a freighter to make some beer money on the side.

Glad you like the limited bays Idea, and it has been fun to help you out so far

Thanks, I do appreciate the help.  I'm really debating on the Arrow IV carrier, however, I do love me some tanks and it's got deep enough ammo bins that would make it useful in a proper firefight and let it pick between the various types of munitions available.  I could do the same with an Archer, especially if I get my hands on Clan Arrow IV launchers (a svelte 12 ton system compared to the IS version) from the AML.

and on the Tag/Sniper I believe they can from hidden but can someone confirm that?

Confirmed, Total Warfare p. 259: "Hidden units may not attack, but may spot for indirect fire and/or act as part of a C3 network."  I wonder how TAG counts in that scenario, I should check the rules forum.

I should add up the total cost of my Clan weapons and see how much it's going to cost me to upgrade KGr W while I'm sitting on Pandora in garrison.  The factories produce Clan technology, so it's not like it's entirely foreign to them and should have no trouble with the refits and refurbishment that might be required.

Eighteen Goblins: LPL, LRM10, SRM6, 2 MG, AMS, 9 tons FF armor: 175,000 for the LPL, 100,000 for the LRM10, 80,000 for the SRM6, 5000 for the MGs, 100,000 for the AMS, and 261,000 for the armor.  That's a total of 721,000 C-bills per tank, or a total cost of 12,978,000 to upgrade the whole lot.

Mirage's Archer boosts its missile capability and armor, four SRM6s and two LRM10s plus 11 tons of FF armor.  The armor costs 374,000, the SRM6s 320,000, the LRM10s 200,000, and that's it for her.  894,000 for her upgrade.  The other Archers are the same, but add in a pair of ERMLs for an additional 80,000 for a grand total of 974,000 each, or 4,870,000 to upgrade those.

The six Pegasus 3058s get upgraded to an MPL, four SRM6s, Clan electronics, and FF armor saving me one ton which goes back into ammo for the SRM launchers.  Laser cost is 60,000 (odd that it's cheaper than the ERML), the SRM6s another 320,000, and the Probe and ECM Suite are both 200,000, and rearmoring costs 153,000.  Total cost is 933,000 per vehicle, or 5,598,000 for the set.

Four Saladins...that's a question of upgrades, the obvious one is swapping the AC20 for a clan tech UAC20.  The Pegasuses cover the critseeking end of things with that big SRM barrage, so I want holepunchers to go along with them.  Going with a Clan UAC20 is going to cost 480,000, but that's the only weapon onboard.  The rest of the tonnage goes to armor, for an extra 136,000.  616,000 is nice and cheap compared to the rest of my upgrades and brings me to a total of 2,464,000 for the set.

And then there's the Rifleman IICs at a nice low price of 5,741,588 C-bills, a lance of those coming in at a whopping 22,966,352; definitely the biggest expense of my upgrades but by far one of the most useful. 

All told, the cost to upgrade over the 18 months on Pandora comes to 48,876,352.  With the good contacts with the AML and the takeover of Falcon factory worlds, and the presence of the Sea Foxes, it shouldn't be hard at all to get what I want, and it only comes to about 25% of my total income during that time.  Being a mercenary is surprisingly profitable, even a munchtastic clantech spammer like me.

Edit: That didn't take long to find.  No TAG for hidden units, but they can spot.  So that settles that.

Another TAG idea: More Ferrets! 

It's a shame you can't mount TAG in a Mast Mount... 

Yeah, it would be nice, but a little on the mean side.  As it is I've got my Pegasus TAGgers to handle the homing arrows; the question I wonder about now is whether to go with an Arrow battery or a second Thumper battery...that'll bump my costs up around another 6 million C-bills, but it's still on the doable side.  Decisions, decisions...I'll go with Arrow IV units, and build Archer Arrows to do it with.  I want the 4/6/4 mobility on them, especially since they're much shorter ranged than the Thumpers.

Mirage is going to need to keep her contact on Carlisle and put in an order for six more stripped down Archers in early 3152...the total cost for the 'Mech and its refit comes to 14,771,923 C-bills for the five standard models and 14,903,673 for the command version with the two tons of communications equipment.  The Archer Arrows have a Clan tech launcher (of course) and 25 rounds onboard, so while it takes a good bit of time to reload them they've got decent fire endurance. 

I imagine the rest of the income from the garrison contract is going to pay and supplies/maintenance, especially with the high cost of maintenance for custom clan gear.  I can afford it, I thiiiiink, as long as I don't suffer major battle losses.  Considering the limited exposure of this unit's core capabilities, I think it'd survive well enough, though I worry about the speedfreaks in the hovers that are spotting for fire where the battle line is hot.

[Daryk]

Don't LB-Xs have longer range than UACs?

[ANS Kamas P81]

Don't LB-Xs have longer range than UACs?

Not in this case, it's the same 12 hexes for the LB20 or UAC20.  And since I've got quad SRM6s on the Pegasus, I needed a can opener.  I posted the designs in Combat Vehicles if you want the details.

[Daryk]

Works for me then! 

[ANS Kamas P81]

And after attacking spreadsheets again, there's no way I can afford to expand Kampfgruppe Wieczorek as much as I'd first thought.  What I'm going to do is come up with a 3151 and 3153 spreadsheet for equipment and quality out of Campaign Operations, and put in for a refit cycle after the end of the current contract.  The 3153 version of things will be post-expansion, and chief in that expansion will be the Arrow IV Assault Vehicle that DOC_Agren championed.  I can afford those; more Arrow Archers not so much.  After that comes modernizing the Goblins and Archers, and adding a Rifleman IIC to each of the four artillery lances as protection elements.  The rest, I'll have to see how many C-bills I have after the monthly expenses are added up.

[Daryk]

Be prepared for sticker shock... missile launchers are EXPENSIVE in terms of monthly expenses...

[DOC_Agren]

Mule will be a good fit for your unit

So we can't tag from the Rangers as hidden units..  but we can still spot. 

My thought for the Arrow IV Assault Vehicle, was for FOB defense mode..  I'm not sure I would even as a Lryan I would like to see those a forward deployed assets without a good bodyguard force

[ANS Kamas P81]

Be prepared for sticker shock... missile launchers are EXPENSIVE in terms of monthly expenses...

Yeah, no kidding.  30,000/ton from regular LRMs, and 27,000/ton for SRMs adds up quick, especially in the 3000s with Wieczorek's Archers.  I'm downright spoiled by the cheap prices of artillery rounds.

My thought for the Arrow IV Assault Vehicle, was for FOB defense mode..  I'm not sure I would even as a Lryan I would like to see those a forward deployed assets without a good bodyguard force

That's something I'll agree with; the Arrow IV Assault Vehicle's just too slow to be on its own to get away from an attacker.  Not that Archers are that much faster, but the Thumper carrier is a 4/6/4 'Mech and those jump jets can be a great help in getting away from recon elements in tight terrain.  The idea of a lance of Arrow IV Assaults as a FOB bodyguard I'm warming up to, but that depends on just how much cash I have left over after my garrison contract.

Which...well, the rule in Campaign Operations is 5% of the value of your combat force as part of your monthly payment, and that is frankly pretty damn generous.  The reputation factor in payments especially kicked things up into a level I wasn't expecting (1.5 multiplier on the base contract fees) and gave me a total gross of 200 million C-bills for an 18 month garrison contract.  Campaign Operations p. 41 says to try reducing things to 2.5% of the value of the combat force to account for a more thrifty employer...which I think I'll do, since I'm dealing direct with the Tamar Pact for the garrison contract and they probably don't have the funds that someone like the AML does.

At 2.5% I end up with a gross of 117 million C-bills, and a net profit of 86.7 million after 18 months of peacetime expenses.  That feels better to me, and still gives me options to work with.  First thing will be only two Rifleman IICs to attach to the artillery battery, breaking it up into two lances of 3 Archers and a Rifleman.  That costs 11,483,176.

After that the Goblin and Archer upgrades to Clan tech, minus selling off the leftover IS weapons and equipment.  For the Goblins, that's 5,410,000 in net costs to upgrade all ten.  The Archers make back 190,000 in sold equipment, for 784,000 each net cost and a total of 4,704,000.  That's 21.6 out of my 86.7 million in profit...

I'll take the Chaparral for an Arrow carrier, and put a lance of them in Charlie Company for base defense.  They're cheaper than Rifleman IICs at only 2.2 million apiece, so buying one lance brings me down to 56.3 million.

...that's enough to let me buy three more Archers and an extra Rifleman IIC, if I were to bend that way.  The other option is buying and upgrading the hovercraft that would make good scouts for my artillery unit in Delta Company.  I think I'll go with the extra artillery lance, and invest what's left in battle armor for Marines for the DropShip and the JumpShip.

Time to total up exact figures and see where I'm at.

[Daryk]

Don't forget the TAGs for the Ferrets...