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Author Topic: Deep Space and Interplanetary Exploration - Houston, we are go for launch!  (Read 64989 times)

Daryk

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As directed by the mods!

We left off the last thread with a pic of the latest Soyuz heading for the pad, with some humorous commentary immediately following...

kato

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Carrying over from the last one...

I don't know why, i just like idea of one oldest forms mechanical proposultion being used move the latest form.


Took this picture in 2008. Buran orbiter being moved to a local museum by ship.

However this is not really a Buran. This is OK-GLI, the aerodynamic test vehicle for Buran. Unlike its counterpart Enterprise OK-GLI was a powered test aircraft - equipped with four engines from a Su-27 fighter jet (fuel tank was simply dropped into the cargo bay), while the main engines were mock-ups. It could take off from a runway on its own and reached up to Mach 0.62 in the air during its 25 flights. Or 300 km/h on the ground in 9 taxi runs.

Youtube video of it taking off and landing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybmj_tRETFI

OK-GLI was also pretty sturdy: During one of multiple transfers between ships on this trip - from Bahrain to Germany - it supposedly slipped off the crane, with the rear dropping 20 ft into the cargo hold of a ship. Damage was "minor". For both OK-GLI and the ship.

At the museum it's now a walk-in exhibit stood inbetween a pretty beat-up BOR-5 (1/8th-sized Buran flown suborbital - one of two still existing), the "slightly" rusted Soyuz TM-19 descent module (flown in 1994 on a Mir crew exchange flight) and mockups of Spacelab, Columbus and Zvezda originally built and used for astronaut training.

Wrangler

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Thats fortune that the OK-GLI survived. Buran wasn't so fortunate.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
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ANS Kamas P81

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The only two prototypes left, after the one that did make it to space died in 2002 when the U-Store-It "hangar" it was in collapsed and crushed it to bits.

Der Hölle Rache kocht in meinem Herzen,
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BirdofPrey

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It's a real shame Bruan was destroyed.
I mean it was a "me too" project really, and unlike the US design wasn't even originally planned as a necessary piece of a larger whole (the Space Shuttle's goal was always building a space station) since the Soviets did things differently, but the Buran and its launcher system are still better designed than their American counterpart.
Also a shame Energia didn't see much of any use, though it's at least nice the boosters went on to become the Zenit.

kato

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The only two prototypes left, after the one that did make it to space died in 2002 when the U-Store-It "hangar" it was in collapsed and crushed it to bits.
Including the various test models / prototypes, there are currently still 9 Buran around, including two partial units.

Full list:
- OK-1K1 : destroyed
- OK-1K2 : 95% complete, stored indoors in Baikonur, Kazakhstan
- OK-2K1 : 40% complete, exhibited outdoors in Moscow, Russia
- OK-2K2 : 20% complete, disassembled/scavenged
- OK-2K3 : build started, disassembled/scavenged
- OK-M (structural test article) : exhibited outdoors in Baikonur, Kazakhstan
- OK-GLI (flight test article) : exhibited indoors in Speyer, Germany
- OK-KS (electric test article) : exhibited outdoors in Sochi, Russia
- OK-MT (engineering mockup) : stored indoors in Baikonur, Kazakhstan
- OK-TVI (environmental test article*) : presumed to be stored indoors in Moscow, Russia
- OK-TVA (structural test article) : exhibited outdoors in Moscow, Russia
- OK-8M (thermal test article*) : exhibited outdoors in Moscow, Russia

* partial assemblies; OK-TVI = main hull only, OK-8M = cockpit hull section only.

In addition there's the exact 1/8th scale reentry/aerodynamic test articles. Launched on Kosmos K65M-RB5 rockets for suborbital glides with water landing for recovery.
- BOR-5 #501 : unknown
- BOR-5 #502 : exhibited indoors in Moscow, Russia
- BOR-5 #504 : unknown
- BOR-5 #503 : unknown
- BOR-5 #505 : exhibited indoors in Speyer, Germany

Thunderbolt

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Theoretically possible to harness the power of a black hole to power a starship with much higher end/net efficiency than nuclear or antimatter (which must be generated by energy-inefficient means in the first place)

You can get about 0.1% mc2 from fission, 1% mc2 from fusion and 30-50% mc2 from a BH:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_hole_starship

Kit deSummersville

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I'd name the first one The Cygnus.
Looking for an official answer? Check the Catalyst Interaction Forums.

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Everyone else's job is easy, so tell them how to do it, everyone loves that!

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Thunderbolt

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Sagittarius after that  ???

Kit deSummersville

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Sagittarius after that  ???

No, the Palomino!
Looking for an official answer? Check the Catalyst Interaction Forums.

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Everyone else's job is easy, so tell them how to do it, everyone loves that!

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Sabelkatten

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I don't know if the quote is optimistic about black holes or pessimistic about antimatter...

Quote
So making a BH is extremely difficult, but it would not be as dangerous or hard to handle as a massive quantity of antimatter.

Because, you know, an atom-sized object with the mass of a mountain spewing ridicolous amounts of hard radiation is so easy to handle!

Wrangler

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I don't know about a Black Hole powered starship. I think it would suck.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
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Wrangler

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Looks like NASA showing off details to it's latest probe, destine for Titan reported on NPR.  The Dragonfly Drone, which supposedly going to be compact car size dual motor quadcopter that's going to be nuclear powered. 



While there suppose to fly a light weight drone copter on Mars, this thing going be monster sized self-driving drone in comparison.  Which really ambitious endeavor i think.  Low gravity, nuclear power going make this thing zip around fast if the winds aren't too bad.

Unfortunately I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I'm going be old man by the time this thing (if its funding is completely taken care of) won't get there until 2034.  I hope it success!
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
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ANS Kamas P81

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I'd name the first one The Cygnus.
Definitely would deserve the X-1 designation.

While there suppose to fly a light weight drone copter on Mars, this thing going be monster sized self-driving drone in comparison.  Which really ambitious endeavor i think.  Low gravity, nuclear power going make this thing zip around fast if the winds aren't too bad.
The thickest air on Mars is in the Hellas basin, and it's 1/100 the pressure of Earth's sea-level average; any random surface outside of Hellas is going to be about half of that.  You need to build something capable of operating at about 110,000 feet on Earth; nNo way are you getting a car-sized probe to fly around on props that small unless they're doing fractional-c rotation...
Der Hölle Rache kocht in meinem Herzen,
Tod und Verzweiflung flammet um mich her!
Fühlt nicht durch dich Jadefalke Todesschmerzen,
So bist du meine Tochter nimmermehr!

Wrangler

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Definitely would deserve the X-1 designation.
The thickest air on Mars is in the Hellas basin, and it's 1/100 the pressure of Earth's sea-level average; any random surface outside of Hellas is going to be about half of that.  You need to build something capable of operating at about 110,000 feet on Earth; nNo way are you getting a car-sized probe to fly around on props that small unless they're doing fractional-c rotation...
This thing going be on Titan. Atmosphere thicker there.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
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rebs

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In many ways, the Titan drone will be easier than the Mars drone.

Daryk

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But not "getting there"...  ::)

rebs

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Any reason to revisit Titan is a damn good reason. 

Daryk

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Agreed!  :thumbsup:

Wrangler

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But not "getting there"...  ::)
Your right. NASA will likely need to use the SLS or commercial carrier with that power.  Given it will be 2026 when it's launched, its possible that the New Glenn & SpaceX's Superheavy/Starship will be operational and be available to do the job. 

I'm still taken back it will be 2026 when it's launched, time i moving along.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
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rebs

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It feels like slow motion.  Like when I was 11 and waiting on Voyager to close the gap from Uranus to Neptune.  Time crawled along. 

But all these things will happen.  It truly is our destiny to explore and colonize our solar system.

« Last Edit: 18 September 2019, 01:01:19 by rebs »

ANS Kamas P81

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This thing going be on Titan. Atmosphere thicker there.
Now that makes much more sense.  They should build it in Texas, then, so it's used to the smell from the cow farts.
Der Hölle Rache kocht in meinem Herzen,
Tod und Verzweiflung flammet um mich her!
Fühlt nicht durch dich Jadefalke Todesschmerzen,
So bist du meine Tochter nimmermehr!

rebs

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Now that makes much more sense.  They should build it in Texas, then, so it's used to the smell from the cow farts.

Cows get exploited by Texans all too often.  Its too easy to peg on that, even for a methane drone copter test.   

Wrangler

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Looks like Hayabusa 2 will be soon send out its last lander vehicle on the Asteroid Ryuga.  Vehicle just finished it's practice runs before it deploys it's last lander.



I wonder what the problem will bring back when it's capsule arrives on Earth in December 2020.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
-Editor on Battletech Fanon Wiki

Wrangler

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Interesting challenge NASA put out, the CO2 Conversion Challenge.
essentially Nasa looking for companies (or people) to get into the act and try come ways to use CO2 on Mars and attempt help change things on mars and more.


This was new article, on Spacedaily,
that pointed it out. It does explain it better, just be careful of the ads.
"Men, fetch the Urbanmechs.  We have an interrogation to attend to." - jklantern
"How do you defeat a Dragau? Shoot the damn thing. Lots." - Jellico 
"No, it's a "Most Awesome Blues Brothers scene Reenactment EVER" waiting to happen." VotW Destrier - Weirdo  
"It's 200 LY to Sian, we got a full load of shells, a half a platoon of Grenadiers, it's exploding outside, and we're wearing flak jackets." VoTW Destrier - Misterpants
-Editor on Battletech Fanon Wiki

kato

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ANS Kamas P81

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It's more a case of "convert CO2 into molecules to do X" - making useful molecules out of carbon dioxide.  Nothing wrong with a little alchemy.
Der Hölle Rache kocht in meinem Herzen,
Tod und Verzweiflung flammet um mich her!
Fühlt nicht durch dich Jadefalke Todesschmerzen,
So bist du meine Tochter nimmermehr!

Daryk

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In the case of Mars, CO2 as is has use in warming the planet.  Not sure why they'd be looking to mess with it at all in that sense.  I still maintain getting that solar wind "shield" in place at L1 is the most important and easiest thing to do RIGHT NOW.

Sabelkatten

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I think it's more about making the most efficient way to produce resources you need - in limited amounts - NOW, rather than waiting 1,000 years for terraforming to make those things come "naturally".

Daryk

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Possibly, but the most urgent things to do on Mars immediately are raise the temperature and thicken the atmosphere.  CO2 is the easiest thing to do that with at the moment.