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Author Topic: Leaving wargaming  (Read 1760 times)

beachhead1985

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Leaving wargaming
« on: 03 October 2022, 23:17:55 »
It's just not *fun* for me to play anymore.

I roll. Like. Garbage.

In every game I play, all the time, consistently.

There should be, I *think* some element of random chance in any wargame, but more and more, I feel like I'd be better off with something that mainly compared stats and derived a result. No rolling. Little randomization and luck is not a factor.

Because I have none.

Oh, sure; I've not literally never had *any* good luck at all. But I am consistently unlucky and It's frankly killed wargaming for me. What does it matter if I can get four headcaps in a row from one mech in one turn, one time; if I still lose the game after that?

I can laugh it off in an RPG, even when everyone at the table knows how I roll. Recently; my DM *watched* as I rolled a D4, 14 times, scoring only 1s and 2s and mainly 1s. That's par for me. The dice don't matter, nor does technique.

Oddly; I find it's in RPGs where I can most often turn tactics to my advantage to cope with the fact that I am going to roll badly nearly every time. In wargames...and particularly BattleTech; I find this is less so and that is not an attack on the game.

But if I have a Hunchback; chances are that I won't land with that AC/20 all game. I'll be doing all my damage with the lasers. if I get around behind someone; I'll whiff every shot or hit only arms and legs. I might get a few SRMs on the rear-armour, but that will be the last time that gets touched. Honestly; PC games are the same. Something I noticed blatantly in BT:PC. Yup; put those big guns into the dirt every time, whiff when it counts and run my 'boats like they're a 3rd or less of their actual firepower.

Honestly? I don't want to play anymore and it is 100% me. I still love what I do in the universe, but when it comes to actually playing a game? I'm just going to lose stinking, so why bother?

Exaggeration? I wish. I've been playing BattleTech over 23 years. In that time I have won two games out of honestly ~50+. I can't even win when someone else rolls for me. And I'm not stupid; I understand the game. I use tactics. It just doesn't matter.

In an RPG; we can laugh about it when I cause a TPK because I rolled a one on a D100. It's not going to happen every time I roll that, but, well...my DM was fudging my treasure rolls for a while before he finally had to point it out to everyone. And no one even batted an eye, because...that's just me. Random number generators...are not actually very well accepted, you know? But they don't change much anyways.

I'm much more interested in running games for others, because as much as I want to enjoy those adventures; I know I won't. The rolls just won't have it. I'd LOVE to play, if I was someone else. I can even write rules and stuff for others and it works just fine for them. But not for me.
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PsihoKekec

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #1 on: 04 October 2022, 00:18:53 »
Sorry to hear that, I didn't know Hellbie's curse is infectious.
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mbear

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #2 on: 04 October 2022, 05:39:59 »
would a dice tower help?
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Sabelkatten

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #3 on: 04 October 2022, 06:42:39 »
Sounds like me and 40k back when I still played that. 3+ means 1 in 3, right...?

But there are some serious wargames that doesn't use random luck, aren't there?

Lanceman

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #4 on: 04 October 2022, 06:59:48 »
Sounds like me and 40k back when I still played that. 3+ means 1 in 3, right...?

But there are some serious wargames that doesn't use random luck, aren't there?

I've not played either myself, but Googling around there seems to be few options out there, the biggest being Napoleon's Triumph and related titles and Battle, with reviews of both saying they are, in effect, a kind of Super Chess when it comes to combat.

You might even be able to adapt Battle to a BattleTech setting....
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nova_dew

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #5 on: 04 October 2022, 07:02:05 »
You could try megamek, or casino grade craps dice a lot of dice are not as fair as people wish they are due to how they're made or designed, and 14 rolls is no where near enough to get any sort of statistical data, you need about a million rolls for that.

My own little story, i once had a GM roll my D&D character because i couldn't roll above a 5 on 4D6 over 12 consecutive rolls, i've also shuffled all the mana in a 60 card (2-1 non-mana to mana) MtG deck to the top of the deck and drew until i drew a non mana card... it was a 1/1 goblin btw, a foil too

There's also at least one RPG system out there that uses a deck of cards and the player gets to pick from their hand what to play, so not as random as dice, no idea what system it was though
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nckestrel

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #6 on: 04 October 2022, 07:57:54 »
Upcoming BattleTech Command game doesn't have dice! :)
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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #7 on: 04 October 2022, 08:07:19 »
Sorry the dice have rubbed you the wrong way so many times. Good news, BT is big enough, you can still enjoy the setting if you want to distance yourself from TW. Currently in a RP group myself and two of my friends who have had bad experiences with their introduction to the table top, still enjoy the fiction and the PC games.
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House Davie Merc

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #8 on: 04 October 2022, 09:24:21 »
I've gone through streaks of similar luck .  In one particular 4 year span I probably averaged
a 5 or below for my 2X6 rolls IN EVERY GAME .
I played a guy that would roll 9+ EVERY single time when I couldn't pull off a single
6 for my to-hit rolls .
One time he successfully rolled a 12 to hit with an LRM-5 from a Locust ,rolled a CT(C) for location ,and followed
that up with a 12 for his roll on the amount of crits .  3 Engine hits of course . On round 1 .On my Awesome . :(
That entire game I never rolled a 6 or above for my to hits when he rolled every 9+ that I kept sticking him with .

Post game he feels the need to lecture me on improving my strategy .  ::)

I walked away for a while .  I came back .  You might to .
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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #9 on: 04 October 2022, 09:33:49 »
Have you considered playing Battletech as a campaign GM? No one is going to mind how bad the OpFor rolls, and I find I get a lot of enjoyment out of creating fun scenarios for my friends to fight through! There's no reason why Battletech has to be competitive or just two equal sides duking it out!

Rebel Yell

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #10 on: 04 October 2022, 10:32:43 »
Chess.

No rng problems.
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MarauderD

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #11 on: 04 October 2022, 11:22:47 »
A change of pace, in all things, is normally pretty nice.  Enjoy your hobby time elsewhere or in some other fashion for while.  We'll be here, and so will the game, if there is a time and place where you want to come back!

Cheers,

Mad

idea weenie

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #12 on: 04 October 2022, 12:59:06 »
One tabletop game I saw was "Battle Fortress".  You design and cost units, but the combat is like Starcraft.  Instead of rolling for damage, you might have a unit that does damage to a single target in range, minus their armor rating.  So if your trooper has a 5-pt weapon and the target has 4-pt armor, then you do 1 pt of damage.  If a second target only had 2-pt armor, then that same rifle would do 3 pts of damage.

So it rewards good unit design, it rewards good tabletop tactics/strategy, and no dice needed.


And if nothing else, whenever you want to come back for the stories/fiction you will be welcome

Greatclub

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #13 on: 04 October 2022, 13:08:52 »
Somebody bring back the battletech CCG and save this player. (Ignoring the luck element in drawing cards)

pokefan548

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #14 on: 04 October 2022, 13:10:09 »
Somebody bring back the battletech CCG and save this player. (Ignoring the luck element in drawing cards)
Easy, just make an entire deck with identical copies of one card. Your draws will be 100% consistent.
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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #15 on: 04 October 2022, 13:44:32 »
Same reason I rarely play any type of game anymore. Shit luck. It's plagued me my entire life. I don't do anything that has too much of an element of chance, because I will lose. This isn't me exaggerating, it's empirical. I will always love the BattleTech universe and be involved in the fiction, but I doubt I'll ever play again. I'll watch, I'll GM or referee, but I am never rolling dice again.

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #16 on: 04 October 2022, 14:28:50 »
Chess.

No rng problems.

Wait, you mean you DON'T have to roll a 4 on 4d100 to see if checkmate actually happens?!

I've been lied to for so long.
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Hellraiser

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #17 on: 04 October 2022, 17:23:03 »
I was feeling this pain last weekend when I went 1/8 on initiative rolls & then went & won the last 3-4 turns in a row but only after half my force was destroyed & it didn't matter, lol.

Hope you find a way to keep playing
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Daryk

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #18 on: 04 October 2022, 19:14:18 »
Have you tried the JVN-11A route?  With that many weapons, you're bound to land at least one hit.  Failing that, GMing as others have suggested is absolutely a good way to go.  I at least hope you keep posting here.  The community is solid.

elf25s

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #19 on: 04 October 2022, 21:58:41 »
sorry to hear it...
had you tried going back to the first war game you played? not for nostalgia but to see where it was fun to play?
i myself hit few dry spots with games and dice
and went back to my first war game i was serious with...i was i highschool and one teacher introduced me to a fleet based game by mail yah it was the 80s,,,went back to it in mid 90s after i had my copy of battledroids stolen by my kid brother.found i still enjoyed it but game started moving too fast and it lost its epic scale because now we played with e mail bbs. so i gave it up and went back to robotech rpg by paladium books after few campaigns i gave up...then i went back to bt and been playing on and off....what i am saying you dont have to give up the game you enjoyed just take break from current game you play pick a different game...
btw for some weird reason every time i played munchcin game i get rather pissed off for no reason...also for change of pace i will pick a game of ticket to ride
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DOC_Agren

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #20 on: 05 October 2022, 17:50:59 »
I hope you will be staying with us even if you don't play the game.

We have in our group two player with crap luck, but only one of them wargames.  Yes they can make the RPG more interesting with bad rolls and good tactics...
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Wrangler

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #21 on: 05 October 2022, 21:58:46 »
Sad to see you go, but you got do what makes you happy.
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Cannonshop

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #22 on: 05 October 2022, 22:08:54 »
Beachead, take a break and let your mind relax.  We'll still be here if you decide to come back.
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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #23 on: 05 October 2022, 22:45:56 »
Since I moved to Ecuador, I do pretty much 100% of my wargaming solo. So I never lose, & all luck is in my favor!

For Battletech, because it is such a diverse & rich background, you could still participate by keeping up with the fiction & the sourcebooks, become a collector rather than a wargamer. I've done this several times in my life, where I haven't been able to game for whatever reason. And when I could, I transitioned back into an active gamer. But I always kept my toe in Battletech, & never sold off my collection of books.

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garhkal

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #24 on: 06 October 2022, 00:51:21 »
I've not played either myself, but Googling around there seems to be few options out there, the biggest being Napoleon's Triumph and related titles and Battle, with reviews of both saying they are, in effect, a kind of Super Chess when it comes to combat.

You might even be able to adapt Battle to a BattleTech setting....

OR go with something BESIDES dice for randomization.  How's about cards?  One of the gamers i played with back in Bahrain, used a custom created deck of 20 numbered cards.. He'd shuffle them.  Have the DM cut the deck, then draw one, for his to hit roll.  Do it again for saves.. 
Maybe you could do something similar for B-tech with one deck, using the Ace to six, from two suits, then shuffling them up, and dealing out two cards, drawn by someone else..

Sorry the dice have rubbed you the wrong way so many times. Good news, BT is big enough, you can still enjoy the setting if you want to distance yourself from TW.

I've known others who 'left the game', mostly RPG side, because they got on a LONG, real bad die roll streak..  Some eventually came back 3-4 years down the line, others i've not known to.. 
But i also know some who left, because nearly every time they rolled for something, they would 99% of the time, succeed.. And it also became boring, because they were never losing.

SO my suggestion, is just take a break.  Don't quit whole hock.  Don't sell your stuff.  Just take a vacation from gaming...

sorry to hear it...
had you tried going back to the first war game you played? not for nostalgia but to see where it was fun to play?
i myself hit few dry spots with games and dice
and went back to my first war game i was serious with...i was i highschool and one teacher introduced me to a fleet based game by mail yah it was the 80s,,

That's a good idea.  If your dice seem to always "roll low", no matter what, then play a game where ROLLING LOW is the goal..  Like axis and allies..
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beachhead1985

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #25 on: 09 October 2022, 16:31:38 »
Thanks for caring so much, guys. Means a lot to me.

But yeah; I think I am going to GM purgatory and never leaving.
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And took their wages, and are dead.             And saved the sum of things for pay.
     
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BirdDog

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #26 on: 09 October 2022, 17:07:07 »
I, too, have just...almost hilariously bad luck.

In any game.  If it's a video game with RNG for loot, you can guarantee I will either never get an item I want, or it'll take YEARS longer than anyone else.

I play SWTOR, and my guild is an RP guild (think basically DnD type events and storylines, using the game's in-game dice roll commands).  My dice rolls are so bad the entire guild...500+ players...changed how the rank-related dice thresholds worked because I was just getting nat 1's all the time.

It was incredibly frustrating for me, that no matter what game I played, I rolled terribly.  I have never won a tabletop game - Battletech, Warmachine, Warhammer.  I have dozens and dozens of games under my belt across those genres and universes.  My rolls are awful.

MegaMek? Forget about it - I've had so many mechs decapitated or just fail simple checks and fall over (and then crush their own heads) it's not even funny.

Over the years though, I just started to embrace the suck and have some fun with it.  My main SWTOR character now is named Jinx for that reason.   It's a callsign I now use cross-platform and even used real-world for a time before I got out of the Army because even THEY knew how bad my luck was.

Don't give up hope!  Sometimes embracing the bad luck can make a game as fun(ny) and enjoyable as winning can be.

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #27 on: 09 October 2022, 17:59:59 »
Did you ever consider having a surrogate pair of hands ROLL YOUR DICE? If you have minions (disposable or otherwise), make use of them (hell, even pay them!), if you think you have the ability to roll consistently low?

o.O

Not that i am even remotely encouraging this idea but you ever rolled dice in gambling? THAT would be the circumstance that tells you are either utterly luckless or a dice savant for rolling 2s, 3s or 4s on 2d6.

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #28 on: 09 October 2022, 18:48:36 »
Did you ever consider having a surrogate pair of hands ROLL YOUR DICE? If you have minions (disposable or otherwise), make use of them (hell, even pay them!), if you think you have the ability to roll consistently low?

o.O

Not that i am even remotely encouraging this idea but you ever rolled dice in gambling? THAT would be the circumstance that tells you are either utterly luckless or a dice savant for rolling 2s, 3s or 4s on 2d6.

It's not about consistently rolling low, it's about things consistently not going your way. Whatever the necessary action is, it will not happen. Things will happen to make it worse, but the goal is unachievable. Bad luck IS a thing.

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Re: Leaving wargaming
« Reply #29 on: 09 October 2022, 23:41:09 »
Reminds me of a guy I used to play with: he just had the absolute worst luck.  No matter what he tried, things just never went well for him.  I have no idea if he quit or not, we fell out of touch about a decade ago (I do know that his wife did not like his gaming habit).
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