BattleTech - The Board Game of Armored Combat

BattleTech Miniatures and Terrain => Gaming Terrain => Topic started by: Savage Baron on 03 December 2020, 15:30:30

Title: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 03 December 2020, 15:30:30
Hello all! First post, long time lurker and BT player, though. I wanted to toss out an idea or two for maps that I've been working on.

So, with hills, would people like to see hills with layers that stand out as multi-tier or more blended.


Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 03 December 2020, 15:34:48
More blended version...

Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 03 December 2020, 15:38:14
And here is a single hex...

Sorry for the multiple posts, the 900K attachment limit bit me.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Major Headcase on 03 December 2020, 17:06:59
As long as the Level is clear on each elevated hex, I prefer the blended look. It's a bit more organic.
Maybe even a map that uses the blended hills with some sharper delineation lines? A mix of both would look realistic as well, representing smooth slopes and sharp ridges and bluffs side by side like real hills?
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 04 December 2020, 17:22:57
Thanks for the feedback.

I toyed around with the idea of mixing delineated hills and blended and came up with...



Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 04 December 2020, 18:28:08
And some buildings... just to try things out. Please let me know thoughts, feedback, and the like.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 04 December 2020, 18:28:34
And a detail of a hill.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 06 December 2020, 12:33:05
I added some addition detail with the hills and tossed in a river.

Any thoughts, feedback, critiques, or the like would be appreciated?
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: SeeM on 07 December 2020, 04:21:45
I like the shadows. They are rarely done right on the classic maps. Are trees in plan?
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 07 December 2020, 08:43:36
Thanks for the feedback. Shadows are something that I like in my topo maps, so it was something I was aiming for.

Yeah, trees are the next round of improvements. I am doing the trees as a separate layer. So they can be 'turned on' and 'turned off.'

I've found that the template works well for desert and snow covered with minimal effort to change.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 07 December 2020, 09:01:59
Desert.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 07 December 2020, 09:02:23
Snow covered.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: NeonKnight on 07 December 2020, 10:04:21
Your maps are nice. Very well done.

If I could suggest one thing though 9and this is something CGL has started doing with all their maps) is while it is not 100% 'natural' align your hill edges with the the hexes, so visually it is easy to see if the hex IS or IS NOT: LEVEL #

As an example, the map view in Post #6:
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/terrain/toying-with-maps/msg1675346/#msg1675346

hexes 0306 & 0407 are listed a LEVEL 1, and hex 0307 has no level indicator, yet visually has a hint of a hill in it.

Also, visually, there is not difference between the LEVEL 3 hex in 0404 and the LEVEL 2 Hex in 0405.

Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 07 December 2020, 10:15:00
Oops! I had the old label layer still on. Too much prototyping and not enough attention to detail.

Thanks for the heads up on that. Let me adjust the elevation label to match the map.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: NeonKnight on 07 December 2020, 10:40:27
No worries, I'm just hoping you also understand what I mean by visually. Not to toot my own horn but I have helped with some of the newer maps, but as this is a 'board game' by definition, the board needs to be as clear as possible.

One of the things I like about the newer CGL maps.

I can 'look' at the map from across the table and know without getting up to read a label what the hex is. because the terrain features are constrained to the hex, so it either IS a level 1 hex, or it is not. it either IS a Depth 1 river, or is not. It either IS a Light Woods, or it IS a heavy woods (because the trees are DARKER and more DENSE).
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 07 December 2020, 10:58:31
I do!

Finding the balance between 'pretty' and 'function' is sort of a quandary for 'satellite' style maps. I'm torn between a bit of carryover over into the surrounding hexes and making everything be single hex.

Any critiques are always and completely welcome.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 08 December 2020, 16:58:46
Martian style.

Overall, I'm really pleased with the terracing of the hills on this map. I was toying with it last night. Only 'readability' issues I ran into were just the couple of hills that transitioned more than one level, i.e. a level 2 hex immediately next to something flat.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 08 December 2020, 16:59:25
And a low-res version of the map.

Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 09 December 2020, 10:46:25
Ocean/Beach Map
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 09 December 2020, 10:47:10
And a detail to show the terracing on the ocean map.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Simon Landmine on 09 December 2020, 13:26:22
Nice! Although I believe that Water hexes should be labelled with their Depth value (e.g. "Depth 0", "Depth 1", etc), rather than as a negative Level, as a negative Level could indicate a dry depression on land ... and the Level refers to the height of the water surface, rather than the bed.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Simon Landmine on 09 December 2020, 13:30:31
Ocean/Beach Map

As a keen designer of coastal maps for MegaMek, I'm especially liking that one! Nice.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 09 December 2020, 13:42:00
Awesome, thanks for the feedback! I'll make changes to the text.

So, there can be a -1 Level (i.e. below the main level of the map) with water in it, i.e. Level -1, Depth 1?
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: NeonKnight on 09 December 2020, 13:54:35
Nice! Although I believe that Water hexes should be labelled with their Depth value (e.g. "Depth 0", "Depth 1", etc), rather than as a negative Level, as a negative Level could indicate a dry depression on land ... and the Level refers to the height of the water surface, rather than the bed.

Actually, LEVELs refer to 'dry heights'. be they UP or DOWN.

So, LEVEL 3 is three levels above 0

SUBLEVELS refer to negative levels and Depth refers to how deep, and that is based SURFACE LEVEL, not 0.

As an examlpe see the latest TUKAYYID maps:

Quote
A water hex that is above Level 0 will include a LEVEL number alongside a Depth number, signifying the Level of the surface of the water, and the Depth of the bottom of the hex.

So, a LEVEL 3, DEPTH 1 hex is 'Surface' is at level 3, and the Depth is 1 hex (at level 2).

Conversely, a SUBEVEL 4, Depth 2 hex, is a pool in a depression, where the surface is at Sublevel 4, and then bottom goes two more levels (ultimatle to a sublevel of 6)
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 09 December 2020, 14:46:55
Thanks for the clarification!

I'm still waiting on my Tukayyid maps, I'm in the wave 2 bucket.  :-\  I stepped out after the FCCW and am just getting back in.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Simon Landmine on 09 December 2020, 22:29:07
Actually, LEVELs refer to 'dry heights'. be they UP or DOWN.
So, LEVEL 3 is three levels above 0
SUBLEVELS refer to negative levels and Depth refers to how deep, and that is based SURFACE LEVEL, not 0.
So, a LEVEL 3, DEPTH 1 hex is 'Surface' is at level 3, and the Depth is 1 hex (at level 2).
Conversely, a SUBLEVEL 4, Depth 2 hex, is a pool in a depression, where the surface is at Sublevel 4, and then bottom goes two more levels (ultimatle to a sublevel of 6)

Thanks - that's what I meant, but you put it a lot more clearly.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: NeonKnight on 10 December 2020, 09:22:01
Thanks - that's what I meant, but you put it a lot more clearly.

No prob, been a long time since I played megamek, so I cannot remeber if the levels are listed + or -
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: Savage Baron on 10 December 2020, 10:42:09
I'll be making the changes today on the coast map and finishing up an open ocean map.

Thanks for the support and feedback so far.

Next, will probably be lunar and some scatter terrain like buildings, craters, and rough patches.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: NeonKnight on 10 December 2020, 10:46:31
Remember, ultimately for buildings, currently the hex only lists the total height of the hex. So a 3 Level Building on a Level 2 hex is still listed as LEVEL 5, so ensure your terrain hex is clear enough for what level it is so when the building collapses, the level of the underlying hex is clear enough.
Title: Re: Toying with Maps
Post by: truetanker on 31 January 2021, 00:06:17
I wonder...

Would it be possible to make an Underwater map with sunken city on it?

Currently, one only has the back of the map and standard city, of which we could " state it's under Depth X level "... but visually...  :-\

TT