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Author Topic: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising  (Read 120884 times)

Medron Pryde

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Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« on: 26 January 2011, 20:34:48 »
I've seen some of the other nations getting a thread.  So here is one where us Taurians can hang out, either the old Taurus or the New New Taurus out on Lastpost. 

I still remember, back in the day, in 1992 or so, when I started BattleTech I went to Marik.  I was only offered five factions to play by the people in charge of the campaign, so that is what I picked.  Then I got a hold of the 3058 Periphery sourcebook and I realized there was an entire new dimension of a universe to play in.  A world where the Star League was the Bad Guy, where Amaris was a hero fighting for the people, and the fall of the "Great Houses" was a good thing.  I was hooked.

The part of me that liked AeroSpace enjoyed the Outworlds, the part of me that enjoyed...well...joy...:).  I didn't really like much about the Marians of the time, but the stubborn Bulls grabbed me.

A free society where education is important, where everybody serves in the defense of the nation.  Where the Department of Propaganda is named exactly that.  :)  There are so many things to like about the Taurians.  :)

And of course, THEN I got Periphery First and I learned more.  In the end, that Taurian Concordat is one of the funnest factions in the game IMHO.

What do you think?
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RunandFindOut

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #1 on: 26 January 2011, 21:19:06 »
Of all the factions in the game the Taurians are my favorite.  While they have their problems I relate to them better than other factions.  I may respect the Capellans for being able to survive the hardships and insane rulers they've been subjected to but I identify with the Taurians.  They may not be the largest, or most fiat-gifted, or reasonable at times, but they've never given up and continued even as the world fell on their heads.  What happened during the Jihad is one of the prime reasons I just ignore the entire Jihad.
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RAE

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #2 on: 26 January 2011, 21:40:10 »
Along with the Free Worlds League, the Concordat is my favourite second faction of choice. I admire their stuborness and how they enter that 'berserker mode' every time someone threatens their homeworlds. I'm dying to see both Field Report: Periphery (hope they'll manage to keep the Vendetta) and, especially, Historical: Reunification War. Chapters about the action on Taurian front are my favourite read both in Star League Sourcebook and the original Periphery sourcebook.

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AirmanR

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #3 on: 26 January 2011, 21:43:53 »
Well, I think the Taurians are just great! Especially during the 3rd Succession War, and I love them equally with the Outworld's Alliance. As a house warming present, I'm sure you'll enjoy this little guy I posted in the Combat Vehicle forums...

http://www.classicbattletech.com/forums/index.php?topic=427.0

I can't give you the CapCon, but I hope this will be a humble substitute :)

Jaim Magnus

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #4 on: 26 January 2011, 22:00:49 »
The Taurians will forever hold a special place for me.  They were my first faction back in the day.  '88 or '89.  Stomping around in a rickety Marauder and fighting pirates.  Good times.

Not too happy with what's become of them in canon, but they're not dead yet, so there's always hope.
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durant

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #5 on: 26 January 2011, 22:21:10 »
the Taurians were the first industrial, cultural and military power back to the 3025 era, without to speak about free thinking, the place of choice for a reborn periphery...  [drool]
what a misery to see this proud nation fall apart...  [tickedoff]
In particular for the fedrat player who explore the periphery... ::).
But like always taurians will rise again and take is complete and rightfull revenge against davion... }:)
This minor house is in my point of view largely more sympathetic and funny than the other periphery power... And largely more than the great house.  :)
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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #6 on: 27 January 2011, 06:31:26 »
Hey! Who are the cow guys and why are we at war with them? - AFFS High Command
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Medron Pryde

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #7 on: 27 January 2011, 06:34:40 »
Says the man with the "my little cthulu" Atlas....

 }:)
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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #8 on: 27 January 2011, 13:22:16 »
He he he, I hereby notify the nation of the bull to keep your Far Lookers in check lest they snoop around one of our old OA settlements and we Ravens mistake them for pirates.  }:)

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RunandFindOut

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #9 on: 27 January 2011, 14:01:44 »
He he he, I hereby notify the nation of the bull to keep your Far Lookers in check lest they snoop around one of our old OA settlements and we Ravens mistake them for pirates.  }:)
And ravens should remember they fly around in fragile eggshells that don't handle a few hundred kilotons of boom very well.  Check my sig vatbrat :P

But he does give me a few interesting AU ideas.  Instead of ignoring the periphery because it isn't one of the Sacred Five, the upheaval and change in focus caused by the Clan Invasion takes a lot of pressure off the Taurians.  And if they hadn't been repeatedly passed the idiot ball plenty of opportunity for them to grow and prosper in the wake of the 3050s.
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Dirk Bastion

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #10 on: 27 January 2011, 15:34:41 »
Here's to the Taurus that was, the Calderon that is and the Taurus that should have been.

*cheers*

Moonsword

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #11 on: 27 January 2011, 16:17:48 »
Now that I can't disagree with.  The main Taurians have been going nuts lately.
« Last Edit: 27 January 2011, 16:51:04 by Moonsword »

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #12 on: 27 January 2011, 16:43:26 »
Long live Erik Calderon the true Protector. down with the pretenders
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Dirk Bastion

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #13 on: 27 January 2011, 16:49:59 »
Now that I can disagree with.  The main Taurians have been going nuts lately.
"That was" is implied to be pre-Shraplen. Say what you will about Mad Tom, but at least he was stopped in time.

RAE

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #14 on: 27 January 2011, 17:24:29 »
I might be one of the few people here who actually likes Shraplen/Tharn Taurians over Calderon Taurians. At least, they're doing something about the Davion threat, no matter how imaginable it is, rather than sitting in their bunkers and waiting for the invaders to invade. I can see how Taurian fans might be angry with their faction going 'nuts' and breaking apart, but on the other hand... they went there and freakin' plastered the FedSuns March capital. "How 'bout that, Inner Sphere scum?"

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Moonsword

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #15 on: 27 January 2011, 18:05:02 »
"That was" is implied to be pre-Shraplen. Say what you will about Mad Tom, but at least he was stopped in time.

As shown by the edit, that's supposed to be "can't", not can.  I changed from can agree to can't disagree and missed something.

Medron Pryde

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #16 on: 27 January 2011, 20:25:01 »
 ;D
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Trajan Helmer

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #17 on: 28 January 2011, 01:16:04 »
...I still dream of a great and powerful Taurian Navy rising from long-dead ashes like the Phoenix of old.

The Concordat is my favorite Periphery faction by far. It's society appeals to me more so than any other group out there. I too, am a browncoat.
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Dirk Bastion

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #18 on: 28 January 2011, 02:20:33 »
As shown by the edit, that's supposed to be "can't", not can.  I changed from can agree to can't disagree and missed something.
Your ninja edit was 2 minutes after my post.
How Capellan of you.  :D

ArcaneRaven

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #19 on: 28 January 2011, 08:07:16 »
I might be one of the few people here who actually likes Shraplen/Tharn Taurians over Calderon Taurians. At least, they're doing something about the Davion threat, no matter how imaginable it is, rather than sitting in their bunkers and waiting for the invaders to invade. I can see how Taurian fans might be angry with their faction going 'nuts' and breaking apart, but on the other hand... they went there and freakin' plastered the FedSuns March capital. "How 'bout that, Inner Sphere scum?"

I have to say, my inner Capellan quite enjoyed that.

Moonsword

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #20 on: 28 January 2011, 08:59:08 »
Your ninja edit was 2 minutes after my post.
How Capellan of you.  :D

1 minute and 5 seconds.  Your post wasn't there when I hit modify.  It was when I finished.

Such is message board life.

Taurianspy

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #21 on: 07 February 2011, 12:18:18 »
He he he, I hereby notify the nation of the bull to keep your Far Lookers in check lest they snoop around one of our old OA settlements and we Ravens mistake them for pirates.  }:)

As a Taurian, I look forward to that day.  The personality of Taurian marines could impress the Ravens like the OA fighter jocks did.  A similiar situation like the OA could get the SASF Harjel and a new asteroid defense battlesuit in exchange for the rare raw material need to make the Hargel.  A straight deal with a wandering Clan merchant would work too.
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Taurianspy

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #22 on: 07 February 2011, 14:55:02 »
I might be one of the few people here who actually likes Shraplen/Tharn Taurians over Calderon Taurians. At least, they're doing something about the Davion threat, no matter how imaginable it is, rather than sitting in their bunkers and waiting for the invaders to invade. I can see how Taurian fans might be angry with their faction going 'nuts' and breaking apart, but on the other hand... they went there and freakin' plastered the FedSuns March capital. "How 'bout that, Inner Sphere scum?"

The problem with Shraplen/Tharn is they are the excuse for the writers to dipict the Taurians as morons.  Access to the old boards would show that I provided a framework for a strike against New Syrtis long ago, argueing the fact that it should have been done as far back as the 1st Successor War.  I supplied supportive materials that showed in every major engagement that the Davion strikes against the Capellans always left the TC border exposed, and together the CC and the TC (even if they did not coordinate together) could have broke the Davion aggressions and made modest gains in territory.  One thing I warned against was not to overextend.  The first step of the TC strategy was to pin and eliminate military forces (specifically Wylie's Coyotes in 3028 and Hanson's Roughriders after 3050).  Without eliminating opposing force, the TC was suceptable to counter attack.  A border wide advance could not be accomplished without eliminating specific key military targets.  It appears that almost every warning I included was used as a framework for writing the TC dibolicles.

A real world example played out last night in the Super Bowl that can characterize limited offense to support defense.  In the closing minutes of the first half, Green Bay was marching for a score.  Green Bay was up 14-3, first down inside the 20 with around 3 minutes left to play in the half.  Green Bay scores on a pass to Jennings and goes up 21-3.  But, on the ensueing drive, Pittsburg drives the field and scores with roughly 18 seconds left in the half.  Green Bay eventually won the game and the point becomes mute, but I will explain more logical call play.

Green Bay should have ran the ball for the three downs to eat up the clock, and kicked the field goal.  If they score a touchdown on any down with the exception of the first play, Pittsburg doesn't have the time needed to score at the end of the half and Pittsburg doesn't go into the locker room with an additional motivator.  Barring a fluke play, which could happen at any time, the minimum halftime score would have been 17-3 instead of 21-10, a 14 point lead, not a 11 point lead.  As the game played out, Green Bay covered the points, but I have shown the advantage of calling the game another way.

The relevance is that by taking too much, you are subsectable to counter attack, and as a whole, what you gain may provide an opportunity for your opponent to regain what they have lost.  The example above also incorperates the use of a timing factor that allows Green Bay to extend or maintain its advantage.  I can hear it now, but Battletech doesn't use a halftime time out.  Technically it does.  After every engagement of military forces, at every level of military organization whether it be tactical or strategical, rest, rebuild and recuperation of the forces involves impliments a form of halftime intermission to the game.  After every Successor War, relative peace evolves between the combatants because the military forces have exhausted their ability to continue to fight.   After every tactical battle, every unit is pulled back to repair damage, replace lost personnel, impliment training, resupply, etc., etc. etc.  This rule is defined in scope as a nessasity because of the 'Pirahna principle' aspect in Battletech.

Look for my next lecture on the problems of the Pirhana Principle as implimented in the Battletech universe. 

"Bosephus" and "Stumprunner" was not just a man and his mech.  They were a style of play that left everyone thinking about the impact of piloting skill on the game.  Unconscious pilots and prone mechs are easy targets even for poor marksman.

RAE

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #23 on: 07 February 2011, 16:16:25 »
The problem with Shraplen/Tharn is they are the excuse for the writers to dipict the Taurians as morons.  Access to the old boards would show that I provided a framework for a strike against New Syrtis long ago, argueing the fact that it should have been done as far back as the 1st Successor War.  I supplied supportive materials that showed in every major engagement that the Davion strikes against the Capellans always left the TC border exposed, and together the CC and the TC (even if they did not coordinate together) could have broke the Davion aggressions and made modest gains in territory.  One thing I warned against was not to overextend.  The first step of the TC strategy was to pin and eliminate military forces (specifically Wylie's Coyotes in 3028 and Hanson's Roughriders after 3050).  Without eliminating opposing force, the TC was suceptable to counter attack.  A border wide advance could not be accomplished without eliminating specific key military targets.  It appears that almost every warning I included was used as a framework for writing the TC dibolicles.
I really don't think that the Taurians are depicted as morons. Overzealous, yes. Reckless, perhaps. But not stupid. They're acting completely in character.

The War of Davion Aggression, that we've been preparing for for almost half a century, finally happened. Maybe it had started even earlier, two or three decades ago. Maybe the chain of events isn't coincidental. Dedrickson's Devils, Edward's demise, Janice's illness, Doru's coup, Jeffrey's death, Fighting Urukhai incident, Roughriders rampage, Pleiades campaign, asteroid attack on Taurus. Hell, maybe they even fed poor Ian Calderon to Thraxan devourers. Maybe Thomas Calderon was right and that's why they deposed him. Maybe Grover Shraplen was right and that's why they killed him. Who was wrong then? Haji Doru was wrong and now he's a butler of the Capellan Chancellor's concubine. Cham Kithrong was wrong and now he's a traitor and a puppeteer to a merc bitch and her bastard.

But enough is enough. Time to go old school, Reunification War-style. Time to bring out those nukes. Time to get some revenge. And if that means selling our souls to the Blake Devil himself, then so be it. Bring it on.

I see the Jihad as the Taurian crowning moment of glory. They've actually managed to bring the war to their ancient foes, despite being severely outnumbered, outgunned and outclassed. Yes, they came out of the conflict battered and bruised, but they did come out of it nevertheless, if not victorious, but not defeated either.

And from OOC perspective, I've always thought that for a BattleTech faction, Taurians don't really get lot of actual battles to participate in. Aside from their short involvement in the St. Ives conflict, they haven't seen combat for a few centuries since their little clash with the Magistracy. Even the Canopians tried to invade the Great House at some point. All the Taurians had ever done was being paranoid about Davion threat, which is not much of a feat. Now, they can have all the action they want, fighting other Taurians, Davions, Capellans, Canopians, pirates and God knows whom else.

A real world example played out last night in the Super Bowl that can characterize limited offense to support defense. [...]
Man, one of these days I will have to learn to understand all those American football references :)

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Dirk Bastion

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #24 on: 07 February 2011, 16:55:42 »
But enough is enough. Time to go old school, Reunification War-style. Time to bring out those nukes. Time to get some revenge. And if that means selling our souls to the Blake Devil himself, then so be it. Bring it on.
The use of nukes in the Reunification War never happened.
Also, I find this attitude to be distasteful.  :-\

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #25 on: 07 February 2011, 17:14:17 »
The use of nukes in the Reunification War never happened.
Technicality. WMDs did happen then, as did numerous other breaches of the Ares Conventions.

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #26 on: 07 February 2011, 19:32:40 »
Given that the Star League was using nuclear weapons, there were major naval actions, and the Taurians did not escape censure for committing atrocities, I would be most interested in seeing a definitive source for that.
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Medron Pryde

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #27 on: 07 February 2011, 22:58:49 »
My daddy told me to not to use no double negatives when making an argument.

Can you cite a source on whether they WERE censured for war atrocities?  Just curious as to whether there is a source that does not conflict with your double negative.
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Charlie Tango

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #28 on: 08 February 2011, 00:17:03 »
 [copper]

Ahem.

Let's keep the posts to the topic and keep the personal sniping out of it.

Last warning for anyone on this matter in this thread.

Best regards,

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Re: Taking the Bull By the Horns: Taurus Rising
« Reply #29 on: 08 February 2011, 00:32:41 »
Given that the Star League was using nuclear weapons, there were major naval actions, and the Taurians did not escape censure for committing atrocities, I would be most interested in seeing a definitive source for that.
Sorry, I can't provide a source, seeing as I take the lack of mention of nuclear weapons during the Reunification War as indication that there were no nuclear weapons used.
But, if you have a source that states differently, by all means, correct me.