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BattleTech Game Universe => The Periphery => Topic started by: ArkRoyalRavager on 04 November 2021, 04:45:43

Title: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 04 November 2021, 04:45:43
The continuation of the Imperial thread. Happy posting!

Perhaps this can be considered the Imperial-exclusive version of the Chatterweb.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 04 November 2021, 05:18:56
All hail the Zarkhan! Now she can lead us with the assistance of Star Dreadnok!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 04 November 2021, 05:52:44
What is the Star Dreadnok? Where can I get one!  :drool:
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 04 November 2021, 08:13:30
Scorpions! 

Sound off.  We have a new home.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 04 November 2021, 08:15:24
So, anyone knows whats the current color scheme for seekers now? I got my Clan Invasion box and the CGS are the clan i can stand the most. Its a shame Gamma died during the WoR, love the scheme.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Metallgewitter on 04 November 2021, 08:30:11
All hail the Zarkhan! Now she can lead us with the assistance of Star Dreadnok!

Now I want some Scorpion Seekers stumble upon an abandoned Dreadnought Warship, refurbish it and then appear above Terra reenacting James McKenna's "Surrender or we will turn you into your miserable atoms" speech
Not realisitc since all Dreadnoughts are long gone but it would be funny
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 04 November 2021, 08:32:34
If the Scorpions could manage to find a mothballed Texas-class, it would be even funnier.  The Revenge of Texas!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 November 2021, 08:41:03
So, anyone knows whats the current color scheme for seekers now? I got my Clan Invasion box and the CGS are the clan i can stand the most. Its a shame Gamma died during the WoR, love the scheme.

Same as Chi Galaxy until/unless stated otherwise.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 04 November 2021, 09:55:56
Same as Chi Galaxy until/unless stated otherwise.

Quote
uses a practical scheme of browns with golden yellow accents. They do not yet display insignia. Warriors are permitted to decorate their preferred dueling weapon with a bright green 'poison' desig

So basically diferent shades of browns camo with golden yellow accents?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 04 November 2021, 11:54:02
Don't mind me, just squeezing by...

Watch Commander Pi
Clan Stone Lion
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: jimdigris on 04 November 2021, 15:58:55
I'm not thrilled with any of the current Scorpion paint schemes, which is a problem because I want to continue painting up mechs for them.  I liked Delta's scheme, but they didn't survive the Reavings.  I consider Alpha to be acceptable.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Longstrider on 04 November 2021, 17:54:07
Carrying over my thought from the last thread:

I do see what you mean, ARR, about the possibility that CGS's potential view of itself as a star-league-in-exile isn't meant to be a legal claim but rather than an aspirational idea. That said, I do think they probably will need to be politically savvy about it or else Alaric and his flunkies might get mad about it.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: five_corparty on 04 November 2021, 22:02:30
I'm not thrilled with any of the current Scorpion paint schemes, which is a problem because I want to continue painting up mechs for them.  I liked Delta's scheme, but they didn't survive the Reavings.  I consider Alpha to be acceptable.

I'm wondering if they have new uniforms?  I can't remember if that was in the scorpian empire PDF, I'll have to go look.  Hopefully they keep the knives and get something new.  Do any of the clans wear kilts?  kilts might be fun.  :D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Kerfuffin(925) on 04 November 2021, 22:29:50
I'm wondering if they have new uniforms?  I can't remember if that was in the scorpian empire PDF, I'll have to go look.  Hopefully they keep the knives and get something new.  Do any of the clans wear kilts?  kilts might be fun.  :D

I’m sure the Falcons will be rocking them soon. Kilts don’t really go with any of the GS founding ‘stereotypes’ either.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 04 November 2021, 22:54:29
I'm not thrilled with any of the current Scorpion paint schemes, which is a problem because I want to continue painting up mechs for them.  I liked Delta's scheme, but they didn't survive the Reavings.  I consider Alpha to be acceptable.

Considering they have freeborns and trueborns from former members of Ice Hellion and Eridani Light Horse that still celebrate their origins there could be groups honouring their fallen comrades.  Use Delta if you like it I won’t oppose it.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 05 November 2021, 00:40:22
Carrying over my thought from the last thread:

I do see what you mean, ARR, about the possibility that CGS's potential view of itself as a star-league-in-exile isn't meant to be a legal claim but rather than an aspirational idea. That said, I do think they probably will need to be politically savvy about it or else Alaric and his flunkies might get mad about it.

Yup, an idea to aspire to.

I doubt Alaric and his associates will mind. In fact, with the weakened Wolves, Alaric needs all the potential troops he can get, so the Empire will be negotiating from a position of strength.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: phoenixalpha on 05 November 2021, 08:15:53
I’m sure the Falcons will be rocking them soon. Kilts don’t really go with any of the GS founding ‘stereotypes’ either.

Nice yellow & green kilts :)
I'm sure that none of the Falcon bloodnamed would be able to claim a tartan from a Scottish bloodline.

Maybe Bailey (if they fix the spelling)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 05 November 2021, 09:07:28
I wonder what color tartans the Chi Li Bloodhouse will wear?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 05 November 2021, 21:50:50
Plenty of Warhawks in the Catalyst store.  For now...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 06 November 2021, 10:53:43
They gone
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Reldn on 06 November 2021, 15:17:33
I missed out on obtaining more Warhawks, sadly. Managed to nab some other 'Mechs that should hopefully fit with my Scorpions at least.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 07 November 2021, 12:42:02
There’s always Mu Galaxy’s love of camouflage patterns too. And, admittedly, Ice Hellion had fun paint schemes.

To quote old Madonna: “Beauty’s where you find it.”  8)

Edit: ...and the Umayyads, for fun Omega and PGC stylings. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 07 November 2021, 13:49:54
For me it's always been cameo, where appropriate and olive gray, as that has been the SLDF standard colour for the last 400+ years ago. Different shades of muted cameo added to the base olive gray has been my norm for awhile now.

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 08 November 2021, 05:44:32
And you can always adapt Hanseatic Leauge camo patterns for form RDF bondsmen.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 08 November 2021, 18:43:14
I'm not thrilled with any of the current Scorpion paint schemes, which is a problem because I want to continue painting up mechs for them.  I liked Delta's scheme, but they didn't survive the Reavings.  I consider Alpha to be acceptable.

Feel the exact same for all points, but replace Delta with Gamma. I will say though, the Goliath Scorpions that appeared in Forever Faithful seemed to be doing their own thing rather than sticking to the Galaxy scheme, and a few descriptions almost sound like they were using Delta's scheme. Gives me hope a subunit or two might be borrowing Gamma's scheme in place of their official one.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 09 November 2021, 17:02:42
Feel the exact same for all points, but replace Delta with Gamma. I will say though, the Goliath Scorpions that appeared in Forever Faithful seemed to be doing their own thing rather than sticking to the Galaxy scheme, and a few descriptions almost sound like they were using Delta's scheme. Gives me hope a subunit or two might be borrowing Gamma's scheme in place of their official one.

 . . . the Galaxy Commander used a quad standard battlemech that had not even been invented yet so . . .
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 09 November 2021, 18:46:13
. . . the Galaxy Commander used a quad standard battlemech that had not even been invented yet so . . .

Huh? Rik Myers was definitely in a standard Fire Scorpion at Wayside V at the end of the book, and that has an intro date of 2852...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 09 November 2021, 20:45:30
You are right about his ride- still a Alpha Galaxy Commander not having a Omni . . . or the whole premier cluster of a Alpha Galaxy not being fitted out with Omnis- like FMWC says- is bonkers.  But it is a Arana in Myers keshik or working with it- built in 3087 when the Scorpions moved to the NC region- that I was thining of is in Chapter 35.  A Kodiak for the Scorps?

All in '62 though they would have had to leave Huntress in late '60 to '61 to follow Paul Moon & Co . . . Forever Faithful has continuity problems like a lot of the author's recent work.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AJC46 on 11 November 2021, 22:48:44
You are right about his ride- still a Alpha Galaxy Commander not having a Omni . . . or the whole premier cluster of a Alpha Galaxy not being fitted out with Omnis- like FMWC says- is bonkers.  But it is a Arana in Myers keshik or working with it- built in 3087 when the Scorpions moved to the NC region- that I was thining of is in Chapter 35.  A Kodiak for the Scorps?

All in '62 though they would have had to leave Huntress in late '60 to '61 to follow Paul Moon & Co . . . Forever Faithful has continuity problems like a lot of the author's recent work.

the presence of the Arana is either a error or it's a Battlemech grade prototype of what would eventually become the Tolva and the Emp scorp Arana was a watered down industrial mech grade stop-gag version until they could remake it to the proper battlemech specs
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 12 November 2021, 01:37:58
the presence of the Arana is either a error or it's a Battlemech grade prototype of what would eventually become the Tolva and the Emp scorp Arana was a watered down industrial mech grade stop-gag version until they could remake it to the proper battlemech specs

Nothing of which was ever put out about the design.  Look at the FMWC/FMU for that formation- should be Omnis.  Further, the Jaguar cast-offs left on Wayside to die of old age?  Too many bloodnames and too many Omnis to be the desperate Jaguars.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 12 November 2021, 20:14:13
You are right about his ride- still a Alpha Galaxy Commander not having a Omni . . . or the whole premier cluster of a Alpha Galaxy not being fitted out with Omnis- like FMWC says- is bonkers.  But it is a Arana in Myers keshik or working with it- built in 3087 when the Scorpions moved to the NC region- that I was thining of is in Chapter 35.  A Kodiak for the Scorps?

It's the Scorpions. They do...*nuanced*, better than most. It's not a flaw, it's a feature.

Look at the FMWC/FMU for that formation- should be Omnis.  Further, the Jaguar cast-offs left on Wayside to die of old age?  Too many bloodnames and too many Omnis to be the desperate Jaguars.

The tables have long been a guide, and not something meant to be taken as carved in stone. The BattleMechs appearing among the 35th Cuirassiers, or the Onagers, Shadow Cat IIs, or even Malvina's Shrike among the 100% Omni Raptor Keshik are proof enough of this.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 24 December 2021, 15:02:25
So, how about those Star Pythons and Star Crusaders...  :D 8)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 24 December 2021, 15:03:46
Brought to you by the funslayer.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Talpini on 24 December 2021, 15:41:33
Good to see Hellions are still causing trouble, getting in tantrums and going feral.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: five_corparty on 24 December 2021, 16:40:10
So, how about those Star Pythons and Star Crusaders...  :D 8)

very niiiice!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 24 December 2021, 19:47:22
Brought to you by the funslayer.  :)

 :beer:

I'll take two.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 25 December 2021, 02:21:00
So far, local consensus seems to be on the Star Crusader A (And a pack of Star Pythons)

What do other people think?

Also pairing them with a Night Gyr T
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Ruger on 25 December 2021, 07:00:17
So far, local consensus seems to be on the Star Crusader A (And a pack of Star Pythons)

What do other people think?

Also pairing them with a Night Gyr T

My favorite of those designs when Comstar first put them out was the Raijin, so I wish the Scorpions had gotten that one too.

Ruger
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 25 December 2021, 11:33:44
Maybe they will one day. Could be they have the schematics but haven't done anything with them yet.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: GuyIncognito on 25 December 2021, 11:47:00
This is just step one of Doc Swift's plans to revive the Celestial series, in the Empire.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 25 December 2021, 11:57:01
Oh, I have grander plans than that!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 25 December 2021, 14:22:31
I'm a bit surprised no one has mentioned the new Galaxy...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 25 December 2021, 15:21:46
Eta? Mix of free and trueborns?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 25 December 2021, 21:01:36
Okay, I can admit when I'm wrong. Intro, Blakist, Mixed, and even EC-tech mechs and tanks. Armed Indys (which I'd previously thought declared extinct in the Empire for some reason) and small combat support vees. Conventional fighters and small craft gunships. No less than four classes of purely IS-tech battlesuits, not to mention what may be the last faction listing for Corona suits.

I need to apologize. Doc Swift, I accused you of rendering the current incarnation of the Goliath Scorpions utterly boring and efficient, and while the loss of Protos still rankles, I was completely wrong on both counts. I am truly sorry.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 25 December 2021, 22:05:39
Sounds like Weirdo just became a die hard Scorpion fanboy!

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 25 December 2021, 23:42:00
Eta? Mix of free and trueborns?

Hopefully a sign of continued progress.

It would be delicious for Imperial Celestials to appear
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 26 December 2021, 02:37:30
I'm a bit surprised no one has mentioned the new Galaxy...

Didn't we already reveal Eta in Moving Forward?
Maybe they will one day. Could be they have the schematics but haven't done anything with them yet.

Even if they have the schematics, remember the files used to create the Star Python were damaged and had to be sent to a civilian contractor to be restored.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 26 December 2021, 02:57:37
You're correct. I never know if everyone reads the fiction, but I expect that most people do read TROs and the like.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 26 December 2021, 09:33:52
So, ¿the Star Phyton is getting another line in Gateway besides the line(s) in Imperial BattleMechs of Braunschweig?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 26 December 2021, 09:36:55
So, ¿the Star Phyton is getting another line in Gateway besides the line(s) in Imperial BattleMechs of Braunschweig?

Gateway was the first full production line. Everything before that were prototypes. No idea if they start another line on another planet.
Remember, the RecGuide is set before Moving Forward. The Mech is still in limited/prototype production state at that point. The Foxes simply didn't know about the factory being set up on Gateway.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 26 December 2021, 09:48:03
Gateway was the first full production line. Everything before that were prototypes. No idea if they start another line on another planet.


Maybe i got it wrong. The RecGuide #23 list the production site of the mech at Imperial BattleMechs of Braunschweig. But the  "MOVING FORWARD" story at Sharpnel #6 states that a line is beign built in Gateway.

So, Gateway´s line was the first, and later they added another production site at Braunschweig´s Imperial BattleMechs?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 26 December 2021, 09:50:26

Maybe i got it wrong. The RecGuide #23 list the production site of the mech at Imperial BattleMechs of Braunschweig. But the  "MOVING FORWARD" story at Sharpnel #6 states that a line is beign built in Gateway.

So, Gateway´s line was the first, and later they added another production site at Braunschweig´s Imperial BattleMechs?

My edit came to late ;)
The RecGuide is set earlier. The Mech is still in prototype/limited production state at that point. Gateway was the first full production line.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 26 December 2021, 09:56:16
My edit came to late ;)
The RecGuide is set earlier. The Mech is still in prototype/limited production state at that point. Gateway was the first full production line.

Got it. So while there is some production at Braunschweig, the first "proper" factory line is at Gateway. Also, if i understanded correctly (english is not my main language) the Scorpions have a "Hephaestus Station". ¿Is something similar to the orbital assembly line the Wolf´s Dragoons used to have?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 26 December 2021, 09:58:42
No, the Hephaestus line was cut from Moving Forward via errata. Plans changed between writing and release of the story and it was forgotten to cut it before release.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 26 December 2021, 10:09:05
No, the Hephaestus line was cut from Moving Forward via errata. Plans changed between writing and release of the story and it was forgotten to cut it before release.

Was not aware of the erratas. So, based on that, we can assume that the first test moderl were produced at Braunschweig, but the first production models at Gateway?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 26 December 2021, 10:13:42
Was not aware of the erratas. So, based on that, we can assume that the first test moderl were produced at Braunschweig, but the first production models at Gateway?

That seems correct, yes. We don't know if the prototype line was later refurbished for full production or used for something else, though.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 26 December 2021, 10:20:15
That seems correct, yes. We don't know if the prototype line was later refurbished for full production or used for something else, though.


While the RecGuides are usually made as in-universe documents, with all the miss-information and errors that it can entail, the information on the TROs (and RecGuides) tend to be correct.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: VhenRa on 26 December 2021, 23:06:03
Also we have Scorpion activity in the "former" [Huh... wonder what happened there] Coreward Confederacy world of Norfolk.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 27 December 2021, 03:34:05

While the RecGuides are usually made as in-universe documents, with all the miss-information and errors that it can entail, the information on the TROs (and RecGuides) tend to be correct.

Yeah. I think Moving Forward made it clear that the Star Python entering regular production on Gateway was a political move. The Khan was running a long game with Emmy Line. Look deep enough and you might find him machinating a lot of things in the background to get her where she ended up. Her own decisions might not really have been her own over large parts of her career once she caught his eye.
That's all speculation, though. So far we have not seen any of that and just because I imagine it happening doesn't mean it really did. Gateway being a political move is quite clear, based on the sources we have.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 27 December 2021, 08:16:02
Really impressed with the Scorpions getting the former C* and WoB Mechs, hopefully they'll get some of the other designs like the Initiate, Lightray, Grim Reaper and Toyama.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 27 December 2021, 08:35:37
Having it Clan tech may help it survive better than Nexus/Nexus II/Jackrabbit would have with Inner Sphere/Star League Tech
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 27 December 2021, 10:11:37
Given they are used in packs, there should be quite a few of them.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 27 December 2021, 16:15:52
I would love to see the Lightray make a come back in the Empire.  I LOVE the mini, think it captures the design's speedy nature perfectly.  I want it to be mixed tech, Clan XL, IS body, Supercharger for more speed, maybe some Clan electronics and a Snub PPC on the arm w/AES.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 27 December 2021, 20:49:44
I would love to see the Lightray make a come back in the Empire.  I LOVE the mini, think it captures the design's speedy nature perfectly.  I want it to be mixed tech, Clan XL, IS body, Supercharger for more speed, maybe some Clan electronics and a Snub PPC on the arm w/AES.

I like where your head is at
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 27 December 2021, 20:57:24
If they take on a WoB 55-tonner, I think I'd rather give them an Omni-Buccaneer.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 27 December 2021, 21:09:32
A piddly 6/9?  Eh, it also has that sort of un-Clanlike hatchet.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 27 December 2021, 21:14:51
Fits pretty well with the folks who made the Rhino, and who got the factory that makes the Surtur.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 27 December 2021, 21:23:33
Fits pretty well with the folks who made the Rhino, and who got the factory that makes the Surtur.

what exactly is the rhino? I've seen referances to a mech called that but can't find it
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 27 December 2021, 21:27:27
Fits pretty well with the folks who made the Rhino, and who got the factory that makes the Surtur.

Lol, 3150 why I said 'sort-of' but did forget they got the Surtur.  I did view the Rhino's ramming attack as more elegant/skill based than swinging a hatchet, punching, or kicking.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 27 December 2021, 21:42:45
what exactly is the rhino? I've seen referances to a mech called that but can't find it

It's in OTP: Hanseatic Crusade.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 28 December 2021, 00:14:33
what exactly is the rhino? I've seen referances to a mech called that but can't find it

It's a very, very, very scary 50 ton Quad mech that first saw print in the old FASA magazine. Doc Swift and the rest of the mad geniuses at CGL took the idea and turned the Rhino into a brutally efficient Clan quad built for charging with a ram plate, spikes, several ER medium lasers, and a supercharger so you can go really fast like Sonic the Hedgehog, and turn your enemies into crash test dummies.  It's what happens when the Clans watch too many Mad Max movies.  And I love it, because CGL is pulling in old stuff from every ancient nook and cranny of Battletech and placing it in a updated format.  Heck, we might even end up with the Screaming Hawk, the Achilles, or even the Ventilator at some point.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 28 December 2021, 04:20:27
And you get to see it in action in Moving Forward ;)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: VhenRa on 28 December 2021, 18:59:32
Ewww, I stepped in pirate mech.

Can sum that up.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 29 December 2021, 00:56:22
That... sounds about right :D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 January 2022, 14:19:32
Can someone remind me again which clans the Scorpions absorbed members from around the time they were Abjured and during the Wars of Reaving. I want to say Hellions and Mandrills but I am not sure.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AlphaMirage on 10 January 2022, 14:22:22
Hellions
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 10 January 2022, 14:52:52
Can someone remind me again which clans the Scorpions absorbed members from around the time they were Abjured and during the Wars of Reaving. I want to say Hellions and Mandrills but I am not sure.

Some of the Mandrills lower caste were taken and unlike the Eridani and Hellions their military presence is nonexistent.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AJC46 on 29 January 2022, 22:07:24
those early clan things that were reintroduced in 3080s likely fell back into extinction due to being outclassed by their "modern" clan standard versions once the scorps regained the ability to mass produce proper clan tech standard stuff in the 3100s.

like why used a improved ppc(standard is PPC with 6 tons weight and 2 crit slots) when you got access to the clan er ppc again..
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 30 January 2022, 06:05:45
Makes sense, the improved weapons were basically a stopgap until the full spec items could once again be produced.

Hopefully we will see a Lightray C and Toyama C at some point as will, although the Toyama at least will need a new name.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 30 January 2022, 11:32:48
The name only matters if the Scorpions care.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 30 January 2022, 12:40:27
Maybe but they did change the names of the Nexus and Grand Crusader so I guess they care on some level.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 30 January 2022, 16:23:21
I think it's not that they care about Blakist names, and more that they care about rebranding to make it theirs.

Thinking about it, I guess it makes no difference, since the end result will likely be the same.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 31 January 2022, 11:45:12
Man . . . 2 Clan ERLL, IS or Clan LB-10X (not much difference), and LRMs or better ATMs for . . . Moreau?  What Founder would you want to rename it to?  Maybe name it after the Imperio's founding Khan?  Lightray becomes the Conner?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 31 January 2022, 11:54:40
If it's meant for second-line use, name it after some famous figure from Castilian or Umayyad history. Or given the Scorpions' proclivities, some famous SLDF general.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 31 January 2022, 12:04:18
If it's meant for second-line use, name it after some famous figure from Castilian or Umayyad history. Or given the Scorpions' proclivities, some famous SLDF general.

Moreau was my first inclination- a abathka Star League officer who was their first Loremaster.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 31 January 2022, 17:06:19
Moreau was my first inclination- a abathka Star League officer who was their first Loremaster.

It would certainly make sense.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 31 January 2022, 17:10:02
I could see that regarding Moreau, but especially for a fairly optimal frontline machine or Omni.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 31 January 2022, 17:12:33
Spotlight On: Hellion Keshik is finally coming out this week. I think I put some good stuff in there. Hope y'all like it!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 31 January 2022, 23:18:40
Toyama already has a non-WOB name, Odysseus
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 01 February 2022, 17:07:04
Toyama already has a non-WOB name, Odysseus

That would work, I guess if anyone is going to know that its the Scorpions.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 February 2022, 20:53:45
I've posted a couple previews for SO: Hellion Keshik on twitter and at my FB author page (link in sig), if anyone's interested. More will follow over the next couple days.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Angrii on 02 February 2022, 10:53:13
I've posted a couple previews for SO: Hellion Keshik on twitter and at my FB author page (link in sig), if anyone's interested. More will follow over the next couple days.  :)

Looking forward to it! I'm excited to see Protomechs in the organization table, even if it is from an older era.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 February 2022, 10:56:28
I just posted another teaser for those interested!  8)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 February 2022, 19:38:45
Another preview is up! This one shows part of the organization from one era, highlighting an interesting mix of battlesuit Points...  8)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: GuyIncognito on 02 February 2022, 22:01:56
Sure, make it even easier for my to run the Empire with my existing collection why don't you.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 02 February 2022, 22:17:52
Hey uh, do you mind? I'm really trying not to get any more invested in the Scorpions right now, so if you could stop making them so damn interesting, that'd be great for me. Help a guy out, would you?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Lanceman on 03 February 2022, 09:51:06
Ya'll got any of them Star Crusaders? I'd really like one.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 03 February 2022, 17:23:24
Curious whether the Scorpions and Foxes get into it from time to time? Might wanna check out my latest preview for SO: Hellion Keshik!  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 03 February 2022, 17:35:53
Oh..

I wonder if it'll be a Fox two-step?

 :thumbsup:

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 03 February 2022, 21:23:16
Curious whether the Scorpions and Foxes get into it from time to time? Might wanna check out my latest preview for SO: Hellion Keshik!  :)

I'm already buying it tomorrow!  No need to sell me.

But yeah, a lot of people want to see more than trials.  They want to see all out war. 

Not me, though!  Lol, these are two of my favorite factions and it would hurt a lot if they ripped each other's hearts out.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 03 February 2022, 23:17:03
Well, a Spotlight On isn't the place to start a full-on war!

Edit: And the last preview is posted. This one shows some of the detailed personalities. Well, it shows their names. I think they're a good tease, showing how the Empire's reforms have continued since the Crusade.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 04 February 2022, 00:03:07
Good to see the progressive Hansa being allowed into a Keshik.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 04 February 2022, 04:16:04
Good to see the progressive Hansa being allowed into a Keshik.
You have a freeborn Hansa as zarKhan. There was never any question about what they can achieve in the Empire :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 10:15:11
Ah, publishing! When something written later steals the thunder of something written first!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 04 February 2022, 11:49:45
You have a freeborn Hansa as zarKhan. There was never any question about what they can achieve in the Empire :)

What's the root behind the word zarKhan? Assuming it's not a Power Rangers reference, best I'm getting is Czar Khan.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 11:59:34
Yep. ArKhan wouldn't work because of the Lyran Commonwealth's ruling title, so I went with zar instead.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 04 February 2022, 14:59:37
Oh my, there was a lot packed into the Spotlight.

Hellion Keshik is a quite the formation.

Favourite parts might be the advancement at the end regarding Clan Sea Fox and the expansion of Hansa traders into the Chainelaines
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DoctorTeeth on 04 February 2022, 15:25:04
Just bought the Spotlight On, and was hoping someone here might have the answer to a question I have:

Do we have an official color scheme for members of Hellion Galaxy who are not Hellion Keshik?

Hellion Keshik is ice blue w/ a navy pinstripe, but Keshiks often have their own unique scheme. Hellion galaxy was originally Beta Galaxy, which was black accents on a sand-color base.

I can't find any official note as to whether Hellion Galaxy as a whole kept the Beta galaxy scheme, or whether the Hellion Keshik scheme is intended for all members of Hellion galaxy, or if its something else entirely.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 04 February 2022, 16:58:20
Here's hoping they retain the tan and black.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DoctorTeeth on 04 February 2022, 17:00:23
That's what I'm hoping too - the Black-on-Sand color is both my favorite of the Scorpions schemes, and the most iconically "Scorpion" in my personal opinion.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 17:08:34
Unless and until expressly changed, the old paint scheme stands for all CGS units.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 17:12:05
Oh my, there was a lot packed into the Spotlight.

Hellion Keshik is a quite the formation.

Favourite parts might be the advancement at the end regarding Clan Sea Fox and the expansion of Hansa traders into the Chainelaines

 8)

And those are Imperial merchants.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 04 February 2022, 20:36:24
Imperial Hansa - which is all sorts of awesome going forward.

I appreciate the lines it opens, and gives all sorts of excuses for further shenanigans.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 20:47:56
someone's gotta compete with the Foxes, right?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 04 February 2022, 21:07:47
someone's gotta compete with the Foxes, right?

looks like we're seeing a number of potential Fox compeition coming down the road between and Empire and the ALM... exciting times.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 04 February 2022, 21:57:34
It's interesting to see that the Scorpions are establishing a relay HPG network between the Empire and their new holding in the Chaine Cluster.

Actually, if the Scorpions wanted to go one step farther, perhaps they could consider going after the Rim Territories? The locals would no doubt welcome someone getting rid of their dezgra pirate overlords.

Plus, with all of the goings-on over in Tamar Rising, even a relatively modest Scorpion presence so close to the Hinterlands would be enough to make things quite interesting. So long as that still (hopefully) leaves enough of the Touman to safeguard the Empire proper, on the off chance that one or more of the Homeworld Clans ever actually get around to showing up in force...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Kojak on 04 February 2022, 22:09:17
someone's gotta compete with the Foxes, right?

"Begun, the Chaine Wars have"
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 22:25:43
if the Scorpions wanted to go one step farther, perhaps they could consider going after the Rim Territories? The locals would no doubt welcome someone getting rid of their dezgra pirate overlords.

Plus, with all of the goings-on over in Tamar Rising, even a relatively modest Scorpion presence so close to the Hinterlands would be enough to make things quite interesting. So long as that still (hopefully) leaves enough of the Touman to safeguard the Empire proper, on the off chance that one or more of the Homeworld Clans ever actually get around to showing up in force...

One thing I endeavored to show in OTP: Hanseatic Crusade is that the Scorpions have learned from the mistakes that the Invading Clans made. Instead of conquering vast swaths of territory far from home, and splitting their forces and focus, their conquest of the Hanseatic League began first by establishing colonies between the Empire and the League. This reduced the distance between the two parts of what would become the larger Empire after the conquest, making it easier to govern the whole. To undertake an invasion of worlds on the edge of the Inner Sphere would require considerable effort and an abandonment of the model that worked so effectively. While the Scorpions are very invested in anti-piracy efforts, even those far afield (as I showed in one of the reborn ComStar trio 'Mechs in the RecGuide), this is as much about maintaining a keen edge on their troops' abilities as cleaning up the neighborhood. Most assuredly, their forces will engage any pirates from the Rim Territories, if the pirates are foolish enough to seek prey outward rather than in toward the Inner Sphere. Since the latter is much closer and thus requires less time and investment to raid, and since they've been around for 70 years, they'd be well-advised to mind their manners. But any attempt to occupy or conquer those worlds by the Empire isn't something I see develeloping given how long it would take to engineer. After all, the Scorpions now have a fully self-sufficient nation. They're not content to sit on their laurels, and they've added at least one Galaxy to their touman since the Crusade. They know what dangers lurk in the depths, after all. I'd say they're busily preparing for the next war, which is more likely to come to them than vice versa.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 04 February 2022, 22:44:52
My personal hope is this: If the Home Clans think about it, they realize attempting to conquer the Scorpion Empire is a counterproductive venture that will only sap their strength and detract from a new invasion of the Inner Sphere.

In effect, they would be spreading themselves thin once more, making a similar mistake to what the original invaders had made.

And now with HPG communication links, it would give away the element of surprise.

I could be wrong, of course.  But I feel the silence from the Home Worlds backs this up.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 04 February 2022, 22:57:38
Just have to say your Awesome C is the scariest Awesome variant I have read about.  And Spot on: Hellion Keshik is definitely a great sequel to Hanseatic Crusade.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 04 February 2022, 23:00:36
One thing I endeavored to show in OTP: Hanseatic Crusade is that the Scorpions have learned from the mistakes that the Invading Clans made. Instead of conquering vast swaths of territory far from home, and splitting their forces and focus, their conquest of the Hanseatic League began first by establishing colonies between the Empire and the League. This reduced the distance between the two parts of what would become the larger Empire after the conquest, making it easier to govern the whole. To undertake an invasion of worlds on the edge of the Inner Sphere would require considerable effort and an abandonment of the model that worked so effectively. While the Scorpions are very invested in anti-piracy efforts, even those far afield (as I showed in one of the reborn ComStar trio 'Mechs in the RecGuide), this is as much about maintaining a keen edge on their troops' abilities as cleaning up the neighborhood. Most assuredly, their forces will engage any pirates from the Rim Territories, if the pirates are foolish enough to seek prey outward rather than in toward the Inner Sphere. Since the latter is much closer and thus requires less time and investment to raid, and since they've been around for 70 years, they'd be well-advised to mind their manners. But any attempt to occupy or conquer those worlds by the Empire isn't something I see develeloping given how long it would take to engineer. After all, the Scorpions now have a fully self-sufficient nation. They're not content to sit on their laurels, and they've added at least one Galaxy to their touman since the Crusade. They know what dangers lurk in the depths, after all. I'd say they're busily preparing for the next war, which is more likely to come to them than vice versa.

Alternatively, if a full-scale conquest of the Rim Territories was not viable, perhaps a more measured approach could be an option?

To put it another way: perhaps the Scorpions could show up and claim control of a single Rim Territories system to begin with, akin to their establishment of a foothold in the Chaine Cluster. (Since the Scorpions are so keen on history, perhaps they might re-name the world in question to the name it went by during the first Star League.)

Such a holding might act as a waypoint to support rimward Seeker expeditions - such as their relatively recent visit to Solaris VII - while offering a useful distraction for the more hot-headed Trueborn warriors who might otherwise stir up trouble in the Empire proper.

And in the medium to long term, the Scorpions could try to pick off a neighbouring star system or two if circumstances permit...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 23:06:21
Just have to say your Awesome C is the scariest Awesome variant I have read about.  And Spot on: Hellion Keshik is definitely a great sequel to Hanseatic Crusade.

There was back and forth over whether it should be the Awesome C or Awesome IIC, since it's really a complete remake. That happened above my pay grade, though. I'm just happy it's what it is. (See, I had it in mind when I gave the Hanseatic League the Awesome 9Q in the OTP, which took some back and forth of its own as I recall.) In the end, it's fairly simple but I think pretty, well, awesome. :)

At some point, the Empire will have to fight a war. Their touman is filled with warriors who want to make their mark. Holding them back will only work for so long. As the architect of things to this point, I hope it doesn't force them to make rash decisions that could lead to disaster. After all, it's not like in the Homeworlds where it was easy to throw your best against another Clan's best and let them beat each other's brains out. They've basically cleared the region of threats, and their warriors need worthy foes...

And thanks! The OTP and the two SOs were fun to craft!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 23:12:43
Alternatively, if a full-scale conquest of the Rim Territories was not viable, perhaps a more measured approach could be an option?

To put it another way: perhaps the Scorpions could show up and claim control of a single Rim Territories system to begin with, akin to their establishment of a foothold in the Chaine Cluster. (Since the Scorpions are so keen on history, perhaps they might re-name the world in question to the name it went by during the first Star League.)

Such a holding might act as a waypoint to support rimward Seeker expeditions - such as their relatively recent visit to Solaris VII - while offering a useful distraction for the more hot-headed Trueborn warriors who might otherwise stir up trouble in the Empire proper.

And in the medium to long term, the Scorpions could try to pick off a neighbouring star system or two if circumstances permit...


"There are always possibilities," Spock said, and it's certainly something that could happen. I'll note that winning a trial for an enclave on a Clan-held world is a far different matter from taking territory from non-Clan forces. They tend not to take such things in stride, and it would definitely escalate beyond a simple trial. In an actual fight, the Scorpions would mop the floor with the Territories, but then the Empire would be left vulnerable. It's not a short trip between the two. Now, if the Seekers get themselves into trouble digging for some relics or other, there might be a reason to send in the troops. It was kinda their fault the Crusade happened when it did, somewhat prematurely for Khan Scott's liking, so there's also precedent for that! (And Seeker Galaxy got tuned up hard in the Crusade.) The Scorpions are sporting at least seven Galaxies, which is pretty significant. It's eight if the PGCs are lumped together into Grunt Galaxy again.

Rather than military conquest, though, a mercantile operation to peel them off from Lyran or Sea Fox suppliers could spark a bigger conflict between the Empire and worthy foes...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 04 February 2022, 23:36:28
Well, I'm glad there is not state of war between the Scorpions and Sea Foxes.  The Sea Foxes are the types that would welcome the competition. 

I see the prominent ELH Bloodnames in existence.  That's something many of us have been speculating about for quite some time.  Barclay sibko decanted on Roche BEFORE they were Abjured?  That's really interesting.


I already can't wait for the Scorpions to appear in future sourcebooks.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 04 February 2022, 23:47:00
I see the prominent ELH Bloodnames in existence.  That's something many of us have been speculating about for quite some time.  Barclay sibko decanted on Roche BEFORE they were Abjured?  That's really interesting.

I already can't wait for the Scorpions to appear in future sourcebooks.

Remember why the Scorpions were abjured? ;) And I think you might mean Winston...  ???

Tell Ray! And tell him you want me to write it!  ;D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 05 February 2022, 00:16:40
"There are always possibilities," Spock said, and it's certainly something that could happen. I'll note that winning a trial for an enclave on a Clan-held world is a far different matter from taking territory from non-Clan forces. They tend not to take such things in stride, and it would definitely escalate beyond a simple trial. In an actual fight, the Scorpions would mop the floor with the Territories, but then the Empire would be left vulnerable. It's not a short trip between the two. Now, if the Seekers get themselves into trouble digging for some relics or other, there might be a reason to send in the troops. It was kinda their fault the Crusade happened when it did, somewhat prematurely for Khan Scott's liking, so there's also precedent for that! (And Seeker Galaxy got tuned up hard in the Crusade.) The Scorpions are sporting at least seven Galaxies, which is pretty significant. It's eight if the PGCs are lumped together into Grunt Galaxy again.

Rather than military conquest, though, a mercantile operation to peel them off from Lyran or Sea Fox suppliers could spark a bigger conflict between the Empire and worthy foes...


Hmm...

I took a look at the maps in First Succession War in order to try and figure out which Rim Territories systems had which Rim Worlds Republic system names - and it turns out that a number of these systems had been part of the short-lived Finmark Free Republic. So there's an added bit of history there to dig up, so to speak.

But then, there is another detail of note. During Operation REVIVAL, the invading Clans were mainly focused on the crimes of the Usurper when they showed up in former RWR systems, to the chagrin of the conquered populace. However, despite everything, the Great Father himself had considered the "post-Amaris" Rim Worlds to be under Star League protection. He was not pleased about the opportunism displayed by the Lyrans during Operation ALMARIC, though any effort to follow up on this was pre-empted by the Exodus. (Over in the Empires Aflame timeline, settling this "unfinished business" would lead the Terrans and Lyrans to co-sponsor the creation of the Rim Federation.)


So, if the Scorpions were to show up in Rim Territories space - in whatever capacity - they could portray themselves to the locals as the (belated) executors of Kerensky Senior's wishes towards them. What said locals might think of it all, however, is another matter...

And another thing: if there is going to be a greater degree of contact between the Scorpions and the Council of Six Clans - or is it seven now, with the return of the Smoke Jaguars? - might there be a Trial of Position to see if threads like this one should stay here, or possibly be moved "back" to the Clan sub-board?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 05 February 2022, 00:27:08
Remember why the Scorpions were abjured? ;) And I think you might mean Winston...  ???

Tell Ray! And tell him you want me to write it!  ;D

Yes, I do remember why they were Abjured.  And of course I meant Winston!   Lol... 

Anyway, if you think it would help, I'll ask, but....
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 February 2022, 00:32:00
if there is going to be a greater degree of contact between the Scorpions and the Council of Six Clans - or is it seven now, with the return of the Smoke Jaguars? - might there be a Trial of Position to see if threads like this one should stay here, or possibly be moved "back" to the Clan sub-board?

No one has really pointed out that the Sea Foxes clearly regard the Scorpions as Clan, not as abjured. I've got ideas on how that might lead to new developments, but there are a lot of moving parts to deal with when you move beyond the isolation of the Deep Periphery. I think unless the Scorpions officially gain some recognition that negates that abjuration, they're still a separate entity. I also like the Periphery and having the Scorpions thread here makes it cooler.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 February 2022, 00:33:01
Yes, I do remember why they were Abjured. 

This was me acknowledging that turn of events and tying it into a new Bloodhouse.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 05 February 2022, 11:42:38
I really see the SO opening up the field like Tamar Rising. More people to fight at sub-invasion levels?

that is gold. Well done!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 05 February 2022, 13:38:19
Technically, isn't the Tamar Pact just the Chaos March 2.0?

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 05 February 2022, 19:42:01
Remember why the Scorpions were abjured? ;) And I think you might mean Winston...  ???

Tell Ray! And tell him you want me to write it!  ;D

DO IT! Start writing now ;D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 05 February 2022, 21:40:13
I really see the SO opening up the field like Tamar Rising. More people to fight at sub-invasion levels?

that is gold. Well done!

The Scorpions will be tied up with expanding their forces in the former Hanseatic League.  The expansion into the Chainelane looks more like an attempt to keep trade that the Hanseatic League kept and to find the next challenge in their expansion.  It looks like they may have competition with the Clan Sea Foxes but I see it (hopefully) more civilized.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 February 2022, 21:43:24
The Scorpions have already formed at least one new Galaxy since the Crusade (mentioned in RecGuide V23, I think), and the Sea Foxes zealously kept others from the Chainelane worlds. Winning that enclave was the Scorpions flexing on them, kind of testing their mettle against their biggest regional threat.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 06 February 2022, 00:18:59
SO on Helion Keshik continues the line of excellence I've loved from your work Doc. I'd love to see how the other Periphery powers end up during the start of the IlClan, especially if you ever get to tackle the Fronc Reaches again. Or even the Taurians/Calderon reapproachment and reunion...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 06 February 2022, 00:31:42
Thanks! Glad to hear you've liked my work!

I still love the Reaches. The sequel to "The Marshal Way" is floating around somewhere with the fiction guys, but it's been there for several years so I'm not confident it'll ever see the light of day. Shame, as I thought it was pretty damn good.

Hassle Ray that you want me to write more Periphery stuff! Maybe he'll listen!  >:D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 06 February 2022, 00:55:57
No one has really pointed out that the Sea Foxes clearly regard the Scorpions as Clan, not as abjured.

Well I don't think any IS Clan cares really what the Homeworld Clans decreed after the Wars of Reavings, otherwise they would all be considered Abjured
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 06 February 2022, 00:58:03
And now the Scorpions know that...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 06 February 2022, 01:03:52
The Abjured Clans outnumber the UntaintedTM Clans of the Homeworlds.

Last I checked might does not make wrong among the Children of Kerensky...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 06 February 2022, 01:32:12
And now the Scorpions know that...

sure? but the IS Clans were all "Abjured" before the Scorpions were...if anything, it should say more that the Scorpions don't consider the Foxes as Abjured
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 06 February 2022, 04:12:36
The Scorpions have already formed at least one new Galaxy since the Crusade (mentioned in RecGuide V23, I think), and the Sea Foxes zealously kept others from the Chainelane worlds. Winning that enclave was the Scorpions flexing on them, kind of testing their mettle against their biggest regional threat.

Yep. And we already had some more details about them in Moving Forward.

sure? but the IS Clans were all "Abjured" before the Scorpions were...if anything, it should say more that the Scorpions don't consider the Foxes as Abjured

Yes and no. If you are talking to the Homeworld Clans, perhaps. But then again, those consider them all tainted.
Now, if you want to talk to the Clans in the IS, their opinion counts a lot heavier than that of the Homeworld Clans. Why would Clan Wolf care what any of the Homeworld Clans think? (That assumes the Homeworld Clans are even alive anymore.) If the Scorpions want to engage with the IS Clans, they have to somewhat play by their rules.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 06 February 2022, 04:28:24
Yes and no. If you are talking to the Homeworld Clans, perhaps. But then again, those consider them all tainted.
Now, if you want to talk to the Clans in the IS, their opinion counts a lot heavier than that of the Homeworld Clans. Why would Clan Wolf care what any of the Homeworld Clans think? (That assumes the Homeworld Clans are even alive anymore.) If the Scorpions want to engage with the IS Clans, they have to somewhat play by their rules.

the point being made was that the Diamond Sharks/Sea Foxes don't consider the Scorpions as Abjured

my point is, why would they? The Homeworld Clans Abjured the Scorpions long after the IS Clans already left the Homeworlds behind and were already themselves Abjured by said Homeworld Clans (including the Scorpions)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 06 February 2022, 05:17:27
my point is, why would they? The Homeworld Clans Abjured the Scorpions long after the IS Clans already left the Homeworlds behind and were already themselves Abjured by said Homeworld Clans (including the Scorpions)

Ah, then I misunderstood :)
We will have to see how the relationship between the Scorpions and the IS Clans will play out. I don't think Alaric has them on his radar. And we don't know what decision they are going to make after the end of Moving Forward. They were going to discuss their relationship with a potential ilClan, not necessarily accepting it or bowing to it, but also not necessarily not accepting it. I don't really see them bend the knee, though. The risk of losing what they have build through careful planing might be too great. But I can see them enter in a mutual beneficial relationship.
Either way, just speculating here. I have absolutely no insight into how things are going to progress from this point forward. I haven't asked, since I am currently not writing anything about the Scorpions.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Gorgon on 06 February 2022, 05:52:48
As I was scrolling to the MUL yesterday (as one does) I saw that the Scorpions have access to the Korvin ever since they conquered the Castilians, bringing it back from extinction. Is that new? Or did I just miss it? Either way, it was a nice surprise.
EDIT: And the Tiger and LVT-4 are on the list as well. This really makes me want to build a mixed second-line Binary.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 06 February 2022, 11:58:59
Yeah, by all appearances the PGCs of the Empire are full of some really cool stuff.

It's kind of a shame that Imperial society seems to be far more Clan than not, meaning there doesn't seem to be any room for militias that rate even below the PGCs, or for small private forces raised by influential civilians(the equivalent of a noble's personal forces, though in this case you'd likely have a merchant of some kind at the top), but I guess we can't have everything.

At this point I think the proper term Imperial law would use for such units would be "Pirate".
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 06 February 2022, 12:10:02
Since they had to fight those private forces during the Crusade, I think the Scorpions would take a dim view of them on their new territory. With the early issues the Scorpions faced consolidating, future Hansa members of the merchant caste would have little political capital to try to reform such forces. And if any tried to build them in secret, their former serfs would waste little time ratting them out or taking matters into their own hands, especially now that they live far better as members of the laborer caste.

However, Clan police forces rate below PGCs, so there's a place for more eclectic force composition out there.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 06 February 2022, 12:20:38
Yeah, by all appearances the PGCs of the Empire are full of some really cool stuff.

It's kind of a shame that Imperial society seems to be far more Clan than not, meaning there doesn't seem to be any room for militias that rate even below the PGCs, or for small private forces raised by influential civilians(the equivalent of a noble's personal forces, though in this case you'd likely have a merchant of some kind at the top), but I guess we can't have everything.

At this point I think the proper term Imperial law would use for such units would be "Pirate".

The Scorpions may create or modify one of their Galaxies to protect their merchants.  They have experience with their Seeker units but the Scorpion Empire is flexible enough that creating such a unit is not out of line.  One other note the Hanseatic League had a poor experience with mercenaries before the Crusade so the chances of creating merc units is the same as the Ghost Bear Dominion directly hiring the GDL in pirate hunting.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: five_corparty on 06 February 2022, 13:11:54
The Scorpions may create or modify one of their Galaxies to protect their merchants. 

afree- Sounds like a mission for a rebuilt ELH... ;-)

They have experience with their Seeker units but the Scorpion Empire is flexible enough that creating such a unit is not out of line.

Agree fully; sorry to see the protos go, but I can see the Scorpions becoming big fans of quadvees, they seem like kind of Mech that would be popular with their freeborn mechwarriors and the trueborns being all "eh, sure, we'll allow it.  whatever." :-)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 06 February 2022, 14:49:03
However, Clan police forces rate below PGCs, so there's a place for more eclectic force composition out there.  :)

Oh hey, I have a Jade Falcon Watch force in the works, but completely forgot about doing something similar for the Scorps! Hmmm...horse-mounted police with a couple APCs as paddy wagons (or whatever they're called now), a couple armed Indys for heavy backup, and a command blimp on overwatch!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 06 February 2022, 14:55:51
Didn't TR mention something about Police 'Mechs as well?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 06 February 2022, 16:10:23
Oh hey, I have a Jade Falcon Watch force in the works, but completely forgot about doing something similar for the Scorps! Hmmm...horse-mounted police with a couple APCs as paddy wagons (or whatever they're called now), a couple armed Indys for heavy backup, and a command blimp on overwatch!


you better be naming them the Imperial Scorpion Mounted Police.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 06 February 2022, 19:02:54
As I was scrolling to the MUL yesterday (as one does) I saw that the Scorpions have access to the Korvin ever since they conquered the Castilians, bringing it back from extinction. Is that new? Or did I just miss it? Either way, it was a nice surprise.
EDIT: And the Tiger and LVT-4 are on the list as well. This really makes me want to build a mixed second-line Binary.

Vali, Vector, Vali, Vector, Vali, Vector....

I don't care how... C model or a IIC variant.

But Vali and Vector need to come back.

Doc! If you do get the chance, please make them great again!

TT

Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 06 February 2022, 20:27:41
Streamlabs sucks more memory than Chrome anymore, so I can't record videos for my yt channel as I once did because my poor computer can't hack it. I'm considering livestreams to continue my BattleTech Author Speaks videos. Any interest? Maybe Tuesday evening, around 6pm CST to talk about Operational Turning Points: Hanseatic Crusade?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 06 February 2022, 23:35:14
. . . Hmmm...horse-mounted police with a couple APCs as paddy wagons (or whatever they're called now), a couple armed Indys for heavy backup, and a command blimp on overwatch!

Juan Wagons?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 07 February 2022, 10:58:25
I saw that the Scorpions have access to the Korvin ever since they conquered the Castilians, bringing it back from extinction. Is that new? Or did I just miss it? Either way, it was a nice surprise.

In Objectives: Periphery the Castillans were making a retrofit of the Korvin. But the wording was kinda confusing. The book was set in 3076.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 07 February 2022, 11:12:57
They were manufacturing kits to retrofit existing Korvins. They were not building new ones at that time.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 07 February 2022, 12:22:07
Streamlabs sucks more memory than Chrome anymore, so I can't record videos for my yt channel as I once did because my poor computer can't hack it. I'm considering livestreams to continue my BattleTech Author Speaks videos. Any interest? Maybe Tuesday evening, around 6pm CST to talk about Operational Turning Points: Hanseatic Crusade?

Have you asked to join one of CGL's upcoming AMAs? That might be a good place to get more word out regarding the Scorpion Empire.

(Perhaps if or when we get closer to the release of the BattleTech Universe book?)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 07 February 2022, 12:24:30
Doc was in on one of the AMA's back last summer.  I'm sure they would let him in to another. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 07 February 2022, 12:29:18
I've been on at least one AMA, but those are few and far between. I posted videos fairly regularly until I uprooted for a new job. Now that I'm settling in again, I intend to resume that. Once a week or twice a month are reasonable, I think. I enjoy making them, and I only got about halfway through the products I wrote for. Lots left to cover!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 07 February 2022, 13:43:49
I already think of "The Hat" when I think of Doc Swift on video or AMA.

As in, "Obey the Hat".

Or "The Hat tells me you're not right in the head."

 ;D
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 07 February 2022, 14:07:53
Something else that occurred to me: should here be an IlClan-era Field Manual at some future point - say, after the current set of four "post-IlClan" books are out - there is now a good excuse to include the Scorpions in the mix. Well, at least those units posted to the Chaine Cluster.

By the way, can it be said which of the star systems named as being part of the Chaine Cluster on page 40 of ISP3 is the one hosting the new Scorpion enclave?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: VhenRa on 11 February 2022, 12:25:16
They were manufacturing kits to retrofit existing Korvins. They were not building new ones at that time.

Yeah. They did produce them in the past IIRC?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 11 February 2022, 12:45:17
Yeah, but I think the start and end dates are unknown.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AJC46 on 15 February 2022, 09:39:20
my big hope the scorp empire builds it strength enough to go back to the clan homeworlds and clear it out and turning the homeworlds to a series of museum systems of SLDF and clan history showing what happened to those who couldn't adapt.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 15 February 2022, 17:00:35
They were the second strongest Clan in the Homeworlds before their Abjuration...I don't recall if they lost many forces when leaving or how many
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 15 February 2022, 17:13:22
They lost a couple Galaxies in the WoR, but kept most of their forces together for the departure from the Homeworlds. They'd need to reactivate dead Galaxies or form some new ones to reach their former peak strength, and that's with Eta Galaxy already being created. (Though it's important to note that their current Galaxies have more Clusters than when they were in the Homeworlds. They could easily spin some off into at least one new Galaxy if they wanted to dilute their strength.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 15 February 2022, 17:15:25
While folks are talking clusters, it is the loss of their Potemkins that makes going back as an invasion harder.  The Scorpions sitting on that many Potemkins should have given them a major political bargaining chip going into Op Revival and afterwards supporting the OZs.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 15 February 2022, 22:39:24
my big hope the scorp empire builds it strength enough to go back to the clan homeworlds and clear it out and turning the homeworlds to a series of museum systems of SLDF and clan history showing what happened to those who couldn't adapt.

Some wayward Seeker(s) trying their coreward luck would be a solid hook to update in some small way what the Homeworlds situation is. Figure the Temple of the Nine Muses would be their fallen Eden, the Holy Grail, if you will. Even if they don't make it that far in before getting picked off by Manei Domini CASPAR VIs or Star Coyote BioProtoMechs, just some breadcrumb on what the hell has been going on would be divine. Otherwise, we haven't heard anything (not counting Icons) since ISP3/WoRS, right? Both from 2012...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 16 February 2022, 01:52:47
they should def do something with the homeworld clans. If not the scorpions returning they could have Alaric create his own explorer corps only to end up "kicking the proverbial ant hill"
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 16 February 2022, 06:20:44
Some wayward Seeker(s) trying their coreward luck would be a solid hook to update in some small way what the Homeworlds situation is. Figure the Temple of the Nine Muses would be their fallen Eden, the Holy Grail, if you will. Even if they don't make it that far in before getting picked off by Manei Domini CASPAR VIs or Star Coyote BioProtoMechs, just some breadcrumb on what the hell has been going on would be divine. Otherwise, we haven't heard anything (not counting Icons) since ISP3/WoRS, right? Both from 2012...

The Scorpions evacuated the Temple of Nine Muses during their exodus, so it won't be their reason to return to the Homeworlds.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: GuyIncognito on 16 February 2022, 08:47:28
Doc: Work’s work, but what would you say was the Scorpion project you most enjoyed working on? Both as a creator and a BT fan.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 16 February 2022, 10:46:37
The Crusade, without a doubt. It's not often you get to write an entire war by yourself.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 16 February 2022, 10:51:52
Then I'd bet Hellion Keshik still ranks up there.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 16 February 2022, 10:56:48
Oh, of course. There's only a few Empire products after all! They're all near the top. There's something else out there that I wrote that has yet to be released, though it's been scooped by some of what's already come out since.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 16 February 2022, 22:41:10
Oh, of course. There's only a few Empire products after all! They're all near the top. There's something else out there that I wrote that has yet to be released, though it's been scooped by some of what's already come out since.
First I am not sure what you mean in the last sentence.

Second I was wondering what the Scorpions what with sea fox trade routes and tech specs?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 February 2022, 08:13:23
I wrote something that was supposed to come out before OTP: Hanseatic Crusade, but things like a viral plague conspired to prevent its release.

The Scorpions took a while to return to their previous technological levels. They know they're behind where the IS and IS Clans are. Getting any technical data is a goldmine. With it they can pursue advancing to parity with the IS powers.

Trade routes are similarly desirable for the Empire and its powerful merchant caste and fleet.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 17 February 2022, 09:22:49
I'm curious how regular Clan Trade Castes will get along with the Sea Foxes since they essentially have a growing monopoly in the Inner Sphere.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 17 February 2022, 09:25:36
I don't think both sides will be selling the same thing. The Scorpions don't have the production capabilities of the Sea Foxes. No way they can sell Mechs left and right like the Sea Foxes do.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 February 2022, 09:59:20
They might be able to sell at a loss, though, and cut into the Fox market. They also sell unique products, which could threaten that looming monopoly.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 17 February 2022, 10:57:21
They might be able to sell at a loss, though, and cut into the Fox market. They also sell unique products, which could threaten that looming monopoly.

Redacted.

I can actually see that going down.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 17 February 2022, 12:01:24
They might be able to sell at a loss, though, and cut into the Fox market. They also sell unique products, which could threaten that looming monopoly.

That they could do.
I can also see them going into the information market. Moving Forward showed them getting really good at combining data and extrapolating information from different sources by combining them and building a full picture. It's not a skill easy to come by.

That might also be a skill they want to keep hidden, though.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 February 2022, 12:10:17
Something I have left unstated is what the Scorpion Watch might be up to. Some will surely be rooting out any lingering restive elements from the conquest, but the rest...?  >:D

I mean, look how far the Seekers have gone. Who's to say there aren't Watch personnel riding shotgun?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 February 2022, 15:12:20
I would expect the Watch to have co-opted the Seekers . . . I mean, they make great Spec Ops teams for the Watch . . .
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 17 February 2022, 15:34:53
i suspect it would become a mutual cooption, since the Watch also make a great research group for the seekers.

I also have to wonder. given the Scorpion watch's skill at gathering information.. are they the reason that Wolfnet was so effective? since we know the scorpions trained the dragoons, and certainly the wolf watch was never all that impressive.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 17 February 2022, 15:37:40
since we know the scorpions trained the dragoons, and certainly the wolf watch was never all that impressive.

Not until the late-great Star Colonel Ramil Kerensky put them on the map, of course.

Wolf Watch was definitely a late-bloomer.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 February 2022, 16:18:59
i suspect it would become a mutual cooption, since the Watch also make a great research group for the seekers.

I also have to wonder. given the Scorpion watch's skill at gathering information.. are they the reason that Wolfnet was so effective? since we know the scorpions trained the dragoons, and certainly the wolf watch was never all that impressive.

The old FASA? Covert Ops group had the Invasion Wolves be better at covert ops while the Falcons were the analysts.

Considering how much the Crusader Wolves had the Lyran border penetrated . . .
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DOC_Agren on 17 February 2022, 18:17:38
Okay...  I'm not much of a clan player and when I was for a long time I was looking a Ghost Bear but I keep thinking how much for the Scorpions could be.

So I am looking at a Seeker lead force set in the 3050/60 era what would it be.
1 mech a few support vehicles, maybe an old Leopard Dropship?

Help the new guy out?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 17 February 2022, 18:37:50
The old FASA? Covert Ops group had the Invasion Wolves be better at covert ops while the Falcons were the analysts.

Considering how much the Crusader Wolves had the Lyran border penetrated . . .

if you're refering to guide to covert ops that book had so many problems with it I'd not trust it if it told me the king of the 31st century battlefield was the Battlemech :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Natasha Kerensky on 17 February 2022, 21:20:09
Okay...  I'm not much of a clan player and when I was for a long time I was looking a Ghost Bear but I keep thinking how much for the Scorpions could be.

So I am looking at a Seeker lead force set in the 3050/60 era what would it be.
1 mech a few support vehicles, maybe an old Leopard Dropship?

Help the new guy out?

https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Clan_Goliath_Scorpion#Seekers (https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Clan_Goliath_Scorpion#Seekers)

Usually folks recommend a highly survivable, all-energy design for Seekers to keep the logistics down.  Hard to beat the thick armor, SFE, dual peepers, quartet of ER Mediums, and heat neutral running alpha strike on the Kingfisher C in that timeframe.

To the extent Seekers are engaging more in banditry than upright Trials of Possession, I might opt for something faster with hands, like a Stormcrow Prime.  Still well-armored with an all-energy, heat-neutral walking alpha strike.

Consider protomech escort.  Scorpions built the Triton specifically for this duty.

https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Triton

I don’t recall any Scorpion vehicles.  But support like a BattleMech Recovery Vehicle seems obvious, depending on how big an artifact you’re going after.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 17 February 2022, 21:38:54
Okay...  I'm not much of a clan player and when I was for a long time I was looking a Ghost Bear but I keep thinking how much for the Scorpions could be.

So I am looking at a Seeker lead force set in the 3050/60 era what would it be.
1 mech a few support vehicles, maybe an old Leopard Dropship?

Help the new guy out?

One other consideration is look into old SLDF “energy boats”.  If any possesses a few of those it is the Scorpion Goliath Seekers.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 17 February 2022, 23:00:31

Trade routes are similarly desirable for the Empire and its powerful merchant caste and fleet.

The Scorpion's have a big fleet? How did they get that?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 February 2022, 23:02:44
In the Crusade.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 17 February 2022, 23:10:12
In the Crusade.

The Hansa had enough jumpships to considered major.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 February 2022, 23:14:13
And the Hansa are now Imperials.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 February 2022, 23:30:18
The Scorpion's have a big fleet? How did they get that?

*sniffles* They did have the majority of the Clan Potemkins, a McKenna, and some other big guns.

Seekers-  Consider a RP party . . . Mechwarrior, your DS pilot has a ASF in the hanger that they can fly while the DS is grounded, you have a point of Elementals that are probably solahma while being able to do some of the grunt work, give them a merchant for dealing, a tech with a Star League expertise, and yes a point of vehicles . . . driven/operated by more solahma.  It would be considered a well equipped Seeker.  Oh, yeah, don't they have familiars?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 18 February 2022, 13:36:08
To the extent Seekers are engaging more in banditry than upright Trials of Possession, I might opt for something faster with hands, like a Stormcrow Prime.  Still well-armored with an all-energy, heat-neutral walking alpha strike.

My preference for playing a Seeker is a Man O' War H. It's got a hand, it's got the speed to quickly get into(or out of) trouble, it's tough, it's got the heavy damage to end a fight quickly, and it's got a solid energy armament so it can keep fighting even after the cannon ammo runs out. My only gripe is a lack of active probe, but that's what escorting Protos or suits are for.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DOC_Agren on 18 February 2022, 19:19:06
Seekers-  Consider a RP party . . . Mechwarrior, your DS pilot has a ASF in the hanger that they can fly while the DS is grounded, you have a point of Elementals that are probably solahma while being able to do some of the grunt work, give them a merchant for dealing, a tech with a Star League expertise, and yes a point of vehicles . . . driven/operated by more solahma.  It would be considered a well equipped Seeker.  Oh, yeah, don't they have familiars?

Now I see people saying using clan mech, what about SL Royal design?  If you are heading into Inner Sphere/ even the Rimward an Inner Sphere mech stands out less?

Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 19 February 2022, 04:09:28
Now I see people saying using clan mech, what about SL Royal design?  If you are heading into Inner Sphere/ even the Rimward an Inner Sphere mech stands out less?

Very true, something like a Royal Black Knight perhaps?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 19 February 2022, 05:33:23
Now I see people saying using clan mech, what about SL Royal design?  If you are heading into Inner Sphere/ even the Rimward an Inner Sphere mech stands out less?

by 3150 a clan mech woul;dn't stand out all that much
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: rebs on 19 February 2022, 12:02:10
Still gives away who you get your rig from, so to speak.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 20 February 2022, 02:40:06
It could just be battlefield salvage or scrap that was restored in any decent yard.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 21 February 2022, 00:49:53
Okay...  I'm not much of a clan player and when I was for a long time I was looking a Ghost Bear but I keep thinking how much for the Scorpions could be.

So I am looking at a Seeker lead force set in the 3050/60 era what would it be.
1 mech a few support vehicles, maybe an old Leopard Dropship?

Help the new guy out?

Lion Wolf Dragoon-Class:

THG-11Eb : Star Commander
TDR-5S (C) : XO
WVE-5Nsl : MW
Puma-005b
Puma-005b
Turhan Original
Turhan Original

Infantry Point
Battle Armor Point
Battle Armor Point
Protomech Point : Early versions

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DOC_Agren on 21 February 2022, 20:34:23
TT I will be honest I'm impressed you guess so right what I was looking at on my Seeker Mech - THG-11Eb

Now my question would he have 2 fellow Seeker Mechwarriors or would they be Bondsmen?

I like the 2 Puma Tanks for security
but was thinking of a Rotunda for "discrete" looking at things.  I mean no one would look at a 20 ton car funny...  plus so u can play Spy Hunter... 8)
Mobile HQ for Dig site command unit
Mech Recovery Vehicle
Engineering Vehicle

2 platoons of Foot Infantry

Either a Royal Sabre or Thunderbird Aerospace Fighter to provide the dropship with "limited" protection and some airmobile recon ability.


Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 21 February 2022, 21:25:06
TT I will be honest I'm impressed you guess so right what I was looking at on my Seeker Mech - THG-11Eb

Now my question would he have 2 fellow Seeker Mechwarriors or would they be Bondsmen?

I like the 2 Puma Tanks for security
but was thinking of a Rotunda for "discrete" looking at things.  I mean no one would look at a 20 ton car funny...  plus so u can play Spy Hunter... 8)
Mobile HQ for Dig site command unit
Mech Recovery Vehicle
Engineering Vehicle

2 platoons of Foot Infantry

Either a Royal Sabre or Thunderbird Aerospace Fighter to provide the dropship with "limited" protection and some airmobile recon ability.

Make your thug seeker into a star commander with one point of tanks, 1 point of infantry (trained in boarding and dropsip defence) , one elemental point, and one aerospace point.  A little mixed but gives you options.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 22 February 2022, 16:48:51
DOC?

Suggest : Record Sheets: 3050 Unabridged (Clan & Star League), p. 297

Might be what your looking for. Sure it's a custom one off, but in the day and age of this era, great minds think alike. And more importantly, it's not only a custom , it's canon legal custom!

And I'd like to replace my dropship suggestion to THIS (https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Trojan).

She'll give you the ability to make your own vessel complements.

AND not only that, a plot line and a background of how you got it as well.

Back to TO&E...

I still say a pair of Badger C's with two Points of Infantry, one Foot ( I'm suggesting Clan Space Marine here) and one Elemental BA. Space Marine for the cross-trained boarding / security. For your Badgers would a pair of Prime be something you'd use? ( ERM and SSRM4 )

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DOC_Agren on 22 February 2022, 23:29:00
DOC?

Suggest : Record Sheets: 3050 Unabridged (Clan & Star League), p. 297

Might be what your looking for. Sure it's a custom one off, but in the day and age of this era, great minds think alike. And more importantly, it's not only a custom , it's canon legal custom!

And I'd like to replace my dropship suggestion to THIS (https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Trojan).

She'll give you the ability to make your own vessel complements.

AND not only that, a plot line and a background of how you got it as well.

Back to TO&E...

I still say a pair of Badger C's with two Points of Infantry, one Foot ( I'm suggesting Clan Space Marine here) and one Elemental BA. Space Marine for the cross-trained boarding / security. For your Badgers would a pair of Prime be something you'd use? ( ERM and SSRM4 )

TT
Prefect dropship idea
and I love  the Thug you directed me too.

Badger C prime nice design
?? would a Seeker be able to take Elemental BA? 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 23 February 2022, 14:13:20
Well, bondsmen them, they don't have to be a full point either... Though you're correct in the fact abstractions work, just not everyone uses that.

So if you have SO book... Check out the abstraction rules.

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 16 March 2022, 11:41:50
Headcanon supported by nothing:

The ability of Confederate-class DropShips to transport and support a small ground force for long periods of time means that those remaining in the Scorpion fleet are highly prized, especially for small Seeker missions. While no permanent conversions have been made, Confederate crews have also proved adept at setting up surprisingly comfortable bunk quarters within 1 or 2 unoccupied Mech Cubicles, providing sufficient space for a small group of Seeker Mechwarriors to be accompanied by supporting Battle Armor Points as well as lower castes support personnel.

With the absorption of large numbers of Hansa Manatees into the fleet, studies are under way to determine if vessels of this ancient class could be permanently refitted into a similar configuration, as they are largely unsuited to regular transport duties in any Clan-style military. It is the hope of all personnel involved that this project would also boost the Manatee's armor levels to levels considered acceptable in the current millennium.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 16 March 2022, 12:00:36
Could the Manatees be used to transport Battle Armor points? It would be able to do it, i would imagine. Sorry I don't have my books to go further, but roughly using sarna.
Quote from: Sarna.net
A Transport bay (a ship one for dropships) used as Battle Armor Bays weigh 2/1 tons. All Infantry Bays can be combined into a single, unified infantry bay slot, regardless of tonnage or number of troopers, when used on combat or support vehicles. Infantry compartments can be of any size, fitting within 1 space, holding 1 troop for each ton.

Under the Advanced Rules for Battle Armor four PA(L) troopers or two Light Battle Armor troopers can be accommodated in a 1 ton Battle Armor Bay. Medium suits use the standard rules, while Heavy and Assault suits require 1.5 tons and 2 tons of space respectively.

So there maybe usable room.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 16 March 2022, 12:42:17
I don't discuss customs, but if the devs were so inclined to take a crack at it, If point out that if you want to carry anything smaller than a mech, there's a LOT of room on a Manatee. :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 16 March 2022, 15:59:59
it is likely that a lot of the Manatee's built by the Hansa were the original cargo carrying version, not just the mech carrier variant. the hansa were very merchant oriented after all.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 16 March 2022, 16:08:37
Both are available per the MUL, and I don't know of any way to confirm the ratio beyond wild speculation.

Honestly, given the fact that the RDF's experience prior to the Crusade(and the buildup to it) was almost exclusively in small-unit actions, it would not surprise me to learn that the Manatee was one of their favorite DropShip classes. If you have a strong aerospace fleet to cover it and think you can prevent it from getting shot on the ground, the Manatee is an extremely good light transport, one I might actually prefer over the Leopard in these circumstances.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 16 March 2022, 16:33:24
The merchants would have built gobs of the standard version. The RDFs would have used the 'Mech variant.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 16 March 2022, 16:57:13
Makes sense. Their engineers would have had literally centuries to refine the design and iron out any quirks in it.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 09:26:51
But does that dropship make sense as the Hansa common dropship . . . IMO that depends on their jumpship fleet.  I mean we are talking about a faction that is set up, big fish/small pond, as a space going trading power.  If their JS are limited to smaller versions that have at best 3 collars, I would expect the merchants to move to bigger cargo DS IF their trade levels warrant . . . OR to be a merchant power, they may not have ships with large numbers of collars but they have a lot of jumpships.

Personally, for their footprint and just how small each trading partner/opportunity would be . . . I would expect a lot of the smaller jumpships with perhaps the handful of Star Lord or equivalents being in the RDF's hands.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 09:44:53
Cargo ships would have been necessary within the League itself, not just outside it. As a low-cost vessel, it should be expected in high numbers for a mercantile power.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 10:39:43
It is not the dropship cost itself, it is how many collars they have to move things period.  It is where you set the efficiency marker- 3 collar JS with Jumbos, Mammoths & what should be larger w/o Behemoth problems.

Or go for large numbers of collars (IE, SOMEONE should have pumped 8 & 9 collar JS, if not baby Potemkins) which allows you to transport more of the smaller DS.

If we are talking about a wide roaming merchant marine, as suggested by fluff, then having 2 or 3 collar JS spread through the League and trading with their economic vassals across that region of space makes more sense since it allows them to disperse the most valuable commodity in BTU across more space.  The operating costs of a Jumbo (50ish crew) would not be too much greater than a Manatee (5 crew for unarmed), taking into account the Jumbo carries about 10 times the cargo for 10 times the crew while offering other functions- self defense, passengers & small craft being the primary ones.

 . . . if the League had the Manatee, they should IMO have the DroST IIa (or clone) as a contemporary design, and the late Age of War Jumbo.

As the 'local' producer of industrial/technological goods, the Hanseatic League would ideally be set up in a sort of triangle trade . . .

Load up industrial goods from the home factories
goes to-
farming/biologicals settlement, trades out agromechs & other industrial products turning over 50-60% of their cargo space
goes to-
mining/fuel settlement, trades out mining mechs, pumps/refining equipment and the bulk foodstuffs taken on at stop 2 for refined metals, distillates, and other resources
goes to-
League home port, sells cargo of refined metals & distillates from stop 3 along with luxury/exotic foods & biological compounds from stop 2 to load back up on industrial products

While the Manatee is not a great interstellar trader because it offers a paltry 1k tons moved on a single drop collar, they MIGHT make brisk sales selling whole dropships to trade partners.  The Manatee would make a pretty good intersystem tramp freighter, and sales of the dropship would be a good means to exert economic hegemony over other systems.  It would allow developing systems access to asteroid/planetoid/moon mining for resources, refining fuel from gas giants, and getting water from Kupier Belt objects by offering economic intersystem transport.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 17 March 2022, 10:58:06
I would imagine Manatees would be most common within the League itself or along known routes to 'safe' destinations, with Trojans being what you find going to more far-flung systems or out into the wilds.

Similarly, a Manatee is more suited to transporting high-value-low-mass stuff like luxury goods or advanced mechs/vehicles, or even zero-mass goods like music recordings or entertainment programs. Who knows how far-flung the audience for a long-running Hansa telenovela really is?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 11:24:43
I think it's important to point out that the Hansa had a surplus of JumpShips (and now the Goliath Scorpions have one...), but no classes are stated. They aren't tied down like most Deep Periphery powers.

Regarding large DropShips: It's more economically feasible to fill those massive beasts for each trip rather than fill them partially. That might delay runs for quite some time, especially for single system hops. Smaller DropShips cost less (fuel, maintenance) and can be filled faster. That means they can load, transport, and offload faster than the big boys. When profits are running on a razor's edge, keeping the revenue flowing is important. Large merchants could probably handle delays created by waiting for cargo, but smaller concerns (especially those looking to move up) would be more dependent on constant operation. Keeping it parked on the ferrocrete costs money that could be made in transit.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 17 March 2022, 12:19:22
Similarly, there's always the practice of doing an initial sale at a loss in order to open a new market. Send a Manatee or Trojan first, and sell some IndyMechs that to an isolated world are likely worth their weight in gold. The cargo bay full of raw ore you're coming back with might not be worth as the mechs you sold...but the market is there now, and next time you can send a Mule.

And if that Mule is carrying heavy refining equipment, then the ships you send after THAT are gonna be bringing refined metals instead of raw ore, and you're making a fortune.

And if you do things right your customers are gonna get richer too from this boost to their industrial base, and that's when you send another Manatee...loaded with luxury goods for sale. :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 12:35:43
Oh, I am all for the Hansa having operated Libertys & Leviathans, just not expecting that . . .

As for the large cargo DS, I was not suggested they were partially filled, merely that their cargo partially changes over at each destination with the final return to Hansa territory bringing in the high value materials they exchanged for their industrial products.  It can also be that it is only worth it for a dropship to hit a destination once every 4 or 5 months on a trade route.  It comes back around to IF the merchant marine operates the smaller JS, basically anything smaller than Star Lords- which matches up with IS, then that cargo costs more using a Manatee over a Jumbo due to economy of scale with that collar.  The drop collar is the most expensive & rare commodity in BTU and should have pushed for cargo dropships to be larger as the overall numbers of jumpships declined.  You are looking at the transit fee for the dropship's COGs on a Jumbo being 10% of what a Manatee would have to charge.

Your low operation costs for the Manatee is why I said it would be excellent for intersystem trade, making it analogous to a ocean barge or coastal trader.  The Manatee shipyard would, IMO, absolutely try to court single-system colony trade partners as buyers of the dropship because it allows them access to their home system w/o having to devote resources to native production for the capability.

For a bit of comparison . . . the Cutty Sark on it's first trip carried a bit under 600 tons of tea back to the UK if the converter I used was right.  So a Manatee carries a it over 1.5 times the Cutty Sark's cargo load.

One thing for the RDF . . . didn't the Manatee pre-date current battlemech drop technology?  Unlike the modern Union or Leopard, the Manatee actually has to land to offload the mechs?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 17 March 2022, 12:44:45
One thing for the RDF . . . didn't the Manatee pre-date current battlemech drop technology?  Unlike the modern Union or Leopard, the Manatee actually has to land to offload the mechs?

That's a fluff-only thing, with absolutely zero rules support. Similarly, that fluff only refers to ships in Terran Hegemony service - for all we know, Hansa shipwrights (or even the IS Houses during the SL years) have corrected that deficiency in the design. 700 years is a LONG time to fiddle with the plans for a DropShip.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 17 March 2022, 12:49:54
especially since we know they were building non-primitive battlemechs even before the WoB and Scorpions got involved in the region. so it wouldn't be too hard to beleive that a more recent design like a Union or Leopard made its way out there for them to obtain and study, letting them update their mechbay designs to post-age of war standards
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 12:50:35
I understand it is fluff . . . but we do not get up-armored dropships- like the Black Eagle getting a (26xx) version that exchanges Primitive Armor for then modern, or the Canopian Dictators getting (307x) where they have better armor than the original version.  So without a canon reference, we are left with the design still having that drawback.  Is it the only mech-carrier DS with that drawback?

One way to answer about the Manatee though . . . did the RDF counterattack make any combat drops?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 15:12:24
Their JumpShip numbers didn't decline. Again: They had a surplus of JumpShips. In a region where JumpShip numbers dropped, your argument would prevail. But that's not the case in the League.

The RDF had more than one DropShip class. See the RAT in OTP: Hanseatic Crusade. Combat drops could be performed with something other than a Manatee if that restriction existed.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 15:40:51
I was not saying their numbers declined- no ROM or infrastructure destruction to deal with.  What I was saying that was the IS and why the average hauler there should have moved to carry more than the Mule.

For the League the question is can the expansion of their trading sphere keep up with their jumpship production . . . and BTU's jumpship production typically answers that with a no.  So if you cannot gain more collars, you are still going to want to put more on each of those finite collars you will have getting back to that economy of scale.  The more cargo each dropcollar moves, the cheaper the cargo gets.  Which also means the cost point per ton for something traded on a interstellar scale would be marginal or even not profitable for a Manatee would be profitable for a Jumbo or some other larger cargo ship.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 15:48:58
I was not saying their numbers declined-

The drop collar is the most expensive & rare commodity in BTU and should have pushed for cargo dropships to be larger as the overall numbers of jumpships declined.

You seem to have suggested it as the reason to support your assertion for them replacing all the small cargo vessels with larger ones. There's clearly no need to push for larger DropShips, since they would only have needed to do so if the number of their JumpShips had declined, which it did not. One might even suggest that since they increased their JumpShip number by various means, the opposite would have happened.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 17 March 2022, 15:56:22
This also assumes that there's functionally no upper limit to the amount of goods you can produce, and/or that the customers you can find can/will buy everything you bring, and/or there's no limit to the amount of stuff that can/will be yours in return.

If you can produce 20,000 tons worth of Bop-It IICs a year, but your various customers are only willing/able to buy 500 tons of Bop-It IICs, then why use a Mule to ship them when a far smaller ship can do the same job for cheaper?

(Yes, I'm aware that DropShips can carry more than one type of goods at a time. It's a very quick and dirty metaphor. VERY dirty if you know what the residents of Space Ohio actually do with Bop-It IICs.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 16:44:00
Doc, the sentence before that referenced the IS and 'overall' as in existence.  No matter what, their jumpship numbers are finite- IF they were trying to expand their mercantile sphere of influence either by gaining more colony customers or more frequent trips it would require more efficient use of those drop collars.  My last statement was that they might not have gone in to the same degree the Inner Sphere should have, but still as they expanded trade they would want more cargo moved on those limited collars.

Weirdo, I agree with that but the smaller ship is only cheaper in it's operation- not the jump cost.  The cost they pay to use the collar is the same for a small DS or a large DS- a large DS is just able to spread that cost out among more goods.  I understand your example but consider this . . . during the age of sail- which oddly enough the end gets close to the same cargo load (ignoring BT's mass vs volume inaccuracy).  During that time, cargo loads were things like precious metals, gems, alcohol, tea, spices, and fabrics- most high value, low mass/bulk with precious metals being a outlier due to the value.  Cargo loads of things like bulk grain or other food stuffs were not shipped half-way around the world because it had no profit margin for the costs of transport.  Fast foward to steam power and metal hulls which allowed more direct/faster transport along with larger hulls to carry more, and things that were previously unprofitable to ship became profitable.

So say when you delivered your Bop It IICs before you only accepted refined rare metals from mining worlds/colonies, and such things as rum, bolts of cotton or other fabric, concentrated organic dyes, and rubber extracts from ag worlds.  Take a larger cargo ship and now you can trade for metals (molybdem vs say nickel) that would not have been profitable to haul before b/c the transport costs were too high- spread over a 1000 tons of cargo instead of 10+k tons of cargo.  So now you might also import unwashed cotton (might be thinking of wool) which has uses for water resistant cloth IIRC, along with the bolts of cotton.

The colony can increase their production of raw materials without having to expand their refinement & processing facilities to make use of the increased production- broader base of the triangle without having to expand the layers on top of it.  So, simplified example . . . every week the colony mined 10 tons of ore to refine and get 2 tons of pure ingots.  Now they might be able to mine 15 tons, still refine to get 2 tons of ingots, but also because the dropship can haul away more they might be able to sell 5 tons of ore and 2 tons of slag that can be used to make fertilizer (to be sold to the ag world) back home.

It makes a feedback loop, the ability of a Hansa DS to take more in trade gives the world they visit more buying power, thus buying more Hansa goods.

Then again, this is all world building in a way FASA never looked at or really provided any guidance beyond 'the economy works.'
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 17:12:18
That's why I'm confused. Why mention what happened in the IS when the circumstances there don't apply to the HL? There's about as little in common between the Hansa and the Inner Sphere nations. There's no reason to expect similar behaviors. And I'd caution against expecting any behavior you might consider rational from a people running a slave economy.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 17 March 2022, 20:21:08
Because in the Inner Sphere the Monoliths and Star Lords are rare and mostly in the service of the militaries, it would be hard to believe the Hansa have a greater ratio of those type of ships than what would be found in the IS.  The most common JS we are told is the . . . Merchant?  or was it the Invader . . . either way, 3 collars would be the upper end of a typical Hansa merchant ship.

While not the IS, it still does not change that the bottleneck for moving a army or engaging in trade is the limited number of dropship collars available- they are the rarest and most valuable commodity in BTU.  I want to say the merc books under transportation say renting a collar is 200k c-bills per jump.  Which means a Manatee has to charge 200 cbills to each ton of cargo while a Jumbo FREX would be charging 20 c-bills per ton.

Also, the trade practices I was stipulating were predatory- like doing the 'company store' on worlds/colonies/systems outside the Hansa borders.  Such as selling a Manatee to a settled system that is a trade partner instead of them building the local infrastructure to build one . . . they get dependent on such a ship and the Hansa has a locked in deal to sell parts.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 17 March 2022, 20:27:02
Those rates don't necessarily apply in a place where C-bills never existed. Like the Hanseatic League (because there were no HPGs there, and thus no ComStar). The Hansa aren't bound to the same limits and concerns as any Inner Sphere entity, including mercenaries.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Colt Ward on 18 March 2022, 05:21:02
It is still a economic measure of volume expressing the cost of transporting.  Hansa script, whatever, the economic cost of jumping from one place to another still gets tacked on the cost of the goods, the same ratio would apply to a load of cargo . . . interstellar transport costs of a Jumbo are going to be 10% per ton of what it will cost a ton of Manatee goods.

I mean, I could say it costs 140000 Hansa megabucks for a DS to hitch a ride one jump, the ratio is still going to be a 10-1 cost difference for interstellar travel, or 140 per ton on the Manatee vs 14 per ton on the Jumbo.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Baldur Mekorig on 18 March 2022, 10:19:57
A quick question, as i dont have my books at hand:

What are the color schemes (that we know) of the current Scorpion Empire Galaxies/Clusters?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 18 March 2022, 10:57:26
My guess is that any Galaxy that can trace a lineage to a pre-Reavings unit would retain those colors. The Scorpions have always held a strong reverence for connections to the past, though admittedly they've also proven to be unafraid of change.

Aside from those older schemes and the new Hellion Keshik, we just don't know.

It's pure headcanon, but I like to think that when Omega Galaxy was first formed it kept the crazy yellow-and-green stripes of Nueva Castile and continues to use that. Similarly, while it would not surprise me to learn that Beta adopted a new scheme when it formally became Hellion Galaxy, I'm continuing to paint all my stuff in the published tan-and-black colors, even newer machines.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 18 March 2022, 13:19:41
A quick question, as i dont have my books at hand:

What are the color schemes (that we know) of the current Scorpion Empire Galaxies/Clusters?

Unless stated otherwise (or on CSO), existing camo schemes remain unchanged. For new units, if not stated or on CSO, then they are presently undefined.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 18 March 2022, 20:02:53
With Tau Galaxy due to the Eridani influence wouldn’t surprise me if other Trinaries or clusters took on colours of former SLDF units to “keep the dream alive”.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: wanderer25 on 19 March 2022, 09:00:33
   I think the deal with the Manatee like allot of other things in BT  boils down to: You use what you have and make due with it!!

The Hansa have the specs and tools to make Manatees so that's what gets used. Is it the best option for a large trading polity.
Probably not  but that's what  they have. The big markets get what Mules and Jumbo's  are available, everyone else get a Manatee.

The escorts get  Centurion light ASF and Vulcan primitive heavy ASF cause that's what the local factories churn out.

The top RDF  units get  the few Unions/Overlords. The  local gov gets Manatees to move things around the planet/system.


Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 19 March 2022, 12:27:06
I think my favorite part of the Manatee isn't actually the very large bulk cargo bay. It may have the cubicles for a mech lance, but in actuality that ship is easily capable of transporting a combined-arms company. The ship lands, deploys the mechs immediately, and those set up a security perimeter while everybody else aboard spends a few hours offloading a couple lances of hovertanks and APCs for an infantry company.

Not so good for smash and grab raids where extracting under fire is to be expected, but if your mission is to just level a pirate base or settlement it's a good way to hit them with a lot more force than they might be expecting just going by observed incoming ships(assuming you were even spotted coming in). And if such a raid goes sour and you need to bug out fast, it's not THAT severe a loss to spike the vees and just evacuate the crews and infantry.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 23 March 2022, 09:33:44
I have to agree the Manatee doesn't make much sense if JumpShip availability is limited. You'd want max out carrying capacity of the drop ships attached.  It would if real like freight costs through the roof.  It likely you want to be using Jumbo or larger dropship if your transport freight or beat up Dictator or Union for Mechs.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 23 March 2022, 10:38:20
You're assuming that the larger DropShips are available in the numbers you'd need for this. Got any evidence?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 23 March 2022, 11:15:43
It's not just availability. This is the Deep Periphery. It's like the old frontier. People don't stop using something that still works, or that can be fixed at any extent. They'd use their old, small DropShips until they simply fell apart and could no longer reach orbit. Even if they had the money to buy a new, larger vessel, they'd refuse while the old one still ran.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 23 March 2022, 12:28:26
I imagine the same would apply to designs for DropShips. Their yards might have the specs for Mules, but they know Manatees like the backs of their hands and know how to build those so they'll last centuries. They probably still build Mules and Dictators because sometimes you NEED the capacity, but the older ship is just too well trusted to abandon.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 24 March 2022, 15:14:58
MoC managed acquire some pristine Dictators during the Jihad. They had to come from somewhere.  There no heavy industry in their end of the universe aside from their own, which last I check didn't include Dictators. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 24 March 2022, 15:16:09
What does that have to do with the Hansa?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 30 March 2022, 13:14:02
What does that have to do with the Hansa?
Aren't they building them too?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 30 March 2022, 14:33:30
They have some. Whether they're building any is unknown.  And that still doesn't make comments about the MoC(which is almost literally on the exact opposite side of inhabited space) relevant to this thread, unless you're implying one of these incredibly distant nations is selling Dictators to the other.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 31 March 2022, 21:07:33
It might be a while before the Master Unit List is updated to account for the Scorpion Empire of the IlClan Era. That said, in light of the events portrayed in Spotlight On: Hellion Keshik, might it be possible for certain Dark Age-era IS Clan General units, such as the Hammerhead BattleMech, might now be available (even in limited numbers) to the Scorpion touman?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 31 March 2022, 22:47:58
It might be a while before the Master Unit List is updated to account for the Scorpion Empire of the IlClan Era. That said, in light of the events portrayed in Spotlight On: Hellion Keshik, might it be possible for certain Dark Age-era IS Clan General units, such as the Hammerhead BattleMech, might now be available (even in limited numbers) to the Scorpion touman?

Unless something changes it depends on how many the Scorpions can bid, buy, or batchall.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 April 2022, 11:48:00
I'd rather see the Goliath Scorpions see what's being used in the IS and develop their own units to counter them.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 01 April 2022, 12:19:56
I'd rather see the Goliath Scorpions see what's being used in the IS and develop their own units to counter them.

To do so ideally they'd wanna have their own versions to test and examine in depth.. best of both worlds :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 01 April 2022, 14:14:29
So we might see the reconquista omni aka Orion omni from the Goliath Scorpions.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 April 2022, 14:36:36
To do so ideally they'd wanna have their own versions to test and examine in depth.. best of both worlds :)

They have simulators for that.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 01 April 2022, 17:30:11
All I want are Scorpion Empire configs for the Perseus and a Clan Banshee 3S, because I want to see people scream in terror as a 95 ton oft disdained unit turns them into paste...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 April 2022, 17:57:33
...Clan Banshee...

Two fists or dezgra.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 01 April 2022, 21:58:07
All I want are Scorpion Empire configs for the Perseus and a Clan Banshee 3S, because I want to see people scream in terror as a 95 ton oft disdained unit turns them into paste...

There is already a clan Banshee, its the Regent.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 01 April 2022, 23:43:47
Nah, we need a proper Banshee C.  If we can get an Urbanmech IIC, a Banshee C should be no issue.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 April 2022, 00:36:44
The League built Banshees (likely the BNC-3S and the -5S) on Falsterbo, so it's certainly possible, given the Scorpions took the AWS-9Q built on Braunschweig and turned out the Awesome C. Thus, the result would probably be a Banshee C, with its origin as the -3S or -5S obscure without a TRO writeup.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Ruger on 02 April 2022, 04:22:03
The League built Banshees (likely the BNC-3S and the -5S) on Falsterbo, so it's certainly possible, given the Scorpions took the AWS-9Q built on Braunschweig and turned out the Awesome C. Thus, the result would probably be a Banshee C, with its origin as the -3S or -5S obscure without a TRO writeup.

One could do quite worse than simply converting the Banshee-3S to Clan-tech. You could do some nasty things with it.

Ruger
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 02 April 2022, 20:37:29
Yup, they are.  I've built a 3 and a 5S Banshee C for the Scorpion Empire, along with a Zeus C and Thunderbolt C 3.  I figure the Wasp 3M, Locust 3S, Phoenix Hawk 3D, 3S, and Wolverine 7D lines will get either converted to C or IIC lines, dismantled, or issued to PGCs.  The Surtur I'd next on my list since I can see plasma cannons and Clan SRMs in its future... 

I am curious about the former Hansa tank lines.  Would the SE bother with them, or just issue the equipment as is? Inquiring minds want to know....
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 April 2022, 21:20:09
I think that even the Scorpions would acknowledge the utility of Demolishers. I also think there will always be a need for such units for solahma warriors and those who either fail their Trial of Position or need a second try to take it. Vehicles are a good place for those who can still contribute militarily but are lesser-skilled than those who pass their trial and become MechWarriors.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 02 April 2022, 23:24:06
Thanks for the quick response, Doc. I appreciate all of your willingness to answer questions about the Scorpion Empire.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 April 2022, 23:39:02
For now, I'm the one who knows the most about them. When that changes, hopefully my successor does the same!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 07 April 2022, 19:26:47
Finally got around to reading the Scorpion story in Shrapnel 6.  I like the way the Empire is developing, but I am sad to see protomechs go away.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 08 April 2022, 06:47:41
Finally got around to reading the Scorpion story in Shrapnel 6.  I like the way the Empire is developing, but I am sad to see protomechs go away.

Glad you liked the story. Protomechs were simply not something that could be realistically explained being available to the Empire. They had to move a lot of stuff. They are upgrading existing production lines. Protomechs are a very unique technology there is nothing in their new realm to use as a stepping stone. There were higher priorities.
It's one of the things Goeff told me to put in there, other things we talked about and developed together. We were coordinating pretty much everything in this story to paint one big Scorpion Empire image over all the products in the pipeline. Pretty sure the PM extinction did also show up in one of the other sources released recently.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 08 April 2022, 08:04:31
Are there any other Empire stories out there?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 08 April 2022, 09:54:55
Another question, is the MUL up to date for the Empire?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 08 April 2022, 10:21:36
Yes
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 08 April 2022, 10:22:37
Are there any other Empire stories out there?

Not to my knowledge, no.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 08 April 2022, 11:00:00
Glad you liked the story. Protomechs were simply not something that could be realistically explained being available to the Empire. They had to move a lot of stuff. They are upgrading existing production lines. Protomechs are a very unique technology there is nothing in their new realm to use as a stepping stone. There were higher priorities.
It's one of the things Goeff told me to put in there, other things we talked about and developed together. We were coordinating pretty much everything in this story to paint one big Scorpion Empire image over all the products in the pipeline. Pretty sure the PM extinction did also show up in one of the other sources released recently.

Who?  :(
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 08 April 2022, 14:26:02
Wasn't point of the ProtoMechs was they could be made economically?  All the  lans bagged the technology. Only fundamental problem with them is what they have to do to make pilots.

The Empire should be able keep these machines in touaman. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 08 April 2022, 14:48:44
I've covered this before. ProtoMechs went extinct because they require additional production lines and advanced considerations to put them into the field. It could be as simple as every surgeon who knew how to implant circuitry into human bodies died or was left in the Homeworlds. Just like it's unknown how ancients built the pyramids or other structures from antiquity, Imperials wondered how ProtoMech pilots got their circuitry implants. But diverting resources better spent on BattleMechs and battlesuits was the motivation for allowing them to go extinct (see SO: Hellion Keshik, page 3).
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: wantec on 08 April 2022, 19:25:30
I've covered this before. ProtoMechs went extinct because they require additional production lines and advanced considerations to put them into the field. It could be as simple as every surgeon who knew how to implant circuitry into human bodies died or was left in the Homeworlds. Just like it's unknown how ancients built the pyramids or other structures from antiquity, Imperials wondered how ProtoMech pilots got their circuitry implants. But diverting resources better spent on BattleMechs and battlesuits was the motivation for allowing them to go extinct (see SO: Hellion Keshik, page 3).
The Ancients didn't build the pyramids, that was the Go'auld.

ProtoMechs came from when the Jaguars had a high tech-level industrial base, but not a lot of resources. Once the Scorpions got to their new home they had many resources, but not the high-tech industrial base.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 08 April 2022, 19:45:36
They had territory. That isn't the same as having resources. Either way, building the industry consumes resources. The same holds for creating new factories and production lines to build different unit types. With the ability to manufacture advanced materiel on their Hephaestus-type station, building PMs would have been possible, but at the cost of resources that could instead be used to build 'Mechs and battlesuits. So it was indeed the Khan's refusal to devote resources to the effort.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 08 April 2022, 19:55:25
hopefully proto's will continue to see use with at least some factions (Hells Horses and Ravens for example.) for that matter i could see the new ilkhanate/star league adopting them as a way to maximize combat power (sure the wolves inherited Terra and fortress republic, but not exactly intact, and they now have to police an inner sphere nearly a thousand times their size.. and do it without reliable HPG's. so massive increase in sibko production and use of proto's to fill out the forces of the "elite" units seems reasonable to me.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 08 April 2022, 20:26:17
The Ancients didn't build the pyramids, that was the Go'auld.

ProtoMechs came from when the Jaguars had a high tech-level industrial base, but not a lot of resources. Once the Scorpions got to their new home they had many resources, but not the high-tech industrial base.

joking aside, the process by which the Pyramids where built is pretty well understood TBH.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: MDFification on 08 April 2022, 22:09:35
joking aside, the process by which the Pyramids where built is pretty well understood TBH.

Well understood yes, but nobody's been motivated to build their own for quite some time. I assume that if the Scorpions decided protomechs were a priority, they could recreate them within a decade or two's worth of effort. But it's unlikely - protomechs were invented not because they're a good idea in an of themselves, but to solve a resource scarcity problem. The Scorpion Empire doesn't have that problem, so they don't need that solution.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: BrianDavion on 08 April 2022, 22:20:03
Well understood yes, but nobody's been motivated to build their own for quite some time. I assume that if the Scorpions decided protomechs were a priority, they could recreate them within a decade or two's worth of effort. But it's unlikely - protomechs were invented not because they're a good idea in an of themselves, but to solve a resource scarcity problem. The Scorpion Empire doesn't have that problem, so they don't need that solution.

yeah pretty much, what clans remaining use protos? the hells horses  and snow ravens are pretty much it yeah?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 08 April 2022, 22:43:52
pretty much, yeah. and the nova cats did as well before they got almost wiped out. (no idea if any survived to make it to the Clan Protectorate)

i'm not sure where the Sea Foxes stand on protomechs. though i have no doubt that they could start producing them if anyone wanted to buy them.

that said, iirc onyl the Jade falcons are actively anti-protomech, the Ghost bears just never had the aerospace phenotype they were designed to be piloted by, and the wolves just decided not to invest in them.

(the biggest users of proto's had been the homeworld clans, the remainder of which presumably are still using them. but with no current information, they're effectively non-entities)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 08 April 2022, 22:54:51

i'm not sure where the Sea Foxes stand on protomechs. though i have no doubt that they could start producing them if anyone wanrted to buy them.

It makes you wonder if the Sea Foxes will go directly into the mercenary trade but I doubt they got into the Prototech since it is a niche market that few outside the CHH or RA have any interest in.  I doubt the Wolf Empire will invest in it unless the Smoke Jaguars still have the prototypes in their possession. 


Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: pat_hdx on 09 April 2022, 00:53:27
The whole protomech argument is all highly subjective.  It comes down to author fiat.  It is real odd that you had mechs getting armed with protomech AC8s because they made it a point to bring lots of them to Castillians space if they didn't want to restart production of them later.

As for the resources, there is zero reason they could not have brought all the tooling with them and kept them in mothballs, till the time was right.

Another thing that bothers me about it, is that the Crimson Seekers book made a point of highlighting the role of an elite protomech pilot, so we start developing our home brew units in that direction, and then poof, they get zapped. I don't blame the second author for having a different vision, that happens..I do think the editing team and the developers dropped the ball not splitying the difference because as a consumer it's not cool to get your chain yanked like that.

I think the developers and editors should have protected the flovour of the faction as set out in ISP3, so as to keep the direction of things. One of the other users (Wierdo?) Was talking about how they had a good excuse to get their Legacy mini in  with the unit direction set out in ISP3 and Crimson Seekers ...it would be a heck of a let down to paint up a Cluster or two worth of mechs and Protos and then find out that the the next era RAT and MUL availability completely switched up directions.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 09 April 2022, 01:17:39
It happens. The Raven Alliance, Hell's Horses and the Homeworld Clans will simply have to carry the Protomech torch boldly into the IlClan era.  The Seekers managed to keep the original Crockett and the Flashman available to me alongside Clan Awesomes, Toyamas, and the Banshee 3S. The Clan Castilian Hanseatic Helion Goliath Scorpion Ummayid Star Leauge Word of Blake Empire can shine on like the crazy diamond it is.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 09 April 2022, 04:59:59
Silly question, where is the most up to date listing of the Scorpions military organization?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Deadborder on 09 April 2022, 08:00:04
Silly question, where is the most up to date listing of the Scorpions military organization?

OTP: Hanseatic Crusade has listings of the Scorpion and Hansa forces before the Crusade, but we don't have a list for their current state
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 09 April 2022, 10:29:24
OTP: Hanseatic Crusade has listings of the Scorpion and Hansa forces before the Crusade, but we don't have a list for their current state

Yeah I figured that was the most recent. Hopefully we will get an update soon. Might have been nice to add to Touring the Stars: Braunschweig
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 09 April 2022, 10:49:02
touring the stars have very strict word counts and formatting
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 09 April 2022, 10:58:58
They're also not focused on militaries.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 09 April 2022, 11:00:18
OTP: Hanseatic Crusade has listings of the Scorpion and Hansa forces before the Crusade, but we don't have a list for their current state

A new Galaxy was noted in the ilClan Recognition Guide series. (I might have mentioned it somewhere else, too. Perhaps in Spotlight On: Hellion Keshik.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 09 April 2022, 11:05:20
Yeah but it would be nice to get an update.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 09 April 2022, 11:15:16
Sure, but most people would hate whatever I came up with.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 09 April 2022, 11:55:59
So if Protos are out, what are the uniquely Scorpion ways of playing combined-arms? We've got the air assault fighter/Elemental groups, and the specialist command stars, what else is there?

And what about mixed tech? We've got Clan stuff, Blakist stuff, Hansa IS Standard, IS Intro, and even some armed IndyMechs, but in which units will that stuff be found? It seems fair to assume the front-line Galaxies will be mostly Clan with a smattering of higher-level IS, but where would the rest of it be found?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 09 April 2022, 13:36:55
I wonder if ultralight Mechs could fill the void for protomechs.  Such like the Emerald Harrier/Road Runner. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 09 April 2022, 19:12:02
And what about mixed tech? We've got Clan stuff, Blakist stuff, Hansa IS Standard, IS Intro, and even some armed IndyMechs, but in which units will that stuff be found? It seems fair to assume the front-line Galaxies will be mostly Clan with a smattering of higher-level IS, but where would the rest of it be found?

Hellion Keshik employs a nice mix of IS and Clan battlesuits. I'm not certain, but it might be the first time some of those suits have appeared in the same formation.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 09 April 2022, 19:46:04
Aside from some BA-centric merc units, you might be right.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 05:03:25
One thing I would recommend, changing the name of the position of ZARKhan.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 10 April 2022, 05:36:38
It's probably a contraction of Czar/Tzar/Tsar, so Zarkhan makes sense.

An Empire needs an Emperor.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 10 April 2022, 05:56:11
It also follows the established naming pattern of the Clans. ilKhan, saKhan, ovKhan, reKhan...
"Zar" is also how you spell the word in German. So it is not completely made up. ;)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 08:55:47
Yeah, but I am sure there are other words for emperor you could use as a base rather than czar.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 08:58:06
And emperor in German is Kaiser.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 10 April 2022, 09:22:29
Quibbling over already published word choice is rarely a fruitful endeavor
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 10 April 2022, 10:52:00
It was chosen because of the Russian origins of Kerensky about a year ago.
And since I have my suspicions where this is coming from, I want to remind everyone of Rule 4. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 10 April 2022, 11:27:50
I always assumed it to be a veiled Power Rangers reference. ;)

Also, is it just me, or is anyone else really disappointed that of the three factions in Battletech to ever name themselves an Empire, only the least popular one ever named its ruler an Emperor?

(At least I'm assuming the Amaris Empire is less popular than the Wolf Empire, but I'll admit I've done no research.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 10 April 2022, 11:40:58
I always assumed it to be a veiled Power Rangers reference. ;)

Hehe, no. We are talking about the Scorpions here. So giving a respectful nod towards the Great Father with their new ruling title seemed the perfect way to handle it. And given that actually is how you spell it in German, I didn't even think twice about the spelling when it came up.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 13:25:03
Hypothetical Question: A Seeker is following his vision to the periphery, what mech would that Seeker take to pass for an Inner Sphere mechwarrior? Would he even bother hiding?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 10 April 2022, 13:46:30
When I was thinking up the names for the post, I really liked arKhan, but the Lyran Commonwealth already has Archon. So I modified it a bit to zarKhan. Which I think sounds damn cool anyway.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 10 April 2022, 14:25:07
Any particular reason it had to be a **Khan of some sort, or was that handed down from above?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 14:38:06
Any particular reason it had to be a **Khan of some sort, or was that handed down from above?
I was wondering that too.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 14:53:51
Something else that just popped into my head: FM:WC says that the Cloud Cobra Cloisters have spread to other Clans. Wouldn't this be another interesting wrinkle to throw into the Empire's cultural mix.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Elmoth on 10 April 2022, 15:37:21
Hypothetical Question: A Seeker is following his vision to the periphery, what mech would that Seeker take to pass for an Inner Sphere mechwarrior? Would he even bother hiding?

I would take a wolverine II. Similar enough to a wolvie to pass up as a modified one, and still  good mech with plenty of speed and potential in case things go south. This or a PHX. I prefer designs that allow tou to retreat if facing strong opposition above designs that will only mean that you die gloriously but die anyway
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 10 April 2022, 15:58:18
I would take a wolverine II. Similar enough to a wolvie to pass up as a modified one, and still  good mech with plenty of speed and potential in case things go south. This or a PHX. I prefer designs that allow tou to retreat if facing strong opposition above designs that will only mean that you die gloriously but die anyway

Doubt they would have access to the Wolverine II, Wolverine -7D appears on the RAT though, and the Phoenix Hawk would be available.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Drewbacca on 10 April 2022, 16:00:48
Would they use a Wolverine though? The Mech seems to have become persona non grate in clan space.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 10 April 2022, 17:28:44
Any particular reason it had to be a **Khan of some sort, or was that handed down from above?

All Clan leaders are Khans or some stripe or other. It would be strange to change that. It follows the example of the Sea Foxes and their ovKhans.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 10 April 2022, 17:31:00
Something else that just popped into my head: FM:WC says that the Cloud Cobra Cloisters have spread to other Clans. Wouldn't this be another interesting wrinkle to throw into the Empire's cultural mix.

If any of that had infiltrated Clan Goliath Scorpion, it would most likely have been purged with extreme prejudice, given that the Cobras are the reason the Scorpions had to flee the Homeworlds.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 10 April 2022, 18:38:32
I always assumed it to be a veiled Power Rangers reference. ;)
funny, my first thought is that he'd be sending robeasts to attack voltron every week. since as the leader of the scoprion empire the full title would effectively be "emperor zarkhan"
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DOC_Agren on 10 April 2022, 19:48:08
Hypothetical Question: A Seeker is following his vision to the periphery, what mech would that Seeker take to pass for an Inner Sphere mechwarrior? Would he even bother hiding?

Seeker Alex LeClair
Well as I am currently looking at the samething in the 3050/60 era , here what I have come up with
THG-11E Reich (https://www.sarna.net/wiki/Thug#Custom_Variants) thanks to TT for pointing it out..  canon legal custom mech.. if there 1 there could be more..   :thumbsup:

Trojan Dropship = Esel Sniker
Yeomen Isabella of house Suvorov as the Capt
Sutler Harold (lead Merchant)
Sage Nikola (lead Scientist)
Harbinger Kristin (chief chronicler and artisan)

Wyvern WVE-5Nsl - Yeomen Roger

along with
2 Puma Tanks for security
2 Badger C's
a Rotunda for "discrete" looking at things.
          I mean no one would look at a 20 ton car funny...  plus so u can play Spy Hunter... 8)
Mobile HQ for Dig site command unit
Mech Recovery Vehicle
Engineering Vehicle

with two Points of Infantry,
1 Foot-Clan Space Marines
1 Elemental BA

Yeomen Ernest of House Ben-Shimon as the pilot of the Royal Sabre SB-27b modified with a Recon Camera for Medium Laser and .5ton of fuel to provide the dropship with "limited" protection and some airmobile recon ability.




Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 10 April 2022, 19:56:56
that thug upgrade is simple enough that i could see it being repeated by others. its not too far off from some of the other C refits the clans have done.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 11 April 2022, 13:56:01
And emperor in German is Kaiser.
kaiser and tsar/czar both come from "Caesar" anyways, does it matter?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 11 April 2022, 20:29:36
It was chosen because of the Russian origins of Kerensky about a year ago.
And since I have my suspicions where this is coming from, I want to remind everyone of Rule 4.

whats rule 4?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 11 April 2022, 20:54:50
whats rule 4?


the forum rules?

4. No politics or religion
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 13 April 2022, 20:59:56
Well, my Seeker Escorpion Cloister will be celebrating the ritual that is known as The Trial of the Lupus this Sunday...  ;D

It's a hare raising good time with much hunting and seeking of colored plastic fowl ovum clutches. Some even contain edibles, others small vineer. While not a rede per say, many ristars will be participating this years nathaculor.

Truetanker
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 13 April 2022, 21:37:42
I know what every individual word in that post means, but I still have no idea what on/off Earth you just said... ???
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 13 April 2022, 23:54:56
I know what every individual word in that post means, but I still have no idea what on/off Earth you just said... ???

the forum rules?

4. No politics or religion

So what's happening this Sunday... is my answer.

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 14 April 2022, 00:27:25
You are allowed to mention that Easter Sunday is this weekend. At this point it's as much a secular holiday as a religious one. Just like how nobody's gotten a warning for wishing the forum community a merry Christmas.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 14 April 2022, 00:33:17
Yeah, but Trial of Lepus (Lupus is wolf.) has an amusing ring to it. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Kojak on 20 April 2022, 01:47:16
Question about Seeker Clusters: other than their obligatory one or more Supernova Trinaries, do they use any non-'Mech forces? ASFs. vehicles. etc?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 25 April 2022, 23:13:28
It might be a bit early to speculate on this, but I wonder how many of the Clan and Inner Sphere 'Mechs to be featured in the forthcoming Alpha Strike box set (https://bg.battletech.com/forums/general-discussion/alpha-strike-boxed-set-discussion/) would have been present during the Hanseatic Crusade.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 02 May 2022, 08:47:31
Well know that I have some downtime since my 11:00 appointment got canceled until June 15th


Based on the Escorpion Imperion and the General Dark Age Periphery MULs, everything but the Fire Moth (Dasher) and the Wraith from the Alpha Strike Box wiyld be available. The Hanseatic Leauge doesn't manufacture the Archer, the Blackjack, or the Warhammer, but they're all common mechs (in various forms) for the Periphery by 3140.  You'd end up with the the following (if you're using the general Periphery MUL for the Hanseatic League plus the Crusade RATs, and the suggestion for the HL to not use any variants past 3067)

Escorpion Imperio
Atlas C
Atlas II 7DH
Archer 2R
Blackjack BJ 1
Locust C
Locust 1V
Nova (Black Hawk)
Phoenix Hawk C
Phoenix Hawk PXH 1
Pouncer
Stinger 3G
Timber Wolf (Mad Cat)
Warhammer 6R
Warhammer C 3
Warhawk (Masakari)

Hanseatic Leauge
Atlas AS7-D
Atlas AS7-K
Atlas AS7-S
Atlas AS7-S2
Atlas AS7-S3
Archer 2R
Archer 4M
Archer 5W
Archer 6W
Blackjack BJ 3
Locust 1V
Locust 3V
Locust 3D
Locust 3S
Phoenix Hawk PXH 1
Phoenix Hawk PXH 3D
Phoenix Hawk PXH 3S
Stinger 3G
Stinger 3R
Warhammer 6R
Warhammer 7M

The Fire Moth could be replaced by the following for the Escorpion Imperio
 Pirahna
Snox Fox Omni
Wasp 1A

The Wraith could be replaced by the following
Escorpion Imperio
Vapor Eagle (Goshawk)
Griffin 1N
Lightray 4Y
Naja Standard (Upgraded Clan Kintaro)
Naja KTO-19b EC (Early Clan tech version of the Kintaro)
Ryoken (Stormcrow)
Shadow Hawk C
Sun Bear (doubtful, since it's a unique)
Wolverine 6R

Hanseatic Leauge
Centurion 11B
Centurion 11J
Cronus 3M
Dervish 6M
Griffin 1N
Lineholder KW LH 2
Lineholder KW LH 3
Marshal 2L
Marshal X1
Shadow Hawk 2H
Shadow Hawk 5M
Surtur
Wolverine 6R
Wolverine 7D.












Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 02 May 2022, 10:59:25
They might not be on the MUL, but you could easily make a case for a very small number of Wraiths to exist in the Scorpion military, either being found in very small numbers in the Cache, or from Blakist refugees making their way to Argentinathe Hansa.

At least, that's the excuse I'm clinging to, to keep a Legacy in my forces. :)

Similarly, if you really want a Dasher, say it came from one of the feral Hellions picked up over the years. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 May 2022, 11:34:45
The Hanseatic Leauge doesn't manufacture the Archer, the Blackjack, or the Warhammer

Where is this stated?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 02 May 2022, 13:00:48
It's based on the production lines mentioned in Objective Periphery: Bordello Military Goods pg 31, and the Hanseatic Leauge planet descriptions on the Braunschweig and Falsterbro factories on pg 4 and 5 of Operational Turning Points: Hanseatic Crusade. The Archer, Blackjack and Warhammer aren't mentioned as units that are made by any of those companies. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 02 May 2022, 14:17:01
Thank you for the detailed reply.

Given the presence of various mercenary companies in Hansa space by the onset of the Crusade, plus various merc and/or pirate groups fleeing the Inner Sphere and near Periphery in this era (as noted in post-Crusade Shrapnel fiction), perhaps these might account for an occasional arrival of a Wraith into the Hanseatic League at some point prior to 3140?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 May 2022, 14:25:48
The list of products in the OTP was not exhaustive. It lists some of what they build, not all of what they build. "Products include" does not mean that every product is listed...  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 02 May 2022, 16:58:06
Got it. Yup a Wraith or several could easily arrive in Hanseatic League Space, even via purchase as a conversation piece.  Also, if you want an interesting look at differing design philosophies for RATs across the years, check out Field Manual Periphery's RAT for the Hanseatic Leauge by FASA and then FMU's RAT by FanPro.  FASA made refitted designs far more available then later caretakers by the 3060s. The HL even has Charger 3Ks by 3064...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 02 May 2022, 17:26:18
Yep. I chose language that would allow us to add additional chassis as needed for whatever reason later. (Even the Surtur is not listed in the Braunschweig planet writeup, for example.) And Antwerp hasn't been updated since I wrote the Objectives, so the factory output there could be radically different. (This is why I omitted it from the planetary descriptions and did not set any of the campaign there: trying to leave freedom for myself or other writers later. It also gave me the chance to describe more of the planets and reduce the retread space.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Rainbow 6 on 03 May 2022, 15:39:44
Makes perfect sense when you put it like that, and no doubt those who come later will thank you for it.
Title: Re: Timbuktu Collective - the New Rim Collection
Post by: Weirdo on 05 May 2022, 07:57:22
https://ironwindmetals.com/index.php/categories/cat-battletech/cat-bt-nr/product/battletech-bt-472

Is it just me, or is this just about the perfect base mini to kitbash a Surtur from?

Or this?

https://ironwindmetals.com/index.php/product-listing/product/battletech-ar20-445/category_pathway-2
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 May 2022, 12:54:11
The first one is more apt, given the tonnage.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 05 May 2022, 23:43:59
Do they make a Griffin 2N model? You might be abke to take the SRMs off of it and mount them on a Wolverine's shoulders? Or are the Surtur's SRMs supposed to be chest mounted?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 13 June 2022, 21:12:16
True confession time: in my own head canon, there are a lot more C variants in the Empire’s MUL than are actually there.

 Im always curious about the process of force conversion over time and what gets prioritized.

Aside from the cool stuff like Star Pythons and Star Crusaders. ;)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 14 June 2022, 09:19:00
They what, broke down a cache or two and found some WoB stash... Then they went on a leisure cruise and instead took a three year tour negotiating for property rights then said the hell with it, your all clan?

Did I sum it up correctly?

The point is they have a barely functional, it works why screw with it, manufacturing process. By using stop gap mechs and give the population a sense of protection, they have created a buffer zone that up to now, haven't been able to pull out their cache of mechs. Everything had been in cold storage and only pulled out if need be. With a refit site only certain things can be fitted, now that they have actual factories they can finish the refurbishment.

The next century is going to be fun...

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 14 June 2022, 10:05:18
First section yes, second section no.

All indications are that the Scorpions have a fully developed industrial base both in their recently conquered Hansa worlds AND in the former Nueva Castille territories, and in the latter case have had it for quite some time.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 14 June 2022, 15:00:50
They are recently as of 3090 started to build up the, then new by 3140, tech.

I understand it took them almost twenty years of absorbing every nook and cranny to proclaim the area safe...

Before revamping the current, then ,  3110 ) lines... Currently it's 3152 or so...

Which means in layman's turn, they have been making as of "10, forty two years of upgrades from what? Six factories and a dozen each refit locations? The few faction factories need to be updated to produce bearable clan tech without a complete overhaul costing unknown amounts material and cash as well as manpower.

Think I'm safe...

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 14 June 2022, 15:30:38
The few faction factories need to be updated to produce bearable clan tech without a complete overhaul costing unknown amounts material and cash as well as manpower.

Can you give a source saying this hasn't already been done?

Their ability to produce multiple OmniMech and BattleMech chassis implies it has.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 14 June 2022, 19:48:19
Building form Cache is different than building fresh. Tonnage is Tonnage.

BUT as you may know, the few factories that they have are ancient models.

The few examples are far and few.

But, the various workshops produce a few products, here and there.

No need to put a number or name to everything.

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 14 June 2022, 20:06:15
This is not as convoluted as some of these hypotheses suggest. Upgrade the existing ground-based facilities immediately, supplemented by the Hephaestus station, while also building new factories (as when they moved the capital). When they conquered the League, they added two modern factories (one which had been unknown to them before they invaded the world) which would lend themselves to upgrading (as seen with the relatively rapid construction of the Awesome C). The huge factory on Antwerp would be the biggest obstacle to upgrading, simply because of its size.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 14 June 2022, 20:10:14
the Scorpions may have had to update their original Castile and Ummayid techbase up from a succession wars grade one, but they had over half of a century to do it. the much mor disorganized and more economically muddled IS managed to overhaul some of their industry to produce clantech after about the same amount of time, and they had to figure out how clantech worked first, without having access to the plans, formulas, and specs. compare that to the Dragoons, which having the data was able to set up production in less than 2 decades starting with succession war industrial techbase and having to do all the work in secret. so the scorpions gettign a clantech production infrastructure in place over 60 years is not much of a stretch.

and do remember that the WoB had been helping to update the factories of the Hanseatic League during the jihad, and got at least a couple up to spec to produce advanced WOB mechs like the Grand Crusader and Nexus. this is one of the reasons why the Scorpions were able to convert those to clan tech and make them the core of their Touman as the Star Crusader and the Star Python. so the refit of their new conquests is going to take a lot less time.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 14 June 2022, 20:30:35
That's not quite correct. The League was not building advanced WoB 'Mechs. Any help the Blakists gave was updating the League's older stuff closer to parity with post-Clan Invasion IS technology. Battlesuits are a different story, of course; this is because the League had zero battlesuit manufacturing and so there was no need to upgrade from an older tech base.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 15 June 2022, 08:19:09
Look at the Star Python. There were no production lines. They discovered corrupted blueprints for the Nexus, restored them, then upgraded them and then went to overhaul a factory to be able to actually build the Star Python.

It's a process that takes some time. But they are doing it.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 15 June 2022, 11:38:54
Exactly. Consider how long it took the League to field their first domestic 'Mech, the Surtur. It was new when the Crusade broke out. There's nothing to indicate that the League ever built Grand Crusaders or Nexuses, much less any of the Celestial OmniMechs or Jihad-era Blakist units.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Metallgewitter on 27 June 2022, 04:06:26
Do you think the Hansa ever build something akin to Warships or perhaps had the facilities to service them? From the FM 3067 which has a lot of Blakist tones in it it sounded like as if the Blakists had the Hansa build at least parts for their Erinyes project which was in essence refitting a Yard ship into a planet killer. It would make sense as the Hansa was a mercantile nation which requires yards to at least service Jumpships as well as Dropships
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AlphaMirage on 27 June 2022, 04:28:53
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already. The Hands don't have anything close to Warship Yards, they could perhaps make primitive jumpships and service their own
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Metallgewitter on 27 June 2022, 04:46:52
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already. The Hands don't have anything close to Warship Yards, they could perhaps make primitive jumpships and service their own

For one complete secrecy. Who of the Great Houses has actually secret services in the Deep Periphery? And I might have to check this again but it defintely sounded as if the Hansa were building parts for the Blakists maybe in exchange for technology or HPG services
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AlphaMirage on 27 June 2022, 05:14:30
For one complete secrecy. Who of the Great Houses has actually secret services in the Deep Periphery? And I might have to check this again but it definitely sounded as if the Hansa were building parts for the Blakists maybe in exchange for technology or HPG services

The Solar System was a complete island under Blakist control, no one came in or out without their permission and they controlled all jumpship and HPG traffic. Additionally there were several other secret naval bases closer by at Ross or Luyten that could have done the work. No need to go out to the deep periphery particularly to untrusted sources that regularly traded between other states (and possibly even the Clans)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: MDFification on 27 June 2022, 07:23:51
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already.

The Hands original mission was to wipe out humanity within the confines of Clan Space. It would make sense that they'd want manufacturing capabilities closer to the Kerensky cluster in order to simplify logistics.

We know, for example, that the Word of Blake did try to take over the Coreward Confederacy (and it's functioning JumpShip maintenance facilities - they hoped they could be restored into a proper shipyard). This effort was dropped due to the Jihad diverting their attention.

I don't think the Word would have tried to move production capabilities to a state they didn't control though, and no evidence that I know of suggests that they'd managed to take of the League's government.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: AlphaMirage on 27 June 2022, 07:46:06
The Hands original mission was to wipe out humanity within the confines of Clan Space. It would make sense that they'd want manufacturing capabilities closer to the Kerensky cluster in order to simplify logistics.

Logistics are a lot simpler when you have the willingness to use Weapons of Mass Destruction for genocide and thus no incentive to fight on the ground except as clean up crews to ensure no one survives to tell the tale. I doubt the Shadow Divisions were meant to return as it would be far easier to explain away the Homeworlds destruction as the Clans killing themselves or their colonies failing, heck the Wars of Reaving almost did the same at roughly the same time. COMSTAR and the Word of Blake are far more pragmatic and don't need to do things for the bragging rights if they don't want to.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Metallgewitter on 27 June 2022, 08:03:30
The thing is though that the Erinyes was sighted around the Periphery. There was a mention in one of the Jihad books that a small Mercenary unit witnessed the Erinyes in action somewhere around the Neuva Castille worlds. That's why I assume that this thing was either modified or got it's finishing touch in the Hansa worlds

But after reading hte small note in the FM 3067 (page 200) I think the Hansa simply provided tech. Here is the quote "The League has proven a willing vendor, able to complete the systems we ordered within the alotted time frame, though their leaders remain oblivious to our goals save those we have allowed them to uncover. Their asteroid mining technologies in particular - combined with testing at Mundo Nublar (travel across such distances of uncharted space is draining but the results have been worth the expense) - stand to play a key role in Erinyes." So yes I think I misunderstood: the Hansa build systems the Blakists asked for but the Erinyes seems to have been assembled or rather being modified at Mundo Nublar which was at Odessa if i remember correctly.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 27 June 2022, 09:25:12
Mundo Nublar is Coreward Deep Periphery. In any case, the Blakists have at least one Newgrange for deep-space mobile servicing of their fleet
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 27 June 2022, 10:58:23
Do you think the Hansa ever build something akin to Warships or perhaps had the facilities to service them? From the FM 3067 which has a lot of Blakist tones in it it sounded like as if the Blakists had the Hansa build at least parts for their Erinyes project which was in essence refitting a Yard ship into a planet killer. It would make sense as the Hansa was a mercantile nation which requires yards to at least service Jumpships as well as Dropships

No. They never had the ability to construct JumpShips, let alone WarShips. They don't even have a means to repair JumpShips. Their means of increasing their JumpShip fleet was via purchasing vessels captured by pirates (I mentioned this in one of the PDFs covering the region). One goes bad, they replace it with one captured from some poor sap. One might envision that the Scorpions' first effort to obtain an enclave in the Chainelane Isle could lead to some attempt to gain control of or access to the shipyard at Brekke, though...  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Metallgewitter on 27 June 2022, 11:57:00
Mundo Nublar is Coreward Deep Periphery. In any case, the Blakists have at least one Newgrange for deep-space mobile servicing of their fleet

Whoops you are right. Odessa had the Ruins of Gabriel
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 27 June 2022, 15:16:57
Funny thing,  I would thought it be interesting if the Legacy Assault 'Mech's forerunner, the Rising Star would ended up back in production as a C variant, given how the Nexus based on Jackrabbit blue prints would ended up Clan service.  The name of the 'Mech certain would fit the Clan culture, it was Star League 'Mech before it was Blakist revamp it into one of its own designs.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 28 June 2022, 09:44:45
Only if it gets renamed the Ristar.  :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 28 June 2022, 23:05:12
There was something which I was minded of, in the midst of posting a few Scorpion-related notes over in the CSO feedback thread:

By the onset of the Hanseatic Crusade, there were three Keshiks in the Scorpion touman: Scorpion Keshik, Hellion Keshik, and Seeker Keshik. With a few exceptions, these protect the Khan, saKhan, and Loremaster respectively.

With the emergence of the office of zarKhan in the IlClan Era, would there be a fourth Keshik created to act as their bodyguard? And if so, from which Galaxy? Or would the zarKhan be formally removed from the touman proper, instead serving as a "civilian" leader - and thus require some alternate means of protection?

To look at the Dark Age Era Rasalhague Dominion as a point of comparison: Prince Hjalmer Miraborg (named in Era Report: 3145) resigned from the military in order to pursue a political career; thus, he is not listed anywhere on the Ghost Bear touman in Field Manual: 3145. However, so far as I can tell, FM:3145 does not list a Keshik as being assigned to his protection. Presumably the Dominion has some form of security force set up to protect the Prince, though I'm not sure if this is formally stated anywhere. (Perhaps we'll see such a thing in Dominions Divided.)

Since the zarKhan appears to be at least somewhat akin to the Prince of the Rasalhague Dominion, would the same apply here also?

For that matter, who (if anyone) serves to protect the reKhans governing the various planets of the Empire?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 29 June 2022, 00:19:36
Protection for such civilians would fall under the auspices of whichever portion of the touman is assigned to the world they're on. I don't envision keshiks being formed for any of these persons. (I think I was pushing it to create one for the Seekers.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 29 June 2022, 09:19:16
Protection for such civilians would fall under the auspices of whichever portion of the touman is assigned to the world they're on. I don't envision keshiks being formed for any of these persons. (I think I was pushing it to create one for the Seekers.)

If the OvKhan is still part of the touman they may have a Star “bodyguard” unit composed of elementals or infantry veterans. 
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 29 June 2022, 11:33:00
I am not speaking to what the Sea Foxes might do for their leaders. The Scorpions do not have any ovKhans.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 29 June 2022, 15:05:14
Are OvKhan title considered to be a honorary title among other Clans or special tasks?  I've seen the title thrown around here and there.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 29 June 2022, 15:21:04
I am not speaking to what the Sea Foxes might do for their leaders. The Scorpions do not have any ovKhans.
Protection for such civilians would fall under the auspices of whichever portion of the touman is assigned to the world they're on. I don't envision keshiks being formed for any of these persons. (I think I was pushing it to create one for the Seekers.)
I am not speaking to what the Sea Foxes might do for their leaders. The Scorpions do not have any ovKhans.

My bad I was thinking of zarKhans the planetary military leaders of the Scorpion Empire.  Are they technically in command of a Cluster or does each planet have greater defences?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 29 June 2022, 15:47:24
Are OvKhan title considered to be a honorary title among other Clans or special tasks?  I've seen the title thrown around here and there.
ovKhan is a Sea Fox rank of those that command one of their Aimags, below the saKhan
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 29 June 2022, 16:09:24
My bad I was thinking of zarKhans the planetary military leaders of the Scorpion Empire.  Are they technically in command of a Cluster or does each planet have greater defences?

The position you are describing is reKhan, and they are not military positions. They fall outside the military command structure. The position of zarKhan was created later, and follows that same philosophy. They are civilian administrators, as the Clan found it difficult to maintain their military readiness while also dealing with the day-to-day needs of their growing civilian population. The Khan still commands the touman. Think of the zarKhan as the president or prime minister, while the Khan is the highest military commander; they are expected to cooperate to ensure the safety and prosperity of the nation, but the Khan would be the ultimate authority when it comes to military matters. Thus, the zarKhan might request or suggest a particular military action, but the Khan could ignore that in favor of something completely different. This, of course, might lead to friction, which is what one might expect. None of the reKhans or the zarKhan are considered to be in command of any military component of the touman, though of course it's reasonable to predict that the local police paramilitary or even a PGC might be seconded to these individuals for a specified time (such as disaster relief, or if the local Galaxy Commander is called away and thus delegates the oversight to the civilian leadership. Again, making warriors subordinate to a civilian could lead to friction, especially in the short term. As the political structure matures, these growing pains should be accommodated and a smoothly running system results. Or bloody revolts and repressions could return. That's part of the fun of BT.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 29 June 2022, 23:08:40
Protection for such civilians would fall under the auspices of whichever portion of the touman is assigned to the world they're on. I don't envision keshiks being formed for any of these persons. (I think I was pushing it to create one for the Seekers.)

Don't some clans use Keshiks as command units for all or most Galaxies?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 29 June 2022, 23:10:04
Perhaps, but the Scorpions didn't.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 29 June 2022, 23:11:02
Don't some clans use Keshiks as command units for all or most Galaxies?
as i recall, one did, but they only had a handful of galaxies to start with, and they didn't have any more keshiks than normal.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: DarkISI on 30 June 2022, 06:38:44
You might also keep in mind that Emmy Line actually stated in Moving Forward that she would no longer be in command of her Galaxy.
She has abdicated any command position. Now, might she get bodyguards? Possible. But she would not be their commanding officer. Just like the US President is not in charge of the secret service agents who protect them. It might actually be the other way around. They can and will get the President out of a dangerous situation, whether the President likes it or not.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Zeruel on 30 June 2022, 15:03:16
Don't some clans use Keshiks as command units for all or most Galaxies?
as i recall, one did, but they only had a handful of galaxies to start with, and they didn't have any more keshiks than normal.

that would be Clan Wolf...they have a Keshik for every Galaxy; still do as of FM3145--that's 14 Keshiks in 3145, albeit they are Trinary sized, not Clusters

I don't believe it's ever been stated why they have a Keshik for every Galaxy (maybe in the Wolf Clan Sourcebook?)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Crimson Dynamo on 01 July 2022, 18:56:05
Don't some clans use Keshiks as command units for all or most Galaxies?

As mentioned, the Wolves have Keshiks leading most/all of their Galaxies, and the Jaguars called the command units of front-line Galaxies Keshiks as well (Jaguar Spirit, Swath, Skyrider, and Dark Prowlers) in addition to the Khans' command units.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 05 July 2022, 22:31:46
So we know what happened to Rudolph Schmidt. Did the rest of his Petraries survive the last battle of the Crusade and join up with the Empire, or was he the only one?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 July 2022, 23:04:41
Their fates have not been elucidated.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 07 July 2022, 16:38:15
As noted over in this thread (https://bg.battletech.com/forums/general-discussion/new-camospecs-online-site/msg1845848/#msg1845848), there is as yet no unit logo or colour scheme for Eta Galaxy, nor for Seeker Galaxy's new Keshik.

While the question of colour schemes might be under CSO's remit, I was advised that they do not typically go so far as to work up new faction logos.

So, are there any experts here who might have ideas as to what, if any, new logos could be drawn up for either of these two units?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 07 July 2022, 17:46:51
Pretty sure I mentioned somewhere (a RecGuide entry, maybe?) that Eta Galaxy has the Greek letter eta on their 'Mechs. H for Hansa, yo.  ;) Seeker Keshik probably uses the Galaxy insignia.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: GuyIncognito on 07 July 2022, 20:52:01
Doc Swift: I feel like I might've said before, but I appreciate how willing you are to hang around here and provide further details/trivia on the lovely little faction you've helped flesh out. After the WoR and Jihad books I was skeptical about their long-term prospects, but the Scorpion Empire's really been built up into something fun to watch with relatively few bumps in the road along the way.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 07 July 2022, 21:01:12
Sometimes when we write something, it's sort of like a fire-and-forget missile. With the Empire, I got to write the OTP, a TtS, two SOs, and some RecGuide entries. It's not terribly common to have so many opportunities to write the same faction in such a short time. I'm glad it's been mostly well-received, and I'm happy to answer whatever I can. Hopefully, I get to write more for them, and maybe my participation gets someone who might be on the fence to pull the trigger and check out the new stuff and they can ask their own questions.  :)

So: Thanks! I appreciate it! I love this game and the fans and players. It wasn't that long ago I was on that side of the game as a fan and player. If I can help, I will.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 18 July 2022, 14:19:08
Apologies for quoting myself from a post in another thread (https://bg.battletech.com/forums/general-discussion/free-guilds-78223/msg1849564/#msg1849564):

Quote
Are there any Free Guilds in the Scorpion Empire?

If so, is there a degree of reciprocity between Free Guild and Clan interaction between the Empire and the Inner Sphere and near Periphery?

In other words: do the Free Guilds supporting Clan Sea Fox operations in the Chaine Cluster consider the recently-acquired Scorpion enclave there as "Clan", for the purposes of providing their services? Or, indeed, what of any Seekers passing through the Inner Sphere - do the Free Guilds consider them to be "Clan" also?

And in the other direction, should any Free Guilds exist in the Empire, would they offer reciprocal services to visiting Clan Sea Fox Aimags?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 18 July 2022, 14:31:06
Are there any Free Guilds in the Scorpion Empire?

Until something is published to that effect, no.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 18 July 2022, 14:44:17
Fair enough.

That still leaves the matter of the Free Guilds in support of the Council of Six Clans: so far as they are concerned, would the Scorpions in the Chaine Cluster (or on long-range Seeker missions in the Inner Sphere or near Periphery) be "Clan" enough for them to treat with?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 18 July 2022, 15:09:57
Same answer, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Maelwys on 18 July 2022, 21:09:09
Oops. Messed that up. Will try again in the right thread :)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Nerroth on 18 July 2022, 23:47:44
Actually, here's a thought: might there be an introduction to the Free Guilds in BattleTech Universe?

If so, perhaps a line or two could be added there (and/or in the Scorpion Empire section of that book) addressing this topic, one way or another...
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Wrangler on 19 July 2022, 08:44:12
Actually, here's a thought: might there be an introduction to the Free Guilds in BattleTech Universe?

If so, perhaps a line or two could be added there (and/or in the Scorpion Empire section of that book) addressing this topic, one way or another...
There mentioned in Empire Alone.  I'm not liking how they went from free society living under the iron heel of Clans to mafia / dark caste of merchants.  One or two being bad doobies, but not entire group.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 August 2022, 14:25:23
Anyone know what the platoon sizes for non-foot Hansa infantry are? Would it be easiest to just use Taurian sizes, since they're the only other faction to use 30-trooper foot platoons?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 August 2022, 14:50:44
See p. 23, OTP: Hanseatic Crusade.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 August 2022, 15:10:25
Is that for ALL infantry types, not just foot troops?

I'm just seeking clarification here, because if this is the case they would be the only faction in the entire Battletech timeline to use the same count across all motive types.

(Except maybe the Society. I'm not 100% on them.)

In either case, someone should submit errata for Tech Manual, because p. 147 of that book currently shows the Hanseatic League as using the same 28/28/21/20/24/28 scheme as most IS and Major Periphery nations.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 August 2022, 15:19:45
Is the Tech Manual information referring to ca. 3140?

Note that formations in OTP: Hanseatic Crusade include non-foot unarmored infantry, and only one platoon size is listed for standard infantry.

they would be the only faction in the entire Battletech timeline to use the same count across all motive types.

Why would uniqueness be cause for alarm?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 August 2022, 15:46:25
It's not cause for alarm. As I said, I was just seeking clarification on the matter.

It's probably a good thing the vast majority of the infantry used by the Scorpions during the Crusade were armored. Against conventional infantry, Hansa mechinf formations would be NASTY.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 August 2022, 15:50:39
(From me, the answer will always be the simplest. If I listed only one size, then that's the size! Also, I find it tiresome how random and arbitrary some things are, such as infantry platoon size, by type. Isn't it simple if they're all the same? No need to look up anything! But those forces only apply for that era, not necessarily earlier eras.)  :)

(However, I might note that while/because Rudolf was reorganizing the Hansa military, they might not still use every infantry type that one could imagine. He was in the process of replacing unarmored infantry with battlesuits as much as possible when the Crusade began. The only ones they use for certain are those noted in the descriptions of OTP: Hanseatic Crusade.)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 August 2022, 16:35:40
Jump platoons that are 50% more powerful than anything this side of Detroit are also gonna be fun, especially since a full company of them fits perfectly in the K1 I'm kitbashing. I don't have many big and slow assault mechs in my Scorpion collection since I prefer Beta/Hellion Galaxy, but I'll have to remember that those I do have need to operate with an escort of some kind.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 01 August 2022, 17:57:27
The reorg allowed them to bulk up the regular infantry, as more battlesuit troops joined the ranks. So a jump infantry regiment should be pretty respectable.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 01 August 2022, 18:56:17
Oh, definitely not going that big. My plan is to build a representative force of RDF-3, consisting of a company each of mechs and vees and two companies each of foot and jump troops.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Gorgon on 09 August 2022, 07:36:59
I just learned that the MUL lists the Scorpions as using the Korvin. The imperial touman is truly the gift that keeps on giving.   
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 09 August 2022, 08:38:23
Oh, that is AWESOME.

I'm thinking a garrison Star for a newly established colony settlement. Either that, or a post in a rural area of pine of the core Castillian worlds, basically an area that's about as safe and unimportant as it gets, but still requires some kind of Scorpion presence.

Hmmm... How about one Araña, two Points of Korvins, and two Points of hover mechinf, broken down into squads? The whole formation is surprisingly fast for a backwoods militia post(and well suited for Scorpion-style pincer tactics), eight squads of fast troops lets you spread your pickets across a large area, and the armored core of your force has respectable firepower at all ranges, all for less than 5,000 BV.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Gorgon on 09 August 2022, 12:27:07
Sounds like a great militia Force  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: JAMES_PRYDE on 13 August 2022, 02:21:49
Officially checking in with the Scorps ! >:D :thumbsup:
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 13 August 2022, 09:10:04
Welcome to the Empire!
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Sartris on 13 August 2022, 17:22:59
cleaned those caches all the way to the back stalls when they fled clan space
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: JAMES_PRYDE on 14 August 2022, 03:23:42
Welcome to the Empire!

Thank you, as emissary of Clan Jade Falcon, I foster good relations, I commend you on your victories, militarily, economically, and politically 8)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ArkRoyalRavager on 14 August 2022, 09:15:51
Thank you. Hopefully the Scorpions will build on its current progress. The Empire congratulates Clan Jade Falcon's transformation to become personal guards of the First Lord, a very prestigious status.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 14 August 2022, 09:27:59
Thank you, as emissary of Clan Jade Falcon, I foster good relations, I commend you on your victories, militarily, economically, and politically 8)

Which faction of the Falcons.  No offence but right now the Falcons are more divided than the Inner Sphere.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 14 August 2022, 15:47:19
He forgot Socially...

 ::)

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: glitterboy2098 on 14 August 2022, 18:12:15
He forgot Socially...

 ::)

TT
no he didn't, the Falcons do not tolerate Societies.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: JAMES_PRYDE on 14 August 2022, 22:36:00
Which faction of the Falcons.  No offence but right now the Falcons are more divided than the Inner Sphere.

I come of at the behest of Khans Stephanie and Jiyi Chistu  ;) Do note it does take a while to get here, alot can happen in 3 years 8)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: CJC070 on 15 August 2022, 08:58:27
I come of at the behest of Khans Stephanie and Jiyi Chistu  ;) Do note it does take a while to get here, alot can happen in 3 years 8)

Either way that is one detour.  Either you came from Terra went to Galactic North (Clan OZ) the Galactic East in the Deep Periphery or Galactic North then Terra then Deep Periphery.  I hope they didn’t make pay your own way and promise reimbursement.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: JAMES_PRYDE on 15 August 2022, 10:26:21
Either way that is one detour.  Either you came from Terra went to Galactic North (Clan OZ) the Galactic East in the Deep Periphery or Galactic North then Terra then Deep Periphery.  I hope they didn’t make pay your own way and promise reimbursement.

You know how it is, detached from the Turkina Keshik on Terra, gifted Jiyi a Cluster of warriors for his ample mechs numbers, retook some worlds in between, convinced Marena to play nice, as the Horses are a menace, visited the new flourishing garrison Trinary on A Place, then continued further north, found a few Turkina Ascendancy warriors holding on to hope, cleaned up Von Strang, even tested them out on a few marooned Vipers and Hellions in North Perhipery, as I headed your way, might have stopped on the way for some Pirate clean up target practice too. I bring shiny Star League toys :thumbsup:
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: tassa_kay on 13 September 2022, 17:24:12
Sometimes when we write something, it's sort of like a fire-and-forget missile. With the Empire, I got to write the OTP, a TtS, two SOs, and some RecGuide entries. It's not terribly common to have so many opportunities to write the same faction in such a short time. I'm glad it's been mostly well-received, and I'm happy to answer whatever I can. Hopefully, I get to write more for them, and maybe my participation gets someone who might be on the fence to pull the trigger and check out the new stuff and they can ask their own questions.  :)

So: Thanks! I appreciate it! I love this game and the fans and players. It wasn't that long ago I was on that side of the game as a fan and player. If I can help, I will.

On this note, I was wondering if I could get some clarification from you on something.

Touring the Stars: Valencia states that the Escorpion Imperio established their capital on Valencia. But "Moving Forward" in Shrapnel states that the capital of the Scorpion Empire is now on Braunschweig in the former Hanseatic League.

Did they move their capital to Braunschweig post-Hanseatic Crusade? If so, why there?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 13 September 2022, 20:29:01
It's a more central location, given the stellar geography of the two united territories.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: truetanker on 13 September 2022, 20:33:04
@Doc...

Got some e'splaining to do there Doc...  :beatdown: :beatdown: :beatdown:

TT
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Weirdo on 14 September 2022, 10:24:44
It's a more central location, given the stellar geography of the two united territories.

Braunschweig has a LOT to recommend it, honestly, even beyond geography(which is no small thing).

It's been the capital of a large interstellar polity and economic powerhouse for centuries, meaning lots of existing infrastructure and trained bureaucrats for that job, even after the damage of the Merchant Council's suicide. On top of that, making that city a priority for rebuilding brings plenty of opportunities for goodwill projects, as well as immediate jobs for the masses to prevent(or at least mitigate) a postwar economic crash. Finally, the Scorpions have an opportunity to custom-build their new capital exactly the way they want it
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 14 September 2022, 10:35:00
You might be confusing Braunschweig for Bremen.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Gorgon on 14 September 2022, 10:46:28
Moving the capital to the former Hansa makes sense. It's the more populous part of the Empire, the transformation of the former castillean worlds to a new clan-inspired society is well under way and the local government structure established.


Restructuring the hanseatic society is going to take time and may require close oversight by the warrior caste. Having the capital close by should help with integration.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: tassa_kay on 14 September 2022, 16:54:40
I get the reasoning behind it, I just... don't like it. Makes me feel like I wasted a few bucks on the Valencia PDF now because all of that wonderful build-up fluff just doesn't matter anymore.

Then again, I'm not a fan of the name change, either. "Scorpion Empire" is just so generic compared to "Escorpión Imperio". RIP.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 14 September 2022, 18:53:42
I was no fan of the old name, but I had a different new name when I wrote the OTP.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Starfury on 14 September 2022, 20:17:12
Valencia will still be an important part of the Empire, even with the Scorps moving the capital.  I'm just waiting for Zeus, Banshee (S or E), Surtur and Crockett C or II C variants to appear. It only took 500 years for the Awesome, so I'm sure someone will build them. Also, who's piloting the Emperor-6A (Nerran) now? Wouldn't Nerran be long dead?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 14 September 2022, 21:02:42
I was no fan of the old name, but I had a different new name when I wrote the OTP.

What was it?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 15 September 2022, 07:11:06
 :-X
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Gaiiten on 15 September 2022, 10:29:48
I was no fan of the old name, but I had a different new name when I wrote the OTP.

Clan Nine from Outer Space ?    ;)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Flaresnake on 15 September 2022, 19:17:23
:-X

why?
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 15 September 2022, 19:55:15
It could be useful in the future.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: ANS Kamas P81 on 23 September 2022, 04:58:35
Clan Nine from Outer Space ?    ;)
That's the Ice Hellions.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Stormy on 23 September 2022, 17:44:41
Scorpion Homeworlds — when you just need to resolve a loose end before getting on with better things. ;)
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: tassa_kay on 05 October 2022, 16:19:58
I'm curious to know if the Imperial military uniforms look any different from those we saw and read about in Field Manual: Warden Clans. The Scorpions have undergone more than one transformation since the Wars of Reaving, and I'm curious to know if the Castilians, Umayyads or Hansa have had any influence on their military attire.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: Doc Swift on 05 October 2022, 18:27:24
If any Clan would be immune to such influences, it would be the one where the Seekers came to be. They're all about preserving their history, which for the warriors would include the uniforms. If Eta Galaxy, for example, tried to use a Hansa color scheme for their personnel uniforms, they'd be singling themselves out as different. That wouldn't go over well. Maybe in the paramilitary police, but not for the actual warriors. They'd be passing their Trial of Position to be Scorpions, not something halfway.
Title: Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
Post by: tassa_kay on 05 October 2022, 21:02:51
Well, that’s disappointing, but not unexpected.