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Author Topic: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us  (Read 19396 times)

Nerroth

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #330 on: 02 May 2022, 14:17:01 »
Thank you for the detailed reply.

Given the presence of various mercenary companies in Hansa space by the onset of the Crusade, plus various merc and/or pirate groups fleeing the Inner Sphere and near Periphery in this era (as noted in post-Crusade Shrapnel fiction), perhaps these might account for an occasional arrival of a Wraith into the Hanseatic League at some point prior to 3140?
« Last Edit: 02 May 2022, 14:47:29 by Nerroth »

Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #331 on: 02 May 2022, 14:25:48 »
The list of products in the OTP was not exhaustive. It lists some of what they build, not all of what they build. "Products include" does not mean that every product is listed...  :)

Starfury

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #332 on: 02 May 2022, 16:58:06 »
Got it. Yup a Wraith or several could easily arrive in Hanseatic League Space, even via purchase as a conversation piece.  Also, if you want an interesting look at differing design philosophies for RATs across the years, check out Field Manual Periphery's RAT for the Hanseatic Leauge by FASA and then FMU's RAT by FanPro.  FASA made refitted designs far more available then later caretakers by the 3060s. The HL even has Charger 3Ks by 3064...

Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #333 on: 02 May 2022, 17:26:18 »
Yep. I chose language that would allow us to add additional chassis as needed for whatever reason later. (Even the Surtur is not listed in the Braunschweig planet writeup, for example.) And Antwerp hasn't been updated since I wrote the Objectives, so the factory output there could be radically different. (This is why I omitted it from the planetary descriptions and did not set any of the campaign there: trying to leave freedom for myself or other writers later. It also gave me the chance to describe more of the planets and reduce the retread space.)

Rainbow 6

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #334 on: 03 May 2022, 15:39:44 »
Makes perfect sense when you put it like that, and no doubt those who come later will thank you for it.

Weirdo

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« Last Edit: 05 May 2022, 07:59:39 by Weirdo »
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Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #336 on: 05 May 2022, 12:54:11 »
The first one is more apt, given the tonnage.

Starfury

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #337 on: 05 May 2022, 23:43:59 »
Do they make a Griffin 2N model? You might be abke to take the SRMs off of it and mount them on a Wolverine's shoulders? Or are the Surtur's SRMs supposed to be chest mounted?

Stormy

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #338 on: 13 June 2022, 21:12:16 »
True confession time: in my own head canon, there are a lot more C variants in the Empire’s MUL than are actually there.

 Im always curious about the process of force conversion over time and what gets prioritized.

Aside from the cool stuff like Star Pythons and Star Crusaders. ;)

truetanker

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #339 on: 14 June 2022, 09:19:00 »
They what, broke down a cache or two and found some WoB stash... Then they went on a leisure cruise and instead took a three year tour negotiating for property rights then said the hell with it, your all clan?

Did I sum it up correctly?

The point is they have a barely functional, it works why screw with it, manufacturing process. By using stop gap mechs and give the population a sense of protection, they have created a buffer zone that up to now, haven't been able to pull out their cache of mechs. Everything had been in cold storage and only pulled out if need be. With a refit site only certain things can be fitted, now that they have actual factories they can finish the refurbishment.

The next century is going to be fun...

TT
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Weirdo

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #340 on: 14 June 2022, 10:05:18 »
First section yes, second section no.

All indications are that the Scorpions have a fully developed industrial base both in their recently conquered Hansa worlds AND in the former Nueva Castille territories, and in the latter case have had it for quite some time.
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truetanker

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #341 on: 14 June 2022, 15:00:50 »
They are recently as of 3090 started to build up the, then new by 3140, tech.

I understand it took them almost twenty years of absorbing every nook and cranny to proclaim the area safe...

Before revamping the current, then ,  3110 ) lines... Currently it's 3152 or so...

Which means in layman's turn, they have been making as of "10, forty two years of upgrades from what? Six factories and a dozen each refit locations? The few faction factories need to be updated to produce bearable clan tech without a complete overhaul costing unknown amounts material and cash as well as manpower.

Think I'm safe...

TT
« Last Edit: 14 June 2022, 15:04:16 by truetanker »
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Weirdo

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #342 on: 14 June 2022, 15:30:38 »
The few faction factories need to be updated to produce bearable clan tech without a complete overhaul costing unknown amounts material and cash as well as manpower.

Can you give a source saying this hasn't already been done?

Their ability to produce multiple OmniMech and BattleMech chassis implies it has.
"Thanks to Megamek, I can finally play BattleTech the way it was meant to be played--pantsless!"   -Neko Bijin
"It's just that the Hegemony had one answer to every naval problem. 'I kills it with my battleships.'" - Liam's Ghost
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"Damn you, Weirdo... Damn you for being right!" - Paul
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truetanker

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #343 on: 14 June 2022, 19:48:19 »
Building form Cache is different than building fresh. Tonnage is Tonnage.

BUT as you may know, the few factories that they have are ancient models.

The few examples are far and few.

But, the various workshops produce a few products, here and there.

No need to put a number or name to everything.

TT
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That is, if true tanker doesn't beat me to it. He makes truly evil units.Col.Hengist on 31 May 2013
TT, we know you are the master of nasty  O0 ~ Fletch on 22 June 2013
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Me: Would you rather fight my Epithymía Thanátou from the Whispers of Blake?
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Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #344 on: 14 June 2022, 20:06:15 »
This is not as convoluted as some of these hypotheses suggest. Upgrade the existing ground-based facilities immediately, supplemented by the Hephaestus station, while also building new factories (as when they moved the capital). When they conquered the League, they added two modern factories (one which had been unknown to them before they invaded the world) which would lend themselves to upgrading (as seen with the relatively rapid construction of the Awesome C). The huge factory on Antwerp would be the biggest obstacle to upgrading, simply because of its size.

glitterboy2098

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #345 on: 14 June 2022, 20:10:14 »
the Scorpions may have had to update their original Castile and Ummayid techbase up from a succession wars grade one, but they had over half of a century to do it. the much mor disorganized and more economically muddled IS managed to overhaul some of their industry to produce clantech after about the same amount of time, and they had to figure out how clantech worked first, without having access to the plans, formulas, and specs. compare that to the Dragoons, which having the data was able to set up production in less than 2 decades starting with succession war industrial techbase and having to do all the work in secret. so the scorpions gettign a clantech production infrastructure in place over 60 years is not much of a stretch.

and do remember that the WoB had been helping to update the factories of the Hanseatic League during the jihad, and got at least a couple up to spec to produce advanced WOB mechs like the Grand Crusader and Nexus. this is one of the reasons why the Scorpions were able to convert those to clan tech and make them the core of their Touman as the Star Crusader and the Star Python. so the refit of their new conquests is going to take a lot less time.

Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #346 on: 14 June 2022, 20:30:35 »
That's not quite correct. The League was not building advanced WoB 'Mechs. Any help the Blakists gave was updating the League's older stuff closer to parity with post-Clan Invasion IS technology. Battlesuits are a different story, of course; this is because the League had zero battlesuit manufacturing and so there was no need to upgrade from an older tech base.

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #347 on: 15 June 2022, 08:19:09 »
Look at the Star Python. There were no production lines. They discovered corrupted blueprints for the Nexus, restored them, then upgraded them and then went to overhaul a factory to be able to actually build the Star Python.

It's a process that takes some time. But they are doing it.
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Doc Swift

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #348 on: 15 June 2022, 11:38:54 »
Exactly. Consider how long it took the League to field their first domestic 'Mech, the Surtur. It was new when the Crusade broke out. There's nothing to indicate that the League ever built Grand Crusaders or Nexuses, much less any of the Celestial OmniMechs or Jihad-era Blakist units.

Metallgewitter

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #349 on: Today at 04:06:26 »
Do you think the Hansa ever build something akin to Warships or perhaps had the facilities to service them? From the FM 3067 which has a lot of Blakist tones in it it sounded like as if the Blakists had the Hansa build at least parts for their Erinyes project which was in essence refitting a Yard ship into a planet killer. It would make sense as the Hansa was a mercantile nation which requires yards to at least service Jumpships as well as Dropships

AlphaMirage

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #350 on: Today at 04:28:53 »
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already. The Hands don't have anything close to Warship Yards, they could perhaps make primitive jumpships and service their own

Metallgewitter

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #351 on: Today at 04:46:52 »
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already. The Hands don't have anything close to Warship Yards, they could perhaps make primitive jumpships and service their own

For one complete secrecy. Who of the Great Houses has actually secret services in the Deep Periphery? And I might have to check this again but it defintely sounded as if the Hansa were building parts for the Blakists maybe in exchange for technology or HPG services

AlphaMirage

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #352 on: Today at 05:14:30 »
For one complete secrecy. Who of the Great Houses has actually secret services in the Deep Periphery? And I might have to check this again but it definitely sounded as if the Hansa were building parts for the Blakists maybe in exchange for technology or HPG services

The Solar System was a complete island under Blakist control, no one came in or out without their permission and they controlled all jumpship and HPG traffic. Additionally there were several other secret naval bases closer by at Ross or Luyten that could have done the work. No need to go out to the deep periphery particularly to untrusted sources that regularly traded between other states (and possibly even the Clans)

MDFification

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #353 on: Today at 07:23:51 »
I don't know why they would do that since Sol has plenty of yards already.

The Hands original mission was to wipe out humanity within the confines of Clan Space. It would make sense that they'd want manufacturing capabilities closer to the Kerensky cluster in order to simplify logistics.

We know, for example, that the Word of Blake did try to take over the Coreward Confederacy (and it's functioning JumpShip maintenance facilities - they hoped they could be restored into a proper shipyard). This effort was dropped due to the Jihad diverting their attention.

I don't think the Word would have tried to move production capabilities to a state they didn't control though, and no evidence that I know of suggests that they'd managed to take of the League's government.

AlphaMirage

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #354 on: Today at 07:46:06 »
The Hands original mission was to wipe out humanity within the confines of Clan Space. It would make sense that they'd want manufacturing capabilities closer to the Kerensky cluster in order to simplify logistics.

Logistics are a lot simpler when you have the willingness to use Weapons of Mass Destruction for genocide and thus no incentive to fight on the ground except as clean up crews to ensure no one survives to tell the tale. I doubt the Shadow Divisions were meant to return as it would be far easier to explain away the Homeworlds destruction as the Clans killing themselves or their colonies failing, heck the Wars of Reaving almost did the same at roughly the same time. COMSTAR and the Word of Blake are far more pragmatic and don't need to do things for the bragging rights if they don't want to.

Metallgewitter

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #355 on: Today at 08:03:30 »
The thing is though that the Erinyes was sighted around the Periphery. There was a mention in one of the Jihad books that a small Mercenary unit witnessed the Erinyes in action somewhere around the Neuva Castille worlds. That's why I assume that this thing was either modified or got it's finishing touch in the Hansa worlds

But after reading hte small note in the FM 3067 (page 200) I think the Hansa simply provided tech. Here is the quote "The League has proven a willing vendor, able to complete the systems we ordered within the alotted time frame, though their leaders remain oblivious to our goals save those we have allowed them to uncover. Their asteroid mining technologies in particular - combined with testing at Mundo Nublar (travel across such distances of uncharted space is draining but the results have been worth the expense) - stand to play a key role in Erinyes." So yes I think I misunderstood: the Hansa build systems the Blakists asked for but the Erinyes seems to have been assembled or rather being modified at Mundo Nublar which was at Odessa if i remember correctly.

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Re: The Scorpion Empire: All your Warhawks are belong to us
« Reply #356 on: Today at 09:25:12 »
Mundo Nublar is Coreward Deep Periphery. In any case, the Blakists have at least one Newgrange for deep-space mobile servicing of their fleet