Register Register

Author Topic: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard  (Read 4782 times)

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #60 on: 29 August 2022, 13:41:53 »
So, finished the Panther test. Nuln oil stained it, so i added another layer red but still not happy with it. Too bright red. Have problems with my green paints, so green cockpit was a no-go, and yellow was difficult.
Did another test with VGC Gory Red, a bit darker one. This is better. There is no wash, i tried was over primer and then red but this isn't translucent enough for that to work. Drybrushed with VGC Sombre Gray over the black areas (AP Necromancer Cloak still), tried drybrushing Bloody Red over red but i don't think that succeeded at all, red is difficult. Some gun metal for quick details (i'll do them more carefully for the company proper), some blues to cockpit.
Uncertain about this scheme. It feels like it needs a wash to to improve the red areas, but it absolutely shouldn't darken the red raised areas, just the recesses. I don't have patience to go over each line with a small brush.

Pics are too bright (especially reds) because HDR seems to be the culprit, will take future pics without that mode.
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #61 on: 29 August 2022, 16:58:04 »
Did a Donegal Guards test. It failed badly. Had wrong base color, let contrast paint (Akhelian Green) pool too much, and my drybrush color choice was wrong and went on too strong anyway. I was basing my attempt on a CamoSpecs video but i evidently don't have proper base color and drybrush color options available.

Did paint a Sandworm token (pic attached) for Dune board game while waiting for stuff to dry, and determined that Agrax Earthshade is far, far easier to use than Nuln Oil. (Both are something like 5-6 year old bottles.)
This lead me to test, with some encouragement from BT Discord, to try Agrax Earthshade on the earlier test minis and it is exactly what it needed to look better, especially over red. I did go over gray-black areas as well, which gives it a bit dirty look but that's OK, i'll just do brownish desert base so it explains the dirty looks.

So, now i have the process clear:
VGC Gore Red over two quarters of a 'Mech, then AP Necromancer Cloak over the other quarters. Drybrush VGC Sombre Gray over dark areas, and VGC Bloody Red over red areas, in so far it actually does something. Then, Agrax Earthshade wash. Finally details like cockpit.
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Wargame_insomniac

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 114
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #62 on: 30 August 2022, 12:38:34 »
Did a Donegal Guards test. It failed badly. Had wrong base color, let contrast paint (Akhelian Green) pool too much, and my drybrush color choice was wrong and went on too strong anyway. I was basing my attempt on a CamoSpecs video but i evidently don't have proper base color and drybrush color options available.
What base did you use?

From memory for the CamoSpecs Donegal Guards Video. they brush painted a light grey layer over the initial white primer spray. I think he said that the light grey was to push the Akhelian Green into a more blue grey colour.

I am curious how Akhelian Green would look over either a proper white primer (e.g. GW's new White Scar) or over light (e.g GW's Wraithbone).

I am trying to decide between Akhelian Green and Terradon Turqoise for a future painting Project. Ironically it seems the fomer is more blue-ish and the latter is more green-ish.


Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #63 on: 30 August 2022, 13:32:21 »
What base did you use?

From memory for the CamoSpecs Donegal Guards Video. they brush painted a light grey layer over the initial white primer spray. I think he said that the light grey was to push the Akhelian Green into a more blue grey colour.

I had gray brush-on primer, and over it VGC Wolf Grey. It was too light i'd say, or not grey enough. But it may be that i didn't control pooling enough and that made things look too saturated, too blue. And then i made it worse with wrong choice of drybrush, that didn't complement the existing color but clashed with it instead. Forget which gray it was but didn't work.

Did check the vid afterwards more carefully, i evidently need to pick my colors more carefully for any next attempt.
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Wargame_insomniac

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 114
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #64 on: 30 August 2022, 14:36:18 »
I had gray brush-on primer, and over it VGC Wolf Grey. It was too light i'd say, or not grey enough. But it may be that i didn't control pooling enough and that made things look too saturated, too blue. And then i made it worse with wrong choice of drybrush, that didn't complement the existing color but clashed with it instead. Forget which gray it was but didn't work.

Did check the vid afterwards more carefully, i evidently need to pick my colors more carefully for any next attempt.
It sounds as if Akhelian Green is one of the trickier contrast colours. It says it is a green yet can come out blue or blue-grey.

The more I have looked into Akhelian Green, the more I lean towards Terradon Torquoise to, ironically given the names, get a greener tint!

Ghaz

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 456
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #65 on: 30 August 2022, 14:59:13 »
It sounds as if Akhelian Green is one of the trickier contrast colours. It says it is a green yet can come out blue or blue-grey.

The more I have looked into Akhelian Green, the more I lean towards Terradon Torquoise to, ironically given the names, get a greener tint!

Akhelian Green is a Teal color (i.e., a dark blue green).  For the Donegal Guards I would switch out the Akhelian Green and give the new Stormfiend color a try, thinned a bit with Contrast medium to make it more translucent.



Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #66 on: 30 August 2022, 15:04:49 »
Interesting, will keep this stuff in mind if i do Donegals in the future.
Unfortunately not progress with TRG today, had too much other stuff to do. Painted other Dune tokens, and worked to get my Vallejo greens to mix, they had separated in their bottles.

I've determined i need a jade green paint for House Hiritsu once i get around to them. The new Aeldari Emerald contrast seemed right to my eye, at least over white primer. Any opinions? And what would be suitable alternatives, and over what primer?
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

worktroll

  • Ombudsman
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 24658
  • 504th "Gateway" Division
    • There are Monsters in my Sky!
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #67 on: 31 August 2022, 03:44:44 »
That Shogun's looking pretty good!

One more step (well, I suppose 2):

- Before the Agrax wash, paint areas you want to be metallic black. To me, that's things like joints, weapon barrels, heat sinks ... so on the Shogun's front, things like the grilles on the hipjoints, and the balls at the knees. Obviously you only need to paint black on the red bits ;)
- Then, after the wash, drybrush metallic paint (again, I'd go gunmetal, leadbelcher, other not silvery metal) over those black bits. You get the metal top, & dark inner bits. I think that adds a lot to the final mini.

And re Donegal Guards - I did these back in 2013, and think they still stand up pretty well for their age.



Very basic paintscheme: a blue-grey base (Prussian blue, IIRC, not Imperial Blue), detailing, and a faint white ghostbrush to just bring up the edges:



* No, FASA wasn't big on errata - ColBosch
* The Housebook series is from the 80's and is the foundation of Btech, the 80's heart wrapped in heavy metal that beats to this day - Sigma
* To sum it up: FASAnomics: By Cthulhu, for Cthulhu - Moonsword
* Because Battletech is a conspiracy by Habsburg & Bourbon pretenders - MadCapellan
* The Hellbringer is cool, either way. It's not cool because it's bad, it's cool because it's bad with balls - Nightsky
* It was a glorious time for people who felt that we didn't have enough Marauder variants - HABeas2, re "Empires Aflame"

Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 28986
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #68 on: 31 August 2022, 04:39:25 »
They're holding up well indeed!  8)

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #69 on: 31 August 2022, 09:01:47 »
That Shogun's looking pretty good!

One more step (well, I suppose 2):

- Before the Agrax wash, paint areas you want to be metallic black. To me, that's things like joints, weapon barrels, heat sinks ... so on the Shogun's front, things like the grilles on the hipjoints, and the balls at the knees. Obviously you only need to paint black on the red bits ;)
- Then, after the wash, drybrush metallic paint (again, I'd go gunmetal, leadbelcher, other not silvery metal) over those black bits. You get the metal top, & dark inner bits. I think that adds a lot to the final mini. [/img]
The Shogun's just a test mini, it "donated" its PPC for my Stalker to be a HGR, and i added some green paints to its base yesterday for testing purposes. Wonder what it'll be a test for next... probably should get around stripping various test minis for re-use.

As for metallic bits, yeah, what you described is the plan indeed, and i intend to do that for the final company. But skipped this for test pieces to save some time and effort.


Got a box for making a wet palette. Seems simple enough, and it seems it should help a lot with painting.
-The idea is simple, if someone who doesn't know about wet palettes reads this:
-Get a plastic box, not very deep and ideally something with a lid.
-Put several layers of tissue paper inside, eg a square piece folded twice.
-Add some water, not much but to make the tissue paper damp.
-And finally, add a piece of parchment paper (baking paper?) on top of the tissue paper. Not wax paper. Palette is done.

Ideally, this keeps paints usable for a long time, and thins them as well. Close the lid when not in use, should be apparently usable for weeks. Add water if it dries out.
This vid is where i found out about this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96mjmqWTPfM
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #70 on: 31 August 2022, 17:28:06 »
Progress. All have gotten base red, adding gray-black. Afterwards, i'll go back to red, second layer as needed, touch up borders etc.
Then it is probably time to add black for detail areas, and then wash.

The Atlas will get golden head. People often go for white but i decided i'll channel some bling and 1st Tikonov Republican Guards and make it golden.

Upper right has legs of my test pieces in case someone wonders.

Here's the company lineup. Haven't sorted them to lances yet, just picked base variants and noted roles BV for baseline pilots. Current lances are as they are because each one got a 3/5, 4/6, 5/8 and 6/9 mover.
Most expensive company of my done and planned companies in BV. Having assault 'Mechs does that...
Not entirely Lyran lineup (eg the Argus, Hellspawn), this is a result of me altering my original plans heavily. These were going to be Donegal Guards originally for whom some of these 'Mechs would've made more sense (the 5th Donegal Guards for example were among the first units to receive Argus near beginning of the FedCom Civil War), but i don't think these are entirely unsuitable for theh Tikonov Republican Guards.
Code: [Select]
Lance:
Uziel Medium UZL-3S Striker 1189
Bushwacker Medium BSW-X1 Skirmisher 1223
Atlas Assault AS7-S2/S3 Sniper 2378 (both)
Awesome Assault AWS-9M Brawler 1812

Lance:
Dragon Heavy DRG-7N Skirmisher 1495
Chimera Medium CMA-1S Striker 1173
Mauler Assault MAL-2R Juggernaut 1586
Thanatos Heavy TNS-4T Skirmisher 1760

Lance:
Stalker Assault STK-8S Juggernaut 2020
Hunchback Medium HBK-4SP Juggernaut 1043
Argus Heavy AGS-4D Skirmisher 1638
Hellspawn Medium HSN-7D Missile Boat 1220

18709

Also got myself that Aeldari Emerald contrast paint and it works brilliantly over silver base coat (and that was over gray primer in my test). Nigh perfect metallic jade for the House Hiritsu, and takes almost no effort. Wet palette made painting silver real easy, and the Aeldari Emerald is extremely easy and pleasant to paint.
Will post pic later.

Also determined that Militarum Green contrast over creates pretty good grayish-green look. More green than gray but close enough, can probably improved with some drybrushed gray. Should be good base for 1st or 2nd St. Ives Lancers.
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #71 on: 31 August 2022, 18:55:29 »
Right, the House Hiritsu test. The jade color in the pic is more blue-tinted than how i perceive the color in reality, i blame my phone camera. EDIT oh, right, i had added satin varnish to this before taking this pic, wanted to test its effect on the metallic color. It doesn't seem to altered the metallic look fortunately.
Decided to be frugal and tested the Militarum Green on the side of the mini.

So, Citadel Aeldari Emeral contrast paint over VGC Silver, if someone wants easy metallic green. Other metal bases probably work as well.
« Last Edit: 31 August 2022, 19:01:30 by Empyrus »
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Wargame_insomniac

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 114
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #72 on: 01 September 2022, 06:53:35 »
Progress. All have gotten base red, adding gray-black. Afterwards, i'll go back to red, second layer as needed, touch up borders etc.
Then it is probably time to add black for detail areas, and then wash.

The Atlas will get golden head. People often go for white but i decided i'll channel some bling and 1st Tikonov Republican Guards and make it golden.

Upper right has legs of my test pieces in case someone wonders.

Here's the company lineup. Haven't sorted them to lances yet, just picked base variants and noted roles BV for baseline pilots. Current lances are as they are because each one got a 3/5, 4/6, 5/8 and 6/9 mover.
Most expensive company of my done and planned companies in BV. Having assault 'Mechs does that...
Not entirely Lyran lineup (eg the Argus, Hellspawn), this is a result of me altering my original plans heavily. These were going to be Donegal Guards originally for whom some of these 'Mechs would've made more sense (the 5th Donegal Guards for example were among the first units to receive Argus near beginning of the FedCom Civil War), but i don't think these are entirely unsuitable for theh Tikonov Republican Guards.
Code: [Select]
Lance:
Uziel Medium UZL-3S Striker 1189
Bushwacker Medium BSW-X1 Skirmisher 1223
Atlas Assault AS7-S2/S3 Sniper 2378 (both)
Awesome Assault AWS-9M Brawler 1812

Lance:
Dragon Heavy DRG-7N Skirmisher 1495
Chimera Medium CMA-1S Striker 1173
Mauler Assault MAL-2R Juggernaut 1586
Thanatos Heavy TNS-4T Skirmisher 1760

Lance:
Stalker Assault STK-8S Juggernaut 2020
Hunchback Medium HBK-4SP Juggernaut 1043
Argus Heavy AGS-4D Skirmisher 1638
Hellspawn Medium HSN-7D Missile Boat 1220

18709

Also got myself that Aeldari Emerald contrast paint and it works brilliantly over silver base coat (and that was over gray primer in my test). Nigh perfect metallic jade for the House Hiritsu, and takes almost no effort. Wet palette made painting silver real easy, and the Aeldari Emerald is extremely easy and pleasant to paint.
Will post pic later.

Also determined that Militarum Green contrast over creates pretty good grayish-green look. More green than gray but close enough, can probably improved with some drybrushed gray. Should be good base for 1st or 2nd St. Ives Lancers.
Well done on progress. My parcel containing spray primer, some constast paints and extra brushes arrived this morning. Will be trying to get set up for making a start over the weekend.

St Ives Lancers is one the companies I am planning. Gives me an excuse to play some Capellan mechs without going full-Liao. So I am certainly interested in how to get a good grey green easily, especially if contrast paint.

Empyrus

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8815
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #73 on: 01 September 2022, 08:28:22 »
St Ives Lancers is one the companies I am planning. Gives me an excuse to play some Capellan mechs without going full-Liao. So I am certainly interested in how to get a good grey green easily, especially if contrast paint.
I'll try to prime another test mini today, and now that i have wet palette, i may be able to get the gray primer applied better. The current Tikonovs have the primer a bit too thickly at times  :(
Another i'll prime black and then do some gray base coat to see how that contrast works on that.

That said, Worktroll's method seems easy enough:
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/miniatures/combined-arms-company-2nd-st-ives-lancers-fccw-era/msg1546841/#msg1546841
Quote
So the St Ives Lancers. Colours are green-tinted grey with jade highlights. Method:

- base light green
- wash with black ink (got to restock on Nuln Oil!)
- Green details
- Black anything to be made metallic
- Wash with black ink
- drybrush metal bits
- 'jewel' cockpits
It seems Nuln Oil may alter a light green's color enough to turn it into "grey-green". Unfortunately none of the non-contrast greens available for me seem to be suitable base color for this.
Sun Tzu Liao: Scheming, opportunistic weasel of a ruler, or brilliant political tactician?
-What's the difference?

Wargame_insomniac

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 114
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #74 on: 01 September 2022, 13:18:07 »
I'll try to prime another test mini today, and now that i have wet palette, i may be able to get the gray primer applied better. The current Tikonovs have the primer a bit too thickly at times  :(
Another i'll prime black and then do some gray base coat to see how that contrast works on that.

That said, Worktroll's method seems easy enough:
https://bg.battletech.com/forums/miniatures/combined-arms-company-2nd-st-ives-lancers-fccw-era/msg1546841/#msg1546841It seems Nuln Oil may alter a light green's color enough to turn it into "grey-green". Unfortunately none of the non-contrast greens available for me seem to be suitable base color for this.
Thanks - on both counts

sounguru

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 272
  • When all else fails shoot the messenger.
Re: Back to painting... now with Tikonov Republican Guard
« Reply #75 on: 17 October 2022, 09:14:59 »
Kind of read through the whole thing and I want to give you another route that might help you on your whites...

Prime White I use Krylon matte white primer almost exclusively have for years. I also use gray and black. Any white primer that has a fine pigment should do just don't over prime keep it light and make several passes letting it fully dry between.

Now here is the change up....

Cooler White color: Mix a little light gray into your white say 75% gray to 25% white and using a gloss medium or flo aid and a touch of water to thin. Now cover the entire area well with the mix and let dry. Go back and panel paint with same mixture just add a little more white to get half way between the first mix and pure white. Now again try to hit about half way between and highlight with that mix. Then use pure white for the final highlight. This will give you panel lines and a cool white look to the entire mini. If you glaze on the highlights the center of the panels will be slightly darker and go bright white towards the highlights the panel lines will be a light gray but stand in contrast to the panels.

Warm White Color: Do the same but use Bone as the base instead of gray. You can use something like a flesh wash by Army painter to pop the panel lines after the first coat if you want more pop to the lines.

Hope maybe this will help and give you another way of looking at it.
There would be less humans if they were tastier....

 

Register