to-hit rolls once TAG has been aquired

[Weirdo]

The trick is to be exactly 15 hexes from the target hex, and call down a salvo of capital missiles, which get even more bonuses.

[Youngblood]

This part kind of confused me.  page 143  "If the to-hit roll is successful, the system designates the target for that turn's weapon attack phase; the target unit is designated for any number of attacks from any number of units using TAG."

My group has interpreted that as meaning a unit with TAG could make an indirect attack at an enemy "tagged" by another friendly even with normal LRM rounds.  We treated the attack as a normal indirect attack but without all the extra mods from(or to) the spotter.   Is that right or are we way off?

From what I recall, this is actually right.  Essentially, for the price of 1 ton, 1 crit, and having to make a to-hit roll (instead of automatically spotting with a penalty), you get the advantage of not having to deal with spotter movement/terrain issues.

The cool part?  Thunderbolt Missile Launcher systems ALSO work this way too. >:D

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

There are Semi-Guided rounds for Thunderbolts?

[Jim1701]

There are Semi-Guided rounds for Thunderbolts?

Not that I am aware of.  Thunderbolt launchers currently only use standard munitions. 

[ANS Kamas P81]

You can still use TAG to "spot" - the benefit is to the TAGing unit, which doesn't suffer the additional +1 to its own weapons fire normal spotting would do.  So you can call down the Thunder while still freeing up your own guns, even without semi-guided weapons.  You'll still have to deal with attacker movement, in that case, but the benefit of being able to blast away yourself without fear sure makes those heavily armed TAG units much happier...it's not a big shift, but +1 is +1.

[Weirdo]

The big difference is that those normal rounds recieve NO benefit from a TAG. You fire standard LRMs or Thunderbolts at a TAGged target and you don't have a regular spotter, you odds of a miss average around 100%.

[GOTHIK]

From what I recall, this is actually right.  Essentially, for the price of 1 ton, 1 crit, and having to make a to-hit roll (instead of automatically spotting with a penalty), you get the advantage of not having to deal with spotter movement/terrain issues.

The cool part?  Thunderbolt Missile Launcher systems ALSO work this way too. >:D

hang on a second ... are you saying that when using TAG you do NOT incurr to-hit modifiers based on terrain?
so in My example earlier, the Archer would NOT receive a +2 for the light woods?
If this is the case, does the negation of the terrain modifier ONLY apply to the special munitions as discussed above?

[Weirdo]

Spotter terrain issues. If you're performing a direct shot instead of indirect fire, terrain between the shooter and target still counts.

Though you are correct in that it only benefits TAG-specific munitions. Just like everything else TAG does only benefits TAG-specific munitions.

Hint: TAG does nothing at all to benefit non-TAG-specific munitions.

[Col.Hengist]

 Question is...Indirect firing with sg rounds.

 Defender is in a woods hex. Tagging unit has to pay for the woods at +1 for a light.

 Launching unit- does it have to pay for the hex that the Defender is in?

 Narc was errated so that the launching unit does not pay for the woods hex that the defender is in.

[GOTHIK]

Spotter terrain issues. If you're performing a direct shot instead of indirect fire, terrain between the shooter and target still counts.

you can use TAG for indirect fire as well though, right? (thereby negating the following to-hit modifiers: +1 for indirect, +x for terrain, and +x for target movement)

[Weirdo]

you can use TAG for indirect fire as well though, right? (thereby negating the following to-hit modifiers: +1 for indirect, +x for terrain, and +x for target movement)

Yes. But only if you are firing S-G LRMs.

Question is...Indirect firing with sg rounds.

 Defender is in a woods hex. Tagging unit has to pay for the woods at +1 for a light.

 Launching unit- does it have to pay for the hex that the Defender is in?

 Narc was errated so that the launching unit does not pay for the woods hex that the defender is in.

I'm actually not sure here...

[Sartris]

And if you love LRMs there's pretty much no better choice than the FWL anyways. Trebuchet, Apollo, Yeoman, Perseus A, and even the Patriot for on-board Arrow IV action. Plus access to the Raven ;D

Longbow, Archer 8M, 9M, Orion,  Anvil 8M (for Arrow IV), Stalker.  Even the lowly Hammer has some utility with SG.

Well, this is certainly a notable occasion: someone mentioned the Yeoman with something other than derision.

Hey! I love my walking boombox.

[GOTHIK]

Yes. But only if you are firing S-G LRMs.

I goth the SG LRM part no problem  ;)
Thank you for confirming the rest!

[pensiveswetness]

in my campaign, the TAG(P) units are used for Indirect Spotting/Weapons Firing from the Spotter Mech since I've not introduced Arrow-IV systems yet. they are a nice niche device, taking away 1 ton of urge to generate 3-more heat you otherwise can't dispate...  O0. i can imagine TAG, using home rules of course, could be Role-Played for artillery hexing as well (the laser verifies the Hex location the shells will land... in 2-3 rounds, give or take the price of Olive Oil...

(P) = Prototype, with all sorts of fun things happening when you roll a 2...  ;D

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

I goth the SG LRM part no problem  ;)
Thank you for confirming the rest!

You goth it?

So it's wearing black eyeliner? ;D

[GOTHIK]

You goth it?

So it's wearing black eyeliner? ;D

buwahahahaha!!!  that was an honest type.

[Warpimp]

Quick TAG question: When I TAG for Arrow IV fire do I have to have the target tagged on the turn the round hits or the turn I fire or both?

[Weirdo]

just the turn of impact.

[Youngblood]

The big difference is that those normal rounds recieve NO benefit from a TAG. You fire standard LRMs or Thunderbolts at a TAGged target and you don't have a regular spotter, you odds of a miss average around 100%.

Yes. But only if you are firing S-G LRMs.

Wha?  I could swear there was something in Total Warfare about TAG proxying for a spotter...now I look like a fool.

[Warpimp]

That would be nice. I always thought TAG had a very small role and yet got slapped on every other design for a few years. I even use artillery somewhat often.

[Weirdo]

Wha?  I could swear there was something in Total Warfare about TAG proxying for a spotter...now I look like a fool.

S'okay, we all mess up every so often.

To clarify, TAG only helps S-G LRMs, homing Arrow IV, Copperhead artillery, laser-guided bombs, and orbital strikes. It's a bit of a narrow niche, but those items it helps, it REALLY helps.

[Jim1701]

To be fair the rules for TAG itself is not terribly clear.  You have to looks at the munitions that benefit from TAG to get the rest of the story. 

[willydstyle]

To be fair the rules for TAG itself is not terribly clear.  You have to looks at the munitions that benefit from TAG to get the rest of the story.

Yeah, that's my biggest beef with TW: some stuff like TAG and NARC could use some cross-referencing, where it really doesn't have any.

[pensiveswetness]

To be fair the rules for TAG itself is not terribly clear.  You have to looks at the munitions that benefit from TAG to get the rest of the story.

*mumbles*

[Weirdo]

I use the index. Works every time.

[bakija]

Yeah, that's my biggest beef with TW: some stuff like TAG and NARC could use some cross-referencing, where it really doesn't have any.

Yeah, this is actually a significant problem. I spent *weeks* trying to figure out what, exactly, TAG actually did. As the rules for TAG are incredibly vague, and make no reference at all to Semi-Guided Missiles. Which, unless you already know benefit from TAG, you have no way to know you need to look up Semi-Guided Missiles (or Arrow IV, I'd imagine) to make TAG make sense. Until someone here pointed that out. What was very helpful :-)

[bakija]

I use the index. Works every time.

If you don't know that "Semi-Guided Missiles" are something that goes with TAG, but you do know that TAG is something that exists and helps missiles somehow, using the index has zero effect. As the rules for TAG don't reference Semi-Guided Missiles. And without knowing that Semi-Guided Missiles exist (which isn't at all unreasonable, especially if learning the game or coming back to the game), looking at TAG is mostly pointless.

[Weirdo]

Interestingly enough, you're right about this one. Though also interestingly enough, looking up TAG in the index actually does point you to same same page as S-G LRMs, if you look up about six inches.

You are right in that TAG should list the munitions it works with. I'd recommend suggesting this to the devs, they might be able to fit it in whenever they next update TW.

[bakija]

Interestingly enough, you're right about this one. Though also interestingly enough, looking up TAG in the index actually does point you to same same page as S-G LRMs, if you look up about six inches.

Semi-Guided Missiles and TAG are even on the same page in the TW rules. And Semi-Guided Missiles reference TAG (with a "TAG, to the right"). But TAG doesn't reference Semi-Guided Missiles. I realize that one might stumble into this, but given that I had the experience of spending a significant amount of time reading the TAG rules and not ever managing to notice the Semi-Guided Missiles that were on the same page, 6 inches away, I suspect that it isn't that uncommon of an issue :-)

You are right in that TAG should list the munitions it works with. I'd recommend suggesting this to the devs, they might be able to fit it in whenever they next update TW.

Probably a good idea.

[Warpimp]

I too have spent quite a while staring at the TAG rules and wondering what I am missing since every third post in the forum references it an how people will use it to kill everything. But it's pretty much for Arrow IV homing missles and rare lrm munitions and orbital strikes.