Author Topic: Outworlds Alliance Expansion Post-Jihad (Read 10000 times)

Archangel · « **on:** 16 June 2011, 07:08:04 »

According to the MPS Handbook, the Outworlds Alliance (like all periphery realms) lost many worlds after the fall of the First Star League. Lacking the technology and resources, they have largely been unable to recolonize them. Now with their alliance with the Snow Ravens and their growing economy, what do you think their chances are to start reclaiming the lost worlds? The Snow Ravens provide the technical know-how while the Outworlds Alliance provides the labor and resources. The Snow Ravens would get part of the material resources extracted and maybe a couple colonies (which would help them improve their self-sufficiency) while the Outworlds Alliance would regain access to the lost colonies (and their resources) and be able to expand their borders without violence.

Kit deSummersville · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 June 2011, 07:50:06 »

Most of those planets don't want to be part of the OA, I don't know that they want to get bogged down in more wars.

Ratwedge · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 June 2011, 08:48:15 »

Why would they waste resources on trying to setup new Colonies? Seems like a rather expensive option.

DaveMac · « **Reply #3 on:** 16 June 2011, 09:50:26 »

Perhaps the Ravens would like a world they have sole control over so and restrict access to clan members only?

An abandoned ex-OA colony might be just the thing...

Terminax · « **Reply #4 on:** 16 June 2011, 15:29:03 »

I'm not sure it was so much the case that worlds became nonviable so much as they left the Outworlds Alliance due to differences with the central government.

Peacemaker · « **Reply #5 on:** 16 June 2011, 15:31:13 »

The Outworlds are so underdeveloped, I don't think there's any real reason to launch a colonization program instead of working on bringing the current worlds up to speed.

Archangel · « **Reply #6 on:** 16 June 2011, 16:18:12 »

Quote from: Kit deSummersville on 16 June 2011, 07:50:06

Most of those planets don't want to be part of the OA, I don't know that they want to get bogged down in more wars.

uhm how many times has the OA gone to war since the fall of the First Star League?

Even if they were active and not part of the OA, the OA would be aware of them (especially with all their pirate sweeps) and would have some sort of relations with them. Just wanted to mention that before I mentioned they don't appear on any maps after the fall of the first SL.

Archangel · « **Reply #7 on:** 16 June 2011, 16:46:15 »

Quote from: Ratwedge on 16 June 2011, 08:48:15

Why would they waste resources on trying to setup new Colonies? Seems like a rather expensive option.

SR reasons-
1) How many warships have the Snow Ravens been forced to convert to barracks to house their people? Even one new colony would allow they to restore one, if not more, warships to their intended purpose.

2) How are those people being fed? Most of their food is being sent up from OA colonies. A new colony would allow the SR to start back on the road to self-sufficiency.

3) Helping the OA regain some of their lost colonies would help the SR show a more benevolent side by helping both gain strength without resorting to violence. Also it would help improve their tarnished image especially after Dante.

4) After the Jihad (and their conflict with the DC), how much raw materials do the SR need to rebuild their strength? A new colony would provide them access to the needed raw material. It would also allow them to build their own factories using tech the SR are not yet ready to share with the OA.

OA reasons-
1) New colonies would help continue President Avellar's Long Road Program. New jobs and access to raw materials that could be used in manufacturing or traded to other nations.

2) There are many factions, such as some Separatists factions, in the OA that are uneasy with the SR presence. Helping the SR establish their own colonies would reduce the drain the SR have on local economies and reduce the number of orbiting warships. This in turn would make them less of a sword of Damocles presence

3) Having OA and SR working side-by-side for a common (and non-violent) goal would improve further improve relations. Most citizens of the OA are not able to see the big picture and how the SR presence has actually helped the OA.

Kit deSummersville · « **Reply #8 on:** 16 June 2011, 17:30:42 »

Quote from: Archangel on 16 June 2011, 16:18:12

uhm how many times has the OA gone to war since the fall of the First Star League?

Too many times for their liking, nobody enjoys being invaded.

Quote

Even if they were active and not part of the OA, the OA would be aware of them (especially with all their pirate sweeps) and would have some sort of relations with them. Just wanted to mention that before I mentioned they don't appear on any maps after the fall of the first SL.

Periphery planets that aren't of note, like most of those that exit a larger state on their own, aren't shown on the map any more. The OA is especially know for this, with the plaet Barahona issuing the following statement of their feelings:

Quote from: End of Days

We send you taxes. We send you our children. We even pay to put your name on everything from statues to letterhead. And what do we ask for? Clean water? We provide that. Food? We grow our own. Social services? We see to our own. Not even a garrison. No, indeed all was ask for is protection when we are repeatedly preyed upon. A strong force to deal with the jackals that seek to steal from us. Instead you leave us to defend ourselves, alone in our hour of need. Well, we have done so. In doing so, we realize that we have no need for you or your government. No longer will you receive taxes or recruits. We will use the letterhead with your name on it, but only until it is gone. No, we are done with you and we will work to better our world and our people. Goodbye from Barahona.
- Citizens of Barahona to Outworlds Alliance officials, July 2846.

Ratwedge · « **Reply #9 on:** 16 June 2011, 17:51:40 »

If only the Outworlds Alliance had a partner that could help it exploit resources it was unable to touch when it was simply a piss-poor 3rd world state in the middle of nowhere. All those seas and space borne resources are crying out for pillaging, if only there was a friend experienced and technologically advanced enough to help them finally get them! ::)

Also, when did fresh Colonies become Raw Resource Vending Machines and not drains where you pour resources down to setup?

Kit deSummersville · « **Reply #10 on:** 16 June 2011, 19:34:21 »

Quote from: Ratwedge on 16 June 2011, 17:51:40

Also, when did fresh Colonies become Raw Resource Vending Machines and not drains where you pour resources down to setup?

Well, there was African colonialism....

:D

Ratwedge · « **Reply #11 on:** 16 June 2011, 20:32:31 »

Quote from: Kit deSummersville on 16 June 2011, 19:34:21

Well, there was African colonialism....

:D

LoL.

Now I have a picture of Snow Ravens singing Men of Harlech.

Jaim Magnus · « **Reply #12 on:** 16 June 2011, 22:29:17 »

There is no Outworlds Alliance post Jihad. It is supplanted by the Raven Alliance in 3083. The Raven Alliance has plenty of expansion opportunities... into
the Draconis Combine.

Also, Dante seems to have become an all Raven world after its scouring.

Korzon77 · « **Reply #13 on:** 16 June 2011, 22:33:07 »

Quote from: Ratwedge on 16 June 2011, 08:48:15

Why would they waste resources on trying to setup new Colonies? Seems like a rather expensive option.

This-- why bother having a colony? over population? most OA worlds have popujlations in the thousands or millions, not billions, so you could still find vast amounts of land. Resources? Pretty much ditto.

The OA's problems-- defense and lack of an industrial base to build up same, are not solved by adding more targets to the mix-- rather the opposite. An intelligent system would start with industriliazing and fortifying the core worlds, gradually moving out to other worlds, not landing a few colonists on yet another deserted, pirate friendly, colony.

Medron Pryde · « **Reply #14 on:** 17 June 2011, 10:16:57 »

Yes, colonizing new worlds never does anything good. *looks at the Calderon Protectorate* ;)

More sensible is finding colonies that have left and encouraging them to join up again. *Looks at Detroit* :)

There are probably some (maybe not many but some) Detroits in the vast region that fell away from the Alliance. The question would be whether they would be would be worth bringing in. Yes, they could provide major labor forces for building factories and the like, ala Detroit, but they might be a bit rebellious as the Calderons found out.

Many things could happen. Not all of them nice for either side. It would be a story I would like to see though. :)

Nibs · « **Reply #15 on:** 28 June 2011, 01:04:44 »

Well, quick look at a 3062 map and a 3130 map and their differences:

Gained from Draconis Combine
Suianheer
Tabayama
Ramgarh
Ziatousi
Kazanaka

Gained from Federated Suns
Pitkin
Pajarito
Kennard

Lost to Periphery
Trimaldix
Ferris
Raldamax
Baliggora
Valasha

So... Anti-expansion (into the Periphery)?

Frabby · « **Reply #16 on:** 28 June 2011, 03:07:09 »

Quote from: Nibs on 28 June 2011, 01:04:44

Lost to Periphery
Trimaldix
Ferris
Raldamax
Baliggora
Valasha

Are these "lost to the Periphery" in the sense of going independent, or were they lost to war? Especially Baliggora I'd expect to suffer from WoB WoMDs, as it was a major Explorer Corps HQ and the Explorer Corps was a highly secular ComStar branch (i.e. a prime WoB target).

BrokenMnemonic · « **Reply #17 on:** 28 June 2011, 03:07:42 »

How many of those worlds taken from the Combine and the FedSuns were Outworlds Alliance colony worlds, prior to the Reunification War?

Sharpnel · « **Reply #18 on:** 28 June 2011, 04:17:21 »

Quote from: BrokenMnemonic on 28 June 2011, 03:07:42

How many of those worlds taken from the Combine and the FedSuns were Outworlds Alliance colony worlds, prior to the Reunification War?

All of the Feddie worlds, IIRC and at least two of the DC worlds

Neufeld · « **Reply #19 on:** 28 June 2011, 10:53:34 »

Quote from: Frabby on 28 June 2011, 03:07:09

Are these "lost to the Periphery" in the sense of going independent, or were they lost to war? Especially Baliggora I'd expect to suffer from WoB WoMDs, as it was a major Explorer Corps HQ and the Explorer Corps was a highly secular ComStar branch (i.e. a prime WoB target).

They are still on map, so I suspect that it is the former.

Rainbow 6 · « **Reply #20 on:** 28 June 2011, 16:07:53 »

I wonder if they are home to an anti - Raven Alliance movement.

Jaim Magnus · « **Reply #21 on:** 28 June 2011, 20:04:33 »

Quote from: Rainbow 6 on 28 June 2011, 16:07:53

I wonder if they are home to an anti - Raven Alliance movement.

That's my theory.

Nibs · « **Reply #22 on:** 28 June 2011, 23:13:32 »

Quote from: Rainbow 6 on 28 June 2011, 16:07:53

I wonder if they are home to an anti - Raven Alliance movement.

Those jerks. >:(

Rainbow 6 · « **Reply #23 on:** 29 June 2011, 04:27:44 »

Quote from: Nibs on 28 June 2011, 23:13:32

Those jerks. >:(

Well given the ammount of risistance the Outworlds put up against the Star League is it any wonder some of them would resist the Star Leagues decendents?

Archangel · « **Reply #24 on:** 29 June 2011, 06:11:08 »

Quote from: Rainbow 6 on 29 June 2011, 04:27:44

Well given the ammount of risistance the Outworlds put up against the Star League is it any wonder some of them would resist the Star Leagues decendents?

Compared to the Magistracy of Canopus and the Taurian Concordat they barely put up any resistance. It was only through support provided by the FedSuns were they able to put up any organized resistance at all.

Nibs · « **Reply #25 on:** 30 June 2011, 01:04:07 »

Quote from: Rainbow 6 on 29 June 2011, 04:27:44

Well given the ammount of risistance the Outworlds put up against the Star League is it any wonder some of them would resist the Star Leagues decendents?

They should be more apathetic.

Rainbow 6 · « **Reply #26 on:** 30 June 2011, 02:48:51 »

Quote from: Nibs on 30 June 2011, 01:04:07

They should be more apathetic.

Well they are probably providing good 'training' opponents for the Raven's.

Crunch · « **Reply #27 on:** 30 June 2011, 02:57:25 »

Quote from: Rainbow 6 on 29 June 2011, 04:27:44

Well given the ammount of risistance the Outworlds put up against the Star League is it any wonder some of them would resist the Star Leagues decendents?

It's not the amount of resistance it's the tendency (which the Ravens share) that the Star League had to murder millions of civilians just because.

Look at the events following Budigen. This is a nation that had 10% of the population of 12 worlds executed by the Star League and names it's highest military honor after the officer who led the fight against the league. Their "Alliance" with the Ravens has always struck me as having been dreamt up by some wizkids staffer who didn't know anything about the OWA except the name and that they liked Aerospace.

Rainbow 6 · « **Reply #28 on:** 30 June 2011, 03:03:55 »

Quote from: Crunch on 30 June 2011, 02:57:25

It's not the amount of resistance it's the tendency (which the Ravens share) that the Star League had to murder millions of civilians just because.

Look at the events following Budigen. This is a nation that had 10% of the population of 12 worlds executed by the Star League and names it's highest military honor after the officer who led the fight against the league. Their "Alliance" with the Ravens has always struck me as having been dreamt up by some wizkids staffer who didn't know anything about the OWA except the name and that they liked Aerospace.

You're probably right about how the Raven Alliance came about, hopefully we will have a fight back by the Outworlders who managed to stay independent, maybe those systems can form a new Outworlds Alliance?

Deadborder · « **Reply #29 on:** 30 June 2011, 06:01:34 »

Quote from: Crunch on 30 June 2011, 02:57:25

Their "Alliance" with the Ravens has always struck me as having been dreamt up by some wizkids staffer who didn't know anything about the OWA except the name and that they liked Aerospace.

*sighs*

This has only been said about a trillion times, but... the Dark Age fluff text, from universe creation down to website content such as touring the starts was written by former and current Battletech universe writers, including, yes, Herb.

With that being said, it's never been made entirely clear how the Ravens ended up effectively taking over the Outworlds Alliance; hell, we still know very little about it beyond the broadest basic details. In the case of the RA, a lot of it is "still to ocme" stuff.