Author Topic: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?  (Read 2720 times)

Giovanni Blasini

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Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« on: 14 February 2024, 04:51:13 »
After four hours of sleep followed by 9-10 hours of work, and general bleariness, I found myself asking a weird question: can you turn a BugMech into a general-purpose trooper?

Now, we all know that larger light 'Mechs can, in some circumstances, make at least passable standard trooper 'Mechs.  I mean, that's what both the Panther and the Valkyrie both functioned as to a large degree during the Succession Wars, right?  But what about the really small 'Mechs, like 20-25 tons?

Here's my thoughts: a lot of small planets or factions have the ability to build a single BugMech, like a Wasp, Locust or Stinger.  That means that, while they may be able to build other, more conventional forces of other sizes (even if that means Scorpions tanks or their equivalents), their 'Mech forces have to revolve around this single BugMech platform.  That means potentially anti-'Mech and anti-vehicle work, infantry support, recon, etc.

So, I've got a couple possible ideas, but I wanted to see what everyone else thought and came up with.  Can it be done?  What would a general trooper that small look like?  Something like the Gùn?

Not going to specify era: I imagine the answer may change dramatically depending on era, and I want this to be as open as possible.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

AlphaMirage

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #1 on: 14 February 2024, 06:20:08 »
Squire SQR-1
Mass: 20 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 100 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 108 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     2 ER Medium Laser
Introduction Year: 3060
Cost: 1,447,840 C-bills

Background - The Squire was envisioned as a mech to support conventional forces and as a general trooper inspired by the Stinger 3G and Locust 1E which typically perform this role. It does this by utilizing its slightly better than average mobility compared to common conventional forces such as Mechanized Infantry and light tanks. A Squire is capable of both Jumping over obstacles or Running almost as fast as a Locust using its MASC system leveraging the mobility advantage of a Battlemech platform. With these it can position its Magna Mark VI ERML where they can be used for best effect and aim them precisely using a built in targeting computer. It's shoulder mounted searchlight can spot targets so that other forces can engage them at a distance.

Unlike the Stinger 3G or Locust 1E however both of its lasers are in its torsos which while limiting their cone of fire protects them from incoming fire and allows the Squire to use handheld weapons further increasing its battlefield adaptability. The most popular weapons are:
An over-under machine gun with a half ton of ammo protected by a half ton of armor for infantry suppression at close range
A Bical SRM-2 with 1 ton of ammo although it is typically underloaded to less than 20% for safety
Or a quad RL-10 Ambush Weapon meant to quickly disable hostile armor or mechs before the Squire can disengage.

Unfortunately its limited carrying capacity and concerns about ammo explosions with such thin armor limit its long range firepower. Missiles and cannons are however common on its accompanying conventional forces so this was considered an acceptable compromise.

Code: [Select]
Type: Squire
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Tonnage: 20
Battle Value: 661

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    2
Engine                        100 Fusion              3
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8(10)
Jumping MP: 5
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  1
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  64                      4

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            6         9     
     Center Torso (rear)               2     
     R/L Torso               5         8     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  2     
     R/L Arm                 3         5     
     R/L Leg                 4         7     


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Jump Jet                 LL        1        -       0.5   
Heat Sink                LL        1        -       1.0   
Jump Jet                 CT        1        -       0.5   
Targeting Computer       CT        1        -       1.0   
Searchlight              RT        1        -       0.5   
Jump Jet                 RT        1        -       0.5   
2 Heat Sinks             RT        2        -       2.0   
ER Medium Laser          RT        1        5       1.0   
MASC                     LT        1        -       1.0   
Jump Jet                 LT        1        -       0.5   
2 Heat Sinks             LT        2        -       2.0   
ER Medium Laser          LT        1        5       1.0   
Jump Jet                 RL        1        -       0.5   
Heat Sink                RL        1        -       1.0   

Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #2 on: 14 February 2024, 07:22:09 »
Not bad.  I thought with handheld, though, you could only use head and leg mounted weapons in conjunction with them.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

AlphaMirage

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #3 on: 14 February 2024, 07:33:45 »
Not bad.  I thought with handheld, though, you could only use head and leg mounted weapons in conjunction with them.

That is true, however the Stinger replaces its hand with a laser and the Locust has no lower actuators preventing their use of handhelds. It still doesn't make sense to put your main weapons in flimsy arms if you have other options and those are special purpose weapons where its lasers are insufficient.

Sabelkatten

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #4 on: 14 February 2024, 09:17:45 »
Base it on the Hornet, 5/8 movement. Build a fire support version with no JJs and twin LRM5s, a lightly armored (no JJ) AA version with an AC/2 and ML, a skirmisher with 5 JJ, ML and LRM5, plus an infighter with 5 JJ, 3 MLs and a MG.

AlphaMirage

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #5 on: 14 February 2024, 09:24:20 »
Sabelkatten, the thing with that design paradigm is that there are lots of vehicles that can do those things, much cheaper, and even faster.

A Heavy APC can become a reasonably protected and faster double LRM5 carrier. Scorpions rearmed with an AC/2 (or put on a wheeled chassis) can do the same as that Mech as well while being tougher to kill.

Cavgunner

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #6 on: 14 February 2024, 11:35:30 »
Minibeast (Scorpion Empire)

Mass: 20 tons
Chassis: Endo Steel Quad
Power Plant: 100 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
     1 Micro Pulse Laser
     1 LRM 10
     1 ER Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-X-X-D
Cost: 1,705,000 C-bills

Overview
The Minibeast is a small second-line quadrupedal mech that was developed by the Scorpion Empire in the late 3140's. Since then it has been supplementing and replacing the variety of quasi-Industrialmechs still lingering in the Empire's arsenal.

Capabilities
The Minibeast was designed to be small, durable, and most importantly, inexpensive. To this end, Clan technologies are used reclaim as much tonnage as possible without resorting to an XL engine.

The Minibeast's firepower far exceeds that of Spheroid mechs of similar tonnage. A cockpit-mounted clan ER Large Laser can engage targets at extreme ranges, while a LRM-10 provides tactical versatility with two tons of ammunition. A micro pulse laser is also mounted in the cockpit to deal with infantry. The latter weapon comes from the Empire's stock of unused Protomech components. Although the small cockpit is rather cramped, the Minibeast is easy to pilot thanks to its quad chassis. 

The mech's primary drawbacks are twofold. First, top speed is limited to 86kph. This was considered an acceptable tradeoff to ensure that the mech could operate with a 1-ton gyro, and thus further reduce expense. Secondly, while the maximized armor layout makes the Minibeast far tougher than most mechs of its tonnage, it still cannot survive for long in a short-range shootout with a medium or heavy mech. Close combat should be avoided.

Deployment
The Minibeast has become a common sight in second-line and freeborn units. Pilots are strongly encouraged to take advantage of their powerful long-range weaponry to offset the mech's slow speed and lack of jump jets.

In many ways, the Minibeast is equivalent in power and capability to a medium tank. Unsurprisingly, it functions well when supporting conventional units. Most importantly, the Minibeast ensures that every Scorpion warrior who is worthy of a mech is sitting in a cockpit.

Code: [Select]
Type: Minibeast
Technology Base: Clan (Advanced)
Tonnage: 20
Battle Value: 849

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure            Endo Steel              1
Engine                        100 Fusion              3
Walking MP: 5
Running MP: 8
Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              10 [20]                 0
Gyro                                                  1
Small Cockpit                                         2
Armor Factor (Ferro)          73                      4

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         9     
     Center Torso            6         10   
     Center Torso (rear)               2     
     R/L Torso               5         8     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  2     
     FR/L Leg                4         8     
     RR/L Leg                4         8     

Weapons
and Ammo                   Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Double Heat Sink             FRL        2        -       1.0   
LRM 10                        CT        1        4       2.5   
2 Double Heat Sink            RT        4        -       2.0   
Double Heat Sink             FLL        2        -       1.0   
LRM 10 Swarm-I Ammo (12)      LT        1        -       1.0   
CASE                          LT        0        -       0.0   
LRM 10 Ammo (12)              LT        1        -       1.0   
2 Double Heat Sink            LT        4        -       2.0   
ER Large Laser                HD        1        12      4.0   
Micro Pulse Laser             HD        1        1       0.5   


Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #7 on: 14 February 2024, 13:25:25 »
Holy crap.  The power of Clan tech compels you.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Syzyx

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #8 on: 14 February 2024, 13:26:35 »
So here's a 3025 take on the task. Medium lasers for anti-'mech work, machine guns for anti-infantry, and SRMs to carry infernos or to crit seek depending on operational needs.

Code: [Select]
Type/Model:    Soldier SLD-3R
Tech:          Inner Sphere / 3025
Config:        Biped BattleMech
Rules:         Level 1, Standard design

Mass:          20 tons
Chassis:       Standard
Power Plant:   100 Hermes Fusion
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets:     None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor Type:    Standard
Armament:     
  2 Machine Guns
  2 Medium Lasers
  1 SRM 4
Manufacturer:  (Unknown)
  Location:    (Unknown)
Communications System:  (Unknown)
Targeting & Tracking System:  (Unknown)

--------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model:    Soldier SLD-3R
Mass:          20 tons

Equipment:                                 Crits    Mass
Int. Struct.:  33 pts Standard               0      2.00
Engine:        100 Fusion                    6      3.00
   Walking MP:   5
   Running MP:   8
   Jumping MP:   0
Heat Sinks:     10 Single                    6       .00
 (Heat Sink Loc: 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL)
Gyro:                                        4      1.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors:                5      3.00
Actuators: L: Sh+UA+LA+H    R: Sh+UA+LA+H   16       .00
Armor Factor:   69 pts Standard              0      4.50

                          Internal    Armor
                          Structure   Value
   Head:                      3          9     
   Center Torso:              6          9     
   Center Torso (Rear):                  3     
   L/R Side Torso:            5        8/8     
   L/R Side Torso (Rear):              2/2     
   L/R Arm:                   3        6/6     
   L/R Leg:                   4        8/8     

Weapons and Equipment    Loc  Heat  Ammo   Crits    Mass
--------------------------------------------------------
1 Machine Gun            RA      0  100      2      1.00
  (Ammo Locations: 1 CT)
1 Machine Gun            LA      0           1       .50
1 Medium Laser           RT      3           1      1.00
1 Medium Laser           LT      3           1      1.00
1 SRM 4                  HD      3   25      2      3.00
  (Ammo Locations: 1 CT)
--------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                          9          44     20.00
Crits & Tons Left:                          34       .00

Calculated Factors:
Total Cost:        1,220,440 C-Bills
Battle Value 2:    491 (old BV = 416)
Cost per BV2:      2,485.62
Weapon Value:      217 / 217 (Ratio = .44 / .44)
Damage Factors:    SRDmg = 13;  MRDmg = 2;  LRDmg = 0
BattleForce2:      MP: 5,  Armor/Structure: 2/2
                   Damage PB/M/L: 2/2/-,  Overheat: 0
                   Class: ML;  Point Value: 5
But as a matter of fact I was quite busy getting potty-trained at the time and had no time for interstellar politics.- ykonoclast

Dragon Cat

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #9 on: 14 February 2024, 14:17:31 »
Code: [Select]
   
 BattleBug 
 3060 IS Light

Original:  https://battletech.doknet.hu/mechfactory_frame.php?call=displaymech&id=10000095

Source: My Own Custom /
Type/Model: BattleBug 
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Standard design

Mass: 25 tons
Chassis:
Power Plant: 100 Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Running Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: 4 Standard Jump Jet
Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Jump Jet Manufacturer:
Armor Type:  Standard
Armament:
 1 ER Medium Laser
 1 Flamer
 1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)
 1 Medium Laser
 1 Machine Gun
 1 Lift Hoist
Manufacturer:
 Location:
Communications System:
Targeting and Tracking System:



 ==Overview:==
 Following the Clan Invasion and a perceived threat from beyond the Federated Suns Periphery world of Tallneer prepared for the worse and began construction of BattleMechs in their IndistrialMech factory. To support local efforts Empress Adele Adams bought 200 Extended Range Medium Lasers to support this effort.

 ==Capabilities:==
 Built using military instead of Industrial equipment the Empress made one request of the design - that they were able to use it during peacetime as well as military operations as a result every design came with two functional hands, and a lift hoist allowing the Mech to support civilian operations.

With a conservative one ER laser and one standard medium laser per BattleMech Tallneer wanted their lasers to last for construction and repairs. A flamer works in both clearing structures and making firebreaks during peacetime and a terror weapon against enemy infantry while a machine gun provides a less collateral damage alternative. a Rocket launcher allows the Mech to provide very basic fire support and a one time punch to make enemies think twice about their advance 

 ==Deployment:==
 This is Tallneers only home built BattleMech plans are for at least a Battalion of the Mechs to be built however with two hundred advanced lasers already purchased the true l target is currently in question.

 ==Variants:==
 Already several MechWarriors have lobbied for all BattleBugs to be equipped with two ER lasers to make the design more combat capable and make more use of the Triple-Strengh Myomers the planet spent so much on obtaining. So far only a couple of Mechs have been upgraded to this standard.   
---------------------------------------------------------
Type/Model:  BattleBug 
Mass: 25 tons

Equipment:                                 Crits    Mass
Int. Struct.:  43 pts Standard               0      2.50
Engine:        100 Fusion                    6      3.00
   Walking MP:4 [5]
   Running MP:6 [8]
   Jumping MP:   4
Heat Sinks:     10 Single                    6      0.00
 (Heat Sink Loc.: 1 LL,2 LT,1 RL,2 RT)
Gyro:                                        4      1.00
Cockpit, Life Supt., Sensors:                5      3.00
Triple Strength                              6      0.00
 (Loc.: 1 HD,5 LT)
L: Sh+UA+LA+H    R: Sh+UA+LA+H               8      0.00
Armor Factor:   89 Standard                  0      6.00

                          Internal    Armor
                          Structure   Value
   Head:                      3          9
   Center Torso:              8         12
   Center Torso (Rear):                  4
   L/R Side Torso:            6      10/10
   L/R Side Torso (Rear):              2/2
   L/R Arm:                   4        8/8
   L/R Leg:                   6      12/12
 
Weapons and Equipment    Loc  Heat  Ammo   Crits     Mass
---------------------------------------------------------
1 ER Medium Laser        LA       5           1      1.00
1 Flamer                 LA       3           1      1.00
1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)LT       3           1      0.50
1 Medium Laser           RA       3           1      1.00
1 Machine Gun            RA       0  100      2      1.00
   (Ammo Locations: 1 RA*)
1 Lift Hoist             RT       0           3      3.00
4 Standard Jump Jets:    -        0           4      2.00
   (Jump Jet Loc: 2 CT,1 LL,1 RL)
---------------------------------------------------------
TOTALS:                          14           4      9.50
Crits and Tons Left:                         22             
 
Calculated Factors
Total Cost:        1,916,458 C-Bill
Battle Value (BV1):504
Battle Value (BV2):655 
My three main Alternate Timeline with Thanks fan-fiction threads are in the links below. I'm always open to suggestions or additions to be incorporated so if you feel you wish to add something feel free. There's non-canon units, equipment, people, events, erm... Solar Systems spread throughout so please enjoy

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,20515.0.html - Part 1

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,52013.0.html - Part 2

https://bg.battletech.com/forums/index.php/topic,79196.0.html - Part 3

Dakkath

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #10 on: 14 February 2024, 14:49:01 »
Simple 3rd SW quick stinger/wasp refit. Drop that big pistol laser for a bigger rifle laser. Has to lose the jump jets to make room, but it's cheap and fast enough.

Code: [Select]
Stinger STG-4G

Mass: 20 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-E-D-D
Production Year: 2802
Dry Cost: 1,513,440 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1,513,440 C-Bills
Battle Value: 500

Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: GM 120 Fusion Engine
Jump Jets: None
Armor: Standard
Armament:
    1  Large Laser

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      33 points                2.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                120                       4.00
    Walking MP: 6 (64.8 km/h)
    Running MP: 9 (97.2 km/h)
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            6         
                                        Center Torso     6            8         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  4         
                                           L/R Torso     5            7         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  3         
                                             L/R Arm     3            6         
                                             L/R Leg     4            7         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Laser                                  RA        8         2         5.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 39

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 5
6          1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA
Guns may be a right, but kneecaps are a privilege.

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7222
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #11 on: 14 February 2024, 15:25:07 »
Base it on the Hornet, 5/8 movement. Build a fire support version with no JJs and twin LRM5s, a lightly armored (no JJ) AA version with an AC/2 and ML, a skirmisher with 5 JJ, ML and LRM5, plus an infighter with 5 JJ, 3 MLs and a MG.

Not bad.  And if you're willing to juggle a bit, depending on era, you could even make it a Hornet Omni to compete with the Gùn: with a standard engine, standard internals, 4 tons of standard armor and you've got 7 tons left for pod space, meaning only the AC/2 version would need to be tweaked (to just an AC/2, dropping the ML, for example).

Sabelkatten, the thing with that design paradigm is that there are lots of vehicles that can do those things, much cheaper, and even faster.

A Heavy APC can become a reasonably protected and faster double LRM5 carrier. Scorpions rearmed with an AC/2 (or put on a wheeled chassis) can do the same as that Mech as well while being tougher to kill.

That's true of 'Mechs and vehicles in general, though: vehicles can quite often carry comparable warloads to 'Mechs, meaning its down to a 'Mech's other features to make it viable compared to a tank.

So here's a 3025 take on the task. Medium lasers for anti-'mech work, machine guns for anti-infantry, and SRMs to carry infernos or to crit seek depending on operational needs.

It's like a mini-Jenner!  Well, slower, but, still!

BattleBug 
 3060 IS Light

Original:  https://battletech.doknet.hu/mechfactory_frame.php?call=displaymech&id=10000095

Source: My Own Custom /
Type/Model: BattleBug 
Tech: Inner Sphere / 3060
Config: Biped BattleMech
Rules: Level 2, Standard design

Mass: 25 tons
Chassis:
Power Plant: 100 Fusion
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Running Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: 4 Standard Jump Jet
Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Jump Jet Manufacturer:
Armor Type:  Standard
Armament:
 1 ER Medium Laser
 1 Flamer
 1 Rocket Launcher 10 (OS)
 1 Medium Laser
 1 Machine Gun
 1 Lift Hoist
Manufacturer:
 Location:
Communications System:
Targeting and Tracking System:


That went in a different direction than I thought of, but it makes sense: if you're spending the money on 'Mechs, you might as well get extra utility out of them when they're not fighting, too.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7222
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #12 on: 14 February 2024, 15:27:37 »
Simple 3rd SW quick stinger/wasp refit. Drop that big pistol laser for a bigger rifle laser. Has to lose the jump jets to make room, but it's cheap and fast enough.


Wow, it's like a STG-3P (which might be a canon 'Mech that qualifies for this, too) before the light PPC exists.  That's pretty cool, especially since you could mix it with the more conventional canon versions of the 'Mechs in your units.  Nice!
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Cavgunner

  • Master Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 259
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #13 on: 14 February 2024, 17:06:29 »
Holy crap.  The power of Clan tech compels you.

That made me laugh. Indeed it does.

Breetai

  • Sergeant
  • *
  • Posts: 142
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #14 on: 14 February 2024, 19:27:35 »
Simple 3rd SW quick stinger/wasp refit. Drop that big pistol laser for a bigger rifle laser. Has to lose the jump jets to make room, but it's cheap and fast enough.

Code: [Select]
Stinger STG-4G

Mass: 20 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-E-D-D
Production Year: 2802
Dry Cost: 1,513,440 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1,513,440 C-Bills
Battle Value: 500

Chassis: Standard
Power Plant: GM 120 Fusion Engine
Jump Jets: None
Armor: Standard
Armament:
    1  Large Laser

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      33 points                2.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                120                       4.00
    Walking MP: 6 (64.8 km/h)
    Running MP: 9 (97.2 km/h)
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            6         
                                        Center Torso     6            8         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  4         
                                           L/R Torso     5            7         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  3         
                                             L/R Arm     3            6         
                                             L/R Leg     4            7         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Laser                                  RA        8         2         5.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 39

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 5
6          1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Counterpoint: NYOOOOOM.

Code: [Select]
Hussar II HSR-350-Z

Mass: 25 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-E-D
Production Year: 3025
Cost: 1,827,917 C-Bills
Battle Value: 612

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 200 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 86.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 129.6 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    1  Large Laser
Manufacturer: Black Hawk Mechworks
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

Overview:
Often maligned as the least well-armoured Battlemech of modern warfare, the
Hussar nevertheless earned a reputation for success as being able to operate
behind enemy lines for extended periods, culminating in the now legendary 'ten
fingers of death' incident on Wotan. That being said, complaints about the
design's robustness are far from over-exaggerated; with a mere 1.5 tons of
armour, it is able to be crippled in one hit from practically any 'Mech-borne
weapon. The redesign of this venerable 'Mech into the Hussar II was predicated
by a desire to provide Mechwarriors with a far hardier alternative.


By lowering the speed of the design slightly, engineers found that a smaller
Gyro could be mounted. This in turn allowed for a lighter internal frame to be
used, bringing the 'Mech's overall weight into the 25 ton range. The follow-on
effect from this was that not only was the design significantly cheaper than
the original HSR-300-D, but it also used more readily available components in
the form of a class 200 engine. This made the design's engine easier to
service.


Although the reduction in speed means that the Hussar II is no longer the
fastest 'Mech available in the Inner Sphere, it is certainly no slouch, and can
prove just as difficult to hit as its forebear. The tonnage saved through this,
however, has given the design enough armour to ensure that it does not need to
worry as much about falling to pieces the first time a lucky shot strikes home.
Additionally, the price of the 'Mech has fallen dramatically - by over 700,000
C-bills. The notion of piloting a cheaper model that is nevertheless harder to
kill is perhaps the strongest selling-point of the Hussar II.


Capabilities:
The Hussar II runs at an impressive 120 kmph - not as fast as its forebear, yet
still faster than 99% of 'Mechs on the battlefield today. It retains the Large
Laser of earlier designs, giving it a weapon that can be used at both long and
short ranges, and providing penetrating power that gives even some medium
'Mechs reason to pause. The biggest difference between the Hussar II and the
300-D is that the Hussar II mounts no less than 4 tons of armour - nearly 3
times as much as the original design. Field tests have shown that the Hussar II
is fully capable of taking a burst of fire from a Class 20 Autocannon to its
Central Torso and still remaining operational - a blow that would have caused
the 300-D to literally disintegrate.


Variants:
The Hussar II is a Battlemech that evolved over the years as new technologies
were rediscovered, developed, and made available to our 'Techs.


HSR-351-Z

This variant was produced in the early days of the Clan Invasion, and made full
usage of recovered technologies. Sporting an Endo Steel chassis, the HSR-351-Z
could afford to devote an additional ton to armour, and therefore sported 5
tons of Ferro-Fibrous protection - literally the most that the chassis was
capable of carrying. 10 double heatsinks ensured that its armament - an
Extended Range Large Laser, could fire indefinitely.



HSR-352-Z

A refit of the 351-Z produced after the end of the Clan Invasion under contract
to the Combine Military, the HSR-352-Z makes use of the advanced C3 targeting
system. It achieves this by swapping out a ton of armour for a C3 Slave
Computer in the Head.



HSR-352a-Z

Designed to provide a command unit capable of keeping up with the HSR-352-Z,
this variant removed the Large Laser in order to upgrade the C3 computer to a
Master Unit. A Medium Laser in the Central Torso provides some protection,
however the 352a-Z was generally regarded as a niche unit and was an unpopular
assignment. It more often than not resulted in Lance Commanders assigning their
command 'Mechs to their subordinates and ordering them to simply evade enemy
fire while maintaining line of sight with their lancemates, in order that the
Commander may participate in the battle themselves.



HSR-353-Z

The most recent model of the Hussar II, the 353-Z is an upgrade of the 351-Z
that mounts a Snub-Nosed PPC in the Central Torso. This weapon is a superb fit
for the Hussar II's mission profile, as it allows the Hussar II to 'dogfight'
from just outside the most effective range of the majority of modern weapons,
using its speed to keep its distance and to provide a difficult target to hit.
4 tons of Heavy Ferro Fibrous armour keeps the HSR-353-Z more than adequately
protected.


================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      43 points                2.50
Engine:             Fusion Engine                200                       8.50
    Walking MP: 8
    Running MP: 12
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            8         
                                        Center Torso     8            13       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  3         
                                           L/R Torso     6            8         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     4            2         
                                             L/R Leg     6            8         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Laser                                  CT        8         2         5.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 43

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 6
8          1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA


Daryk

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 37604
  • The Double Deuce II/II-σ
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #15 on: 14 February 2024, 19:31:32 »
If you're willing to take some TacOps stuff in 3025, you can add an AOE weapon at 5/8/5, and target like you have a TAG... ;)
Code: [Select]
Velite VLT-1

Mass: 20 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-F-E-D
Production Year: 3025
Dry Cost: 1,189,840 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1,237,840 C-Bills
Battle Value: 401

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 100 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    1  Medium Laser
    1  Mech Mortar 1
    1  Recon Camera
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      33 points                2.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                100                       3.00
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 5 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT                                   2.50
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LT, 3 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               1.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            4         
                                        Center Torso     6            9         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  3         
                                           L/R Torso     5            8         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     3            6         
                                             L/R Leg     4            8         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Medium Laser                                 RA        3         1         1.00
Mech Mortar 1                                LA        1         1         2.00
Recon Camera                                 HD        0         1         0.50
@Mortar 1 (Airburst) (24)                    CT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 32

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 4
5j         1       1       1       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

Giovanni Blasini

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 7222
  • And I think it's gonna be a long, long time...
Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #16 on: 14 February 2024, 20:34:43 »
OK, decided to try my hand myself at one.  Based it on the Super Wasp, the 25-ton Wasp variant.

I dropped the jump down to 3 MP, which is the minimum to give you additional ground clearance capabilities over a standard 'Mech that lacks jump jets, allowing you to climb more than 2 levels at a time, even if not by much.  Armor is essentially maxed out, with the most coverage on the CT and legs, the most likely spots to cripple a small 'Mech like this.

Weaponry is...mixed.  An ERML is a decent main gun for a BugMech, and I backed it up with an ER flamer, allowing it to start fires, create smoke, heat up opponents, roast infantry, etc.  I chose the ERML in the CT, and the ER flamer in the RA, to provide coverage but also keep one weapon if you lose your arms.
 Along with that is an SRM-2 I-OS, packed with Infernos, for anti-vehicle work.  A single RL-10 provides a modicum of reach as a panic button.

To assist ground troops, paramedic gear is mounted in each leg.  Also, for spotting purposes, you've got a head-mounted recon camera, and a remote sensor dispenser in the side torso, paired with a vehicular mine dispenser.

Code: [Select]
Super Wasp WSP-2F

Mass: 25 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 150 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 90 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 ER Medium Laser
     1 SRM 2 (I-OS)
     1 Rocket Launcher 10
     1 ER Flamer
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3145
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-X-E
Cost: 1,941,250 C-bills

Type: Super Wasp
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Tonnage: 25
Battle Value: 620

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                  2.5
Engine                        150 Fusion            5.5
Walking MP: 6
Running MP: 9
Jumping MP: 3
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  88                    5.5

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         8     
     Center Torso            8         12   
     Center Torso (rear)               4     
     R/L Torso               6         10   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  2     
     R/L Arm                 4         8     
     R/L Leg                 6         12   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo                   Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
Jump Jet                      LL        1        -       0.5   
Paramedic Equipment           LL        1        -       0.25 
Jump Jet                      CT        1        -       0.5   
ER Medium Laser               CT        1        5       1.0   
2 Heat Sink                   RT        2        -       2.0   
Remote Sensors/Dispenser      RT        1        -       0.5   
Vehicular Mine Dispenser      RT        1        -       0.5   
SRM 2                         LT        1        2       0.5   
2 Heat Sink                   LT        2        -       2.0   
Rocket Launcher 10            LT        1        3       0.5   
Jump Jet                      RL        1        -       0.5   
Paramedic Equipment           RL        1        -       0.25 
Recon Camera                  HD        1        -       0.5   
ER Flamer                     RA        1        4       1.0   


Still kicking around ideas for a 20-tonner.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #17 on: 14 February 2024, 20:42:52 »
Counterpoint: NYOOOOOM.

Code: [Select]
Hussar II HSR-350-Z

Mass: 25 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Introductory
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-E-D
Production Year: 3025
Cost: 1,827,917 C-Bills
Battle Value: 612

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 200 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 86.4 km/h
Maximum Speed: 129.6 km/h
Jump Jets: None
    Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    1  Large Laser
Manufacturer: Black Hawk Mechworks
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

Overview:
Often maligned as the least well-armoured Battlemech of modern warfare, the
Hussar nevertheless earned a reputation for success as being able to operate
behind enemy lines for extended periods, culminating in the now legendary 'ten
fingers of death' incident on Wotan. That being said, complaints about the
design's robustness are far from over-exaggerated; with a mere 1.5 tons of
armour, it is able to be crippled in one hit from practically any 'Mech-borne
weapon. The redesign of this venerable 'Mech into the Hussar II was predicated
by a desire to provide Mechwarriors with a far hardier alternative.


By lowering the speed of the design slightly, engineers found that a smaller
Gyro could be mounted. This in turn allowed for a lighter internal frame to be
used, bringing the 'Mech's overall weight into the 25 ton range. The follow-on
effect from this was that not only was the design significantly cheaper than
the original HSR-300-D, but it also used more readily available components in
the form of a class 200 engine. This made the design's engine easier to
service.


Although the reduction in speed means that the Hussar II is no longer the
fastest 'Mech available in the Inner Sphere, it is certainly no slouch, and can
prove just as difficult to hit as its forebear. The tonnage saved through this,
however, has given the design enough armour to ensure that it does not need to
worry as much about falling to pieces the first time a lucky shot strikes home.
Additionally, the price of the 'Mech has fallen dramatically - by over 700,000
C-bills. The notion of piloting a cheaper model that is nevertheless harder to
kill is perhaps the strongest selling-point of the Hussar II.


Capabilities:
The Hussar II runs at an impressive 120 kmph - not as fast as its forebear, yet
still faster than 99% of 'Mechs on the battlefield today. It retains the Large
Laser of earlier designs, giving it a weapon that can be used at both long and
short ranges, and providing penetrating power that gives even some medium
'Mechs reason to pause. The biggest difference between the Hussar II and the
300-D is that the Hussar II mounts no less than 4 tons of armour - nearly 3
times as much as the original design. Field tests have shown that the Hussar II
is fully capable of taking a burst of fire from a Class 20 Autocannon to its
Central Torso and still remaining operational - a blow that would have caused
the 300-D to literally disintegrate.


Variants:
The Hussar II is a Battlemech that evolved over the years as new technologies
were rediscovered, developed, and made available to our 'Techs.


HSR-351-Z

This variant was produced in the early days of the Clan Invasion, and made full
usage of recovered technologies. Sporting an Endo Steel chassis, the HSR-351-Z
could afford to devote an additional ton to armour, and therefore sported 5
tons of Ferro-Fibrous protection - literally the most that the chassis was
capable of carrying. 10 double heatsinks ensured that its armament - an
Extended Range Large Laser, could fire indefinitely.



HSR-352-Z

A refit of the 351-Z produced after the end of the Clan Invasion under contract
to the Combine Military, the HSR-352-Z makes use of the advanced C3 targeting
system. It achieves this by swapping out a ton of armour for a C3 Slave
Computer in the Head.



HSR-352a-Z

Designed to provide a command unit capable of keeping up with the HSR-352-Z,
this variant removed the Large Laser in order to upgrade the C3 computer to a
Master Unit. A Medium Laser in the Central Torso provides some protection,
however the 352a-Z was generally regarded as a niche unit and was an unpopular
assignment. It more often than not resulted in Lance Commanders assigning their
command 'Mechs to their subordinates and ordering them to simply evade enemy
fire while maintaining line of sight with their lancemates, in order that the
Commander may participate in the battle themselves.



HSR-353-Z

The most recent model of the Hussar II, the 353-Z is an upgrade of the 351-Z
that mounts a Snub-Nosed PPC in the Central Torso. This weapon is a superb fit
for the Hussar II's mission profile, as it allows the Hussar II to 'dogfight'
from just outside the most effective range of the majority of modern weapons,
using its speed to keep its distance and to provide a difficult target to hit.
4 tons of Heavy Ferro Fibrous armour keeps the HSR-353-Z more than adequately
protected.


================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      43 points                2.50
Engine:             Fusion Engine                200                       8.50
    Walking MP: 8
    Running MP: 12
    Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 1 LT, 1 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               2.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            8         
                                        Center Torso     8            13       
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  3         
                                           L/R Torso     6            8         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     4            2         
                                             L/R Leg     6            8         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Large Laser                                  CT        8         2         5.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 43

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 6
8          1       1       0       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: ENE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA


I did not anticipate that.  And, if an 8/12 25-tonner works, doing a Mongoose variant would be easy to do, too.

If you're willing to take some TacOps stuff in 3025, you can add an AOE weapon at 5/8/5, and target like you have a TAG... ;)
Code: [Select]
Velite VLT-1

Mass: 20 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Succession Wars
Tech Rating/Era Availability: D/X-F-E-D
Production Year: 3025
Dry Cost: 1,189,840 C-Bills
Total Cost: 1,237,840 C-Bills
Battle Value: 401

Chassis: Unknown Standard
Power Plant: Unknown 100 Fusion Engine
Walking Speed: 54.0 km/h
Maximum Speed: 86.4 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
    Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
    1  Medium Laser
    1  Mech Mortar 1
    1  Recon Camera
Manufacturer: Unknown
    Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment           Type                         Rating                   Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Standard                      33 points                2.00
Engine:             Fusion Engine                100                       3.00
    Walking MP: 5
    Running MP: 8
    Jumping MP: 5 Standard
    Jump Jet Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT                                   2.50
Heat Sinks:         Single Heat Sink             10                        0.00
    Heat Sink Locations: 3 LT, 3 RT
Gyro:               Standard                                               1.00
Cockpit:            Standard                                               3.00
    Actuators:      L: SH+UA+LA+H    R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor:              Standard Armor               AV -  64                  4.00

                                                      Internal       Armor     
                                                      Structure      Factor     
                                                Head     3            4         
                                        Center Torso     6            9         
                                 Center Torso (rear)                  3         
                                           L/R Torso     5            8         
                                    L/R Torso (rear)                  2         
                                             L/R Arm     3            6         
                                             L/R Leg     4            8         

================================================================================
Equipment                                 Location    Heat    Critical    Mass 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Medium Laser                                 RA        3         1         1.00
Mech Mortar 1                                LA        1         1         2.00
Recon Camera                                 HD        0         1         0.50
@Mortar 1 (Airburst) (24)                    CT        -         1         1.00
                                            Free Critical Slots: 32

BattleForce Statistics
MV      S (+0)  M (+2)  L (+4)  E (+6)   Wt.   Ov   Armor:      2    Points: 4
5j         1       1       1       0      1     0   Structure:  2
Special Abilities: SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

I was going to ask the advantage of a 'Mech Mortar over an LRM rack, besides being AMS-immune, but you already hit the nail on the head: area-effect.  That would make a great infantry-support 'Mech.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Daryk

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #18 on: 14 February 2024, 20:59:18 »
Thanks Gio!  That's exactly what I was going for... :)

Retry

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #19 on: 15 February 2024, 14:51:49 »
Code: [Select]
Pholcidae (3032)
Mass: 20 tons
Chassis: Standard Quad
Power Plant: 100 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 54 kph
Maximum Speed: 86.4 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     1 Small Pulse Laser (T)
     1 ER Large Laser (T)
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3032
Tech Rating/Availability: F/X-F-F-E
Cost: 1,356,400 C-bills
Type: Pholcidae
Technology Base: Clan (Advanced)
Tonnage: 20
Battle Value: 808
Equipment Mass
Internal Structure 2
Engine 100 Fusion 3
     Walking MP: 5
     Running MP: 8
     Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink: 10 [20] 0
Gyro: 1
Cockpit: 3
Armor Factor: 72 4.5
Internal
Structure Armor
Value
Head 3 9
Center Torso 6 9
Center Torso (rear) 2
R/L Torso 5 8
R/L Torso (rear) 2
FR/L Leg 4 8
RR/L Leg 4 8
Weapons
and Ammo Location Critical Tonnage
ER Large Laser (T) RT 1 4
Small Pulse Laser (T) RT 1 1
3 Double Heat Sink RT 6 3
BattleMech Turret RT 1 0
3 Double Heat Sink LT 6 3
Targeting Computer HD 1 1
Features the following design quirks: Compact Mek, Easy to Maintain, Narrow/Low Profile, No Cooling Jacket (ER Large Laser), No Cooling Jacket (Small Pulse Laser)
[AU: Vela Corridor]
Produced in (though not used by) the Republic of Crossroad, the Pholcidae, nicknamed "Phoebe" by troops, is a light, compact and very cheap Battlemech produced for export to friendly states in the breakaway worlds of the Gumerian Diktat.  Its quad structure allows even poorly trained Mechwarriors to use it, and its turret partially negates the downsides of the quad chassis.  Its limited armor and speed is not thought to be a huge hinderance in the Gumerian region, as their most likely prey are anticipated to be unarmored insurgents with little more than rifles, SRMs, technicals, and the odd light tank salvaged from old Diktat stockpiles.

Daryk

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #20 on: 15 February 2024, 17:00:41 »
Why is it showing tonnage for your free heat sinks? ???

Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #21 on: 15 February 2024, 17:13:04 »
Why is it showing tonnage for your free heat sinks? ???

I can't remember if it's MegaMekLab or Mech Factory for Android that does that, but I've seen one app out there that does for some reason.

Neat design, though.  Reminds me a lot of the Araña in style and role.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

glitterboy2098

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #22 on: 15 February 2024, 17:48:21 »
out of curiosity.. how far would you say that you can bulk up an existing chassis tonnage wise before it would stop counting as a modified version of an existing design?

because being able to modify your 20 ton bug mech chassis into one for a 25 or 30 ton design would seem to be in keeping with some existing precedents in the setting, and free up some extra mass to use.

Retry

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #23 on: 15 February 2024, 17:52:23 »
Why is it showing tonnage for your free heat sinks? ???
Not sure.  MML weirdness.  Which is weird because it correctly gives the weight on the overview above it as "0".

Giovanni Blasini

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #24 on: 15 February 2024, 18:22:19 »
out of curiosity.. how far would you say that you can bulk up an existing chassis tonnage wise before it would stop counting as a modified version of an existing design?

because being able to modify your 20 ton bug mech chassis into one for a 25 or 30 ton design would seem to be in keeping with some existing precedents in the setting, and free up some extra mass to use.

Marauder I to Marauder II was a 33% increase, going from 75 to 100 tons.  What especially made it work is that while the structural mass increased, the engine, gyro, etc. didn't: they just added 2.5 tons to the chassis and then piled on another 22.5 tons of armor, jump jets and heat sinks onto a MAD-3D.

The Wasp and Stinger LAM were 50% increases in mass, going from 20 to 30 tons, though from another perspective that's only a 10-ton increase.  On the other hand, they changed engines as well.  The Valkyrie is an equal-weight spinoff of the WSP-100 Wasp LAM, which makes it oddly two steps removed from the original Wasp.

Then there's the Phoenix Hawk which, depending on which Tech Readout you read, either started its life as an Orguss-branded project to embiggen the Stinger, or an Earthwerks project to embiggen the Wasp.  Of course, the Phoenix Hawk has, in turn, spawned multiple different-mass variations on itself, from the 35-ton Phoenix Hawk-L, to the 50-ton Agrotera, to the 55-ton Bakaneko.

If you're wanting to recreate something like the Marauder II, bumping a 20-ton 6/9 'Mech to a 30-ton 4/6 'Mech would preserve the size of the engine and gyro, essentially.  You'd lose 2 jump capacity, but you can always fluff that as greater power draw from the extra myomers or something.  A 6/9 20-tonner has 9 tons free for armor, jump jets and weapons before factoring in weight savings.  That same setup, with an added ton of structure, gives you double that amount of mass free for armor, jump and weapons.

That would be funny, though, and an interesting solution: build a 20-ton version as your typical light BugMech, then use the same chassis in essence as a 30-ton trooper.
"Does anyone know where the love of God goes / When the waves turn the minutes to hours?"
-- Gordon Lightfoot, "The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald"

Retry

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #25 on: 15 February 2024, 18:32:33 »
If there's a limit to how heavy you can make an upgrade before it ceases to be a "II" variant and becomes its own thing, I'm not sure where that is.  The 20t Mercury and the 40t Mercury II are a whopping 100% difference in weight between each other.

Daryk

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #26 on: 15 February 2024, 18:37:05 »
The 20-ton 6/9 to 30-ton 4/6 redesign could keep 6 jump via IJJs... ;)

glitterboy2098

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #27 on: 15 February 2024, 19:26:10 »
started with an introtech version, despite setting the date to 3050. mostly to see hat a baseline version of a +50% mass bugmech might be.

pretty much doubled the armor (not the max for the mass but close enough), kept it at a 4/6/4 movement. which left enough space for a large laser, 2 mediums, and a pair of SRM2's with a ton of ammo. i went with SRm2's on the principle that if they can build a stinger, they can probably build a Wasp since the two are almost the same design, and would thus have SRM2's on hand.

Code: [Select]
Stinger STG-4T

Mass: 30 tons
Chassis: Standard Biped
Power Plant: 120 Fusion
Cruising Speed: 43.2 kph
Maximum Speed: 64.8 kph
Jump Jets: Standard
     Jump Capacity: 120 meters
Armor: Standard
Armament:
     2 Medium Laser
     2 SRM 2
     1 Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Unknown
Targeting & Tracking System: Unknown
Introduction Year: 3050
Tech Rating/Availability: D/X-X-D-D
Cost: 2,131,740 C-bills

Type: Stinger
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Introductory)
Tonnage: 30
Battle Value: 748

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    3
Engine                        120 Fusion              4
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 4
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  96                      6

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         8     
     Center Torso            10        12   
     Center Torso (rear)               6     
     R/L Torso               7         10   
     R/L Torso (rear)                  4     
     R/L Arm                 5         9     
     R/L Leg                 7         12   


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm, Lower Arm, Hand

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage
3 Heat Sink              RT        3        -       3.0   
2 Jump Jet               RT        2        -       1.0   
SRM 2                    RT        1        2       1.0   
2 Medium Laser           LA        2        3       2.0   
3 Heat Sink              LT        3        -       3.0   
2 Jump Jet               LT        2        -       1.0   
SRM 2 Ammo (50)          LT        1        -       1.0   
SRM 2                    LT        1        2       1.0   
Large Laser              RA        2        8       5.0   


and it has 10 tons of weapons space though, so you could easily work up a version with LRM's for fire support, though said variant would probably look a lot like a valkyrie.

Daryk

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #28 on: 15 February 2024, 19:48:39 »
Fractional Accounting would get you to max armor by halving the ammo load... :)

Liam's Ghost

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Re: Design Challenge: BugMechs as General-Purpose Troopers?
« Reply #29 on: 15 February 2024, 20:01:17 »
So I went with a tweaked Flea. Kept the large laser from the FLE-4, pulled the small lasers for more armor protection, and switched the rear mounted flamer for an arm mounted machine gun. The reasoning for that is that while the flamer is statistically a more effective anti-infantry weapon, the machine gun has a much lower risk of causing collateral damage in engagements where you don't just want to burn everything down.

The upgraded version basically tries to do the same thing, but better. Endo steel structure to save weight for more armor, double heat sinks, ER large laser for better range, and a small pulse laser for anti-infantry firepower that won't explode.


Flea FLE-6

Mass: 20 tons
Chassis: Earthwerks Trooper
Power Plant: GM 120
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Livingston Ceramics
Armament:
     1 Machine Gun
     1 Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Neil 2000
Targeting & Tracking System: Dalban HiRez-B
Introduction Year: 3025
Tech Rating/Availability: D/X-E-D-D
Cost: 1,501,800 C-bills

Type: Flea
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Introductory)
Tonnage: 20
Battle Value: 437

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure                                    2
Engine                        120 Fusion              4
   Walking MP: 6
   Running MP: 9
   Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sink                     10                      0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  48                      3

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         6     
     Center Torso            6         6     
     Center Torso (rear)               2     
     R/L Torso               5         6     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  1     
     R/L Arm                 3         4     
     R/L Leg                 4         6     


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo                      Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
Heat Sink                        LL        1        -       1.0   
2 Heat Sink                      RT        2        -       2.0   
Machine Gun                      LA        1        0       0.5   
Half Machine Gun Ammo (100)      LA        1        -       0.5   
2 Heat Sink                      LT        2        -       2.0   
Heat Sink                        RL        1        -       1.0   
Large Laser                      RA        2        8       5.0   
   
Features the following design quirks: Easy to Maintain, Improved Life Support, No/Minimal Arms


Flea FLE-6B

Mass: 20 tons
Chassis: Earthwerks Trooper
Power Plant: GM 120
Cruising Speed: 64.8 kph
Maximum Speed: 97.2 kph
Jump Jets: None
     Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Livingston Ceramics
Armament:
     1 Small Pulse Laser
     1 ER Large Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
     Primary Factory: Unknown
Communication System: Neil 2000
Targeting & Tracking System: Dalban HiRez-B
Introduction Year: 3059
Tech Rating/Availability: E/X-X-E-D
Cost: 1,747,200 C-bills

Type: Flea
Technology Base: Inner Sphere (Standard)
Tonnage: 20
Battle Value: 578

Equipment                                          Mass
Internal Structure            Endo Steel              1
Engine                        120 Fusion              4
   Walking MP: 6
   Running MP: 9
   Jumping MP: 0
Double Heat Sink              10 [20]                 0
Gyro                                                  2
Cockpit                                               3
Armor Factor                  64                      4

                          Internal   Armor   
                          Structure  Value   
     Head                    3         6     
     Center Torso            6         8     
     Center Torso (rear)               2     
     R/L Torso               5         8     
     R/L Torso (rear)                  2     
     R/L Arm                 3         6     
     R/L Leg                 4         8     


Right Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm
Left Arm Actuators: Shoulder, Upper Arm

Weapons
and Ammo              Location  Critical   Heat    Tonnage   
3 Double Heat Sink       RT        9        -       3.0   
Small Pulse Laser        LA        1        2       1.0   
3 Double Heat Sink       LT        9        -       3.0   
ER Large Laser           RA        2        12      5.0   
   
Features the following design quirks: Easy to Maintain, Improved Life Support, No/Minimal Arms
Good news is the lab boys say the symptoms of asbestos poisoning show an immediate latency of 44.6 years. So if you're thirty or over you're laughing. Worst case scenario you miss out on a few rounds of canasta, plus you've forwarded the cause of science by three centuries. I punch those numbers into my calculator, it makes a happy face.

(indirect accessory to the) Slayer of Monitors!

 

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