How to use the new Clan Invasion box set?

[WilliamGrant]

I have recently received the new Clan Invasion box set, which contains five Clan OmniMechs, two Elementals, a map sheet, and a rulebook. I am very excited to play with these new models, but I am not sure how to use them properly. I have some questions that I hope the experts on this forum can answer:

How do I balance the Clan forces with the Inner Sphere forces? Are the Clan OmniMechs and Elementals more powerful than the Inner Sphere Mechs and vehicles?

How do I create scenarios and campaigns that involve the Clan Invasion? Are there any official or fan-made resources that I can use?

[Minemech]

 In oldskool Battletech play, the most powerful balancing force was the player using Zel. You would say things like I will only engage you with my Large Pulse Lasers and try to force 1v1 combat. For the Inner Sphere forces, this was still a bit much, so they would try to set up a maneuver where they would break it at a pivotal moment. Clan mechs were much more powerful than their Inner Sphere counterparts at that time. To illustrate, a Clan ER Medium Laser did 7 points of damage, while an Inner Sphere Large Laser did 8. That is a 1 ton Clan Weapon competing with a 5 ton Inner Sphere weapon.

 Zel is a Clan thing.

 In BV (Battle Value) balanced games, the Inner Sphere will often win out, but a good Clan player has a lot of edges.

 

 

[Minemech]

Something you should be aware of is that Clan Invasion Era Inner Sphere mechs can differ dramatically in quality from very effective against the Clans to just plain rotten as a mech period. There was a lot of experimentation with new technology going around in the Inner Sphere, and some of the mediocre mechs can be quite fun to play with. You can always proxy.

 Inner Sphere mechs as a whole tend to be more fragile and less forgiving so if it seems like a bad choice, it may perform worse against the Clans.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

The best way to balance games is via Battle Value.  All units in Battletech have a Battle Value score based on factors like speed, armor, and weapons, with modifiers based on the quality of the ability scores of the mechwarrior/infantry troops/vehicle crew.  There's a comprehensive list of all Battletech units with their Battle Values and charts showing the change in cost for different skill ratings at the Master Unit List, which is a free resource.  The best way to balance between Inner Sphere and Clan mechs is to set a Battle Value for a match and build forces that add up to that number.

For example, you could declare a fight with BV of 3000 and pit a Black Hawk (Nova) Prime with a gunnery and pilot score of 4/4 (for a BV cost of 2919) vs a Griffin GRF-1N with a gunnery and pilot score of 3/4 and a Wolverine WVR-6R with a gunnery and pilot score of 4/3 (cumulative BV cost of 3000).

As far as scenarios and campaigns, there are a lot of options available depending on how much you want to invest in the game.  I recommend getting the free stuff from the downloads page to look through first, then there are books and PDFs available for purchase on the Catalyst Game Labs web store and DriveThruRPG if you're interested in more.

[glitterboy2098]

The best way to balance games is via Battle Value.  All units in Battletech have a Battle Value score based on factors like speed, armor, and weapons, with modifiers based on the quality of the ability scores of the mechwarrior/infantry troops/vehicle crew.  There's a comprehensive list of all Battletech units with their Battle Values and charts showing the change in cost for different skill ratings at the Master Unit List, which is a free resource.  The best way to balance between Inner Sphere and Clan mechs is to set a Battle Value for a match and build forces that add up to that number.

For example, you could declare a fight with BV of 3000 and pit a Black Hawk (Nova) Prime with a gunnery and pilot score of 4/4 (for a BV cost of 2919) vs a Griffin GRF-1N with a gunnery and pilot score of 3/4 and a Wolverine WVR-6R with a gunnery and pilot score of 4/3 (cumulative BV cost of 3000).

As far as scenarios and campaigns, there are a lot of options available depending on how much you want to invest in the game.  I recommend getting the free stuff from the downloads page to look through first, then there are books and PDFs available for purchase on the Catalyst Game Labs web store and DriveThruRPG if you're interested in more.

this. and if you are doing Alpha Strike, that game's Point Value system.


that said.. the downside of these systems is you often end up with the two sides having widely different numbers of units.. single clan stars against full companies is not uncommon if the IS player isn't using highly skilled pilots or high end designs. on paper this is even, but if you aren't careful with mission and map choices. it can make things a little rough for the clan player, since the IS player can gang up on them.

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Yeah, the system does take some understanding before you'll start to get things right and your choices of terrain and tactics influence things a lot but with practice it's possible to get a reasonable feel for when two forces are mostly balanced.  And as you get past the Clan Invasion Era into later eras, the technology (and Battle Value) gap between the Clans and the Inner Sphere will shrink significantly.

[Lanceman]

You might find Era Report: 3052 (https://store.catalystgamelabs.com/products/battletech-era-report-3052-pdf-1) very useful, not only does it provide some background lore, it has some very open framework scenarios to help you create games in the Clan Invasion era.

[Minemech]

 There are some technical readouts and record sheets that can be valuable for building a lineup. I tend to own the older versions so I will allow other players to speak on the quality of the anthology versions that have been recently released. The anthologies are Technical Readout Clan Invasion, and Technical Readout Succession Wars. I do not know if TRO 3026 was included in Succession Wars.

[Minemech]

 Oh and when playing Clan characters, it is good to develop personae. Clan pilots can range from being cartoonishly hypocritical to similarly obsessed with honor. If you are employing Zel, these personae will affect how the Inner Sphere player has to think around your force when fighting you. It can make things more fun, and plausibly confuse your opponent.

[Lanceman]

There are some technical readouts and record sheets that can be valuable for building a lineup. I tend to own the older versions so I will allow other players to speak on the quality of the anthology versions that have been recently released. The anthologies are Technical Readout Clan Invasion, and Technical Readout Succession Wars. I do not know if TRO 3026 was included in Succession Wars.

The "Era" TROs are supporting products for the BMM and only contain BattleMechs, so no TRO: 3026 units in them.

[Starfury]

The standard I've seen and used, barring BV, is one Clan Star vs 8 Inner Sphere lostech refitted mechs.  BV isn't always a good measure for effectiveness, but it's also not a bad way to go either.  If you do dec8de to get the older FASA products, be careful. Several of the Clan Invasion era scenarios are terribly unbalanced, such as the early stuff of the Grey Death Legion vs the Clans in Day of Heroes. One battle has 25 mechs and a Star of Elementals vs 16 introtech mechs and a company of infantry, and the Clan Mechs are mostly heavies and assaults.

[DevianID]

It is recommended that both sides have the same number of units for the best balanced initiative.  So Usually this means 2 elementals and 2 mechs versus 4 inner sphere mechs.

If you pit the 5 omnis and 2 elementals against the IS 8 mechs from AGOAC, the 7 clan units at base skill are about 12k BV, while the 8 inner sphere mechs are about 9k base.  So you probably are gonna drop the gladiator or a lighter mech + 2 elementals, and have ~12-14 units total with 3 paper mapsheets--a pretty big game.

If you pit the box against itself, its the two big mechs (twolf and Gladiator) versus the 3 smaller mechs, with each side getting 1 elemental.  Or you split the twolf and gladiator up, as they cost about the same, and split the nova+2 elementals and grendel+puma up, and that comes out about even as well.  Of course, changing variants can alter the ratios a bit, but overall its pretty close.

[Hellraiser]

How do I balance the Clan forces with the Inner Sphere forces?

http://masterunitlist.info/

The MUL above has Battle Values for Total Warfare play & Point Values for Alpha Strike play.


In terms of #s for those BVs in the MUL, 5 Omni-mechs (1Aslt, 1Hvy, 2Med, 1Lit) and 2 Elemental Points (BattleArmor/Infantry) should balance out well enough to a mixed IS Company or so.

So, 2 Mech Lances  (1Aslt, 2Hvy, 3Med, 2Lit) + 1 "Support Group" of say 1-2 tanks (APC/IFV types) & 2-3 Infantry (Grunt Platoons or BA Squads)

[OatsAndHall]

BV2 will do a good job of balancing out IS versus Clan. I suggest paying attention to the era you're playing in though. The 3025 IS tech can be woefully inadequate against the Clans, even given the fact that it's much cheaper. That tech gap can be far too wide, particularly the Clan double heat sinks. Star League/Clan Invasion IS units will fair much better in those scenarios and be more fun to play.

[DevianID]

BV2 will do a good job of balancing out IS versus Clan. I suggest paying attention to the era you're playing in though. The 3025 IS tech can be woefully inadequate against the Clans, even given the fact that it's much cheaper. That tech gap can be far too wide, particularly the Clan double heat sinks. Star League/Clan Invasion IS units will fair much better in those scenarios and be more fun to play.

Eh... bv2 with intro tech is fine in 'standard' games.  Usually the clan player gets crushed if the BV is too high, because the IS player can bring more pips of armor then the clan player has ammo.  Now, on infinitely large maps the clan range advantage is unbeatable sure, but likewise in dense forests the IS tonnage advantage and point blank range is likewise almost unbeatable.  So I always advise using 'standard' maps, like the neoprenes or box set maps, to judge things.  And with standard maps the clan versus IS balance is pretty good.  Pulse lasers are the main thing that everyone knows is mathematically broken in the base game for BV, and tac ops/int ops adds loads more weird tech, but barring the outliers introductory mechs traditionally beat clan mechs in standard map games unless the clan player brings elementals to shore up the short range and bulk issues.

[OatsAndHall]

Eh... bv2 with intro tech is fine in 'standard' games.  Usually the clan player gets crushed if the BV is too high, because the IS player can bring more pips of armor then the clan player has ammo.  Now, on infinitely large maps the clan range advantage is unbeatable sure, but likewise in dense forests the IS tonnage advantage and point blank range is likewise almost unbeatable.  So I always advise using 'standard' maps, like the neoprenes or box set maps, to judge things.  And with standard maps the clan versus IS balance is pretty good.  Pulse lasers are the main thing that everyone knows is mathematically broken in the base game for BV, and tac ops/int ops adds loads more weird tech, but barring the outliers introductory mechs traditionally beat clan mechs in standard map games unless the clan player brings elementals to shore up the short range and bulk issues.

Agreed. We use the bigger neoprene battle maps for everything. We get mixed results when it comes to IS versus Clan, depending on the players. Our better players are absolute axe-murderers with the IS numbers advantage, while our less "tactically-minded" players make some poor decisions. Usually exposing their forces way too early and giving the Clanners the range advantage. 

[Von Jankmon]

In oldskool Battletech play, the most powerful balancing force was the player using Zel. You would say things like I will only engage you with my Large Pulse Lasers and try to force 1v1 combat. For the Inner Sphere forces, this was still a bit much, so they would try to set up a maneuver where they would break it at a pivotal moment. Clan mechs were much more powerful than their Inner Sphere counterparts at that time. To illustrate, a Clan ER Medium Laser did 7 points of damage, while an Inner Sphere Large Laser did 8. That is a 1 ton Clan Weapon competing with a 5 ton Inner Sphere weapon.

 Zel is a Clan thing.

 In BV (Battle Value) balanced games, the Inner Sphere will often win out, but a good Clan player has a lot of edges.

Zel is great for flavour, but it is a trap for spheroid players.  Normally IS outnumbers clan 8 to 5.  If you agree to Zel you reduce that to 1:1, and get called dezgra if you then pick a time to play dirty.  Yes, you can shoot a clan assault with a light mech then play hide and seek, but if you go too far the clan mech will pick a new target, and you still need to deal with it.
Zel can draw out a fight and spheroids can exploit that, but most of their mechs will not last long and the damage might not be enough for the next guy to exploit, though the target order might vary.
Most importantly most duels get ended on the clan players terms and timing, and they might thus get to select the next target.

[OatsAndHall]

Zel is great for flavour, but it is a trap for spheroid players.  Normally IS outnumbers clan 8 to 5.  If you agree to Zel you reduce that to 1:1, and get called dezgra if you then pick a time to play dirty.  Yes, you can shoot a clan assault with a light mech then play hide and seek, but if you go too far the clan mech will pick a new target, and you still need to deal with it.
Zel can draw out a fight and spheroids can exploit that, but most of their mechs will not last long and the damage might not be enough for the next guy to exploit, though the target order might vary.
Most importantly most duels get ended on the clan players terms and timing, and they might thus get to select the next target.

Yeah,Zel has been in play for a lot of our Clan vs IS games and it gets broken quickly. There are only a handful of ways that an IS player can use it to their advantage as 1v1 dueling obviously favors the Clanners.

On another note, there are some bargain-bin Clan mechs outside of the Clan Invasion box set that limit an IS player's ability to swarm. There's quite a few Clan omni assaults and heavies under 2.5k BV that are tough as nails and can make life tough for an IS player.  Many of the Kingfisher variants are cheap but quite effective.

[Paul]

Zell is an RP solution to a game balance problem. Ergo, intrinsically flawed. Worse, it lacks positive incentives to reward "correct" behavior, so it just adds suck without any upside.

If you take it as an RP exercise though, it can be fun, and Clan players should challenge either multiple Sphere 'Mechs at once (best) or at least bid away weapons if they stick to 1:1 duels (less fun)

The key thing to remember is that in most larger unit duel setups, you will often have at least 1 'Mech on the sidelines. That is Unfun unless everyone controls several 'Mechs. And things should be kept fun first and foremost. You'll need to be willing to re-assign 'Mechs to players to ensure all of them have some fights.

[OatsAndHall]

Zell is an RP solution to a game balance problem. Ergo, intrinsically flawed. Worse, it lacks positive incentives to reward "correct" behavior, so it just adds suck without any upside.

If you take it as an RP exercise though, it can be fun, and Clan players should challenge either multiple Sphere 'Mechs at once (best) or at least bid away weapons if they stick to 1:1 duels (less fun)

The key thing to remember is that in most larger unit duel setups, you will often have at least 1 'Mech on the sidelines. That is Unfun unless everyone controls several 'Mechs. And things should be kept fun first and foremost. You'll need to be willing to re-assign 'Mechs to players to ensure all of them have some fights.

Zel also rewards the squad that loses initiative as they get to declare targets first. Having the ability to smack someone and declare them as your duel opponent is a huge advantage. We had a Clan vs Clan game while back and my squad was able to declare the majority of the duels early in. We dictated the movement and did a fair amount of damage before the opposition decided to break Zel. Since then, we've either avoided Zel or someone has broken it immediately.