Author Topic: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth  (Read 22942 times)

iamfanboy

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'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« on: 16 November 2012, 02:56:39 »
WHT-** Whitworth

The Whitworth, aka Worthless, aka Tin Woodsman, aka "Oh, no, the Colonel found out about his daughter" is a much-disparaged design, and unfairly so in this author's opinion. Though its original design specs offered it as an intermediate scout 'Mech between the Phoenix Hawk and its lighter brethren the Stinger and Wasp, it never filled that gap, instead becoming a stolid and reliable light fire design.

First produced in 2610, the Whitworth's creation was almost certainly influenced by the Reunification War. The long years of peace allowed it to proliferate, though its only factory on Dieron was destroyed during the Amaris Crisis - presaging the fire that would consume so many facilities. Still, unlike other designs it managed to survive the Succession Wars, being most common in the Draconis Combine and Federated Suns. In fact, two famous pilots were former DCMS lancemates and best friends until one defected to the FedSuns. It lead to a situation where propaganda experts on both sides exaggerated their exploits against each other in newsfeeds to incite hatred against the other nation, even arranging for them to be assigned to regiments which frequently clashed. Post Fourth Succession War, their fame faded - discarded by the system that had created them.

In the modern battlefield, Whitworths are an uncommon but not unexpected sight, but will probably fade sometime between the post-Jihad and the Dark Age eras. I couldn't find it in any MWDA list, though admittedly I am inexpert in perusing the RATs.

Whitworths were originally equipped with three medium lasers, two SRM-6 launchers, and fourteen heatsinks (enough to alpha strike with nominal heat buildup), with one ton of ammunition for each launcher. This model was designated the -1S. SLDF planners convinced the Whitworth Company to change the primary armament from SRM-6s to LRM-10s (dropping four heatsinks to do so, and redesignating it the WHT-1) after combat reports showed that it wasn't an effective design in close combat.

Presumably, this had nothing to do with the armament and everything to do with two factors: the lack of hand actuators, and the embarrassingly bad design of the legs. Their overly slim build exposed the actuators too easily and caused them to tear apart during strenuous maneuvers. Some mechanics in the Succession Wars actually replaced the legs with those of other 'Mechs, creating bizarre but effective FrankenMechs.

Its armor is a solid 8 tons, spread well enough across the frame to have extra armor left on all frontal locations even after a PPC hit, though no area will be able to stop an AC/20 barrage - but the legs will come close, despite their physical thinness. Its rear torso will likewise sneer at everything up to a medium pulse laser, as befits a 'Mech first armed to be an infighter.

The factor which colors everyone's opinion of the Whitworth is not its armament or its armor, but its speed. At a paltry 64 kph, its top speed hardly comes close to the PXH, WSP, or STG units it was supposed to supplement, though at least it can jump 120 meters in a single leap. This creation of slow low-end mediums was not unusual for the Star League; both the Panther and the Wyvern share its movement profile, which may explain its longevity beyond another porkbarrel SLDF project. Other jumping designs common in the SLDF, such as the Guillotine, Victor, and Blackjack, make finding lancemates for the Whitworth easy.

Like so many other refits of older designs first catalogued in TRO 3050, the WHT-2 seemed to be influenced more by shiny toy syndrome than good sense - in this case, the Artemis IV FCS. Replacing two of the WHT-1's medium lasers with Artemis systems is hardly the WORST offense to come out of TRO 3050, but that only says how bad some of the refits showcased therein truly are. Reducing its short-range firepower by 66% to increase its long-range damage by 33% could be described as inefficient, if one were feeling kind, and stronger language was no doubt used by pilots suddenly forced into using the 'upgrade'. One of the high points of the Whitworth is its flat damage curve; taking that away just seems... dumb.

A simple Periphery upgrade (WHT-1H) takes the original, SRM-6 equipped model and replaces one SRM and its ammo with eight RL-10s. Though in fairness this gives the 'Mech a devastating alpha strike, if it actually USES that alpha strike it overheats by a very significant amount, risking shutdown and ammo explosion problems. Despite that, it is a popular design in the Periphery, though I personally wouldn't touch it with a dead womprat.

The WHT-2A takes the original Whitworth to the extreme. It carries four Streak-4 racks, CASE to protect against ammo explosions, and a C3 slave unit. To save the weight, it has an Endo Steel frame, ten double instead of fourteen single heatsinks, and downgrades one of the medium lasers to a small. Though still slow, it carries a dangerous punch, and at least it has CASE.

Popular among the Capellan March forces is an interesting variation on the LRM-equipped Whitworth, marked WHT-3. By using an Endo Steel frame and dropping the medium lasers entirely, it saves enough weight to upgrade to six Improved Jump Jets and add a C3 slave. It trades the two LRM-10 racks for four LRM-5s, using the weight saved to up its ammo to four tons total. Overall, the tradeoff isn't worth it to my eyes, especially when examining what the Dragon came up with...

By using dual MML-7s instead of either SRMs or LRMs, the DCMS neatly combined the entire history of the Whitworth, simply adding -K to its designation. Aided by a pair of ERMLs, it can fight well at any range, and carries the now-common C3 Slave and five Improved Jump Jets with the weight saved by Endo Steel. It's not all gravy, however; the lack of CASE is painful, and the fact that it only has ten single heatsinks (!!) gives it potentially crippling heat problems on the post-Jihad battlefield.

An experimental variant, the -5S, tries to cram as much tech in there as possible. Composite internal structure and a supercharged XL Engine (still the 160-rated engine common to the Whitworth, however) are the basis for a design that carries two Streak-6 racks and two Medium X-pulse lasers, with CASE II to guard the ammo. Actuator Enhancement Systems give the MXPLs even more accuracy, and a Guardian ECM adds to its in-fighting ability.

Lastly, the WHT-0 used by the Amaris Dragoons as a terror weapon was very simple: drop one of the medium lasers for a flamer and load the SRM-6 racks with Infernos. Infamous for burning down entire towns, only two dozen were ever used, and all were presumably destroyed by Kerensky's forces.

Using a Whitworth depends on whether you have a short-range or long-range version; and for the BV they are solid units to add to a force.

The short-range version excels at close-quarters fighting (fluff text to the contrary notwithstanding), particularly city streets. Its slow speed does mean that in an open battlefield, it will take a pounding that it is not well-equipped to handle, but used sensibly it can swing a close-in fight to your advantage.

The long-range version, on the other hand, is an excellent light-fire 'Mech that (aside from the WHT-2 and -3) carries enough short-range firepower to defend itself once its ammo bins run dry. 

Countering one is not hard (simply find the range that it is not comfortable fighting at, and pound it into submission), but as evinced by the addition of C3 Slaves to three of the late-model Whitworths, it is a team player first and foremost. Watch out for the team when fighting a WHT.

So, what do you think, sirs?

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #1 on: 16 November 2012, 04:01:26 »
I take it for what it's worth. As a lightweight indirect fire support vehicle for heavier 'Mechs like the Victor, Warhammer, Marauder et al. One of my fave mods is to replace an LRM-10 with an SRM-6 and one tone of ammo and a heat sink. the other LRm willnow have tons of ammo keeping it in the long-range fight longer, while short-range firepower nearly doubles (if all SRMs hit). In the post-Helm Core era this 'Mech does suffer greatly, though as the lack of speed is now a handicap.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #2 on: 16 November 2012, 04:26:54 »
This is one 'Mech full of surprises:

The fluff suggests a poor or hated design; I have yet to see a BattleTech player who doesn't at least respect, if not outright like it.

The fluff suggests a scout design, though it is hard pressed to follow line combat units.

The fluff suggests a rare design, with the only factory destroyed long ago, but (much like the Clint) this supposedly rare 'Mech has increasingly come to the fore now that the Unseen were taken out of the starterbox. (CGL should really have included at least a stat sheet and perhaps record sheets for the ubiquitous classic unseens in the new boxed set, to maintain continuity here.) Also, didn't the RWR field the original WHT-1S? I dimly recall mention of some RWR terror lance of Whitworths.

Conversely, 40 tons suggest an overall weak design (for a trooper/line combat unit anyways), yet the Whitworth can fight well above its weight class.

Finally, given it's a low-end medium 'Mech with only 4/6/4 speed I should hate it. But I don't. In the admittedly few instances where I fielded a Whitworth, it always gave sterling performance above and beyond what I expected.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #3 on: 16 November 2012, 09:11:44 »
The fluff suggests a rare design, with the only factory destroyed long ago, but (much like the Clint) this supposedly rare 'Mech has increasingly come to the fore now that the Unseen were taken out of the starterbox.

Well, regarding how rare it is, the Whitworth is the only one of the original 55 TRO3025 mechs that have not AFAIK been in production during the 3050+ era. (Lyran seems to have started building the Clint.)

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #4 on: 16 November 2012, 10:08:15 »
I've used Whiteworth using MegaMek and Battletech Minigame (aka Blender Battletech) and found it okay. 

I really with the Kurita's Jihad era refitted has gone little further ahead and replaced the darn single-heatsinks with doubles in later refit to it.   Point refit it improve and upgrade, i can't see any sane Mechwarrior who would be sattled with version of the Mech no pushing to have it heatsinks replaced when they could get them.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #5 on: 16 November 2012, 10:38:32 »
Phenomenal 'Mech in 3025 era play. Useless everywhere else. New tech really killed this design.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #6 on: 16 November 2012, 10:41:06 »
I love the 1S and often pair it with a Hunchback in city fighting.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #7 on: 16 November 2012, 11:04:23 »
The old WTH-1 is still a good, ceap medium fire support 'Mech. 3 MLs are more than just a token close range weapon array.

The -1H is the natural companion to the -5H Hunchback. Both do not use their RLs to Alpha or as a primary weapon. The RLs are just a little extra for those special situations that require a bit more pain (HBK) or to project force outside the 9 hex bubble (WTH).


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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #8 on: 16 November 2012, 12:05:30 »
I don't use it often, but that's mainly because I tend to take mechs like the Catapualt, which is strikingly similar.  It fits very well in the Succession Wars context, and its one of the best medium weight fire support mechs. 

I actualy really like the SRM veriants.  You can often spring a nice little trick with them on someone who's unsuspecting, and the high power and easy heat curve make them lovely little brawlers.
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iamfanboy

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #9 on: 16 November 2012, 13:14:00 »
Frabby, that was the Amaris Dragoons version, which replaced an ML with a flamer, and presumably loaded infernos in their SRM launchers.

Yeah, the Whitworth is an odd one: disliked according to the fluff, but no player I've met has horrible things to say about it in its proper era. When I was divvying up my 'Mechs to paint up, I had the hardest time sticking it in the Kuritan SoL battalion because I wanted it for my merc unit; the next box I get it is definitely going into my mercs, fluff about it being a Davion design be damned.


One of the things which stuck with me from childhood about the WHT was the fluff describing two pilots who hated each other from TRO 3025; I was a bit disappointed to see no mention of it in TRO 3039, and the little section I included on that was a bit of fan-made explanation as to WHY it was in 3025 but not 3039.

So, yeah. This MotW thread isn't likely to last as long as some more controversial designs, but I enjoyed writing it.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #10 on: 16 November 2012, 13:44:54 »
Seeing as how the two famous mech warrior that rode it and that kurita has one of the highest concetration that isn't a problem.  Also it fight with the stanrd Kurita scout lance backing up panther as they share the same movement profile.

Frabby, that was the Amaris Dragoons version, which replaced an ML with a flamer, and presumably loaded infernos in their SRM launchers.

Yeah, the Whitworth is an odd one: disliked according to the fluff, but no player I've met has horrible things to say about it in its proper era. When I was divvying up my 'Mechs to paint up, I had the hardest time sticking it in the Kuritan SoL battalion because I wanted it for my merc unit; the next box I get it is definitely going into my mercs, fluff about it being a Davion design be damned.


One of the things which stuck with me from childhood about the WHT was the fluff describing two pilots who hated each other from TRO 3025; I was a bit disappointed to see no mention of it in TRO 3039, and the little section I included on that was a bit of fan-made explanation as to WHY it was in 3025 but not 3039.

So, yeah. This MotW thread isn't likely to last as long as some more controversial designs, but I enjoyed writing it.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #11 on: 16 November 2012, 14:32:02 »
What? Charlie Tango hasn't jumped in here yet? I'm amazed.

This is a great design and the stock WTH-1 is amazingly good even in the Jihad. The Battle Corps Legion has a reinforced lance made up of mostly heavy and assault LRM Mechs. Attached to this is a dinky old WTH-1. This Mech see more action than you would believe. It's jumping ability and it's low threat rating (oh, just a couple of LRM10s) means it doesn't get slammed the minute it shows up.

When the 120 plus missiles arc over the hill to follow up its paltry 20, people start to notice it.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #12 on: 16 November 2012, 15:40:29 »
the thing for the mech for its weight range its well arm and well armor for introductory design.   the only drawback is that a lot of player particular as new tech start to appear figure that no design should be slower then 5/8 when its a medium.  Giving that it too slow to get a good movement modifier it best bet is to use for indirect fire support which is why the LRM version with 3 laser is the best of the bunch.  Other than that city fighting where the closer ange srm work the best.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #13 on: 16 November 2012, 17:37:23 »
Phenomenal 'Mech in 3025 era play. Useless everywhere else. New tech really killed this design.

Agreed.  In all the games i have played with it sticking to mostly L1 tech, it was a solid medium trooper mech.  When you added in the new toys of L2 (especially ER PPCS, gause rifles etc) it does very poorly.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #14 on: 16 November 2012, 18:17:36 »
Pairing a Whitworth with a Blackjack give you a nice medium fire support/anti-air team to support your heavies. A team that few people want to send a medium 'mech up close to kill off.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #15 on: 16 November 2012, 18:25:41 »
Give the WHT-3 one more look. The IJJs? Bad idea, always are to me- I'd rather go back to the original jets and get a couple of the lasers back. But four LRM-5s... ok, not scaring anyone, I admit. Except this is the Capellan Confederation, and there's all sorts of ways to make people's lives miserable with LRM-5s by forcing them to pick through minefields. Mechs might look at a five point minefield and shrug, but infantry and vehicles might be loathe to risk it. A WHT-3 can make a battlefield all but impassable for those convetional troops with a few turns worth of fire.
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #16 on: 16 November 2012, 18:32:19 »
If you're coming at it from a "five point minefield" perspective, you're doing it wrong.  It's a "four hex minefield". ^-^
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #17 on: 16 November 2012, 18:45:19 »
So, what do you think, sirs?
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #18 on: 16 November 2012, 19:04:16 »
Give the WHT-3 one more look. The IJJs? Bad idea, always are to me- I'd rather go back to the original jets and get a couple of the lasers back. But four LRM-5s... ok, not scaring anyone, I admit. Except this is the Capellan Confederation, and there's all sorts of ways to make people's lives miserable with LRM-5s by forcing them to pick through minefields. Mechs might look at a five point minefield and shrug, but infantry and vehicles might be loathe to risk it. A WHT-3 can make a battlefield all but impassable for those convetional troops with a few turns worth of fire.
Yeah, quite honestly, out of all the advanced tech versions, the WHT-K comes the closest to being GOOD - falling short, of course, by not including DHS. Still, one simple field-refit away...

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #19 on: 16 November 2012, 19:36:27 »
Phenomenal 'Mech in 3025 era play. Useless everywhere else. New tech really killed this design.

Agreed, it's just 'meh' enough for opponents to disregard it in favor of more direct threats. All the while it's lobbing 20 LRM's at you in releative safety. It doesn't have the speed to be a rushing or front line unit so I always treated them as mini-Archers. Keep them back till the ammo runs dry and then use that trio of mediums to support heavier units.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #20 on: 16 November 2012, 20:38:15 »
I periodically get bored and run a star of medium and heavy 3050 omnis against a company + of 3025 IS mechs against the bot in MM.  I ignored a couple of these one time and had a Mad Dog get pretty well mangled.  They are pretty useful as cheap fire support mechs.


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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #21 on: 16 November 2012, 20:42:15 »
Having seen someone pick this and bring down a couple Clan Black Pythons... Well, it can be a surprise at times...

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #22 on: 16 November 2012, 20:46:56 »
Having seen someone pick this and bring down a couple Clan Black Pythons... Well, it can be a surprise at times...

Wait what?  Super dice?


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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #23 on: 16 November 2012, 20:50:53 »
Well, to the credit of the two Clanners, it was during a larger match, and they ignored him to focus on the Marauder II on the wall above the small woods Mr. Whitty was hiding in... (Getting Golden BBs to the machine gun ammo didn't hurt either...)

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #24 on: 16 November 2012, 20:54:54 »
Well, to the credit of the two Clanners, it was during a larger match, and they ignored him to focus on the Marauder II on the wall above the small woods Mr. Whitty was hiding in... (Getting Golden BBs to the machine gun ammo didn't hurt either...)

Yeah thats how that scenario goes most times


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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #25 on: 16 November 2012, 22:42:13 »
It really helped define one of the more effective design strategies for SW era mechs. It may have low end speed, but it is a true bracket fighter, and packs a lot of firepower in both brackets for its mass. Unlike like a lot of its contemporaries the WTH will most often be able to sink a brackets worth of heat, while most faster mechs of the time will be bogged down by waste heat, allowing the WTH to keep up with its "faster" contemporaries in high intensity fights.

As other's have mentioned, the arrival of new technologies, mainly the double heat sink, makes this strategy irrelevant and with it most WTH models.

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #26 on: 16 November 2012, 22:49:42 »
If you're coming at it from a "five point minefield" perspective, you're doing it wrong.  It's a "four hex minefield". ^-^

If you're coming at it from a "four hex minefield" perspective, you're doing it wrong. It's a "twenty-eight hex minefield". }:)
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #27 on: 17 November 2012, 00:57:25 »
you can sum up the looks of the Whitworth as "unassuming". or possibly "sad panda", but that's getting a little personal about it. the 'mech just plain manages to look like it's not a threat. it's big chunky torso is carried on a pair of slightly skinny-looking legs while the laser-mounting arms looks stubby and useless. even the head's looks are at best like a rough dog shape or someone wearing an oversize bucket hat. this actually works pretty well for the Whitworth because while it's a perfectly capable 'mech and one of the few LRM packing 'mechs of its day with jump jets, it's still only 40 tons and can't really afford to draw a lot of attention towards itself.

with the well-embedded weapons and the plain and unrefined lines of its armor, the Whitworth is an almost painfully dull 'mech to look at. but dull and reliable is a pretty good place to be if you want to be around a long time, and this 'mech can do that just fine.

If you're coming at it from a "four hex minefield" perspective, you're doing it wrong. It's a "twenty-eight hex minefield". }:)

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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #28 on: 17 November 2012, 01:29:01 »
A wonderful mech in 3025, a let-down afterwards.
But the Kurita-Update with MML could be interesting. I wil also accept the SHS, it's Kurita style...  ;)
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Re: 'Mech of the Week: WHT-** Whitworth
« Reply #29 on: 17 November 2012, 03:00:25 »
If you're coming at it from a "four hex minefield" perspective, you're doing it wrong. It's a "twenty-eight hex minefield". }:)

No.  It's a "I can't even walk from the barracks to the latrine without stepping on a mine!" field.  ;D