Clan Protectorate

[Church14]

I forget where the theory came from, but I’m half expecting Nova Cat survivors to end up under Alaric’s umbrella and Spirit Cats commit to FWL

[Minemech]

 Assume that it is necessary for the present course of writing for things to get extremely messy. There have been hints dropped in the writing as to some of the direction of this.

[Angrii]

As Randle get's closer to wrapping up lose ends.  I wonder is the Spirit Cats are going to become fully Clan Spirit Cat, revert to Clan Nova Cat, or the two remain separate and the Marik aligned Spirit Cats just keep hanging out inside of the Clan Protectorate.

Considering the rift in ideology and the Nova Cats going off half-cocked in Empire Alone, I don't see them and the Spirit Cats integrating easily.

[JAMES_PRYDE]

As an outsider, in a few sentences, what is "Spirit Cats" ? And Nova Cat (after Abjuration to ilClan)

As political / cultural identities ?

I still get abit confused

Are they similar to Clan Wolf and Clan Wolf in Exile ?

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

As an outsider, in a few sentences, what is "Spirit Cats" ? And Nova Cat (after Abjuration to ilClan)

As political / cultural identities ?

I still get abit confused

Are they similar to Clan Wolf and Clan Wolf in Exile ?

Check the previous page for my chart I just posted. It will explain pretty much everything.

Made this to help clear up some confusion about Clan Nova Cat/Spirit Cat in the Dark Age/IlClan Era.

My guess is that Alaric will use Kisho Nova Cat and his survivors as the carrot to get the Spirit Cats to fully jump on-board with his Star League. The Falcons becoming splintered makes sense post-Terra, but the Nova Cats/Spirit Cats, like the Wolves/Exiles have been splintered for decades, IRL and in universe, they could do with a reunification.

[JAMES_PRYDE]

Thanks for that

[cmerwin]

Considering the rift in ideology and the Nova Cats going off half-cocked in Empire Alone, I don't see them and the Spirit Cats integrating easily.

I'm not sure that the "rift" in ideology is really _that_ significant.

[Fire Scorpion IIC]

I forget where the theory came from, but I’m half expecting Nova Cat survivors to end up under Alaric’s umbrella and Spirit Cats commit to FWL

Mutually assured self-destruction

Perfectly in-character for Cats

[Colt Ward]

You have a good chance the Kishio survivors ended up stumbling into the Wolf Empire advance around Terra- especially as we know they were attacked by the Bears as they fled.  Considering the secrets kept with the revival of the Jaguars and return of the Great Father's flagship & floating tomb . . . yeah.

[Geg]

Considering the rift in ideology and the Nova Cats going off half-cocked in Empire Alone, I don't see them and the Spirit Cats integrating easily.

The Spirit Cat contingent formally led by Kev Rosse folded back in with the Nova Cats just in time to get annihilated by the Combine.

The simplest resolution is Kisho and Crew stumbling close to Terra and Alaric Revives the Nova Cats under the 3rd League just like the Jaguars all while the Spirit Cats continue to chug along in Marik space.  However with the Clan Protectorates proximity to Terra, the Sea Foxes going all in on the ilClan, and the Protectorate seemingly getting involved in fighting against the FWL for the Empire, I am envisioning a more complicated resolution to this story.

I just hope at the end of the day we keep a Clan Spirit Cat, or at least a Spirit Cat lead clan protectorate.

[Angrii]

I'm not sure that the "rift" in ideology is really _that_ significant.

Nova Cats have been stated to view the Spirit Cats as "dangerous cultists". That, to me, suggests a significant difference of opinion.

[Colt Ward]

Nova Cats have been stated to view the Spirit Cats as "dangerous cultists". That, to me, suggests a significant difference of opinion.

Right up until Khan Nostra sent 3 of the mystics to bring the Spirit Cats back to the Clan.

[cmerwin]

Nova Cats have been stated to view the Spirit Cats as "dangerous cultists". That, to me, suggests a significant difference of opinion.

Sure, I get that. But two things are really important here: Even when Jacali Nostra was elected Khan of the Nova Cats, she had - according to ER: 3145 - a difficult/unsuccessful time swaying the majority of the Nova Cats to the Kesari movement. The Nova/Spirit Cats are already fractured, but the Kesari view is certainly not a "dominant" ideology among a tiny population by any means. And with her death, and Kisho Nova Cat missing, and Galaxy Commander Rikkard Nova Cat, who while a Spirit Cat, is dedicated to old Nova Cat ways at heart, the Cats who think these are "dangerous cultists" are small in number. Further, it has to be remembered, the spiritual side of Clan Nova Cat is how they have been *from the founding*, those Nova Cats who view them as "dangerous cultists" are the minority, not the majority.

[Metallgewitter]

The question will be how the Protectorate develops under the now open war between the League and the Empire. The leader of the Khanate had to fight a trial against the Spirit Cats so they can open a line of dialogue with the Empire for the possession of the HPG's (and also support for the IlClan if I remember correctly). While he won this probably made the relations within the Protectorate strained. The Protectorate also voted against the war (no suprise there) but the more interesting part comes now: how will they react? Gobble up Empire worlds for "safekeeping"? Stabbing the League in the back? If they play it wrong we might see the end of another faction 

[Istal_Devalis]

From the material, I get the idea that the Spirit Cats are actually the Tradionalists when it comes to Nova Cat spirituality. There's a bit of verbiage involving Clan Nova Cat dropping a lot of it due to how things have been going for them.

[Geg]

I am enjoying the divided loyalties and the competing agendas of the Clan Protectorate.   We've got:

• Lady Julietta - Pro ilClan, when she should be supporting her sister and the FWL
• ovKhan Petr Kalasa - Pro-ilClan, but has already betrayed Alaric once in order to gain control of the Empires HPGs and most likely expand the Protectorates territories at it's expense.  Views the Protectorate as a Tool, and as a dumping ground for pro-ilClan Warriors
• Rikkard Nova Cat - Pro League, but really more pro-"Cats"

Battletech talks a lot about it's political side, but in my opinion it's really only in this little corner of the IS that we get to see the sausage getting made.

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

From the material, I get the idea that the Spirit Cats are actually the Tradionalists when it comes to Nova Cat spirituality. There's a bit of verbiage involving Clan Nova Cat dropping a lot of it due to how things have been going for them.

Yep, the Nova Cats in the Combine had become heavily swayed by the Kesari (They were the main reason she got elected to Khan, as mentioned by an earlier poster), while the Nova Cats in the Republic birthed the Spirit Cats who were probably some of the most fervent believers in Nova Cat traditions. It seems one of the other fault lines between Nova Cats in the Republic and Spirit Cats were whether or not to stay loyal to the Republic. Kev Rosse and his Spirit Cats saw the Republic as a sinking ship, whereas other Nova Cats like Tyrina Drummond (R.I.P.) stayed loyal.

Battletech talks a lot about it's political side, but in my opinion it's really only in this little corner of the IS that we get to see the sausage getting made.

The Dark Age FWL novels and the more recent Damocles Sanction have done an excellent job handling politics, I have high hopes for the Spirit Cat/Nova Cat novel to continue that.

[Metallgewitter]

I am enjoying the divided loyalties and the competing agendas of the Clan Protectorate.   We've got:

• Lady Julietta - Pro ilClan, when she should be supporting her sister and the FWL
• ovKhan Petr Kalasa - Pro-ilClan, but has already betrayed Alaric once in order to gain control of the Empires HPGs and most likely expand the Protectorates territories at it's expense.  Views the Protectorate as a Tool, and as a dumping ground for pro-ilClan Warriors
• Rikkard Nova Cat - Pro League, but really more pro-"Cats"

Battletech talks a lot about it's political side, but in my opinion it's really only in this little corner of the IS that we get to see the sausage getting made.

I wonder how long Lady Julietta stays in the "Ilclan camp". The longer there is no reaction from the IlClan the more it's reputation gets damaged. I mean Othar already sounded diilusioned when he got the message from Alaric which blandly stated "I own you". Right after the Dragoons had sacked Gienah and nearly destroyed the entire Garrison there. If this notion seeps through the empire, the Preotectorate and the League I would bet that at least some Protectorate Clanner will think to turn away from the IlClan and tie themselves to the League. after all what good is the IlClan when it can't defend it's holdings right? Winning Terra is one thing but keeping it is another

[Geg]

I wonder how long Lady Julietta stays in the "Ilclan camp". The longer there is no reaction from the IlClan the more it's reputation gets damaged. I mean Othar already sounded diilusioned when he got the message from Alaric which blandly stated "I own you". Right after the Dragoons had sacked Gienah and nearly destroyed the entire Garrison there. If this notion seeps through the empire, the Preotectorate and the League I would bet that at least some Protectorate Clanner will think to turn away from the IlClan and tie themselves to the League. after all what good is the IlClan when it can't defend it's holdings right? Winning Terra is one thing but keeping it is another

I think Lady Julietta is more trying to set herself apart from the rest of her family, and to be the Clanniest Clanner she can be.  She has completely bought into the ideology.   The ilClan could be a council in exile abord the McKenna and her Zeal would be undiminished.

[Spirit Cat Refugee]

I wonder how long Lady Julietta stays in the "Ilclan camp". The longer there is no reaction from the IlClan the more it's reputation gets damaged. I mean Othar already sounded diilusioned when he got the message from Alaric which blandly stated "I own you". Right after the Dragoons had sacked Gienah and nearly destroyed the entire Garrison there. If this notion seeps through the empire, the Preotectorate and the League I would bet that at least some Protectorate Clanner will think to turn away from the IlClan and tie themselves to the League. after all what good is the IlClan when it can't defend it's holdings right? Winning Terra is one thing but keeping it is another

It will really come down to whatever carrot Alaric might have to offer the Spirit Cats. Right now, you have some Clansmen who want to prove loyalty to the IlClan + Sea Foxes trying to buy gratitude in the FWL. Now that FWL is at war with the Wolf Empire those positions become dangerous, especially with the 1st Marik Militia Regiment sitting on Marik as well.

But if Alaric has a bunch of Nova Cat survivors led by Kisho with him, and offers to reconstitute Clan Nova Cat with Rikkard and Kisho at the head of it... that is a tempting offer.

[rebs]

It's bound to happen.  And if so, it would make three Clans that are basically starting over.  So it's kind of fortuitous that way.  The TerraSecFalcons, the NuJags, and possibly the Nova Kitties?  They can all build off each other at least.

Terra has some kind of serious Pet Cemetery mojo going. 

[Church14]

It will really come down to whatever carrot Alaric might have to offer the Spirit Cats. Right now, you have some Clansmen who want to prove loyalty to the IlClan + Sea Foxes trying to buy gratitude in the FWL. Now that FWL is at war with the Wolf Empire those positions become dangerous, especially with the 1st Marik Militia Regiment sitting on Marik as well.

But if Alaric has a bunch of Nova Cat survivors led by Kisho with him, and offers to reconstitute Clan Nova Cat with Rikkard and Kisho at the head of it... that is a tempting offer.

What does Alaric have to offer? He can’t offer military aid. He can’t even help the Empire. He could send the Foxes? The foxes are already there.

Also, why would Alaric resurrect the Cats? They were abjured for siding with the Second Star League, which Alaric is going out of his way to try and delegitimize with the nuJags resurrection.

[Metallgewitter]

The question is WHICH Foxes are on the Ilclan's side at this point? The Clan Protectorate seems to have thrown some support Alaric's way but they have extracted a hefty price so far (possesion of the Empire's HPG's and claim to a lot of salvage from the Ilclan trial which they apparently sell to the Empire wolves at a premium). But what about the other Khanates? Have they shown preferential treatment of the Wolves? So far they are more interested in taking over the Mercenary market and plying the trade everyhwere. And let's not forget one Kanate has now 3 worlds in the Federated Suns. I am not sure they will just throw that away for free especially when being surrounded by a battle hardenend nation

And as Church said: what exactly can Alaric offer? Become part of the Star League because Clan law says so? The longer he cowers on Terra the more respect / authority he looses. Heck his Empire is crumbliong and the Protectorate has first row seats to witness it

[Geg]

Also, why would Alaric resurrect the Cats? They were abjured for siding with the Second Star League, which Alaric is going out of his way to try and delegitimize with the nuJags resurrection.

This was covered in the CoK.  They would be brought back, because Alaric is putting any type of Clan Society, even an abjured Clan over that of the IS Houses.  The destruction of a Clan can only truly happen by that of another Clan, and this both the 2nd League and the Combine upset the natural order by doing so.  Alaric would be trying to be seen as setting things right again.

What does Alaric have to offer? He can’t offer military aid. He can’t even help the Empire. He could send the Foxes? The foxes are already there.

A reborn Hegemony / Republic at the heart of the IS would offer a safety net to all Clan Society.   

The value of being inside the ilClan's Sphere of influence is entirely dependent on how effective you think the ilClan will be in enforcing its will.  The FWL made the decision that the Wolves will be strong in the future, and it would be better to act sooner. The Combine has made a similar choice when they abandoned the Davion front to refocus on their Clan neighbor.  The IS governments are making the calculation that the Clan state establishing itself on Terra is going to be a powerful entity.  A Revanchist policy stance, would make those same powers think twice about trying to pickoff a weaker smaller Clan society.

[rebs]

Having survived the attempt to completely eradicate them, the Nova Cats could have some very interesting psychological reactions going forward - should they in fact rebound.

I can't imagine them ever being on friendly terms with any Great House ever again, except possibly Marik.  And even then it wouldn't be to the extent as before, when they had more or less given fealty to Kurita.

[Metallgewitter]

A reborn Hegemony / Republic at the heart of the IS would offer a safety net to all Clan Society.   

The value of being inside the ilClan's Sphere of influence is entirely dependent on how effective you think the ilClan will be in enforcing its will.  The FWL made the decision that the Wolves will be strong in the future, and it would be better to act sooner. The Combine has made a similar choice when they abandoned the Davion front to refocus on their Clan neighbor.  The IS governments are making the calculation that the Clan state establishing itself on Terra is going to be a powerful entity.  A Revanchist policy stance, would make those same powers think twice about trying to pickoff a weaker smaller Clan society.

The main problem I see is that the Clans on Terra have to deal with a concentrated population. Something they nevert had to do in their time in the Is. Terra has still 10 billion people. And if Alaric pulls a Clan society together how do they plan to handle this many people? Plus: any coming war will deplete the already denuded numbers they have. The same goes for the other Clans as well. Can they afford to loose so many true Clanners at a fast pace without any hope to replace them?

[Geg]

An ilClan state, centered on Terra, with a two jump (60LY) buffer around earth, would directly boarder the Clan Protectorate...  if not directly bordering the planet Marik. 

It looks like the 3rd League is occupying most of Prefecture X by the end of 3151.  It also looks like the FWL is abandoning the Augustine Alliance when they pulled 6th Free Worlds Guards (Shrapnel 8) to focus on the Empire closer to Atreus.  Assuming that CapCon get's thrown back or pulls back, there wouldn't be much to stop the ilClan from completing the expansion in what used to be prefecture VII (the FWL slice). With Nicole invading the Empire at New Olympia in mid 3152 and at least part of the Clan Protectorate (Beta Strike Cluster, some Spirit Cats) on the losing side of that Battle, the time to make a decision is fast approaching... if it hasn't already been made by  Petr Kalasa, and he's just forgotten to tell his partners.

[Metallgewitter]

The question would be how the former Prefecture X looks like at the start of the Leagues full blown assault into the empire. We know so far that the Ilclan forces clash with the Capellans on New Earth in 3152. If the Capellans have expanded more in this particular region then the IlClan is cut off from it's Empire Holdings (and I would assume most Empire conquests in Prefecture X have no garrisons left).

The Foxes of course are in a bind here: the League declined their offer of HPG repair for a new armistice with the Empire. They are now part of a nation that is at war with the new leader of a "shaky" Star League that consists of 1 system while it's most potent ally (the Bears) wage war with the Combine. Kalasa has to tread carefully lest his own investments get stomped under the League's boot (or even torn asunder by his Spirit Cat partners who were not very keen on joining the IlClan or even dealing favorably with them)

[rebs]

-snip-
torn asunder by his Spirit Cat partners who were not very keen on joining the IlClan or even dealing favorably with them)

If nothing changes the Spirit Cats may find their selves on their own.  Spirit Cat on Sea Fox violence on table tops may occur (and sounds fun) regardless of what happens in the timeline.

[cmerwin]

If nothing changes the Spirit Cats may find their selves on their own.  Spirit Cat on Sea Fox violence on table tops may occur (and sounds fun) regardless of what happens in the timeline.

That's honestly my biggest worry, and I think your analysis of Cats (of whatever flavor), absolutely distrusting - well, almost everyone - is a concern. All that said, it means the Cats are in an amazing position from a storytelling standpoint! :D